Merlin XII - wrong temperature limits!

[reflected]

I have a copy of the Spitfire II pilots notes which clearly states that a rad. temperature of 135 C and an oil temp. of 105 C was allowed for 5 minutes. However, in CloD, the engine dies in a matter of seconds once you go above 120 C (rad.) or 95 C (oil).

This is wrong, isn't it?

Although I have no data about the Spitfire MkI I assume that the limits were the same. Then again , I might be wrong, but the Spitfire MkII is wrong, that's for sure.

[41Sqn_Banks]

Merlin III
Amendment List No. 4 from November 1940 of AP 1590B Merlin II and III Aero-Engines has the following limits:

Oil
Type ... Specification D.T.D.109
Inlet oil temperatures
Minimum for opening up ... 15°C
Maximum for continious cruising ... 90° C.
Maximum for climbing or 30 minute emergency (1 engine stopped : multi-engined aeroplanes) ... 90° C.
Emergency maximum (5 minute limit) ... 95° C.

Coolant
Type ... Treated ethylene glycol: Specification D.T.D.344
Outlet temperatures
Minimum for opening up ... 60° C.
Maximum for cruising ... 95° C.
Maximum for climbing and level flight (5 minutes limit) ... 120° C.
Maximum for 1/2 hour emergency* ... 120° C.

* Though not stated, I assume this limit is for multi-engined aeroplanes with one engine stopped, because there is no 30 minute emergency for single-engined aeroplanes.

The initial limits (without amendment) stated in AP 1590B Merlin II and III Aero-Engines (October 1938, reprint October 1939) are the same.

However, IIRC the Pilot's Notes Spitfire I of the Collector's Edition state higher limits.

Merlin XII
The Merlin XII employs a mixture of ethylene glycol and water instead of pure ethylene glycol.

The Pilot's Notes here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/4598146/Pilots-Notes-Supermarine-Spitfire-Mk-IIA-IIB-Merlin-XII-Engine
state 120° C and 95° C for emergency (last page).

However I know that there are 2 different versions of Pilot's Notes Spitfire IIA circulating, for example this one: http://www.scribd.com/doc/46069063/1940-A-P-1565B-Pilot-s-Notes-for-Spitfire-II-Aeroplane which states the 135° C and 105° C.

Conclusion
There are obviously different limit depending on the date of the publication. My conclusion is that the limits for Merlin III and Merlin XII were changed over the time. We have to take a close look at the Amendment Lists for every publication.

[reflected]

Impressive, thanks for the info!

[Viper2000]

Early Merlins used 100 per cent ethylene glycol colling which allowed 135ºC coolant temperature, but with the advent of the Merlin XII a major move was made to pressure water cooling using 30 per cent gycol as anti-freeze. The advantages of water as a cooling medium are considerable. With 135ºC coolant temperature the mixture at 15 lb per square inch reduces the cylinder head metal temperature by some 30ºC when compared with 100 per cent glycol.

Harvey-Bailey, A. H. 1995. The Merlin in Perspective - the combat years. 4th Edition. Derby: Rolls-Royce Heritage Trust.

However, Appendix VIII of the same book notes the Merlin IV as the lowest Mark number of Merlin designed for pressurised water cooling, and describes the Merlin XII as

Basically as Merlin IV but with higher supercharger gear ratio and uses 100 octane fuel. Coffman starter, pressure water cooled. For Spitfire II.

Meanwhile, Appendix VII, which is the list of Mark numbers from the Production Drawing Office & Service Department is not in complete agreement. It states that the Merlin IV was pressure glycol cooled, whilst the Merlin XII is listed as pressure water/glycol cooled.

Merlin III is listed as glycol cooled, as is Merlin V.

However, in yet another list which forms part of the same appendix, Merlin V is given as "converted Merlin III" and as either pressure or glycol cooled.

So, what I think was actually going on is this:


Originally, all Merlins were glycol cooled.
Glycol causes all sorts of trouble and is flammable, so it was phased out in favour of pressurised water cooling from the Merlin XII onwards.
Existing Merlin III engines were gradually converted to Merlin V standard, using pressurised water cooling, presumably some time after the arrival of the Spitfire II in September 1940.
The switch to pressurised water cooling reduced the maximum coolant temperature from 135ºC to 120ºC.
Pilot's notes were amended accordingly, but the engines weren't allocated a new Mark number because they weren't new engines; it's easy to imagine the pen-pushers saying "You can't possibly give these engines a new Mark number without filling in the following 17 forms for each engine in triplicate - we have a system to maintain!"...
Therefore my best guess is that Spitfire I and Hurricane I during the Battle should have the older 135ºC limit, whilst Spitfire II should have the 120ºC limit, and then some time in late 1940 the older aeroplanes should be converted in dribs and drabs during overhauls.


