Friday 2010-12-03 Dev. update and Discussion

[Asheshouse]

Originally Posted by Necrobaron

I often find the criticism leveled at SoW overly pedantic or just outright silly, but it seems to me that if the map is as far off as some are saying, that's a big deal. I would say correctly modelling the area over which the Battle largely occured is absolutely important.

If for whatever reason the map has been developed based on modern urban areas then at this stage it may be financially impractical to consider significant changes. The historic info for the uk is available http://www.npemap.org.uk/

From the NPE site:

If you drop us an email letting us know which areas you are interested in (ideally either sheet numbers, or the whole lot), and confirm that your use falls within the tile licence, we can work out the best way to let you get the tiles. It may even be possible for us to post you a dvd of the tiles, but we'll normally request a donation to OpenStreetMap in-leui of the postage.

Using the 1940's maps would significantly reduce map objects in urban areas therfore would presumably benefit fps/gameplay, to everyones benefit.

If it is too late for official changes maybe include the necessary tools with the FMB to edit the map and it could be done unofficially and later adopted, if the work is good enough.

[Triggaaar]

Originally Posted by Necrobaron

I often find the criticism leveled at SoW overly pedantic or just outright silly, but it seems to me that if the map is as far off as some are saying, that's a big deal. I would say correctly modelling the area over which the Battle largely occured is absolutely important.

I agree. If this was any usual 'game' that we were looking at, we wouldn't care, but this isn't your usual game. Oleg has set the highest standards. Following previous update discussion you see the effort he has gone to regarding the landscape and photo-realistic colour, and he has gone to lengths to explain to us why it should look different from the sky than we're used to seeing on the ground. SoW could give us quite a unique look at the 1940s landscape and really help with immersion. It's too late now for widespread changes, but if there are a few significant errors I imagine the developer that created that section of the map could make changes quite quickly. It would be disappointing if the release isn't a good representation of the way it was - partly because it wouldn't have been much more work to get it right than to get it wrong.

[Blackdog_kt]

Originally Posted by swiss

Awesome!
You had to crosscheck google earth to even notice.

This is game - Not a history sightseeing tour, also they won't use it in history class.


What is wrong with you guys?

I wouldn't really mind that much to be honest, as i don't expect a house for house recreation of Britain in the summer of 1940, just an accurate enough approximation that focuses mostly on terrain outline (rivers, coastlines, elevation data, etc).

However, this is not only about accuracy. If this is true then the developers have spent a lot of time working on urban areas that they could have left out, which is a real pity when they have tried so hard and faced so many delays.

Plus it would also benefit frame rates to have the smaller 1940s-size towns. Who knows, maybe the time already spent on it and the resources needed to run the extra, post war urban areas could have been enough to model a few more airfields to the north for the people who want to fly as 12 Group pilots.

That being said, what's done is done and to be honest i don't worry much because i know the high standards of support and add-on content that comes from this company. This is a long-term project and as the development team have said a lot of times, the real work starts after the release of the first title.

To me that means that while we might not have a 100% accurate map of Britain now, we could have it after a couple of expansions and provided the games sell well enough. If sales are good they could probably assign a few people to correct the mistakes, which in this case consists of deleting items from the map, so it should be much easier than adding to it. Maybe two years in the future we will get a big patch with a new map replacing the current one, featuring smaller towns and a few more kilometers of coverage to the north of the current map, who knows?

Also this:

Originally Posted by nearmiss

Talking about the map can't hurt. Afterall Oleg did post the update expecting feedback.

I just feel sorry for the amount of extra work these guys had to put in now that it's obvious they could have skipped it, that's all

[JVM]

The truth is we have no idea what has been done, nor more than what we know about clouds...
So far Oleg showed us mainly FMB features...the only comment he made about the map was about its size (to Foo'bar); It is true that what is shown is a 2000 content map: who says this map served as a basis for the real 3D landscape?

It would not have been that difficult to assemble this 2000 map with easily found internet data, and maybe this is what MG did at first to have an idea of the size to use, and first placement of airfields (which shows some mistakes consistent with the use of modern maps to begin with, like in Arras)...

In other words, maybe this post was about FMB, using an old placeholder map...Why panic and risk saying something stupid?

Be sure Oleg has towns of precise documentation since a while, on the English as well as the French landscapes! Have faith...

JV

[Abbeville-Boy]

Originally Posted by JVM

The truth is we have no idea what has been done, nor more than what we know about clouds...
So far Oleg showed us mainly FMB features...the only comment he made about the map was about its size (to Foo'bar); It is true that what is shown is a 2000 content map: who says this map served as a basis for the real 3D landscape?

It would not have been that difficult to assemble this 2000 map with easily found internet data, and maybe this is what MG did at first to have an idea of the size to use, and first placement of airfields (which shows some mistakes consistent with the use of modern maps to begin with, like in Arras)...

In other words, maybe this post was about FMB, using an old placeholder map...Why panic and risk saying something stupid?

Be sure Oleg has towns of precise documentation since a while, on the English as well as the French landscapes! Have faith...

JV

+1

i dont think the team would be that foolish to give themselves so much extra work. lets keep the faith here, the map will be reflective of that time in history im betting

[Sutts]

You guys are right. I've been a bit too hasty to judge perhaps. What we see on the zoomed out map doesn't necessarily reflect the 3D world underneath.
I've got so much hope invested in this product that it gets the better of me sometimes.

I'll shut up and wait to see what we get.

A whole new housing estate as been built in my area since Oleg first announced SOW hopefully this will be on the map.

[AndyJWest]

Originally Posted by Tree_UK

A whole new housing estate as been built in my area since Oleg first announced SOW hopefully this will be on the map.

:I don't suppose you could tell us where you live, Tree? I'll gladly remove all the houses Oleg has put on the map: from 3000m, in a He 111...

[Insuber]

I humbly suggest to refrain from intellectual overload about hypoteses and partial information. It's a game, and few houses or a railway here and there will not alter by much the pleasure of playing it. At least for me.

Again: priority number 1 is to play BoB asap ... small fixes will follow, if necessary.

Cheers,
Insuber

[Chivas]

Its highly doubtful that the development team would have the time and energy to model the towns and cities as large as they were in 1940, let alone later.