More severe moderation in update threads?

[Jimko]

Originally Posted by YellowPaw

This is my first post here though I've been following Il2 (and now SoW) since being hooked by the original demo back in the stone age when pentiums ruled the earth.

I've been avidly following the progress of our new great sim since it was announced but, before now, I've never felt the need to comment since, whenever I pondered some interesting question I might ask, someone else generally went ahead and asked it for me (maybe I'm just slow).

Now, however, I feel a bit left out as this hearty debate progresses so I thought I'd add my own observations to the fray:

Over the last few weeks I've found myself wincing every now and then at the occasional crass statement or question directed at Oleg, but I've generally reassured myself that Oleg himself (who is after all grown-up) recognises idiocy when he sees it and doesn't take it too personally. I'm sure he gets annoyed, as most of us would, but I doubt anyone as capable and confident in his professional abilities as Oleg clearly is, is going to take it to heart.

In addition, I've never felt those crass statements or questions were intended to be malicious in any way (obvious trolls aside), so for my part (and mine alone), I don't have too much of a problem with ill-considered posts directed at the devs or the game itself. I've actually done a few ill-considered things in my own life and I don't have it in me to censure it in others where I find no malice behind it (or if I do I keep it to myself).

And anyway, I haven't done a comparative post count as such but I don't believe it is these inconsequential blatherings that fill up these threads to such herculanean proportions... it is the responses to them - and the responses to the responses.

In the end, it is the rage and insults spent in pursuit of the 'wicked' that leaves me with the occasional bad feeling when I read these threads. I honestly don't believe you can legislate against idiocy, since all of us are guilty at one time or another and at the same time no one is irredeemable. Manners, and respect, however, should be something we are all capable of. Oleg made a statement recently calling for patience. I took to this to mean something akin to tolerance for one another but I may be wrong.

So can't we all just try a little respect and a little more humility.

Anyway, that's my first post (there are probably too many brackets, but I like brackets) and I'm off to bed - it's a cold night in blighty.

Praise the Oleg and pass the ammunition.

Hear Hear! Well stated, YellowPaw!

As I was reading these posts, I was formulating a reply when I came to yours and discovered that you have already stated my thoughts (and probably the thoughts of many others) on this matter.

So I will just reiterate the point that Oleg made and that you drew attention to. Polite, respectful forum protocol...something that everyone should be capable of. This is the one aspect that, when ignored, I think deserves severe and swift moderation

Unless the rules governing the posting of questions and opinions in the 'Update' forum are spelled out very carefully to restrict the kind of postings made, then stopping those kinds of comments is a form of censorship that really defeats the purpose of discussion. And that's why I say that the rules governing the posts would have to change and be spelled out very carefully so as to be very restrictive, and, would likely eliminate meaningful discussions .

As it stands, I wouldn't want to see anyone prohibited from asking questions, stating opinions, or entering into POLITE discussions and debates. I can handle all that and I readily filter Oleg's comments when I need to. I am still of the opinion that there is no such thing as a 'stupid question', (probably because I can be guilty of many examples of them), although sometimes a question is ill-timed or not well thought out beforehand...a minor annoyance, not a major crime.

But the denigration of others should not be tolerated, and there are many forums where it's not. I believe that was the aspect that concerned Oleg and the reason he addressed us with his comment.

[baronWastelan]

I don't care. This forum sucks and you're all gonna die.

[JG52Uther]

Originally Posted by baronWastelan

I don't care. This forum sucks and you're all gonna die.

You see,this is just the sort of thing that could get a ban.The poster might think he is being funny,but humour does not always travel well on the net,with lots of people from different countries.

[nearmiss]

Don't take the baron serious he's older than dirt and twice as ugly.

[BadAim]

We'll someone had to break up the civility of this thread, it's actually making me wretch a little.

Seriously though, WTG guys. Like I said before, we need to moderate ourselves first, and it looks like that's happening here. If we can get that spirit moved over to the update thread tomorrow we'll be all good.

[YellowPaw]

@ Splitter - Thanks for the comment - I would like to post more often but I'm not sure I have too much to offer. I'm reasonably well-educated about WW2 and its aircraft but no where near the walking encyclopaedias that frequent this forum - I come here to read, to be honest, and I hugely enjoy it! Though I do feel the odd question rearing its head as SoW nears completion.

Originally Posted by Jimko

...

Unless the rules governing the posting of questions and opinions in the 'Update' forum are spelled out very carefully to restrict the kind of postings made, then stopping those kinds of comments is a form of censorship that really defeats the purpose of discussion. And that's why I say that the rules governing the posts would have to change and be spelled out very carefully so as to be very restrictive, and, would likely eliminate meaningful discussions .

As it stands, I wouldn't want to see anyone prohibited from asking questions, stating opinions, or entering into POLITE discussions and debates. I can handle all that and I readily filter Oleg's comments when I need to. I am still of the opinion that there is no such thing as a 'stupid question', (probably because I can be guilty of many examples of them), although sometimes a question is ill-timed or not well thought out beforehand...a minor annoyance, not a major crime.

But the denigration of others should not be tolerated, and there are many forums where it's not. I believe that was the aspect that concerned Oleg and the reason he addressed us with his comment.

Actually, I think in supporting my comment, you have rather surpassed it. - Very clearly stated. Damn.

[nearmiss]

Originally Posted by YellowPaw

@ Splitter - Thanks for the comment - I would like to post more often but I'm not sure I have too much to offer. I'm reasonably well-educated about WW2 and its aircraft but no where near the walking encyclopaedias that frequent this forum - I come here to read, to be honest, and I hugely enjoy it! Though I do feel the odd question rearing its head as SoW nears completion.

Actually, I think in supporting my comment, you have rather surpassed it. - Very clearly stated. Damn.

Often troublesome members and their postings are deleted and no one even knows of it.

I think we all agree there should be some latitude or allowances made in postings, if the poster doesn't go too far.

[GOA_Potenz]

But what is exactly what are you looking for to people to say in Updates threads???

There are a lot of stupid question in those threads, but there are lot of good ones too, so moderators can't keep deleting or warning people just cause some
of the senior members doesn't like their questions.

Have you ever realized that the main problems in forum or chats is the lack of
expresion in the letters, you can try to say something in a funny way but can
be missunderstood by other and end up in something bad.

I suffer that in one of the updates talking about the effects, i sated that were wrong and doesn't look right and then fans flame me for that, then i don't remember who, but one from oleg team said that they hated those effects more than anybody else and were just wip. the main point in this
is in an update thread all the forum users will not think the same and you
should not filter that, let everybody express them selves and then take
what it worth for you.

I remember another time that somebody asked when was the first time
that this sim was anounced, i answered the question, and i recive a PM from
nearmiss that answering that i was insulting oleg.

Lads please let the fellas out there really say what they really think, nice or
not it will help to improve the project, developer doesn't need lamers fro their
good, need compliments and complains.

Regards

Potenz.

[ECV56_Guevara]

Originally Posted by GOA_Potenz

But what is exactly what are you looking for to people to say in Updates threads???

There are a lot of stupid question in those threads, but there are lot of good ones too, so moderators can't keep deleting or warning people just cause some
of the senior members doesn't like their questions.
Lads please let the fellas out there really say what they really think, nice or
not it will help to improve the project, developer doesn't need lamers fro their
good, need compliments and complains.

Regards

Potenz.

+10 Buen post!
We must moderate ourselves before posting. And it´s so easy to recognize a troll when you read a forum, so it s simple.

[SlipBall]

Originally Posted by GOA_Potenz

But what is exactly what are you looking for to people to say in Updates threads???

There are a lot of stupid question in those threads, but there are lot of good ones too, so moderators can't keep deleting or warning people just cause some
of the senior members doesn't like their questions.

Have you ever realized that the main problems in forum or chats is the lack of
expresion in the letters, you can try to say something in a funny way but can
be missunderstood by other and end up in something bad.

I suffer that in one of the updates talking about the effects, i sated that were wrong and doesn't look right and then fans flame me for that, then i don't remember who, but one from oleg team said that they hated those effects more than anybody else and were just wip. the main point in this
is in an update thread all the forum users will not think the same and you
should not filter that, let everybody express them selves and then take
what it worth for you.

I remember another time that somebody asked when was the first time
that this sim was anounced, i answered the question, and i recive a PM from
nearmiss that answering that i was insulting oleg.

Lads please let the fellas out there really say what they really think, nice or
not it will help to improve the project, developer doesn't need lamers fro their
good, need compliments and complains.

Regards

Potenz.

The problem with the up-date thread as I see it, is that a question/complaint to Oleg, becomes a debate between members. I would like to see questions/complaints (and questions/complaints only) offered to Oleg, if he answer fine, if not then he doesn't want to answer. No need for other members to try and answer for him, or to criticize the question...in short only questions/complaints should be posted, with no follow up by other members (I have been guilty of this), and that includes "thanks for answering Oleg", which are not needed, and only add to the clutter.