FW190D-11 / D-13 question

[LcSummers]

Hello community,


why was the bottom paint of theses aircraft multicolored? Who of you can help me please?

Searched the internet but didnt found any answers.

Was it not easier for the manufacturer to overpaint the bottom surface with RLM76 or was it later done by the unit itself?

I know that the FW190D-13 YELLOW 10 (Major Franz Götz) top was overpainted in the "fields" to maximize consealment. But the lower surface?

Wich answer might be right?

1, The wings were spare parts from different airplanes?

2, There was a color shortage

3, Recognition for friendly FLAK not to shoot them (like Doras of JV44)



Thank you all for all answering these questions.;)


S!


LC

[JG26_EZ]

Do you have an example pic? I took a look for yellow 10, but can't see the multi-coloured part that you mention.

[TomcatViP]

There was a shortage of paint in Germany. I think that it was in matte 44 that they ordered all underside of fighter plane being left un-paint (unless the leading and trailing edge section).

Same for rubber. You can see on latte war picture that all service towed vehicules use concrete wheels instead of normal ones. ;)

I hope it's what you were expecting for answer.

[Robo.]

Wich answer might be right?

[QUOTE=LcSummers;461144]1, The wings were spare parts from different airplanes?

2, There was a color shortage

3, Recognition for friendly FLAK not to shoot them (like Doras of JV44

Hi mate, 3 is wrong. The reason for different RLM colours on the bottom of the late war Doras (and 109s for that matter) was that they came from different places and have been primed or painted the RLM 76 in the factory. At the very end of the war, the German industry got much more laid back on the standards and regulations (because they had to) and you see all sorts of colour combinations. Some parts were just primed in RLM02 and the a/c has been assembled and sent on the front to be used asap. Paint shortage was partially a reason...

[NZtyphoon]

Such was the shortage of raw materials for paint many of the late-war German aircraft (Fw190D, Bf 109G-14-10 and K-4) had natural metal undersurfaces except where components were wooden or steel; these were painted in the standard RLM 76.

[lonewulf]

Yes, agree with most of the comments above. As the War progressed, and standards slipped, German paint manufacturers often supplied paint in tints and tones that deviated in varying degrees from RLM standards. New upper surface tones were also introduced by the RLM in 1944, before the older redundant colours were formally withdrawn. This increased the potential for variation. In some instances these colours were not properly documented. Subcontractors were also forced to improvise from available paint stocks, including the newly approved defensive camouflage colours and mix and match as best they could. When these sub-assemblies were finally brought together and assembled as a finished aircraft, this relaxation in standards and the necessity for improvisation became apparent.

That said, in some cases garish striping was applied to the undersides of some Luftwaffe fighters in the final stages of the War and was indeed intended to assist the FLAK defenses, particularly around airfields, to distinguish between German and allied aircraft.

[Al Schlageter]

Hi mate, 3 is wrong. The reason for different RLM colours on the bottom of the late war Doras (and 109s for that matter) was that they came from different places and have been primed or painted the RLM 76 in the factory. At the very end of the war, the German industry got much more laid back on the standards and regulations (because they had to) and you see all sorts of colour combinations. Some parts were just primed in RLM02 and the a/c has been assembled and sent on the front to be used asap. Paint shortage was partially a reason...

http://www.ms-plus.com/images_item/24000/24146_1.jpg

[Robo.]

(JV44 Doras pic)

Yes, but the OP was asking if the random under surfaces on late war Doras served any ID purpose.. which they didn't. All of the above posts are correct, there are combinations of RLM 76 with some RLM 02 or just unpainted aluminium (most ofthen on the mid section of the wing between the landing gears and flaps / ailerons), some had even dark surfaces like RLM 83 used on the bottom of the wing. Different shades of RLM 76 were also not uncommon...

[LcSummers]

Thanks guys for your answers.

My own opinion was number 2, shortage of paint but i was not really sure.

For clearance i will upload a pix for what i meant. This is the D-13 but i know that D-11 had nearly the same mixed colours.


Any comment on this one is appreciated too.

[badfinger]

I have read that the red/white paint was put on tha 190D's because they were used to provide air cover for ME-262's during take off and landing. The stripes helped AA batteries distinguish the 190D from marauding Allied fighters that liked to pick off the 262's when they were most vulnerable. I've never seen other German fighters with similar stripes.

Binky9

[Robo.]

Thanks guys for your answers.

My own opinion was number 2, shortage of paint but i was not really sure.

For clearance i will upload a pix for what i meant. This is the D-13 but i know that D-11 had nearly the same mixed colours.


Any comment on this one is appreciated too.

Yeah that is quite typical undersurface of a very late war Doras. The aircraft parts were coming from different places (factories) and then assembled in another place. They came in painted to various degree hence the mix and match look...

The ailerons of this one are RLM 76 and so is the fuselage. The wings were left in natural aluminium on the bottom and the front section was painted in dark green RLM 83 colour in this case. The typical late war scheme was RLM 76 (later variant) on the bottom, RLM 82 and 83 on the top.

Some Doras had a finish in older RLM 75 with RLM 83. The one you posted seems to have RLM 75 and 83 combination with some more mottling apparently applied in the field in RLM 83 and 82 (the lighter of the 2 shades of green). Hope that helped.

[badfinger]

Google "190D red/white stripes", and you will find several web sites that say the stripes were used as I have described.

Binky9

[NZtyphoon]

The first experiments with unpainted undersurfaces started in July 1940 with a batch of 50 FW 190s: http://www.amazon.com/Luftwaffe-Colours-1935-Michael-Ullmann/dp/1902109074
http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k304/Major_Sharpe/latewarLuftwaffecamouflage-page-004a.jpg
http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k304/Major_Sharpe/latewarLuftwaffecamouflage-page-006a.jpg
http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k304/Major_Sharpe/latewarLuftwaffecamouflage-page-005a.jpg

[LcSummers]

Hi all,

i ddint spoke about the Doras of JV 44. There is so much (even i have the books) information i was not interested of them.

I prefered to the D-11 ( i know that JV 44 had Red 4) and D-12 and D-13.

My question has been answered. Thanks a lot.:grin: