DX11 Tessellation Demo [Eve Online]

[Buchon]

After only a few games using it very light, and someone game using it as a gimmick, the real time tessellation is starting to take off.

Some tests reveals (http://www.geeks3d.com/20120322/the-geforce-gtx-680-is-a-tessellation-monster/) that nVidia are seriously pushing the real time tessellation so 2012 appears the year of when we will see his initially spread use, bringing us a incredible detail in models finally.

Here is a amazing video showing the real time tessellation possibilities in-game models, seriously detailed space ships and asteroids in this Eve Online demo, worth to see :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_pGFGHKaaM

[ElAurens]

Interesting, but right at the end is the important bit.

5 man years to update their current graphics so that all objects can take advantage of tessellation.

Translation, no current game will be able to add tessellation and keep their profit margins anywhere near in the black.

For an all new game, sure it will be cool, but for our little sim, not gonna happen.

[JG52Krupi]

Interesting, but right at the end is the important bit.

5 man years to update their current graphics so that all objects can take advantage of tessellation.

Translation, no current game will be able to add tessellation and keep their profit margins anywhere near in the black.

For an all new game, sure it will be cool, but for our little sim, not gonna happen.

Where did the "5 years" come from?

And I hope your wrong about COD :( but they have already said tessellation messed up there models when they tried it so a rework would have to be done.

Oh and cool video, can't wait for the next eve addon :D

Here is a better video...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8k7oaz8mWug

[Liz Lemon]

You should have posted a demo of water tesselation. One thing that could significantly improve the look of water in COD - especially down low. And this wouldn't take 5 man years too implement either....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4G9anRoYGko

[ElAurens]

Krupi, one of the voices in the video mentioned it.

[JG52Krupi]

Krupi, one of the voices in the video mentioned it.

Hmm, looks like I need my hearing checked :(

[Flanker35M]

S!

EVE is one of my favorites, already for over 6 years. But what is concerning me is the "push of nVidia" in this title too. This means that we get the "The Way AMD is to Be Shafted" aka TWAT logo and a piece of code disabling certain features when a non-nV card is detected. Now they offer nV cards for in-game currency so what else.

Otherwise the presentation was interesting, but I have my doubts how the servers will cope and in fleet battles eye candy = lag fest and low FPS. Anyway interesting..wish I could have been at the Fanfest..

[Raggz]

That looks simply amazing :D

[JG52Krupi]

S!

EVE is one of my favorites, already for over 6 years. But what is concerning me is the "push of nVidia" in this title too. This means that we get the "The Way AMD is to Be Shafted" aka TWAT logo and a piece of code disabling certain features when a non-nV card is detected. Now they offer nV cards for in-game currency so what else.

Otherwise the presentation was interesting, but I have my doubts how the servers will cope and in fleet battles eye candy = lag fest and low FPS. Anyway interesting..wish I could have been at the Fanfest..

Hey Flanker,


I recently got back into eve, I am a low sp character (only 7 million) but I am looking to join a corp once I have my logistic skills up to speed, do you know a good corp for newer players.

[Flanker35M]

S!

Krupi, I would check EVE Online forums under Allaince/Corp Recruitment section. I think our corp has a minimum of 10-15mill SP to join, DAB.

[Buchon]

Well, Eve Online have a lot of objects to tessellate, I bet there tons of different asteroids, it is a mmorpg with alot of ships and objects ... but CLOD is different.

You can obtain a huge visual impact just bump mapping the water and then tessellate it, not a huge task here.

The main problem is tessellating planes and objects, and it´s the texture displacement caused by the tessellation, explained here :

http://developer.amd.com/archive/gpu/MeshMapper/pages/default.aspx

It will mess panel lines for example, but there tech to fix this.

A recently AMD demo (Leo) showed Ptex and PRT Technology that is nothing but texture displacement correction by hardware, explained here :

http://developer.amd.com/samples/demos/pages/AMDRadeonHD7900SeriesGraphicsReal-TimeDemos.aspx

It was used to correct the texture of the face, shirt and the ears for example, all in real time.

So there still room for hope :)

[Immermann]

Yes it looks promising. Unless of course Nvidia only decides to make more of those million vertice concrete barriers again like in Crysis 2, in which case it's pointless.

http://techreport.com/articles.x/21404/2

[JG52Krupi]

So nvidia physx or amd ptex ;)

Hopefully they will come to some sort of arrangement and the technology will become available to all... Yeah I know wishful thinking :)

[Buchon]

Yes it looks promising. Unless of course Nvidia only decides to make more of those million vertice concrete barriers again like in Crysis 2, in which case it's pointless.

http://techreport.com/articles.x/21404/2

Hahaha, yep :)


I like specially his use in the flat window frames more than in concrete barriers :

http://techreport.com/r.x/crysis2/wood-full-620.jpg
http://techreport.com/r.x/crysis2/wood-mesh-620.jpg

The use of tessellation in Crysis 2 deserve his own thread :rolleyes:

[Stefem]

Well, Eve Online have a lot of objects to tessellate, I bet there tons of different asteroids, it is a mmorpg with alot of ships and objects ... but CLOD is different.

You can obtain a huge visual impact just bump mapping the water and then tessellate it, not a huge task here.

The main problem is tessellating planes and objects, and it´s the texture displacement caused by the tessellation, explained here :

http://developer.amd.com/archive/gpu/MeshMapper/pages/default.aspx[/url]

It will mess panel lines for example, but there tech to fix this.

A recently AMD demo (Leo) showed Ptex and PRT Technology that is nothing but texture displacement correction by hardware, explained here :

http://developer.amd.com/samples/demos/pages/AMDRadeonHD7900SeriesGraphicsReal-TimeDemos.aspx[/url]

It was used to correct the texture of the face, shirt and the ears for example, all in real time.

So there still room for hope :)

Why? to have a flat surface tessellated? bump mapping does not alter geometry

[Stefem]

Yes it looks promising. Unless of course Nvidia only decides to make more of those million vertice concrete barriers again like in Crysis 2, in which case it's pointless.

http://techreport.com/articles.x/21404/2

I didn't know that NVIDIA is the developer of Crysis 2

[Stefem]

So nvidia physx or amd ptex ;)

Hopefully they will come to some sort of arrangement and the technology will become available to all... Yeah I know wishful thinking :)

As already stated in this thread Tessellation could introduce some drawbacks when precision of the model is required, which is the case for sims.

Ptex is not an AMD tech, actually this texture mapping system was developed by Walt Disney Studio and, if I remember well, it was demonstrated for the first time (excuse the pun) in realtime at Siggraph 2011 by NVIDIA.

http://developer.nvidia.com/siggraph-2011

[Buchon]

Why? to have a flat surface tessellated? bump mapping does not alter geometry

Off course when I said tessellate it mean given it some geometry, this is not Crysis 2 ;)

And if the mesh is a bit animated better, I mean that it is not a huge task because you dont need rely on textures displacement correction techniques :)


It could be a fast way to obtain a good detail and release it prior to the final approach, that its Tessellate + Bump-mapping + texture displacement, explained here :

http://www.nvidia.com/object/tessellation.html

[Buchon]

Forget say ...

Yeah, Ptex is not an AMD tech, it simply rely in the hardware compute capabilities of the card to do it, mean Nvidia and AMD cappable tech, while the Nvidia tech for texture correction rely on Physx software and Cuda cores.

[FFCW_Urizen]

I didn't know that NVIDIA is the developer of Crysis 2

No, they are not, but you have heard of nVidia´s "The way it´s meant to be played" program, of course. This program is and has been under suspicion of intentionally optimizing the graphics code to the point, that ATi/AMD GPUs are next to completely useless. Of course, this hasn´t been the case so far and it will never be the case, think of the outrage in the gaming community if something like this would become apparent.
Instead what they can do, is giving nVidia GPUs just a little edge over their competitors. ATi/AMD of course has a similar program, i just can´t remember the name and it is not as agressively advertised as nVidias program. It´s just a regular day at the office.

And for the water being rendered throughout the scene: Had the author of the article taken a look at the CryEditor, he might know the reason for the water popping up everywhere, where there is a coastline. CryEngine1 and 2 were focussed around the Rendering of tropic islands, instead of manually placing watermeshes everywhere, creating a waterlayer and displaying it throughout the level is much, much easier.
My guess is that the CryEngine 3 still shares that code with its predecessor.

[ramstein]

....


I recently got back into eve...

I bet you are glad, the name wasn't sam..
LOLOLOL...ROFL..

[TheEditor]

Thanks to EvE, I don't have to think about this game every day. Comparing EvE and IL2's dev team is like night and day. 1c make il2 an MMO already and hire some people.:grin:

Oh topic...Well hopefully when this patch comes out, maybe MG can think about adding DX11.

[Thee_oddball]

So nvidia physx or amd ptex ;)

Hopefully they will come to some sort of arrangement and the technology will become available to all... Yeah I know wishful thinking :)

i dont think it will be an issue, in the upcoming ARMA 3 the dev team said there wont be a problem with physx as the Nv cards will handle on the GPU and for AMD users the CPU will handle it, so tess should follow the similar route....i hope :)

[Stefem]

Off course when I said tessellate it mean given it some geometry, this is not Crysis 2 ;)

And if the mesh is a bit animated better, I mean that it is not a huge task because you dont need rely on textures displacement correction techniques :)


It could be a fast way to obtain a good detail and release it prior to the final approach, that its Tessellate + Bump-mapping + texture displacement, explained here :

http://www.nvidia.com/object/tessellation.html

Bump mapping is an old technique, it's not used in conjunction with tessellation.
Give a better read to the page linked in your post.

Forget say ...

Yeah, Ptex is not an AMD tech, it simply rely in the hardware compute capabilities of the card to do it, mean Nvidia and AMD cappable tech, while the Nvidia tech for texture correction rely on Physx software and Cuda cores.

Ptex can be done with OGL 3 end D3D 10

[Buchon]

Bump mapping is an old technique, it's not used in conjunction with tessellation.
Give a better read to the page linked in your post.


ohh ... I guess I'm getting old :eek:, thanks for the correction, now I understand all :)

So the top work is Tessellation + Displacement + Displacement Correction (Ptex)

But talking about water I think that you can drop the Displacement Correction, there no panel lines there ;), it should be fine just doing Tessellation + Displacement, and that water should be some thing worth to see really :grin: