Its almost free now..

[Tvrdi]

12.5 $

http://www.getgamesgo.com/product/il-2-sturmovik-cliffs-of-dover

Why Im not suprised...

Now I feel like a real donkey...

pfftt

[Trumper]

Just flight £8.75 / €12.49 / $12.49.until Tuesday 8th November!

http://www.justflight.com/product.asp?pid=645

http://www.justflight.com/

Anyone used just flight?

News

Incredible low price for IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover
75% off the usual price - until Tuesday 8th November!
02/11/2011

Get a huge 75% off IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover this weekend!

Until midnight on Tuesday 8th November you can snap up the Download edition of IL-2: Cliffs of Dover for just £8.75 / €12.49 / $12.49.

IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover takes place in 1940 during the pivotal aerial battle for the skies over Britain between the British RAF, the German Luftwaffe and the Italian air force. The sim features over a dozen flyable aircraft (fighters and bombers), 13 AI aircraft, incredible damage modelling, a new 3D engine, and interactive training. Also included are an exciting single player campaign and customisable multiplayer modes which allow for up to 128 pilots to join in huge ongoing battles!

Please note: Due to the publisher's restriction, IL-2 Cliffs of Dover is not available for sale from European websites to North America.

[Winger]

Makes me worry about the future support for this game...

Winger

[Duke88]

I was been the only stupid which had bought this game when it was in preorder and I can't to play it decently yet. Bah! I've lost the hope...

cheers

[SYN_Jed]

Either this will bring a lot of new players to the game giving the developers the boost they need to carry on....or it will be consigned to the bargain bin and forgotten. As someone who bought the collectors AND the Steam version I truly hope its the former :)

[JG52Uther]

Just Flight is fine, I used it a few times. If its cheaper, more people will buy it. What new game doesn't get cheaper?
On another note, RoF is free now... ;)

[Dano]

Makes me worry about the future support for this game...

Winger

Why? Sales at this point will be minimal at best, either they have the funding to continue development or they don't, given that a sequel is planned it would appear they do.

[Tvrdi]

Just Flight is fine, I used it a few times. If its cheaper, more people will buy it. What new game doesn't get cheaper?
On another note, RoF is free now... ;)

ROF demo is unlimited now (free game with 2 planes flyable)....you still must buy all the other planes...that is if you want to fly something else besides the two...and you want, if your serious with ROF

Yep games gets cheaper (with time) but CLOD is 5 times cheaper than it was few months ago...WTF? Usually for 12 bucks you can get the games few yrs old....IL2 46 is 10 bucks now....10 yrs old sim...
btw I still feel like a donkey

[JG52Uther]

Should have waited then! I was a huge fanboy, but even I could see the CE was a complete waste of money, dreamed up by some marketing monkey somewhere!
You get a pretty box, a disc you don't need 'cos we have steam, a badly printed manual I can but cheaper at the local museum, and a 'map' that might possibly make a good dishcloth.
I bought the Russian version first, for very little money, to see what it was like, and then bought the download from D2D for £23.
Free RoF is not the demo, its the whole game, but you are welcome to buy every extra plane if you wish. Otherwise they stay as A.I.

[JG52Krupi]

ROF demo is unlimited now (free game with 2 planes flyable)....you still must buy all the other planes...that is if you want to fly something else besides the two...and you want, if your serious with ROF

Yep games gets cheaper (with time) but CLOD is 5 times cheaper than it was few months ago...WTF? Usually for 12 bucks you can get the games few yrs old....IL2 46 is 10 bucks now....10 yrs old sim...
btw I still feel like a donkey

Hey I got the limited edition version and brought my bro a copy through steam... It's a bloody good game amazing graphics and a struggiling but clearly amazing engine.

I will never regret my purchase of cod only the state it was released in.

[Tvrdi]

Should have waited then! I was a huge fanboy, but even I could see the CE was a complete waste of money, dreamed up by some marketing monkey somewhere!
You get a pretty box, a disc you don't need 'cos we have steam, a badly printed manual I can but cheaper at the local museum, and a 'map' that might possibly make a good dishcloth.
I bought the Russian version first, for very little money, to see what it was like, and then bought the download from D2D for £23.
Free RoF is not the demo, its the whole game, but you are welcome to buy every extra plane if you wish. Otherwise they stay as A.I.

ROF with two planes is more empty than full game (*wink*)...

Yes I didtn wait...I WAS a huge 1C fan, il2 was masterpiece....this is why I was so eager to buy this...whataver it is in current state...

[Jumpy]

Yep games gets cheaper (with time) but CLOD is 5 times cheaper than it was few months ago...WTF? Usually for 12 bucks you can get the games few yrs old....IL2 46 is 10 bucks now....10 yrs old sim...
btw I still feel like a donkey

Don't worry, I am sure most people think donkeys are cute! It does make you wonder about future support, though. :confused:

[Tvrdi]

Don't worry, I am sure most people think donkeys are cute! It does make you wonder about future support, though. :confused:

njihaaaaaaaaaaaa

[trumps]

well i pre-ordered the collectors edition and yes the ride has not been without frustrations but all in all i have more than got my moneys worth out of the sim and find that excepting the launcher failure issue it plays and looks great. there is no way known i could imagine going back to Il-2 now. i do hope that optimization will continue until the next installment is released. either western desert/med, or BoM, i would love to see either if not both as time passes.

Cheers
Craig

[Tvrdi]

Tell your squaddies and friends from the old game about the sale, there's no reason to be on the fence. Hours of entertainment and frustration for the price of 3 coffees!

already did that....Im the "good whiner" :-)

[ATAG_Dutch]

I pre-ordered and purchased two collector's editions (one was for a gift), a Logitech G940 and subsequently a GTX570, solely because this was Cliffs of Dover by the IL2 team; and wouldn't have bought the latter two unless I thought it was worth it.

I've done some whining and moaning myself since release, but as an old fan of the series, I don't regret spending a single penny if what I paid for the two CE's helps assist development.

As it happens, I was given a copy of IL2 in 2001, then bought Forgotten Battles and 1946 but only when they went down to less than £10.00.

Bringing the price down to the level of 'bargain' will mean it'll be sitting on a lot more people's hard discs whilst we wait for further software improvements and hardware development. Long term, surely this can only be a good thing for the promotion of the genre, as it was in my case.

I've no doubt that I'll be first in the queue for any expansions/sequels too. I'll probably kick myself for paying full price on release, have another whine/moan and then do it again.

So, I went from bargain hunter to pre-orderer, why not others?

[Tvrdi]

I pre-ordered and purchased two collector's editions (one was for a gift), a Logitech G940 and subsequently a GTX570, solely because this was Cliffs of Dover by the IL2 team; and wouldn't have bought the latter two unless I thought it was worth it.

I've done some whining and moaning myself since release, but as an old fan of the series, I don't regret spending a single penny if what I paid for the two CE's helps assist development.

As it happens, I was given a copy of IL2 in 2001, then bought Forgotten Battles and 1946 but only when they went down to less than £10.00.

Bringing the price down to the level of 'bargain' will mean it'll be sitting on a lot more people's hard discs whilst we wait for further software improvements and hardware development. Long term, surely this can only be a good thing for the promotion of the genre, as it was in my case.

I've no doubt that I'll be first in the queue for any expansions/sequels too. I'll probably kick myself for paying full price on release, have another whine/moan and then do it again.

So, I went from bargain hunter to pre-orderer, why not others?

What if they fail in optimising this sim? Its theoretically possible...

[Pudfark]

What if they fail in optimising this sim? Its theoretically possible...

Well, some folks don't seem to understand the difference between optimism and optimization...I don't believe that you are one of them....

There seems to me...to be...less optimism.
While seven months later? No optimization.
In the last couple of months?
Take a look/search in regard to the numbers of folks who have "left" the forum.

[Qpassa]

I bought two weeks ago CE for 20 euros(19.95)

[ATAG_MajorBorris]

Thats great, considering I have gotten my moneys worth flying the JU 88 alone. WW2combat flight simers who havent allready have no reason not to give the sim a go now.

[Trumper]

Just Flight is fine, I used it a few times. If its cheaper, more people will buy it. What new game doesn't get cheaper?
On another note, RoF is free now... ;)

It was an offer i couldn't refuse and even though i need to upgrade my computer and get win7 instead of xp2 i consider it something for the future.

[Mattius]

Pretty Sick as I paid £58.91 for a flight sim that runs slowly & I get Launcher crashes when flying near Northern France. Worse £60 I ever spent. Current price really rubs salt into wound. Also I believe that this is a sign that support will drop off before long! :(

[addman]

First off, almost all games drops in price within a year, there are very few exceptions. Nintendo's first-party games are exceptions, parents will pay for Mario at any cost. Regarding financing for the sequel(s), they wouldn't start development if financing wasn't already secured, it's business after all not poker.;)

[Tvrdi]

Well, some folks don't seem to understand the difference between optimism and optimization...I don't believe that you are one of them....

There seems to me...to be...less optimism.
While seven months later? No optimization.
In the last couple of months?
Take a look/search in regard to the numbers of folks who have "left" the forum.

Dont be a smart ars, english is not my native language. Yep it should be optimization not optimisation. BTw it was just a typo. They did something to make the game smooth. Is it enough. No. Will they further improve this sim (performance wise)? - I hope yes.

[Matt255]

It's not a typo at all.
optimisation is BE, optimization AE

I don't think that's what Pudfark meant though.

Anyhow, i bought CloD for 27 € right at its release. It's not like you were forced to buy it for ~60 € or something.

So it's like half as expensive as it was seven months ago. That's not that special imo.

Only the devs know if they'll keep supporting it.

[RCAF_FB_Orville]

Pretty Sick as I paid £58.91 for a flight sim that runs slowly & I get Launcher crashes when flying near Northern France. Worse £60 I ever spent. Current price really rubs salt into wound. Also I believe that this is a sign that support will drop off before long! :(

Yeah, pre-ordered well in advance and payed 60 quid myself......COLOUR ME MUG. :grin:

Feel a bit bumped, but I'm over it lol. What can ye do? Hopefully they will get their act together one day (probably in the next release) and the improvements will be retro actively fitted to CoD. It would be insane if they do not provide the merged install option.

Had some fun with it, and it has some very good points too no doubt (particularly DM and engine management, when it works properly lol).....But I have to say a big let down overall to be honest.

Ah well. Tomorrow is another day, and lets see what it brings. :)

[von Pilsner]

Most people came on here to complain/fix problems. Their problems are fixed and they don't need to come back.

True, or we are patiently waiting for the next patch (AI and Radio fixes!!!) :)

I picked up a 2nd copy from Just Flight (great sale price) as I expect the fps optimisations and SP fixes to be in the next patch.


Our main priorities now are:

1. Physics and FM. This means plane behavior in the air, brand new landing gear model on the ground, collision modeling including tree collision (if performance allows), and improved vehicle physics.
2. AI. Currently working on everyone’s favorite controls flutter and AI wingman behavior. Also working on improving radio comms, getting your crew to be more verbose on the intercom, and lots of other changes. Coupled with #1, this should give us quite a dramatic change in how air combat looks and feels.
3. Performance. We are in final stages of testing a thorough overhaul of the game’s graphic engine. It won’t look any different but it will be much more streamlined. It’s too early to say what the FPS increase will be in the final version, but it shouldn’t be less than 50%.
4. Sound. The sound in the v15950 is considered a beta. We will continue to improve existing sound, and to add new ones to the aircraft and to the world around them.
5. SDK. As promised earlier, still planning to release a map-making SDK in the near future. More details will be released when we are ready for them.

[jf1981]

CoD is not yet in a state where it should have been released.

[Pudfark]

Well, some folks don't seem to understand the difference between optimism and optimization...I don't believe that you are one of them....

There seems to me...to be...less optimism.
While seven months later? No optimization.
In the last couple of months?
Take a look/search in regard to the numbers of folks who have "left" the forum.

@Tvrdi, I was not trying to make fun of you or poking fun at you...I meant word for word, what I said. It was a compliment to you.

@cheesehawk, You may get exactly what you ask for..."That certainly points to the improved nature of the sim. Most people came on here to complain/fix problems. Their problems are fixed and they don't need to come back".

[Bakelit]

Actually for all the fans, I would not be worried about the critics and pessimists still posting here.

You really should be worried about the people who don't come here anymore and about those who did not buy in the first place after seeing CoD at their friends pc's. I'm the only one of four mates owning Il2 who bought CoD.

I'm cool about anyone getting their enjoyment of CoD. But everytime I start a mission from the strange UI and see the AI "perform" I want to throw up. So I instantly stop playing and wait for the next patch. For seven months now.

To me this is the biggest disappointment I ever had from a pc game. Won't ever buy any extension for this mess. I mean they aren't newcomers with their first ever flight sim produced, are they?

[swiss]

Just Flight is fine, I used it a few times. If its cheaper, more people will buy it. What new game doesn't get cheaper?
On another note, RoF is free now... ;)

1. the demand curve is not that elastic
2. don't expect too many new players
3. ROF uses the business model King Gillette invented

[usr]

ROF demo is unlimited now (free game with 2 planes flyable)....you still must buy all the other planes...that is if you want to fly something else besides the two...and you want, if your serious with ROF
Yeah, my day one RoF account (western euro release), which was about as expensive as my day one CoD has now been redesignated "lite" (which means it's no less than twice as big as the free demo..) and they are offering me a generous discount of 15$ on the upgrade to "ICE" level, as opposed to an upgrade from the free demo. Thank you very much. I hope the money i initially gave you is invested well, because there won't be any more coming from my direction.

The game itself, while having received some serious technical improvements, now looks like a huge nag-screen where 90% of all options presented are only available upon further payment. The shareware of old has never been as bad. CoD, meanwhile, has already given me the first free plane addon, two if you count the 4/B as a separate model.

[ReconNZ]

CoD is not yet in a state where it should have been released.

Mate you are kidding right???? I have been playing Battlefield 3 the last few days - with its gazillion dollar budget and rating as the biggest selling pc game ever, it still crashes to desktop for me even hour or so - and I'm running a new, highish-end rig.

So even with all the resources in the world the BF3 guys cant get it right straight away. Cliffs is a fantastic engine and is full of potential, I just truly hope the dev's get the budget to keep the development going, and I for one will continue to support them with every release they offer. I have had more fun playing cliffs than any other game of recent times, including BF3 which last night i played for an hour, then put down to go fly 46 with my squad mates.

[swiss]

But like thos BidNow sites and the $20.00 iPad2s, just because a 3rd party retailer puts something on sale, doesn't mean the manufacturer wants it sold at that price, or that they are going out of business.

what?!

[SIDWULF]

Mate you are kidding right???? I have been playing Battlefield 3 the last few days - with its gazillion dollar budget and rating as the biggest selling pc game ever, it still crashes to desktop for me even hour or so - and I'm running a new, highish-end rig.

So even with all the resources in the world the BF3 guys cant get it right straight away. Cliffs is a fantastic engine and is full of potential, I just truly hope the dev's get the budget to keep the development going, and I for one will continue to support them with every release they offer. I have had more fun playing cliffs than any other game of recent times, including BF3 which last night i played for an hour, then put down to go fly 46 with my squad mates.

I am having a hell of a good time with BF3 currently. This is the most fun ive had playing a pc game in recent memory.

I agree that IL2 is most fun when your flying online campains or structered events when your in a squardron...i figure cod will be the same way. I get bored and lonely just flying around hunting in pub servers...but the cod community needs to be bigger for any of this to happen.

So everyone needs to start recruiting, spread the word on how good COD is (or for some) how good it will be.

[machoo]

Realistically if COD was released today i'd still feel pretty ripped with what it is. It has a long way to go.

[ATAG_Septic]

I have around 250 hours on this sim. Divide that into £30 is 12p per hour so far?
This, for me, is fantastic value from a game.

I fear a future I cannot afford is looming though, micro-payments, monthly payments, payments for planes/trains etc.

Cheers.

[BigC208]

Realistically if COD was released today i'd still feel pretty ripped with what it is. It has a long way to go.

You got ripped off. so did I. We both had systems that fell within the min specs but don't perform. I upgraded, spend about a 1000 bucks. Now I'm in dogfight heaven. Best sim ever. Been simming for about 20 years now. Last few days, online, have been some of my best, most realistical sim sessions ever. Flying on the deck following railroad tracks and hedge hopping, sneaking up on a hapless Hurricane, blasting him to pieces at 50 yards. Priceless! Never knew what hit him. Last week, while in a Spit over Calais, had a one hour(!) dogfight with a 109E4, full real. One bloody hour! We went from 15k down to the deck back up to 15k. This guy used his e advantage all the way and I squeezed the turn ablity of the Spit to the max. In the end I got low on gas, had to run back home. Did a split S, reversed it a few times on the way down. Hoped he would lose sight of me. As I leveled out 10 feet over the water he caught up with me. I ran out of juice, options, ate lead and splashed in the Channel. Could not believe that it had been an hour. I payed $45 in all for this game and it's worth every penny. Even in the "sorry ass state" it's in now. Porked QMB, coms, graphic anomalies etc. etc. Even with my upgraded system the game crashes after about 1.5 hours so there is lots of work to be done by the dev's. My advice is this. Upgrade your system or shelve the game untill it's fixed or you have the money to upgrade. Untill then you don't know what you're missing. I still believe they should change the official min specs so people don't get pissed off and disappointed.

[TomVolume4]

Downloading now.

[swiss]

What I mean by that statement, is JustFlight's pricing does not have to be officially sanctioned by 1c. Note that Steam is not selling it for that price, so it's not like this is an across the board price cut. This could be a way for a single retailer to get the volume up enough for their next price cut (prices are normally set by volume). Or this could be a method to drum up traffic (not just for CoD, but for their other products as well).

In the case of the BidNow sales, obviously, Apple does not sell the iPad 2 for $20.00, and just because 1 website was "selling" them for that, doesn't indicate Apple is going out of business.

If you dont want retailers to sell your product cheap, you shouldn't supply it cheap in the first place. So, whose fault is it? 1Cs.
I also dont think you can really sell masses of Clod, so this is unlikely too.
Cookie? Cookies usually are never sold below cost, on the other hand selling a key, is not like having a gas station where sell the fuel at cost but expect the customer to pick up other things like drinks and snacks to make up for the missing profit. This does work if you sell hardware online but not if you only sell software. It not like you visit their homepage and go like: "Wow, cool Clod for $12! No I'm here, let's buy a copy of footballmanger 2012 too."

The way I see it there a two options:
A: Some retailer preordered(I don't know this business, others work like that, maybe it's bs) too many and can't return them, looking at the price it must be an east European one. Which leads to the next point: Pricing related to buying power in different countries. Sounds fair, but you'll end up with a mess like this. This is software, not a big mac.
B: Sales collapsed, they are giving a super discount to collect at least a few bucks. Worst scenario, it it was true its the end.

My guess(and hope) is A.

[JG52Uther]

'Just Flight' is more geared toward civilian sims (MS FS etc) and sell some high end sim stuff for cessna's, airliners etc. A combat flight sim is going to make up a tiny percentage of their business, and I doubt they have sold many, so are not that bothered with it.

[Ataros]

Have a look at Origin's Battlefield 3 PC support forums (maybe have to be registered with Origin - it is like a new Steam competitor). This multi-zillion $$$ launch is a complete disaster compared to CloD in terms of performance, crashes (10-20 minutes), user-friendliness, software and even hardware compatibility issues.

This is how PC gaming works nowadays. The next best flightsim after Il-2 will come out on consoles or gamepads in 2021 :grin:

[Scarecrow]

I've bought every IL2 product since FB all at full price on day of release, I never do this with any other game. If they never got the core functionality up to par i'd be dissapointed in the death of something I love but since there is already a sequel planned I figure we'll get there eventually. I don't care about the money I paid for the CE, just the future of the genre. I don't torture myself anymore by playing the current version i'll wait till the Devs are done.

[jcenzano]

Well, some folks don't seem to understand the difference between optimism and optimization...I don't believe that you are one of them....

There seems to me...to be...less optimism.
While seven months later? No optimization.
In the last couple of months?
Take a look/search in regard to the numbers of folks who have "left" the forum.

As a non native english speaker I think your comment is way out of line and very arrogant. i think Tvrdi made his point quite clear and there was no reason for the smart ass language barrier joke.

I wonder in how many languages can you make yourself understood as well as he can in english. My personal guess is: NONE.

@Tvrdi: Normally I think your oppinions are quite aggressive/radical, but lately I am beginning to agree more and more with you.

[Tree_UK]

Even at the prices advertised its still way to expensive, for a game that still as massive issues it should now be a give away product.

[SYN_Jed]

Ask yourself this and answer honestly. Knowing what you know now, if 1C released CloD2 next month would you pay £60 for it...or maybe...just maybe would you wait a few months til it was £8.49.

Before this release I`d have said "definitely on day 1"

Now I`m not so sure...

(Sadly you notice I didnt say I wouldnt :P)

[flyingblind]

Hey - just think. If only you had held off buying IL2-Sturmovic all those years ago just think what you would get for a few quid now. One disc with the whole series plus a ton of mods and stuff to download and it all works! You could have saved yourself hours, no, years of irritation and frustration and updating your computer and operating sytems to get it all working smoooth and perfect - not to mention the wasted wad of cash.

[tintifaxl]

Have a look at Origin's Battlefield 3 PC support forums (maybe have to be registered with Origin - it is like a new Steam competitor). This multi-zillion $$$ launch is a complete disaster compared to CloD in terms of performance, crashes (10-20 minutes), user-friendliness, software and even hardware compatibility issues.


This is not my experience with BF3 which works very well and stable on my system and some 15 clan members I play with every evening since launch.
There were no complaints about performance or stability. The only crashes I had occurred while launching the game. Never a CTD/Blue Screen while playing.

[KG26_Alpha]

In 2001 IL2 Sturmovik was retailing £29.99.

That's 10 years ago when MS CFS 2/3 series and FS 2000 and FS 2002 was retailing at around £60.00

What ever the condition of the CoD software on release it was cheap, and for those that remember the farcical MS FS series releases back then they relied on 3rd party programmers to fix the bugs and there were hardly never any official patches to fix anything.

Quit yer moaning and let 1C team sort out CoD

I'm sure their past history with the IL2 series will be evident in the CoD series.

:grin:

[ATAG_Dutch]

What if they fail in optimising this sim? Its theoretically possible...

If they fail in optimising this sim, I'll fly it as it is. ;) Performance is acceptable on my pc, which is by no means top end.

The things I'm hoping for most are that the track editor function gets sorted and the AI gets less boisterous. The online aspect is getting really good now, and I'm not too bothered about SP campaigns/missions, dynamic or not.

This is in spite of what I may have done in the past (See screenshot.That's not really me by the way, I'm much better looking :rolleyes:).

[Tvrdi]

@Tvrdi: Normally I think your oppinions are quite aggressive/radical, but lately I am beginning to agree more and more with you.

Im not radical in eye to eye conversation :-) ....here on forums it seams so (more or less) because of the language barrier....so I hope I didnt insult anyone....except Ace of Aces. This guy I could insult every single day.

The bottom line is that all the "whining" is because Im the big fun of ("hardcore") sims including il2 series....and ofcourse Im frustrated by CLOD performance on my modern rig (yep, I did all the things one can do to optimise his system).....thats the "whole secret"....After the last (beta!) patch CLOD is much smoother on my rig but nowhere as it should be (when the dust is near, or when the dogfight is low it gets very slow)....

[namroob]

I'm not a business expert and I could be wrong but it seems to me to be quite possibly hard to make a loss with many PC games these days. With on-line downloads, distribution costs of the product are virtually nil per unit aren't they (no packaging or paper manuals etc)?

Again, on-line updates mean it's infinitely easier and cheaper to maintain/update it. This also means it is quite practical from their point of view to release it "unfinished" (whatever you think of the ethics of that).

Finally, PC ownership and use is going up exponentially as the developing world becomes computerised; even if only a fraction of 1% of total PC users in the world are flight sim fans that still represents an expanding potential market of tens of thousands. Perhaps the reasoning is to sell it for a few quid and maybe thousands more will come on board.

Discuss...

[Tree_UK]

In 2001 IL2 Sturmovik was retailing £29.99.

That's 10 years ago when MS CFS 2/3 series and FS 2000 and FS 2002 was retailing at around £60.00

What ever the condition of the CoD software on release it was cheap, and for those that remember the farcical MS FS series releases back then they relied on 3rd party programmers to fix the bugs and there were hardly never any official patches to fix anything.

Quit yer moaning and let 1C team sort out CoD

I'm sure their past history with the IL2 series will be evident in the CoD series.

:grin:

Yep quit the moaning guys its only been 8 months since release. :confused:

[Flanker35M]

S!

Well..all the moaning and bitching will not update CoD to anything no matter how loud and obnoxious we would be. Luthier and his team have improved the game over the months, there is no denying that. And I hope this same path will continue along with sequels/add-ons/whatever.

I was for sure a dissapointed customer when paid full price of something that clearly was not ready for publishing. But I could have wasted the money on something else that could have been totally useless. So no big deal. I enjoy now what the game has to offer and most of it is Multiplayer. It works for me except the few launcher.exe crashes now and then, but now I have taken note on symptoms preceeding it so I restart the game :)

Also have to say that meeting different people over TS is fun, thanks JG52 Krupi and others for the fun times last night raiding England's shipping :D Just enjoy and relax, CoD will mature and meanwhile we can STILL play it..

End of overpositive ramble, but I think we all need sometimes to loosen the tie or something ;)

[Tvrdi]

S!
Well..all the moaning and bitching will not update CoD to anything no matter how loud and obnoxious we would be.

one of the "whines" revealed (to the public) the issue with SSAO....after that the problem was partialy corrected and the SSAO was included in video options. And this is just one example.

[Flanker35M]

S!

I know Tvrdi, but what I meant was that we can sling mud all we want and CoD will not gt finished/patched/changed any faster :) But got your point :)

[Tvrdi]

I know Tvrdi, but what I meant was that we can sling mud all we want and CoD will not gt finished/patched/changed any faster :) But got your point :)

I agree.

[Ze-Jamz]

This is not my experience with BF3 which works very well and stable on my system and some 15 clan members I play with every evening since launch.
There were no complaints about performance or stability. The only crashes I had occurred while launching the game. Never a CTD/Blue Screen while playing.

Plus one..

Haven't had one issue with BF :/. Didnt even know there were any major issues with it?

[AKA_Tenn]

alot of games are really cheap now cause u make more money selling 5 copies for 10$ each than you do selling 1 copy for 30$... when the cost of the game is in development, not in the actual copies of the game, that makes sense, since its easier to sell something for 10$ than 30$....

[Chivas]

I don't regret the monies I spent on the initial release of this sim. I consider it an investment in our genre. If the new IL-2 series fails I don't see any other developers now or in the near future doing the kind of sims the majority here are looking for. The ROF developers could eventually make a WW2 sim, but I don't see that happening for atleast another five years. I thought Gaijin made a good start, that could have been upgraded to a decent combat flight sim but they dropped the ball.

[Tree_UK]

I don't regret the monies I spent on the initial release of this sim. I consider it an investment in our genre. If the new IL-2 series fails I don't see any other developers now or in the near future doing the kind of sims the majority here are looking for. The ROF developers could eventually make a WW2 sim, but I don't see that happening for atleast another five years. I thought Gaijin made a good start, that could have been upgraded to a decent combat flight sim but they dropped the ball.

Well the lesson to be learned by all future developers is dont blatently lie to your fanbase and dont release a crap product.

The damage done to the flight sim community with the release of this shoddy product is unrepairable. Its virtually killed half the squadrons that had large numbers on il2 servers, and coupled with the fact that there can be no more online wars/competions the creation of future squads looks very bleak.

The death of WW2 flight simming will not come about because of those who have had the balls to ask questions and complain it will come about by the sheer arrogance of developers who believe they can get away with this kind of disrespect to their loyal customers , shame on them, they should be on here every single day thanking us greatly for our loyalty and extreme patience why they sort out the mess that 'they' created. How many time in the past did we hear the words "Oleg would never do that to us" or "Luthier wouldn't lie to us", well its time to wake up, because they have and they did.

[ReconNZ]

Well the lesson to be learned by all future developers is dont blatently lie to your fanbase and dont release a crap product.

The damage done to the flight sim community with the release of this shoddy product is unrepairable. Its virtually killed half the squadrons that had large numbers on il2 servers, and coupled with the fact that there can be no more online wars/competions the creation of future squads looks very bleak.

The death of WW2 flight simming will not come about because of those who have had the balls to ask questions and complain it will come about by the sheer arrogance of developers who believe they can get away with this kind of disrespect to their loyal customers , shame on them, they should be on here every single day thanking us greatly for our loyalty and extreme patience why they sort out the mess that 'they' created. How many time in the past did we hear the words "Oleg would never do that to us" or "Luthier wouldn't lie to us", well its time to wake up, because they have and they did.

LOL, :-P ahhh the sky is falling we are all doomed!!!!

Easy tiger. Its not so bad! Life will go on!

My squad mates and I have a great time playing this sim, with more of our squad making the move to cliffs all the time - the largest thing holding them back has been hardware updates needed.

Dude this game cost less than a box of beers. I think some perspective is needed. Just chill, enjoy it for what it is and like us all hope that it continues to improve. Or better yet, grab your stick - head onto the ATAG server and come have a good time.

Laterz,

Recon.

[150GCT_Veltro]

A price of 12 Euro is still too much for (this) CoD. It worths 10 Euros, not one only more cent. Actually this game is still so crude after 7 months that is really hard to be optimistic for its future.

However we need to wait for the next patch, but i seriously don't believe anymore in The Battle of Britain. Probably The Battle for Moscow will be the first chapter of the new IL2 serie (in the next two years).

[addman]

Well, it is what it is, I've "learnt" to accept that. It's great fun for some online skirmishes on either one of the two servers that I prefer to populate but that's about it. It's still very bare bones. I like it for what it is but Battle of Britain it is not, Skirmish of Britain rather.

[Feathered_IV]

...I like it for what it is but Battle of Britain it is not, Skirmish of Britain rather.

I don't think it will ever really replicate the sort of numbers one saw in a typical BoB engagement. Blaming it on hardware limitations is a cop out too. It just requires a creative solution that the developers are incapable of producing.

[gwalch]

Good luck to all who get it cheap.
I bought that wothless boxed thing when it first came out because I believed them.
I'm no fan or hater,just indifferent.
I am a Tree fan though!

[pupo162]

I don't think it will ever really replicate the sort of numbers one saw in a typical BoB engagement. Blaming it on hardware limitations is a cop out too. It just requires a creative solution that the developers are incapable of producing.

WOV BOB, managed to get decent numebrs, and waht people claimed to be a decent AI. never got into that game. but numbers wise,best bobmer formations ive seen, with no lag due to them.

[Feathered_IV]

WOV BOB, managed to get decent numebrs, and what people claimed to be a decent AI. never got into that game. but numbers wise,best bobmer formations ive seen, with no lag due to them.

I know. EAW did it too, many years ago. These days it'd take a creative aproach to give distant AI a simplified set of routines, changing to a full set of behaviour once the player aprroached within a certain distance. In my opinion though, the Maddox Games people have long since lost sight of the very basics of what makes for good gameplay, and I do not expect them to rediscover it under Luthier's leadership.

[jcenzano]

I like it for what it is but Battle of Britain it is not, Skirmish of Britain rather.
On big +1

[TheGrunch]

alot of games are really cheap now cause u make more money selling 5 copies for 10$ each than you do selling 1 copy for 30$... when the cost of the game is in development, not in the actual copies of the game, that makes sense, since its easier to sell something for 10$ than 30$....
Only because your comparison is invalid. If you sold 5 for $6 each to make $30 overall, you make less money than selling one for $30 because it still cost you the same amount to manufacture each copy of the game.

It's just desperation, presumably sales have been so low on the US release (because everyone knew that the game was a turkey) that they're just hoping to attract bargain-bucket sales. "How bad could it be?"

[AFJ_rsm]

Bought it finally, thanks :)

Now I just need a new rig

[flyingblind]

Personally I can't really see the problem.

We all know what the situation is.The sim has been under developement under Oleg for five or six years. For whatever reason he has left and Luthier has taken over. Again, for whatever reason, the sim seems to have been rushed out in a less than happy condition. Luthier has been steadily improving the sim and has stated that large chunks of code are having to be rewritten from scratch. No small feat considering the time already spent on the code pre-release. The next release is expected to give 50% performance increase.

Already it is all looking pretty good visually and the positive posts are overtaking the negatives. My own opinion, and it is only an opinion but as valid as anyones, is that although the developers are working on the models and maps for the next theatre to be released, Luthier will get the CloD code fully sorted first with good reviews.

Luthier said in his last post: "And here’s where we are in terms of plans. We obviously remain hard at work on the series. We will continue to improve the game up until the eventual release of its sequel."

From this I take it that Luthiers intention is to remove all the bugs from the game and have the engine working properly using CloD as the working version that everyone has. We will all continue to recieve our free upgrades and fixes via Steam. Untile CloD is properly fixed there is no point in releasing a sequel to disatisfied customers but once CloD owners find it working as it should then they are very likely to want to buy the sequel.

It seems to me then that the more people owning CloD and getting thier updates the better for the developers even if they bought it for peanuts. It also seems pretty clear that the quicker CloD can be fixed the quicker the sequel will be released and the quicker IC will get thier revenue stream flowing again which means Luthier will not be sleeping on the job.

The negative people's assumption that the engine will never be fixed is just that - an assumption. We will just have to wait and see.

[addman]

Personally I can't really see the problem.

Considering your nickname, I'm not surprised.

[Bakelit]

I know. EAW did it too, many years ago. These days it'd take a creative aproach to give distant AI a simplified set of routines, changing to a full set of behaviour once the player aprroached within a certain distance. In my opinion though, the Maddox Games people have long since lost sight of the very basics of what makes for good gameplay, and I do not expect them to rediscover it under Luthier's leadership.


I seem to recall an interview quote from Oleg or Luthier were something about "AI bubbles" was said. You get closerr to the action and from a certain point you get into a bubble with complex AI and FM. Out of your bubble the AI will use simplified FM and fighting techniques. Can't find it now, sadly.

[Jaws2002]

The first time I felt I was robbed with Cliffs of Dover, was when they released the last patch. :!:
Up until that point the game had some elements unmatched in any other game. No other sim had such a beautiful lighting engine. I was getting the worth of my money just flying around at sunset.

They had artistically impared programers, that spent too much time in the basement, "fix" the looks of something created and calibrated by a proffesional photograper. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/compsmash.gif

This last patch robbed me of most of the fun I had with Cliffs of Dover.:(

[Stealth_Eagle]

Personally I can't really see the problem.

We all know what the situation is.The sim has been under developement under Oleg for five or six years. For whatever reason he has left and Luthier has taken over. Again, for whatever reason, the sim seems to have been rushed out in a less than happy condition. Luthier has been steadily improving the sim and has stated that large chunks of code are having to be rewritten from scratch. No small feat considering the time already spent on the code pre-release. The next release is expected to give 50% performance increase.

Already it is all looking pretty good visually and the positive posts are overtaking the negatives. My own opinion, and it is only an opinion but as valid as anyones, is that although the developers are working on the models and maps for the next theatre to be released, Luthier will get the CloD code fully sorted first with good reviews.

Luthier said in his last post: "And here’s where we are in terms of plans. We obviously remain hard at work on the series. We will continue to improve the game up until the eventual release of its sequel."

From this I take it that Luthiers intention is to remove all the bugs from the game and have the engine working properly using CloD as the working version that everyone has. We will all continue to recieve our free upgrades and fixes via Steam. Untile CloD is properly fixed there is no point in releasing a sequel to disatisfied customers but once CloD owners find it working as it should then they are very likely to want to buy the sequel.

It seems to me then that the more people owning CloD and getting thier updates the better for the developers even if they bought it for peanuts. It also seems pretty clear that the quicker CloD can be fixed the quicker the sequel will be released and the quicker IC will get thier revenue stream flowing again which means Luthier will not be sleeping on the job.

The negative people's assumption that the engine will never be fixed is just that - an assumption. We will just have to wait and see.

+1 May this sim prosper and live a long life.

[nearmiss]

12.5 $

http://www.getgamesgo.com/product/il-2-sturmovik-cliffs-of-dover

Why Im not suprised...

Now I feel like a real donkey...

pfftt

Yes, I know what you mean but I look at it differently.

I remember when Oleg was having a hard time financially several years back. I bought extra copies of IL2. There really wasn't any way to get money to him that we knew of then. I've still got the unopened boxes.
There is no way I could ever afford to pay Oleg for the many hours of enjoyment I've received from the IL2 series.

So, supporting the developers to me is important and I think that is as it should be for many of us. I say that, because I don't give a flip for any other genre of game, nor do I have anything besides IL2 and COD on my HDD.

[albx]

This is what happen when you release an unfinished beta bugged software... learn the lesson....

[Trumper]

. No other sim had such a beautiful lighting engine. I was getting the worth of my money just flying around at sunset.

They had artistically impared programers, that spent too much time in the basement, "fix" the looks of something created and calibrated by a proffesional photograper. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/compsmash.gif

This last patch robbed me of most of the fun I had with Cliffs of Dover.:(

I remember the discussions years ago on the forums with Oleg about photography.
In Mr X 's video everything scenery wise looks a "blue haze".
It's a shame you can't mix and match bits from each patch,the best of each.

[Chivas]

Well the lesson to be learned by all future developers is dont blatently lie to your fanbase and dont release a crap product.

The damage done to the flight sim community with the release of this shoddy product is unrepairable. Its virtually killed half the squadrons that had large numbers on il2 servers, and coupled with the fact that there can be no more online wars/competions the creation of future squads looks very bleak.

The death of WW2 flight simming will not come about because of those who have had the balls to ask questions and complain it will come about by the sheer arrogance of developers who believe they can get away with this kind of disrespect to their loyal customers , shame on them, they should be on here every single day thanking us greatly for our loyalty and extreme patience why they sort out the mess that 'they' created. How many time in the past did we hear the words "Oleg would never do that to us" or "Luthier wouldn't lie to us", well its time to wake up, because they have and they did.

It is unfortunate that a vocal few in the community has taken everything the developer was trying to accomplish in the development as a promise. That's the price developers have to pay, keeping the community apprised of some of the work they're trying to do. Yes there are more than a few features unfinished, as the developers ran out of time, and were forced either to release what was done or can it. This software is set up with a ton of immersive features that if the developer is given time to sort out, we could have a great combat flight sim for another ten or more years. The developer is still working on it with very little on going investment, so the developer/publishers must think things can still get sorted. If the developer was Microsoft they would have sold it and forgot about it.

This is not the time to throw the only decent WW2 aircombat developer under the bus. For the price of a case of beer, the upside is huge and downside dismal. There is simply no other developer in the foreseeable future going to make a sim this complex. Yes we can be totally pissed, and help drive away as many customers as possible, but that would be like biting off your nose to spite your face. Luckily most of the community are old enough to understand that the real world is complicated, and the personal investment in this project minuscule.

[nearmiss]

Even at the prices advertised its still way to expensive, for a game that still as massive issues it should now be a give away product.

Tree you are still amazing... you persist to be the troll that pokes his head from under the bridge makes a stinky comment and crawls back under the bridge. LOL

You make me laugh often.

http://stuartnager.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/troll.jpg

[KG26_Alpha]

Tree you are still amazing... you persist to be the troll that pokes his head from under the bridge makes a stinky comment and crawls back under the bridge. LOL

You make me laugh often.

http://stuartnager.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/troll.jpg

That seagull is under-modelled.

:)

[Pudfark]

I've yet to see tree proved wrong....
There do seem to be a lot of tree baiting going on...
To include taunting and barking....and name calling...
If what I have stated above ain't accurate?
It's surely a nearmiss.

[ATAG_Bliss]

I don't think it will ever really replicate the sort of numbers one saw in a typical BoB engagement. Blaming it on hardware limitations is a cop out too. It just requires a creative solution that the developers are incapable of producing.

It's already achieved the highest number of AI in a mission out of any flight sim ever made besides the original IL2 (If not go ahead and give me some proof) And considering the developers have already produced the longest lasting most popular WWII, IMO the best flight sim ever made, I think they're more than capable of doing just about anything.

Did you ever remember how buggy ROF was when it 1st came out? Heck, they still can't even fix the problem with their master browser, and it's pushing 3 years. The game engine for ROF is soo limited it's not even funny. I think I have more AAA at a single airfield in our mission than what's even possible for the total number of objects in a ROF mission before it crashes. IL2COD is straight up awesome. Just because everything doesn't work right atm, does not mean that it won't ever work right. The main thing, the game engine, has already proven it can do more than any other sim out there already and this is by a long shot. As a MP player, the only sim that even comes close to what you can do in IL2COD is the old IL2.

Please show me any flight sim that can even think about getting this many planes in the air.

Here's over 1000 planes: (yes it's slowed down for performance sake / record) Go ahead and show me 1/10th of those # of planes in a ROF video. Good luck getting the mission to even load!

Oh, and this was back in May.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xn1f7vnfxo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtQZTI-ft3o

[Tree_UK]

Tree you are still amazing... you persist to be the troll that pokes his head from under the bridge makes a stinky comment and crawls back under the bridge. LOL

You make me laugh often.

http://stuartnager.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/troll.jpg

lol, come on Nearmiss you can do better than that, and surely you know by now that I never crawl back under the bridge Im more than happy to fight my corner. :grin:

Nice pic though I'll give you that. :grin::grin:

[Trumper]

Well i bought it yesterday even though i know my computer isn't up to it.
Even with alot of the settings low, poodling about in a Tigermoth is lovely,well worth the price of a litre of fuel and a bar of chocolate.
Whether it should be called a combat sim or not is possibly a step too far but seems nice at the moment.:)

[tk471138]

Just Flight is fine, I used it a few times. If its cheaper, more people will buy it. What new game doesn't get cheaper?
On another note, RoF is free now... ;)

yea new games get cheaper but not from 50-60$ to like 12$ in less than a year....usually most modern games wont reduce their price by even $10 untill after a year, or so...i wish with all games i can wait 7 or 8 months and be able to pay 15$ for the game...this is totally unprecedented, but you are trying to say that this is normal and everything is fine....

also RoF, has a different business model, and thus might be able to make profit based on the new planes and additions...

[41Sqn_Stormcrow]

RoF also has a more supportive community and not a basher community for some reasons I do not know despite RoF's equally or more desastrous beginnings in comparison to CoD.

I guess as newcomers ppl were more forgiving towards the RoF devs. Some ppl changing from IL2 to Clod probably expected they will have something like the uber IL2 with great graphics, phantastic FM and DM and similar monster content, absolutely bug-free and running on a computer two years old with high settings. They got angry when their expectations hit reality ... :)

[Flanker35M]

S!

Stormcrow, there is truth in your statement ;) We were told to expect something better and above IL-2. And there was no doubt because we knew the dev team had already several years of experience from IL-2 and would use lessons learned to create something even better. But something happened along the way and we got CoD at it's current state. So for sure there were may upset fans because of this.

Only thing we can wish is that Luthier and his team can pull together CoD and with it's sequels/add-ons bring up to the place it was planned to be, the new benchmark in WW2 flight sims.

[PLebre]

Hi,

When they can fix the laggy moving model part, they will have a working Great Sim.

Anyway CoD is full a great things, and can by most immersive, and I believe that Devs are working hard to correct it.

For 12€ think it is a good buy.

P.S.

Didn't fly CoD for some time, and the other day (after the last patch) I did a go on multiplayer. Always CTD, please correct it ASP.

Regards

[AKA_Tenn]

Only because your comparison is invalid. If you sold 5 for $6 each to make $30 overall, you make less money than selling one for $30 because it still cost you the same amount to manufacture each copy of the game.

It's just desperation, presumably sales have been so low on the US release (because everyone knew that the game was a turkey) that they're just hoping to attract bargain-bucket sales. "How bad could it be?"

assuming you even sold 1 copy for 30$.... and most copies are digital... cost nothing...

[swiss]

assuming you even sold 1 copy for 30$.... and most copies are digital... cost nothing...

Not entirely true.
-500% raise in suport request
-higher commissions (they are not linear)
-(500% raise in moaning lol)
- plus bandwith, power etcpp.