[WIP] Ground texture mod

[pupaxx]

1 of 2 is looking better (original COD trees?)

throw a splatter of browns into the trees and darken the ground a tad and things could be well on the way

pict 2 of 2 on my last post is with darkened trees.
the green patch below the trees is original untouched.
The ground textures are quickly modded from google earth, just put togheter an photoshopped a bit. Starting picts are in post #235 #238.
What drive me crazy is that I made this little attempt in 40' mins; is it possible that in 6 years devs have not been able to do better? :mad:

[GilB57]

Great progress in what I see here !
I applause !
Keep up the good work ;)

[pupaxx]

i thought my map was quite complete when I realized i was working on a 1/4 scale map ...wuaaahhh!!!:cry::cry::cry:

6346

to low res to enlarge now!

[Ali Fish]

lol oops ! hate to say this but you "must" remove the trees, otherwise thats looking good.

[Jatta Raso]

is it dead?..

[Ali Fish]

for now yeah ! Ive not lost interest though :) However the patches for this game are going to have to be very interesting for me to spend anytime doing anything for it.

[Zerotown]

I understand. Though to be honest I was regarding your mod as a 'very interesting patch' that would make it worthwhole for me to spend some time with the game at last. :)

[Ali Fish]

i have tried. i really have. but without that SDK and abbility to remove everthing what 1c layed down and then replace. its the most incredible amount of artistry required. Also i came to realise the only enjoyment i was getting out of the game was fiddling with it LOL. thats not good. when its time ill bust out somthing from scratch hopefully if the sim is in a fit state to be fiddled with. from trying what i have i must say ive come to really appreciate what 1C has done with the terrain and that it should be left alone.

[Jatta Raso]

well thanks anyway.. at least you exposed the gruesome error with the colour of trees. i'm looking at the Zeltweg airpower festival right now and the grass is as green as in COD, but the trees are way darker (and you don't get to see trunks just foliage). me thinks these things are the major reason why the map, dispite looking good, looks nothing like england hence the constant disbelief sensation

http://www.mediafire.com/i/?kyhfbs1kwyfwbet

[Ali Fish]

good point! i should concentrate on those trees again with a view to modding them explicitly. <gets his thinking cap on> http://i.imgur.com/11bia.png

[adonys]

oh please do, is the visual mod I think we need the most, at least at this moment (besides of some work on some of the shaders though :) ).

[pupaxx]

...almost finished 1/4 of entire map set, unfortunately very poor time to dedicate. I'm risking to be fired by my boss, wife and daughter ;).
The goal is to grossly complete the 4 sets and refine them in looking (tuning the wooden areas where needed etc). I downloaded an nvidia tool with which retool the bump channel. I have to study that.
Cheers
6545

[pupo162]

...almost finished 1/4 of entire map set, unfortunately very poor time to dedicate. I'm risking to be fired by my boss, wife and daughter ;).
The goal is to grossly complete the 4 sets and refine them in looking (tuning the wooden areas where needed etc). I downloaded an nvidia tool with which retool the bump channel. I have to study that.
Cheers
6545

im not sure it will blend in the game but AWSOME first notch Work!

[Ali Fish]

OK ive done the tree colours mod.
http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showpost.php?p=306799&postcount=1

[badfinger]

Ali Fish,

I like these new tree colors, but am not so sure about the tree trunks. Shouldn't they be be more brown, like tree bark really is? That way, they wouldn't be so obvious in amongst the leaves.

Also, is that a crucifix sticking up out of the trees in the background?

binky9

[Ali Fish]

Ali Fish,

I like these new tree colors, but am not so sure about the tree trunks. Shouldn't they be be more brown, like tree bark really is? That way, they wouldn't be so obvious in amongst the leaves.

Also, is that a crucifix sticking up out of the trees in the background?

binky9

lol its a windmill.

[Ekar]

I've been putting in some time in having a go at redoing the terrain textures.. very slow process... but here's a (detail) comparison screen of default and modified.

http://www.imageupload.org/?d=8889B8991

http://www.imageupload.org/getfile.php?id=78447&a=2cb2c947cd6862e298e09f1d0ecaacec&t=4e175cae&o=1B069F4D0982A1D493C269F6DB132CE51348984B1C82E9CB 92AD2FB6900F5483061A864D09&n=comparison.jpg&i=1

I realised that I really do like the tiles in higher res (currently the 1st tile is being authored at 4k), and the photographic detail looks great at low altitudes. There doesn't seem to be much of a performance hit on my computer- but I have not updated the bump maps yet.

Issues-

It's really slow going. I'm working from stitched together maps taken from Flash Earth, editing out the lighting/shadowing information, and then trying to work out how the bits need to fit into the original template.

This comparison shot isn't colour graded yet. Personally I don't have too much of a problem with the original colours, and I've tested ingame some modded textures colour graded to the originals. To me they look fine.. some people may prefer a more muted or desaturated look. Anyway, changing colours is the easy part- it's no big deal. What's really needed is to get that texture detail in there. I noticed in CloD, that anything below around about 900 feet looks awesome- it pretty much does the reverse of all other flight sims- where going higher produces a better visual result. After 900 feet, the vegetation in CloD fades out and you're left with just the plain texture, but to me the resolution isn't really holding up there. Using 4k maps takes care of that problem and things should hopefully look nice from any altitude above that range.

Anyway, just thought I'd give a preview. I'm a little busy so no idea when or if this will get done to a finished level. I'd like to imagine I have the energy for it. :confused:

[David198502]

dont give up, try to finish!in my opinion this looks great!!!!
if i would have the knowledge to do such stuff, i would give it a try as well.

[JG1_Luckystrike]

I've been putting in some time in having a go at redoing the terrain textures.. very slow process... but here's a (detail) comparison screen of default and modified.

http://www.imageupload.org/?d=8889B8991

http://www.imageupload.org/getfile.php?id=78447&a=2cb2c947cd6862e298e09f1d0ecaacec&t=4e175cae&o=1B069F4D0982A1D493C269F6DB132CE51348984B1C82E9CB 92AD2FB6900F5483061A864D09&n=comparison.jpg&i=1

I realised that I really do like the tiles in higher res (currently the 1st tile is being authored at 4k), and the photographic detail looks great at low altitudes. There doesn't seem to be much of a performance hit on my computer- but I have not updated the bump maps yet.

Issues-

It's really slow going. I'm working from stitched together maps taken from Flash Earth, editing out the lighting/shadowing information, and then trying to work out how the bits need to fit into the original template.

This comparison shot isn't colour graded yet. Personally I don't have too much of a problem with the original colours, and I've tested ingame some modded textures colour graded to the originals. To me they look fine.. some people may prefer a more muted or desaturated look. Anyway, changing colours is the easy part- it's no big deal. What's really needed is to get that texture detail in there. I noticed in CloD, that anything below around about 900 feet looks awesome- it pretty much does the reverse of all other flight sims- where going higher produces a better visual result. After 900 feet, the vegetation in CloD fades out and you're left with just the plain texture, but to me the resolution isn't really holding up there. Using 4k maps takes care of that problem and things should hopefully look nice from any altitude above that range.

Anyway, just thought I'd give a preview. I'm a little busy so no idea when or if this will get done to a finished level. I'd like to imagine I have the energy for it. :confused:

fantastic texture

[philip.ed]

Very nice work! Out of interest, I think the darker green should be lightened, because even out driving today around the London/Westerham/Sevenoaks area, the grass-fields are still very light in colour (depsite saturation)
Keep up the excellent work though! :cool:

[Ali Fish]

YES ! this is looking good. i dont envy what its taking to do it but iam ashamed ive not the patience ! wow. keep going man ! if u need any help shout me. the dark border upon the roads is essential, keep doing that please.




I've been putting in some time in having a go at redoing the terrain textures.. very slow process... but here's a (detail) comparison screen of default and modified.

http://www.imageupload.org/?d=8889B8991

http://www.imageupload.org/getfile.php?id=78447&a=2cb2c947cd6862e298e09f1d0ecaacec&t=4e175cae&o=1B069F4D0982A1D493C269F6DB132CE51348984B1C82E9CB 92AD2FB6900F5483061A864D09&n=comparison.jpg&i=1

I realised that I really do like the tiles in higher res (currently the 1st tile is being authored at 4k), and the photographic detail looks great at low altitudes. There doesn't seem to be much of a performance hit on my computer- but I have not updated the bump maps yet.

Issues-

It's really slow going. I'm working from stitched together maps taken from Flash Earth, editing out the lighting/shadowing information, and then trying to work out how the bits need to fit into the original template.

This comparison shot isn't colour graded yet. Personally I don't have too much of a problem with the original colours, and I've tested ingame some modded textures colour graded to the originals. To me they look fine.. some people may prefer a more muted or desaturated look. Anyway, changing colours is the easy part- it's no big deal. What's really needed is to get that texture detail in there. I noticed in CloD, that anything below around about 900 feet looks awesome- it pretty much does the reverse of all other flight sims- where going higher produces a better visual result. After 900 feet, the vegetation in CloD fades out and you're left with just the plain texture, but to me the resolution isn't really holding up there. Using 4k maps takes care of that problem and things should hopefully look nice from any altitude above that range.

Anyway, just thought I'd give a preview. I'm a little busy so no idea when or if this will get done to a finished level. I'd like to imagine I have the energy for it. :confused:

in respects to what i have been doing. i have been thinking of ways to change things indirectly. i have a new update ready for the trees that uses the mipmaps to fade out the colour and introduce some fake enviromental haze, it works nicely on the trees, on the ground it may eleviate the colour problems by viewing less colour at higher distances. its worth a try and if it works it could be added to anyones mod.

[adonys]

a new trees update ready? awesome!! when, please?

[Ali Fish]

It looked like this !http://i.imgur.com/0pVlpl.jpg (http://imgur.com/0pVlp)

now its like this. Small change in all colours, with added distance haze effect. i like how it blends with the sea colours, Personally i like the colours in the high sunshine now. and at dusk there some extra blue/grey distance haze. when you get real close to the textures then the colour becomes more vibrant !!! anyway ill release this soon. itll be a pretty big DL though. 164 meg (74 meg rar)

http://i.imgur.com/pNVhHl.jpg (http://imgur.com/pNVhH)http://i.imgur.com/Ad2hfl.jpg (http://imgur.com/Ad2hf)
Extra atmosphere at dusk, notice the vibrancy at differnet heights from pic 1 to pic 2.
http://i.imgur.com/mlAOZl.jpg (http://imgur.com/mlAOZ)http://i.imgur.com/gqphHl.jpg (http://imgur.com/gqphH)

one issue with the mod is what general texture setting you use in game :( higher the better the whole effect, Pictures taken with high settings. so.... yeah i hope this solves some issues for some people colours wise without actually changing things to drastically.

[Ekar]

Thanks guys, and Ali- great work with the trees! I really like the distant haze effect and overall things seem that much more realistic. Looking forward to it. :)

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

Love all the hard work you guys are putting in,COD is taking shape v nicely;)

[adonys]

awesome ali, thanks for your hard work.

and if soon is today, it would be even better, i want to play some il2cod :)

[Ali Fish]

a couple of folks are gona test it over the weekend. (whilst im at work) BOO !

[adonys]

Then I have volunteer for testing too, please :)

[David198502]

ali you are doing an awesome work!you really are a benefit to the community.
regarding your ground texture mod,...have you thought of continueing it?is it just too much work??have you thought of doing a patchwork mod, working with others like Ekar?i would offer help as well, but that would need step by step instructions, as im totally worthless when its about modding yet.

[Ali Fish]

ali you are doing an awesome work!you really are a benefit to the community.
regarding your ground texture mod,...have you thought of continueing it?.

thats what post 273 is about. It is continuing. i think i was tyring to drastically change the scenery before i gave up. but with some very simple changes and the haze addition i think it''ll work out untill a real overhaul can be done.

[David198502]

ah now i understand the post.i thought you spoke about the trees only.now i see the difference you mentioned.stupid me.
this terrain actually looks way better than the default one.
hope i can test it soon.

[pupaxx]

Nice job Ali,
please, how did you tuned the distance haze effect?
thx

[Wolf_Rider]

good effort there Ali... top left shot is looking good

[Ali Fish]

thx for the appreciations.

ive given the mod to 3 peoples to try out. the first feedback comment is as i had half expected. Shimmering textures out at the horizon. This is related to mip map settings upon generating them.

Does anyone have any experience with this out of interest from other games modding ? i believe i can fix it but not 100% certain as ive never had the problem before when working with dds& mipmap profiles.

Another issue is the realisation that using Original or even High general texture settings is the root cause of Stuttering in IL2. When you set High your actually using a stage 2 mipmap of the texture. which is always half the resolution of the prior mip map. etc etc. The haze effect might need to be removed coz of this. the mod is for using using High or original settings explicitly due to the special haze effect ive added via the mip maps (your answer pupaxx).

[Wolf_Rider]

try looking into shadows...
I run Original textures on HIGH and with shadows OFF it is smooth

[Ekar]

Small update: :)

I was playing around with trying to replicate how bump mapping is done in CloD in order to use some new bumps for the modified terrain textures. Here's what I came up with (Ali, please tell me if this is wrong, as it's a bit weird, but actually seems to work)... Firstly, I extracted a normal map with crazybump- and then the red channel of the normal map, I put into RGB of the modified bump. The green channel of the normal, I put into the alpha channel. Then I saved out as DXT5 (there was a little bit of trial and error in this). Anyway, I tested this new bump out in CloD's evening lighting. Here are some pics...

(please ignore the white empty parts, there's no texture in there yet)


http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_85040.jpg (http://www.imageupload.org/?d=86385D321)



http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_85043.jpg (http://www.imageupload.org/?d=784F51EB1)


http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_85045.jpg (http://www.imageupload.org/?d=FEFE71291)


There's still quite a way to go with these textures, but I should proably say, I'm becoming pretty inspired to push ahead now. I'm quite happy with the way things are looking already. The bump map is working (even though I might be doing something wrong there), and I generally feel that the terrain is starting to be lifted to quite a nice level graphically. In motion, things are really starting to look great. :)

Ok, back to work,

[Ali Fish]

cant see the images.

[Ekar]

I'm trying to work out what happened. They showed up when I first made the post, but now they don't.

If you right click the broken link icon and copy url, then you can see the images. I'll edit this post when I've fixed things.

[Ali Fish]

As far as i can see! colour me Interested ! lost of sweet effects your getting with the bumps, If you have emulated whats in the default normal maps. which i presumed as (DXT5_NM) then well i think excellent. youve done dusk shots because it shows the effects better ?, youve clearly given them more impact than the level 1C gave there. very interesting. show me some daytime shots man.

[JG1_Wanderfalke]

could u post pic during the afternoon ?
Please

[SQB]

could u post pic during the afternoon ?
Please

infact... post ALL the times of the day!!! :grin:

Just so we can check what the colours actually look like, it looks mighty fine at the moment.

[David198502]

well the vanilla version of the game looks best in evening or morning time.
but these three shots, especially the first one, look stunning!!!

[Ekar]

Sorry guys- here are a few day shots.

http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_85177.jpg (http://imageupload.org/?d=7840900A1)

http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_85178.jpg (http://www.imageupload.org/?d=328997641)

http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_85179.jpg (http://www.imageupload.org/?d=9DAC3ADF1)

[David198502]

excellent!!

[pupaxx]

Great!
Can u post a day-time video?

Cheers

[David198502]

yep a vid would be great!

[Ekar]

The textures still need much work. I only have one tile at the moment (well there are two ingame at the moment, but the other needs a lot of work) so most of the landscape is still just default textures. This is really just a proof of concept, and to post my little victory over the CloD bump mapping.

There is potential here to make a really nice landscape for CloD, but it will take time. :( I am inspired to push ahead now though after these initial results.

PS- how are people feeling about the colours here so far?

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

Images not showing Ekar?

[Ekar]

Looks like image upload is down atm.

[Ali Fish]

The textures still need much work. I only have one tile at the moment (well there are two ingame at the moment, but the other needs a lot of work) so most of the landscape is still just default textures. This is really just a proof of concept, and to post my little victory over the CloD bump mapping.

There is potential here to make a really nice landscape for CloD, but it will take time. :( I am inspired to push ahead now though after these initial results.

PS- how are people feeling about the colours here so far?

indeed proof of concept. im concerned though, its not much dissimilar from the original textures colour wise etc. but your normals are better if maybe just more emphasized.

i cant say i like cod much anymore now. i love texturing etc so i may help out but tbh if i could id (in a virtual way) smack that luthier accross the mouth for how he treats his european customers. Not to mention Nearmiss pulling an 8 page petition thread. Ive just about had enough of this farce of a sim.

[David198502]

i think the colours are way better than the original ones,at least what i can see on those screenshots!
you are doing great!

[Ekar]

Ali -

I've matched the colours to more closely resemble the originals in those screens. We can change them to something considered more realistic- when I finish the first tile you can have a play around with colour grading it if you like.

The bump is a little too pronounced as well, as you mention. My first reaction to the original bump maps ingame was that they too looked a bit extreme. I can easily tone it down and may even be able to tease some more detail out as well. It's just a first run.

What I really wanted to do with these textures was get away from the 'every field is a different colour' look that the originals had, and also generally make things look more 'photographic'. Those two things could not be done working on the original tiles themselves. I also aim to play around with making each tile texture a little more unique, and show different kinds of landscape features... hopefully put to better use the four tiles as at the moment they all look very similar.

Like you, I really enjoy the modding process- and if all games were perfect already, there wouldn't be much for modders to do. I've certainly spent more time modding CloD than actually playing it.


edit: David- yeah, I don't mind the colours as they are now. To me it looks kind of 'summery'. As I say above, different tiles will probably emphasise different colours once done- some more/less irrigated, some denser/less dense in terms of agriculture, abandonded or more natural fields. That kind of thing. I have quite a lot of material to work with. ;)

[Wolf_Rider]

great effort there and you just might be on the track of something, but, you seem to have lost a lot of "light" in the concept

[Ekar]

you seem to have lost a lot of "light" in the concept

What do you mean by 'light', Wolf Rider?

[JG1_Wanderfalke]

Could u please post a external view picture,too.


It looks quite good

Thanks for your work


God bless you

[philip.ed]

From what I can see, those look excellent! My only concern would be an apparent lack of what I might term 'burnished' fields, which look like they've been bleached golden by the sun. Such colours are typical of summer. Having said that, some external shots could soon disprove this ;)
What you've done is miles ahead of the teams effort. If the trees could be reworked, the landscape could look awesome.

[Ali Fish]

so today i got named and shamed in this thread : http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=24721

is this fair.? for my earlier posts today i guess it was fair.! but after 1 post?. but that was my first post after having properly lost the plot with this il2 affair. i wasnt rude to anyone, i requested the Petition be put back up in an angry manner

i believe i have tried to compliment the community by showing what i was doing as far as my modding was concerned. i believe i have been positive almost everywhere. anyway im not sure i can put up with this nonsense anymore on all sides.

[JG1_Wanderfalke]

So true.
I completely agree with you; have noticed for long time.

[itgl72]

You're not to feel ashamed but proud of helping the community. That being said, this thread has 31 pages to it. Can someone please answer me this, is this texture mod available, is it the only one, how and where to download? I'm very unhappy with my IL2 COD.

i7 930 stock
6GB ram
5870 1GB Vram

[Ali Fish]

its Work In Progress. ive kinda given up in favour of awaiting the SDK (software design kit) because of the multitude of problems in re hashing 1C,s work for a more appealing mod.

However Ekar is doing some good work of his own within the remit of whats possible presently, It is very time consuming but he'll get there and im happy to help him.

[JG1_Wanderfalke]

No, its not out yet,



sorry.

[itgl72]

However Ekar is doing some good work of his own within the remit of whats possible presently.

Thank you for the information. Is that currently available at all?

[JG1_Wanderfalke]

No.

[David198502]

hey ali!
i think most know what you are doing for the game!
some guys here just cant stand critisism,regardless if there are reasons for it or not.i dont get them.most of them reacted offensive and even aggressive in the last few days, no matter how hard one tries to establish ones concerns with facts.try to ignore them.
im confident its not just me who really appreciate your efforts.
you are a benefit for the community and the game!

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

This is looking very nice Ekar,we appreciate you're hard work mate;)

[JG1_Wanderfalke]

When will u release a first beta???
i cant wait :grin:

the current textures partly appear so unrealistic that there is simply no fun flying another mission.


i feel like flying in my märklin model railway


Vanilla Dust, dawn and night looks acceptable.

[itgl72]

Out of curiosity, is there a way for us to manually compress the image files that are causing issues? I have no idea if this is possible, just throwing out an idea.

[Ekar]

so today i got named and shamed in this thread : http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=24721

is this fair.? for my earlier posts today i guess it was fair.! but after 1 post?. but that was my first post after having properly lost the plot with this il2 affair. i wasnt rude to anyone, i requested the Petition be put back up in an angry manner

i believe i have tried to compliment the community by showing what i was doing as far as my modding was concerned. i believe i have been positive almost everywhere. anyway im not sure i can put up with this nonsense anymore on all sides.

Hi Ali. Sorry to hear about this. I felt that your post this morning was uncharacteristic of you, considering everything I've seen you write on previous occasions regarding CloD, the devs, etc.


JG1_Wanderfalke-

Not sure when I'll be ready to release these textures. I feel motivated enough now that things seem less daunting atleast, so that's good I guess! I'll post updates anyway in either this thread, or create a new one.

[Ali Fish]

nah im fine. i did loose it earlier. and thanks for the understanding that it was un-characteristic of me. im only human so apologies too all concerned.

Maybe some of those who expect better scenery can understand just what an undertaking it is. More so because you have to work within the 1C stuff. Asides todays hickup your inspiring me further Ekar. respect due.

[Ali Fish]

Out of curiosity, is there a way for us to manually compress the image files that are causing issues? I have no idea if this is possible, just throwing out an idea.

manually compress. these textures are DDS textures, they could be put into some sort of container but presently and before any SDK output work they have to lie in a raw state. The files exist in an .SHS file that is a container but im not sure if it uses any compression tech.

i will consider doing a half size texture replacement pack next week. my expereinces with them as posted here* were inconclusive in there findings about creating better performance.

* http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=24486

[Rattlehead]

nah im fine. i did loose it earlier. and thanks for the understanding that it was un-characteristic of me. im only human so apologies too all concerned.



No need to apologise buddy. You've done more than most for this sim, starting with this very thread.
Hell, I've had three moans myelf lately, and I'm usually pretty at ease with things.

[Wolf_Rider]

What do you mean by 'light', Wolf Rider?

constructively, and any comment I make is meant as contructive and genuine.... the shots you put up compared to others seem to be darker. Darker as though something is lacking with the way the scene has been lit.



Ali Fish...

I don't know what that other thread is about at all, but crikey I think it has something to do with his lunchbox only.

[Ekar]

Wolf Rider- Ah, ok. Thanks.

Not sure what would be causing that. Anyway I'll keep it in mind.

PS- on the topic of lighting. I was looking at some photos of Dover yesterday and came across these two very contrasting shots. It's all about lighting...


http://www.destination360.com/europe/uk/images/cliffs-of-dover.jpg

http://photos.igougo.com/images/p340567-Dover-White_Cliffs_of_Dover.jpg

Oh yeah, and the seasons. And monitor calibration. And people's subjective and aesthetic preferences... :grin:

[JG1_Wanderfalke]

what about fog ?

[Ali Fish]

btw the sea colour in that first picture is in line with the overly saturated green terrain. with colour like that id expect to be in the bahamas. not a true image imo

[Ekar]

Thanks Ali. Yeah, now that you mention it- it does look way oversaturated. Guess we can add 'photoshop' to the list.

[Madfish]

Well, it was overly sunny. Also keep in mind that near the cliffs the color of the sea is brighter than usual. This is because of the chalk. First of all the high mineral saturation makes for a more "blueish" water when light hits the ground and also it reflects much better.

While this picture might be a bit oversaturated it's not too far off, considering that it was really sunny of course.

I also have to say that I'm a very light sensitive person as I do have extremely bright eyes. So to me during summer a lot of the landscape looks very bright without any sunglasses.

[BMCha]

To gauge the saturation of that first picture I think the best point of reference would be the sky color. It's getting really saturated and light blue near the horizon, which makes me think it's been very saturated and probably even lightened.

As far as I know the sky color all over the world doesn't change much from the color in this image. (and this is angled up too = bluer)
http://wallpaperblog.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/blue_sky_320.jpg?w=490

Here's a more desaturated and hue shifted version that I'd say matches the original colors more closely.
http://i.imgur.com/7havn.jpg

[Ekar]

I'd go with BMCha's adjustments- it was the surreal sky colour that tipped me off as well that things were too saturated.

[philip.ed]

Ekar, any update with the textures mate? I've just looked back through the screenshots you previously posted, and they look awesome :grin:

[Ekar]

Hi Philip :) I've been busy at work (texturing a soccer ball for a Nike ad) so there's been little progress on the terrain. Thanks for the nice comment- as far as I remember you live close to Dover (or are atleast an English native) so I am listening closely to what you say. It's good to know I'm on the right track... and yeah, I checked out some 'burnished' fields and I see what you mean there.

Cheers-

[philip.ed]

Hi mate
Yes, I live in Kent, and have flown over Dover a number of times (and driven around there many times as well). It's great to see your enthusiasm towards this, and it's nice to see as well how open you are to constructive comments. I can't wait to see the final results.
your work certainly sounds interesting, too! :grin:

[furbs]

Hey EKar, ive only just seen your screenshots and that is a huge improvement!!! Im in the south of England and im very impressed. :)

Please keep up the good work!

Listen to Phil, he knows whats what.

[philip.ed]

Firstly, I hope your work is going OK Ekar.
I was wondering, considering the recent update by Luthier, whether your project was still on? It certainly looked pretty awesome.

[Ali Fish]

i cant see the update affecting anything anyone is doing here. i hope luthier would have seen whats happened here and it made him have a light bulb moment regards distance effects which is what they have done in the images. i cant see them having re designed mip maps, and i do see them adapting some of my theories. but im sure its a simple shader adaptation only and nothing that will void anyone elses work here.

one thing i do hope for is some performance boost from what they have applied in those update images. its these devices that the landscape really needs to help that side of things. sad but true.

[Ekar]

Hi Philip.

I've been dabbling with the terrain a bit but I haven't been super focused on it. I'm more familiar with the different textures being used for the terrain now as I've been flying over England to get a better understanding of things, but it has made me aware that there is more work to be done than just the four main landscape tiles, which was my original goal. I guess that's the problem when you start to update textures, the old ones tend to stick out more. Going through the original textures, another thing which strikes me is the fact that, especially the ones relating to towns and built up areas, there is just an incredible amount of work there. Whoever made these must have spent hours upon hours moving around little boxes all over these tiles. I am simultaneously impressed and also a little bemused, because the result is not really very nice. Just thinking about it makes me feel a little sad actually. :-( All that work...

My predominant feeling now is maybe to wait a bit, see how CloD matures before jumping in too far. You never know what's going to happen- I just caught the new update, which looks fairly significant in a number of important areas. The whole thing could be changed around tomorrow, there's no telling. Maybe the landscape guy is putting final touches on things, or maybe the whole terrain is just a placeholder and is about to be totally stripped out. It doesn't make sense to me, looking at these textures- that Oleg could be confident in saying that his system could stand up to photorealism. You just can't get there with these textures. Either his vision and timeframe for the completion of CloD was much broader than what was provided on release (seems fairly likely- there's enough evidence that they're still working hard), or he was stretching the truth in order to make a sale. If it's the former, then their obviously working on the terrain in order to lift things to a higher standard. If it's the latter, then that doesn't exactly inspire me to pick up the ball and run with others in the community, to finish others work.

I think we'll see some good updates over the next 6 months or so. Someone brought up in Luthiers latest thread the fact that reflections had been turned off for planes in the official patch. With reflections turned on in that video posted, the plane looks really fantastic, metalic, realistic. Right now the planes look very dull. I'm a patient guy so I have no beef with the devs in terms of progress. They obviously need time to get things to a level where everyone's happy. They seem to me like they are being rushed. What's with the horrible new/old map border for eg?

Haha, sorry, long post.

[philip.ed]

No problem, Ekar, it was a very interesting post. I agree with you on all your points, although it does seem sad to see your work lead to nothing, however I am in no doubt that the landscape will undergo changes shortly (whether for good or for worse)

What this doesn't suggest to me, though, is whether they will change the individual placement of fields. Currently the look of the textures is like a patchwork quilt, whereas in reality, the fields in England are usually grouped closely together reuslting in large areas of grassland and similar areas of crop-fields (rather like what you achieved in you work)

I hope the team have a notebook at hand!

[Ali Fish]

Hi Philip.

I've been dabbling with the terrain a bit but I haven't been super focused on it. I'm more familiar with the different textures being used for the terrain now as I've been flying over England to get a better understanding of things, but it has made me aware that there is more work to be done than just the four main landscape tiles, which was my original goal. I guess that's the problem when you start to update textures, the old ones tend to stick out more. Going through the original textures, another thing which strikes me is the fact that, especially the ones relating to towns and built up areas, there is just an incredible amount of work there. Whoever made these must have spent hours upon hours moving around little boxes all over these tiles. I am simultaneously impressed and also a little bemused, because the result is not really very nice. Just thinking about it makes me feel a little sad actually. :-( All that work...

My predominant feeling now is maybe to wait a bit, see how CloD matures before jumping in too far. You never know what's going to happen- I just caught the new update, which looks fairly significant in a number of important areas. The whole thing could be changed around tomorrow, there's no telling. Maybe the landscape guy is putting final touches on things, or maybe the whole terrain is just a placeholder and is about to be totally stripped out. It doesn't make sense to me, looking at these textures- that Oleg could be confident in saying that his system could stand up to photorealism. You just can't get there with these textures. Either his vision and timeframe for the completion of CloD was much broader than what was provided on release (seems fairly likely- there's enough evidence that they're still working hard), or he was stretching the truth in order to make a sale. If it's the former, then their obviously working on the terrain in order to lift things to a higher standard. If it's the latter, then that doesn't exactly inspire me to pick up the ball and run with others in the community, to finish others work.

I think we'll see some good updates over the next 6 months or so. Someone brought up in Luthiers latest thread the fact that reflections had been turned off for planes in the official patch. With reflections turned on in that video posted, the plane looks really fantastic, metalic, realistic. Right now the planes look very dull. I'm a patient guy so I have no beef with the devs in terms of progress. They obviously need time to get things to a level where everyone's happy. They seem to me like they are being rushed. What's with the horrible new/old map border for eg?

Haha, sorry, long post.

that map border was just a placement taken from the old game when they patched the ingame map to work better.

reflections. dont think they were turned off, but more toned down through the mma files. i didnt like the effect, it looked nice and shiny, but they were not so nice and shiny back in the day 1940. granted though because of the presence over enhanced effects it can appear to look better because its more interactive & dynamic in its environment but for me its wrong not realistic. when we see bare or polished metal then we should see these effects and through the series and modernised materials we should see this more.

regards photorealism. we dont get to that level with textures. its shaders that do the job of reality. the texture is just a scale presentation of an object in a non dynamic state. At the core context of Photorealism is the dynamic aspect, One example of further development was the furthered use of a shader that mimmicks distance and atmosphere and the combined colouring chaanges it can make as i had discussed here in this thread, and as luthier told us in the last update.

its all about the shaders with this sim and the context of photorealism.

you have touched upon the 4 tiles factor too Ekar. I had previously commented that if we had 1 or 2 more tiles in that mix to make 6 interacting tiles then we might be able to get further with what seems wrong as youve stated. i agree with that.

if i had free reign to mod an englaish scenery the scale as is. i would have a 9 map grid system, but at 1024x1024 size. This would allow regional variations upon the patch quiltwork effect. 3 main field types and for each type a transitional tile. If i get the chance to for e.g. fully re create the current scenery of england i will attempt this. but within the current format i just dont see the outcome of the work being actually worth it. i.i. no better than what we have at present. no point modding what 1C have done already, in many respects 1C nailed it given the current possibilites even though you may dislike it or be very opinionated of it.

[Ekar]

that map border was just a placement taken from the old game when they patched the ingame map to work better.

reflections. dont think they were turned off, but more toned down through the mma files. i didnt like the effect, it looked nice and shiny, but they were not so nice and shiny back in the day 1940. granted though because of the presence over enhanced effects it can appear to look better because its more interactive & dynamic in its environment but for me its wrong not realistic. when we see bare or polished metal then we should see these effects and through the series and modernised materials we should see this more.

regards photorealism. we dont get to that level with textures. its shaders that do the job of reality. the texture is just a scale presentation of an object in a non dynamic state. At the core context of Photorealism is the dynamic aspect, One example of further development was the furthered use of a shader that mimmicks distance and atmosphere and the combined colouring chaanges it can make as i had discussed here in this thread, and as luthier told us in the last update.

its all about the shaders with this sim and the context of photorealism.

you have touched upon the 4 tiles factor too Ekar. I had previously commented that if we had 1 or 2 more tiles in that mix to make 6 interacting tiles then we might be able to get further with what seems wrong as youve stated. i agree with that.

if i had free reign to mod an englaish scenery the scale as is. i would have a 9 map grid system, but at 1024x1024 size. This would allow regional variations upon the patch quiltwork effect. 3 main field types and for each type a transitional tile. If i get the chance to for e.g. fully re create the current scenery of england i will attempt this. but within the current format i just dont see the outcome of the work being actually worth it. i.i. no better than what we have at present. no point modding what 1C have done already, in many respects 1C nailed it given the current possibilites even though you may dislike it or be very opinionated of it.


You might be right about the reflections- I do prefer a bit of shininess on the planes exactly because its a more dynamic look. But I do have trouble believing the original planes were that matt. I mean, they were mostly straight out of the factory I assume. Watching this video the other day-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFj8NDqZhlc

I also noticed the shininess of the Spit- right in the first shot you see a very metallic looking reflection along the side panels, much closer to the video posted in Luthiers thread, than what is ingame currently. I'm not a WWII plane expert at all so I can't tell you if they've gone to extra trouble to polish the planes up for display or not. Anyway... it's probably just another thing to argue over, like the colour of the grass.

Regards shaders and the environment, it will be interesting to see what changes after the next lighting update. I think they might be headed in the right direction but I still think the textures are very important. They both work off each other. One thing I thought might help is the use of a detail texture- just like WOP uses on its terrain, in order to break up the pixelation at lower altitudes. I can't imagine WOP's terrain textures are higher res than in CloD, but the detail texture helps to sell the illusion of higher res.

PS, Going off topic now, but I'm also really into shaders. In fact, I've just started a blog about shaders and materials in Maya. Its a tutorial driven site with tips on how to make various handy shaders. Check it out when you've got a free moment Ali :) (although not much content right now)

http://materialism-blog.blogspot.com/

Philip-

Currently the look of the textures is like a patchwork quilt, whereas in reality, the fields in England are usually grouped closely together reuslting in large areas of grassland and similar areas of crop-fields

Yeah, those were my initial thoughts about the landscape as well. I voiced my concern to Oleg some months ago about it, he reassured me at the time but I can't remember what he actually said now. PS, I haven't abandoned this terrain mod stuff, I just want to tread lightly and not use up all my energy, or waste all my energy. Be good to let the sim settle down a bit I think. :)

edit- finally, working AA....

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=25281

Happy days :)

[CrisGer]

I saw the threads about working AA last night, that is quite a development.

So is there any form of this landscape texture mod that we can try out?..i understand the decision to let the developers proceeed....so if not that is fine.

Re the shine, i have heard some crews (ground crews) tried wax to gain speed, perhaps that is what they were aiming for in the sim..... i have no idea if it helped back when.

is there any way we can adjust the ini or the settings to get back a bit of that shine? I kind of like it for at least some things.

[Ali Fish]

howdy

i think Ekar has a project of sorts. i wont do more untill i have official help on modding, ie the SDK.

i do have a tree mod that recolours the trees to a more appropriate darker tone. see thread.

re shine, its all personal preference indeed !, personaly i just try not to confuse the eye candy that is a simple reflection with reality of materials. but there are " .mma " files that configure many of the shaders. so im sure it is possible. for this image i changed the shader effects. So it definetly is possible. suprised nobody is tinkering.
http://i.imgur.com/F8n5cs.jpg (http://imgur.com/F8n5c)


I saw the threads about working AA last night, that is quite a development.

So is there any form of this landscape texture mod that we can try out?..i understand the decision to let the developers proceeed....so if not that is fine.

Re the shine, i have heard some crews (ground crews) tried wax to gain speed, perhaps that is what they were aiming for in the sim..... i have no idea if it helped back when.

is there any way we can adjust the ini or the settings to get back a bit of that shine? I kind of like it for at least some things.

[Ekar]

Ali says:

" for this image i changed the shader effects."


This is one of the nicest images I've seen from CloD. It's been the main pic to my custom homepage for months.

[philip.ed]

Ali, is that completely unedited?! That's that nicest CloD shot I have yet to see (I remember being equally gob-smacked when I first saw it)
The lighting looks perfect.

[adonys]

well ali, maybe you can share the modified shader with us, please?

[katdogfizzow]

I'm trying to work out what happened. They showed up when I first made the post, but now they don't.

If you right click the broken link icon and copy url, then you can see the images. I'll edit this post when I've fixed things.

Use tinypic.

whatever.org sucks balls

[Ali Fish]

Ali, is that completely unedited?! That's that nicest CloD shot I have yet to see (I remember being equally gob-smacked when I first saw it)
The lighting looks perfect.

prior to v v14550 i changed a few shader settings. the shaders have subsequently changed.. the result was the same image but i used colour balance on photoshop to simply balance the colours out as at that time i was discussing how il2 general colour balance seemed wrong. (to much red balance everywhere) the result was that image which blew me away too lol. the original image was exactly the same i just balanced the excessive red. when this sim is upto par with "MY" expectations i shall continue to do what i do.

[Ali Fish]

i Found the original 1920 x1080 raw screenshot \o/ \o/ that was the shaders i re jigged/balanced a few months ago. another effect i added back then was surface reflection flash due to the heightened speculars. so..... you can see the red balance differences. it was approx 18:30 in that shot which was not representing a realistic light for that time of day in summer. hence the colour balance change. which was the only post processing of any sort. Try it for yourself !

http://i.imgur.com/2AQOOl.jpg (http://imgur.com/2AQOO)

[philip.ed]

That looks amazing. Would it be possible for you to play with the current version of the game, and see is this is possible to achieve? It would be interesting to see how this looks during daylight, too. :cool:

Awesome work mate!

[Ali Fish]

thanks m8, i did write about 400 words about why i dont want mod this sim anymore ..... but really its agitating me just discussing it. If that little dream ive had about modding this to the best of my abbility re occurs ill be right on it. But for now they dont waste time on anyone here so im not wasting another 100 hrs of this sim untill its worth its weight in time. as far as im concerned 1C owe me 100 hours due to there lies and inability to converse as we currently do in the modern western world.

Not adapting to modernity in this fashion and the reluctance of change in general are traits i do not expect Luthier & co to have. But they do none the less. its practical ignorance now.

i feel disrespected as a customer presently but i'll wait patiently.

[philip.ed]

Fair enough mate, can't say I disagree either!

[Ali Fish]

that dream may come back sooner than i even thought after 4:47 today \o/. i sense a smile coming from the corner of my mouth lol.... and with some actuall information and general niceties from luthier. well i will eat my words. more of this and well ... if my dream is re kindled ive no reason to complain.

[philip.ed]

that dream may come back sooner than i even thought after 4:47 today \o/. i sense a smile coming from the corner of my mouth lol.... and with some actuall information and general niceties from luthier. well i will eat my words. more of this and well ... if my dream is re kindled ive no reason to complain.

Well said mate. Will you be looking into the shaders of the next patch when it is released? Looking at the video Luthier posted, the shadows don't look as dark as in the current version of the sim. It will be interesting to see what work they've actually done.

[Ali Fish]

well there should be a map making sdk soonish, so regards shaders yeah ill be lookin at that and the shader textures.

need ideas for maps tbh ¿?¿?.(more interested in large multiplayer maps)

i like how they have implemented the atmospherics on these latest updates, but i get the feeling its still not dynamic like my version of the same concept was, (shaded mip maps).

[JG1_Luckystrike]

Do we need this thread anymore ? :grin:

[Ali Fish]

im glad to say "NO we dont need this thread anymore" !

[Ali Fish]

but we may need a mod for the pre computed atmopsherics scatter technology.

[Ekar]

Ali- PM sent..

[philip.ed]

Sorry guys- here are a few day shots.

http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_85177.jpg (http://imageupload.org/?d=7840900A1)

http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_85178.jpg (http://www.imageupload.org/?d=328997641)

http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_85179.jpg (http://www.imageupload.org/?d=9DAC3ADF1)

Was just wondering what happened to this project. It looked bloody awesome (just like Ali's spitfire picture a page or so back).

[Ali Fish]

i care only about DCS and the DCS " World " of opportunity for everyone. if they throw BFM at me with some respect and without required payment. i shall return. fat chance of that ehh ? so thats why i cant be arsed with this side of flight simming. besides ive joined a virtual aerobatics group now (virtual tuskegee airmen) which will consume all of my time in the skies. and working the texturing over at DCS like nothing ive done before. so bye bye to modding Clod and whatever comes after.

[JG52Krupi]

Pity but if aerobatics is what your interested in then it's no wonder cod doesn't do anything for you.

I still believe cod is the best ww2 flight simulator out ATM and looking at the competition, or the lack of it, it is not going to be knocked off the top spot anytime soon...

[philip.ed]

That's a shame, Ali. I still think that shaders tweak you did produced the best screenshot I've ever seen in a flight-sim.

Did Ekar drop his ground-texture project? it looked so promising as well.

[Ali Fish]

hi phillip, im still doing my thing ! what you think. this is the profile view at 07:00 hrs with some sparse clouds in the vacinity. and of course some shader work, custom templates etc etc. all ingame shots asides the border darkening.(DCS World)

http://i1003.photobucket.com/albums/af156/AliFishGMT/1ca93174.png

[philip.ed]

That looks absolutely stunning! I thought it was a photo for a minute.

Could something similar be achieved in CloD? It reminds me of the spitfire pictures posted in an early update topic which were presented in bare aluminium.

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

I agree Ali that is fantastic mate......WOW

[SQB]

That looks absolutely stunning! I thought it was a photo for a minute.

Could something similar be achieved in CloD? It reminds me of the spitfire pictures posted in an early update topic which were presented in bare aluminium.

They removed reflections on aircraft early on, if they could be modded back in it would be fantastic, if not we just have to wait. It was one of my favourite things in the game...

[philip.ed]

I remember the reflections. I was in two minds about them: they looked pretty awesome, but were overdone on the Spitfire and Hurricane.

[Ali Fish]

i didnt realise the relections were taken away, its a tough one design wise, where as the lovely p51 was rolled out the factory in shinney metal form, and adapted from there for combat. Red tails/ tuskegee airmen kept most of the metalic effects present, im sure most planes came in that form to some degree, but the idea was to mute all the object effects down for visual purposes. so to not have them does make sense in terms of performance in a sim that simply cant perform very well.

i remeber when i looked at the files in p51 and noticed how they do there special effects and i instantly noticed and thought wow its all here but they are not being used. nobody is using it !!! so then the metallics came about. but its a strange situation too. im posting outrageus images compared to others and im feeling that they all i think im photoshoping them etc. one aspect that is quite phenominal is my owning a Gforce 670 card. thats where the power for these images is coming from, but its still ingame un edited.

come check our newly created display team fb page, chuck yeager recently had a looksee on us :)
https://www.facebook.com/virtualtuskegeeairmen

[Robo.]

i remeber when i looked at the files in p51 and noticed how they do there special effects and i instantly noticed and thought wow its all here but they are not being used. nobody is using it !!! so then the metallics came about. but its a strange situation too. im posting outrageus images compared to others and im feeling that they all i think im photoshoping them etc. one aspect that is quite phenominal is my owning a Gforce 670 card. thats where the power for these images is coming from, but its still ingame un edited.


With all due respect no one thinks you're photoshoping them, you did a great job using available specular textures and yes, DCS looks that good even on 560Ti. Rest is just time of the day etc. just like CloD.

DCS P-51 looks like photograph sometimes:

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/10668862/misc/formacia.jpg

Looking forward for your skins when you relese them.

[philip.ed]

I think this shot is pretty outstanding:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/532968_379846062061401_728420084_n.jpg

Loving your work on the P-51. If the scenery in DCS was up to scratch the whole thing could look photographic.

[Stublerone]

Some cool pics, I must admit. But why do u like the last pic? For me, the pits in dcs series are detailed enough, but are far, far away from CoD so far from depth impression. It looks like a small enhancement over il2 1946 with some mods.

Sorry, but the planes do not reach the detail of CoD in my opinion.

But what I really would like to know: Only few are tryinf to analyse this game as it was already done with il2! What about flight dynamics, wind and air under the wings? What about the performance data compared to the real world data? Is it suiting to the right P51? Is motor management completely accurate? What about dynamic campaigns? Great missions or just flying?

SORRY, but this is again an unfair comparison. A bunch of you talk hilarious things about every dcs game, bit noone really did the work to ask questions for performance.

Clod is (compared to that reactions) always in discussion. I am aware of bugs and fm issues, but what are u intending to get with this dcs p51 thread, which seems to be the uber game for some of u.

Dcs normally has no good fm engine to simulate flying. It is a military flight sim, where nobody ever compared to real life data. It is still lock on engine after years of promises to get a new engine. Additionally, the recent engine reworks force us to buy dcs blackshark 2 and nobody complained about the additional costs. Still no satisfying missions (very static) and still no dedicated server possibilties, which they had also promised years ago for blackshark.

Again sorry, but you do not compare fair, when talking about dcs. Perhaps you are happy, because u think, that the army bought this too? Nothing to complain? Loooooooool, thats not near to hilarious. Stop advertising a game, which also has the same bunch of problems in a slightly other way. I also have friends, who will never touch dcs anymore, because their promises will also never come true!!!

Done ;)

[philip.ed]

I agree, the pits in CloD are much better.

But what I love about that particular shot is the effect of the propeller, the reflection in the front windscreen, and the slight green effect. It looks awesome (at least to me). There was an early shot of CloD which showed a spitfire cockpit, and the gunsight glass had this similar green reflection-effect. It looked beautiful, clearly showing that the glass for the gunsight had different properties than the perspex in front of it.

[Ali Fish]

the prop was a mod of mine, the cockpit textures are all modded by me in that shot.

Dcs normally has no good fm engine to simulate flying.

this comment really gets me ! are you referring to lockon because DCS has the most competant realistic FM ive ever tried. there is whats called a SFM, standard flightmodel, lock on flaming cliffs1/2 and all AI behaviour over the range within the new DCs world. ,and then the AFM advanced flight model that isnt quite open to the publics understanding, thats the ka50, the su25, the a10 and the p51D. the AFM itself is extensive i can assure you. within it we have a helicopter, a ww2 warbird, and an a-10c with full systems implementation. that tech is incredible in my eyes then...... to have a prop driven aircraft within DCS was the icing on the cake for my understanding about just how good DCS was over the whole range of whats possible in flightsimming. geez if they created a glider non powered flight sim addon it would probally be the best. btw DCS world, p51, su25,,ka50, a10 is still beta. for me presently it is the best flightsim ive ever touched. without dynamic campaigns and whatever else it apparently lacks. actually its all about the FM its that good.

also dcs gets developed properly. no pushing crap out the door here, no releasing shaders to then retract them. no epileptic warnings. want me to go on?. DCS works thats all, and whats more it has a future that isnt going down the wrong path, the feedback is constructivly taken, no over zealous administration behind your opinion, you want to know why ?- because it damn well works. DCS team has a p51 to work from, real pilots have evaluated the FM to be precise and i believe them. usaf invited a dcs user to there real training facilities. the user competantly flew the whole sortie without help by the side of the flabergasted trainers. and you want to tell me DCS isnt worth anything over il2 ? your mis informed due to lack of interest and knowledge. this is the base that all DCS users exist in, they dont need to go about shouting about there sim. because it does not get better anywhere else at its core.. it gets worse you see. Fact. and its nothing to shout about. so that why DCS are a quiet informed bunch of users. they survive on a solid core foundation, bells and whilstles are not essential....lol whistles are required for the gunports on the p51 actually.

[itgl72]

the prop was a mod of mine, the cockpit textures are all modded by me in that shot.



this comment really gets me ! are you referring to lockon because DCS has the most competant realistic FM ive ever tried. there is whats called a SFM, standard flightmodel, lock on flaming cliffs1/2 and all AI behaviour over the range within the new DCs world. ,and then the AFM advanced flight model that isnt quite open to the publics understanding, thats the ka50, the su25, the a10 and the p51D. the AFM itself is extensive i can assure you. within it we have a helicopter, a ww2 warbird, and an a-10c with full systems implementation. that tech is incredible in my eyes then...... to have a prop driven aircraft within DCS was the icing on the cake for my understanding about just how good DCS was over the whole range of whats possible in flightsimming. geez if they created a glider non powered flight sim addon it would probally be the best. btw DCS world, p51, su25,,ka50, a10 is still beta. for me presently it is the best flightsim ive ever touched. without dynamic campaigns and whatever else it apparently lacks. actually its all about the FM its that good.

also dcs gets developed properly. no pushing crap out the door here, no releasing shaders to then retract them. no epileptic warnings. want me to go on?. DCS works thats all, and whats more it has a future that isnt going down the wrong path, the feedback is constructivly taken, no over zealous administration behind your opinion, you want to know why ?- because it damn well works. DCS team has a p51 to work from, real pilots have evaluated the FM to be precise and i believe them. usaf invited a dcs user to there real training facilities. the user competantly flew the whole sortie without help by the side of the flabergasted trainers. and you want to tell me DCS isnt worth anything over il2 ? your mis informed due to lack of interest and knowledge. this is the base that all DCS users exist in, they dont need to go about shouting about there sim. because it does not get better anywhere else at its core.. it gets worse you see. Fact. and its nothing to shout about. so that why DCS are a quiet informed bunch of users. they survive on a solid core foundation, bells and whilstles are not essential....lol whistles are required for the gunports on the p51 actually.


Have to +1 this. He is right. That being said, I would like to see IL2 CoD succeed because there is a market for it.

[Smokeythelung]

What about flight dynamics, wind and air under the wings? What about the performance data compared to the real world data?

If your only flying experience is with il2 sims I would have to venture a guess and say that you probably couldn't even takeoff/land in the DCS P51. It's actually "simulating" ;) a p51 and it is consequently much more demanding...

Il2 clod of dover is a more fun game than DCS, which I agree is very static...But as a flight simulator DCS has no real equal imho

[Ali Fish]

must have missed that part you quoted. lol. heres the prop wash video for stublerone, should enough air under them wings to enlighten one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUgDqhPnekw

[Madfish]

Well, that beta footage? looks very realistic... for a UFO :P Is it still like that?