In danger of giving this up

[drambuie]

Hi all,

Am on normal, level 19 Mage atm and in serious danger of giving this game up. Problem is I have none of the better spells - turn back time, resurrection, divine armour - and am now at the point where every fight is lethal/impossible. I have trolls, cyclops, assasins, royal griff and inquisitors or a variety of other stuff. Have no more trolls/cyclops available as I only found a few. Can't upgrade any items because the fights invovled are pretty ridiculously overpowered.

I have seen a few paladins but not many. Not trying to do a timed game or no loss, just want to have fun.

Problem is it is now becoming a real slugathon, big stacks of say royal snakes are just taking too long to kill before they start killing my troops off.

Any tips or advice? Am I doing something drastically wrong? I don't want to play a perfectly managed game of losing no troops etc - not my idea of enjoyment - but this is now becoming a chore rather than fun.

Cheers

[N3MES1S]

¿? U cant advance / fight strong enemies with that units?? dude, u have a serious lack of strategy / skills. Royal Griffins and summoned avenging guards are one of the most cheat units on the game, use em and u cant lose dude. With that army u have, u should not have ANY problem. If u cant do a no losses battle with that army or just a battle without losing more than a few units, then u really dont know how to play this game, or u just lack of completely strategic methods. Playing with mage is harder, but on normal mode the game is too easy. Dont be afraid on fighting lethal / very strong troops, use avenging guards of royal griffins to move em at the center of the battle and use rangers to kill stack of enemies. And use cyclops as a melee unit too, not only at range. But i am amazed that with that troops u say u cant advance... O_o (i only play on impossible and the game turned too easy ..). If your problems are too strong, start again with a warrior til u know the basics of the game and the basic strategies.

[drambuie]

Hmm well what I'm saying is for instance fighting Zig Zag, I can't stop losing things because he does lightning or the pillars of water thing. Kills trolls and there's nothing i can see that I can do about that? What would others do to stop the effeect of hero's magic?

Maybe my earlier post was out of frustration but I don't see how using royal griffins and summoned ones 'can't lose'. Why? They aren't that great, they die pretty quick.

[Razorflame]

don't listen to nemesis;)

i think i know your problem or at least i give u a good shot at it

the problem is u got alot of level 5 units which is costing extremely lot of high leadership(which in results makes your army weak)

sure level 5 units are strong
but they also don't come in high numbers

for simple calculation


what would be better 2 trols or 50 royal snakes?
royal snakes big time ^^


try to swap some of the level 5 units for level 3 or 4 units

royal snakes for the trolls for sure

cyclopes are just a medi core unit it's better to use paladins

demonologist if avabile is also good
assasins are very bad royal snakes own assasins easily
(this is deu to leadership wise)


hope this helps u a bit

:)

[N3MES1S]

It is supossed hes asking for advice using the army he got now, and the problem is not he got too many level 5 units (i can kill zag zag on impossible with trolls, cyclops or watever i want with no losses), the problem is that he need to play according the army he got. If u have trolls, for god sake, wait til the night and they automatically recover health on every turn. And its impossible zag zag kill your trolls if u play at night. In that case trolls are faaaaar better than royal snakes if u wisht to comprate both. And apply stone skin on trolls, use the defense spells. Paladins better than cyclops?? if u want no losses against zag zag or minimal, cyclops+stone skin owns, and is better choice. Assasins very bad?? lol.. Razorflame i think u are talking of another game...

[Razorflame]

not really

paladins can give another unit an extra turn which is great

royal snake got a distant attack and no retalitation

assasins can only use their ranged attack once and they have to kill a stack before they can reuse it not worth it
royal snakes way cheaper and strong

in large quantiies royal snakes can kill a troll in 1 hit
give them another turn from paladins and another troll goes down

sure they are nice at night and cyclops too

but that is if u understand the game better

like u said yourself he doesn't utilize his units abilities

so why let him use it?
give him sometihng else that CAN work for him;)

[kcwong]

drambuie, try using the droids on Bolo (sometimes spelled Bola). Buy a stack of guard droid and repair droids, and split the repair droids in half. Put any other troops you got in castle or reserve.

Put stoneskin on guard droid and let the enemies focus on it, while your repair droids fly around, shoot and repair. Use your spells and pet dragon to their fullest.

The droids can give you no loss battles even when vastly outnumbered (like 200 vs 2000).

[ywhtptgt]

Yeah, you are definitely not using good strategies if you struggle as Mage in Normal mode. Unless I am facing stacks with low mobility and low range power, I'd prefer going around with a single level 5 stack (either dragons or trolls).

Against bosses or stacks with high range damage potential, I'd cast Invisibility on my single stack and then cast Demon Portal + Mana Spring over the next few rounds. As long as you keep the enemies pre-occupied with the summoned creeps (recast invisibility if needed), you can defeat most armies without casualties. This should hold especially true in Normal mode.