Note however, that this is nothing more than informed speculation. It is possible that the temperature reduction was independent of the change in coolant.

However, my best guess would be that the original intention was to retain the 135ºC limit, but that the pressurisation required to prevent the system from boiling over was such that leaks became a problem (indeed, coolant leaks were quite well documented in this period) and therefore the degree of pressurisation and thus the maximum safe temperature was reduced at some point in order to mitigate the problem.

Obviously the arguments for standardisation are pretty strong, so I imagine that once the decision was made to convert the installed fleet to pressurised water cooling with a 120ºC limit this new limit was imposed across the board irrespective of the progress of the conversion programme, resulting in the strange combination of pure glycol cooling and a 120ºC limit in some sources.

BTW, the Spitfire I notes in the CE state that the limit is 120ºC and the coolant is 70% water and 30% glycol; but they state the engine as Merlin II or III not Merlin V.

[ivo]

Hi see here for manual download:
http://www.wargamespezia.org/downloads/manuali-militari-military-handbooks/

[41Sqn_Banks]

Early Merlins used 100 per cent ethylene glycol colling which allowed 135ºC coolant temperature, but with the advent of the Merlin XII a major move was made to pressure water cooling using 30 per cent gycol as anti-freeze. The advantages of water as a cooling medium are considerable. With 135ºC coolant temperature the mixture at 15 lb per square inch reduces the cylinder head metal temperature by some 30ºC when compared with 100 per cent glycol.
Harvey-Bailey, A. H. 1995. The Merlin in Perspective - the combat years. 4th Edition. Derby: Rolls-Royce Heritage Trust.

...

4. The switch to pressurised water cooling reduced the maximum coolant temperature from 135ºC to 120ºC.
...


The first quote from The Merlin in Perspective doesn't state that the coolant temperature had to be reduced due to the switch to water/glycol. Is there any source for the reduction from 135° C to 120° C?


6. Therefore my best guess is that Spitfire I and Hurricane I during the Battle should have the older 135ºC limit, whilst Spitfire II should have the 120ºC limit, and then some time in late 1940 the older aeroplanes should be converted in dribs and drabs during overhauls.

My sources don't support this theory.

Operational Notes for Pilots on Merlin II and III.
2nd Edition January 1939

Coolant Temperatures-
The engine, which employs ethylene glycol as the cooling medium, should not be opened up to full power until the coolant outlet temperature exceeds 60°C. The maximum permissible temperatures under normal flying conditions are:-
95°C. when cruising and 120°C. on climb, and under full throttle conditions in level flight.


Air Publication 1590B Volumne I, Merlin II and III Aero-Engines
2nd Edition October 1939, Reprinted 1939

Leading Particulars
Coolant
Type ... Treated ethylene glycol: Specification D.T.D.344
Outlet temperatures-
Minimum for take-off ... 60° C.
Maximum for cruising ... 95° C.
Maximum for climbing and level flight. ... 120° C.


Operational Notes for Pilots on Merlin II, III and IV.
4th Edition, April 1940

Coolant-
Ethylene Glycol to Specification D.T.D. 344.
...
Coolant Temperatures-
The engine should not be opened up until the coolant outlet temperature exceeds 60°C.
The maximum permissible outlet temperatures under normal conditions of flight are-
Cruising ... 95°C.
Climb ... 120°C.
Full throttle level fllight [sic] ... 120°C.
Recommended cruising temperature ... 85-95°C.


Amendment List No. 4 to Air Publication 1590B Volume I (2nd Edition, October, 1938 ) November 1940


Leading Particulars (Merlin III and V)
Coolant
Type ... Treated ethylene glycol: Specification D.T.D.344
Outlet temperatures-
Minimum for opening up ... 60° C.
Maximum for cruising ... 95° C.
Maximum for climbing and level flight (5 minutes limit) ... 120° C.
Maximum for 1/2 hour emergency* ... 120° C.


My conclusion is that at some date after November 1940 the coolant temperature was increased from 120°C. to 135°C.





Because it might be interesting, the Amendments to Air Publication 1590B Volume I states:
7A. The Merlin V aero-engine is basically similar to the Merlin III aero-engine, with the exception that, while its airscrew shaft is of the same general type, it is not universal in its ability to take all forms of airscrew.

[ivo]

Yes, and why in the simulation gauges boost max indicate +8Lb./Sq.in and the real Merlin XXII arrive to 12 Lb/Sq.in look here
http://www.spitfireperformance.com/spit1pn2-a.jpg :confused:

[ivo]

Bye now I have understand, it is a wronf oh the game, and also the gauges in the cockpit is wrong, see pictures on internet...:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: