Anton, there are some SERIOUS multiplayer issues...

[TempestV]

Hi guys, first post and all but I think the games great. Really looking forward to some DLC planes....maybe a Tempest?

I do think the online play does need a tweek if it's possible. I agree with the quote below, it would certainly make online play that much better.

Originally Posted by nsabournemouth

One thing that does hack me off is the having to re-invite your friends every time or is there a way to avoid this?

I think the COD4/5 online system is brilliant and a version of that would work brilliantly on IL2.

Once again, great game and I look forward to your solutions.

TempestV

[niroe]

I really hope you can sort out something with the crashing on purpose. I understand some people crash and it can't be avoided. If you crash because your plane is damaged, you flew too low and clipped something or you stalled at low altitude, I can handle that. When people head straight towards the ground in an attempt to avoid the other person/team gaining a point, then thats blatant cheating. Its happened a few times to me

The other thing that annoys me with crashing, shoot a few rounds in the enemy and then crash head on. You shouldn't get any points for suiciding! Some mid-air collisions cant be helped, fine - but to crash into another plane in the desperate hope you get the point, its dumb.

[Rhah]

I've not actually had any deliberate crashes happen to me yet while playing online, although I haven't played all that many matches. One thing I did notice is that I stacked my plane a couple of times during dogfights because I was using the tracking camera and lost my bearings at low level. Thats not a problem with the game obviously (just bad flying on my part) but it might explain some of the crashing.

As for mid-air crashes.... I can really see that being a problem in strike games. I remember on IL-2 on the PC getting rammed by idiots while flying a bomber...
I've noticed that a lot of people have been asking how to unlock the B17, or to have a Lanc as DLC... thats all well and good, but wait till you've been Kamikaze'd a few times while on a bomb run!!

[Raw Kryptonite]

"I keep hearing the little "hit" sound, as I spray a target with bullets, yet they don't die (one guy was spewing smoke as I got three "hit" sounds in a row, still didn't die!)"

This actually speaks well of the game and the damage model, IMO. The planes should be able to get shot up, exploding should be a function of where they get shot and what the plane is.

Haven't seen explosions at respawn, but we have seen people at the start of the round seem to either spawn too close causing it, or they spawn so close that when one moves out of "formation" they collide.

As for MP rooms, I think that will pick up as more people finish the game and have a good number of planes unlocked. Many people don't even know the game came out early. It will pick up. If you have a good connection (upload speed in particular) just host a room. People pop in with my friends and I very quickly. We see no lag at all, unlike almost every other game out there at launch.

[Flying Coffin]

The main issue that people are having with the multiplayer is the damage model on Arcade. I'm talking about the 360 mainstream gamers here, not the flight sim fans etc. If you check out the forums around the net there's a growing number of people spreading the word that it takes ages to bring a plane down in Arcade and that you get nothing in the way of score if somebody else finishes off your target after you've done all the hard work.

People are quitting because of this. They spend a lot of time hammering plane after plane and score nothing. I was talking to two players today who both pointed out they felt the game had wasted their time online.

People are also passing on the game after rental because of this. The 360 is a console and the gamer demographic is radically different to that of pc gamers. Most gamers on the 360 want a fast action air combat game that looks pretty and has a much more immediate multiplayer than the game currently offers. They are not interested in Realistic or Simulation modes.

The picture being painted on this forum is a bit skewed because it's full of hardened flight simmers. The world at large has a far simpler issue with the online multi and it can be patched easily if the game is to attract a bigger player base.

[Yossarian]

Originally Posted by Flying Coffin

They are not interested in Realistic or Simulation modes.

After talking to a few friends with this game, they never even knew there was a realistic or sim mode because like a lot of gamers they never bothered with the tutorials and went straight into the campaign.

Added to that I've noticed in MP on realistic mode that most people don't know to lower elevator sensitivity and constantly spin and crash, then quit.

I have to admit that after my first couple of games online I did not like this game. I've played flight sims since the early 1980's and was not to bad on IL2 online either but after shooting someone loads of times with an aircraft armed with cannon and not getting kills I was like 'what the hell is wrong with this game'. You can't use boom and zoom tactics because you can't destroy an aircraft like that. I've played a game of dogfight where there was a train of 6 of us all following and shooting at the person in front for ages and no one got a credited kill, most people quit.

I do fear for the long term life of this game online. There are hardly any servers now, in a couple of week there will probably only be a few diehards that still play this.

[HornedGod]

I have experienced the 'explode just after respawn' bug once. I think there are enough reports of this in the wild for it to be a high priority fix.

I'll also add my voice to the clamor for someone getting a kill credit on a plane that deliberately crashes. It's probably all but impossible to determine if a crash is really deliberate or not, but I think the game should err on the side of trying to assign a kill for any crash. If a plane is at all damaged, whoever got the last hit should get the kill credit.

I think it would be nice to also give assist credits. This would go to whoever dealt the most damage to a downed plane but didn't deliver the final killing blow. This would especially appease the arcade crowd.

I think the comments about how the arcade/casual crowd finds it much harder to get a kill in MP is totally understandable. All you have to do is compare the accuracy and persistence needed between arcade campaign and arcade multiplayer to see a world of difference. In the campaign, all you need to do is shoot in the vague direction of a bogey to see them go down in flames. Playing multiplayer, it takes some concentrated fire to score a kill.

The campaign should teach players all they need to know about the rules of combat to be able to play against other humans in multiplayer. The differences in the damage modelling and weapon accuracy/assistance breaks this implicit rule, which is in turn making arcade players scratch their head and walk away from the game.

If the arcade campaign is nothing but one hit kills then the same should be true in arcade multiplayer. This should be the default. If necessary (and something I think should be kept) there could be an option to have the current arcade mp damage modelling.

[moozicmon]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

1) Never heard of this. Will check.
2) Just lag. Nothing van be done from our side. Try to select games from nearby places (with smalle ping) or host session
3) If you simply hit someone, doesn't mean that they die immediately. Considering that you have prooved lag, probably not all of your bullets really find a target.
4) That will be addressed in a neares update. Although it is more complicated that it seems to be, but it will be addressed somehow. Details soon.
5) It is called NAT configuration, I assume. Network configurations can be very sophisticated, and not all of the sessions can be joined. Try to select another game. Or there are simply no MP games available.

Anton,

Thanks for responding, I can't tell you how much it is appreciated.

I hope it is understood that I am speaking from the perspective of your average gamer. While realistic and simulation mode are pretty much spot on, Arcade mode is just a little too frustrating for your average "pick up and go" gamer. The future of this game, and any other sim-esque games depends on a strong MP community. Once you have lost people, it is very hard to get them back.

I am sure you and your team are doing everything to make the MP experience the best it can be, but it is crucial to get any changes implemented ASAP in order to build a strong online community.

Best of luck!

[moozicmon]

Originally Posted by Flying Coffin

The main issue that people are having with the multiplayer is the damage model on Arcade. I'm talking about the 360 mainstream gamers here, not the flight sim fans etc. If you check out the forums around the net there's a growing number of people spreading the word that it takes ages to bring a plane down in Arcade and that you get nothing in the way of score if somebody else finishes off your target after you've done all the hard work.

People are quitting because of this. They spend a lot of time hammering plane after plane and score nothing. I was talking to two players today who both pointed out they felt the game had wasted their time online.

People are also passing on the game after rental because of this. The 360 is a console and the gamer demographic is radically different to that of pc gamers. Most gamers on the 360 want a fast action air combat game that looks pretty and has a much more immediate multiplayer than the game currently offers. They are not interested in Realistic or Simulation modes.

The picture being painted on this forum is a bit skewed because it's full of hardened flight simmers. The world at large has a far simpler issue with the online multi and it can be patched easily if the game is to attract a bigger player base.

I absolutely agree with you and despite the fact it's SP is amazing, if this game does not get a good player base it's future will be grim...

[Pauwus]

My two cents. I'm not good at flight simulators, and don't know much about individual planes, however, saying that, the arcade difficulty online is perfect for someone like me.

I think the planes 'health' (such a newb i know) in online is perfect, makes playing online a really fun, enjoyable, intense and visceral experience. I love the fact that you can have battles with one person that can last the entire game. I can't see how people can complain about how hard it is to kill someone online, because it's all about positioning. If you're miles away shooting someone, then you're not gonna get very far.

I've had the game for what, two days, and i'm finding online on arcade difficulty perfect, and pretty balanced too. I do agree that there should be some way of tracking people who just crash in the ground to avoid letting someone get a kill. However, i think the damage model is fine, especially for mainstream gamers, as i'm one of them! It's just a matter of playing for a little bit, learning how to turn quicker than your opponent, and figuring out how the reticule system works. I cant tell you how opposed i'd be to changing the damage model in online mode.

The thing that makes this game different and more fun to the rest of them is that i dont rack up 20 kills to 10 deaths, its that i barely get more than 3-5 kills every game. This makes it more intense and personal, and means you dont constantly get pissed off with dying. People are only complaining because they're not very good at the moment, not to mention people choosing rediculously lousy brick planes in online mode.

In summary, the damage model for online is perfect. It just requires a little bit of skill to figure out how to do the most damage. This is coming from one of the most mainstream 360 gamers out there.