Alternatively, you can also opt for nuking the sh1t out of the enemies with Fire Rain/Fire Ball/Ice Snake. Since this is Normal mode, you should easily be able to wipe out the enemy within a few rounds.

Of course, this is assuming you have the right and spells skills learned... For example, a viable Mage should at least have:
- Maxed Order, Distortion, Chaos magic
- High Magic (as many levels as possible)
- Summoner (as many levels as possible)
- Invisibility spell
- Mana Spring spell (maxed)
- At least one of Fireball, Ice Snake, and Fire Rain spell (maxed)
- Demon Portal spell (maxed)
- Trap spell

Spells like Time Back, Resurrection, and Divine Armour are actually not a necessity.

As for your lineup, I'd dump Cyclops and Assassins. Trolls should also be dumped except for the occasion of using one-stack strategies. As many suggested, Royal Snakes are good. Paladins are also decent. With the right items, a Dwarf (Alchemist, Foreman, Soldier, Cannoneer, Miner) or Undead lineup (Necromancer, Ancient Vampire, Dark Knight, Bone Dragon, any other Dragon) will also be very powerful. If you ever come across any Dragons, you should also get a few.

[travelingoz]

@ Drambuie,

With all those level 4-5 units, all you need to do is spam your "Fear" spell. On the first round, try to kill Zig Zag's 2 trolls with fire arrow or something, then start casting "Fear" on all the remaining stacks. (Do you have higher magic?)
Once all of Zog Zag's units are under the influence of the "Fear" spell, he won't be able to have his turn and therefore won't be able to cast "Geyser" and "lightening". :grin:

[N3MES1S]

@ Drambuie,

With all those level 4-5 units, all you need to do is spam your "Fear" spell. On the first round, try to kill Zig Zag's 2 trolls with fire arrow or something, then start casting "Fear" on all the remaining stacks. (Do you have higher magic?)
Once all of Zog Zag's units are under the influence of the "Fear" spell, he won't be able to have his turn and therefore won't be able to cast "Geyser" and "lightening". :grin:

yup, thats another reason that using level 5 units in the right strategy are best instead of low level troops. Fear is a cheap spell, and is essential when u are using level 5 stacks.

I still prefer cyclops instead paladins, only a few troops will target cyclops, while paladins are always 1st or 2nd troop on being attacked.

Trolls + Cyclops + Fear + night fight = u cant lose.

Everyone's here only recommends units that can only be adquired on later island, thats useless while hes asking for kill zag zag ¿?.

And if u going to choose between royal snakes or assasins.. i prefer assasins.

[drambuie]

Thanks for all the replies folks. I can see just by reading them all that there are various things to try - I've also started a paladin game on hard to try and redo the game more carefully and think about my approach more.

Cheers

[ywhtptgt]

Everyone's here only recommends units that can only be adquired on later island, thats useless while hes asking for kill zag zag ¿?. I don't see the problem with that. I beated Zig-Zag with a single stack of Green Dragons. Unless you are doing a speed game, it's perfectly reasonable to scour later islands before doing boss battles in the first few islands.

[Heroe]

I just want to share my experience with this game...
I want to say, this game is harder than "the legend"
All enemies are always strong, lethal overpowering :)
At least devs left the same freedom of lurking, stealing, sneaking :)
But, princess Amelia is not a royal treasure searcher, thats why she is almost like a beggar.Im having almost no gold to keep my army at full units.

Im level 19.. i use 5trex, a bunch of horsmen(those guys with spears, i forgot the name) demonologists, assasins, royal? griffins..
And i have a hard time improving my army, re suplying it..
I wanted to get dragons etc, but its impossible :) no gold.
Still i have one unexplored island.. :)
P.S. in armored princess game, all units have much more special abilities, that its hard to think of what units to get.And its hard to find ancient vampires, nekromancers, dragons etc..

[Razorflame]

if u got cash problems then u don't utilize your abilties well
and lose alot of armies during battles

step nr.1 for mass gold is 3x treasure searcher

step nr.2 is don't lose units or only a very small amount

[Heroe]

i loose a couple of low level units rarely, mostly i never loose units.
Its not my problem thė game is tedious :( ( maybe because devs got a ton of complains about "the legend" being not challeging enough(for geeks :) so thats why they made a sequel a lot harder)
p.s. if you fight an ordinary battle, you loose one or two dragon or 3-5 low level units, for about the same amount of gold.2dragons ~ 25k gold.Its the same or more than the loot you get from the fight.
p.p.s. pls dont suggest for me to dig a chest each round...

[N3MES1S]

What level are u playing, cuz if u are not playing hard or impossible, it is too easy not to run out of money on Armored Princess. On easy and normal i cant see a way for running out of money, seriously. If u lose only a couple of units on combat, u should not run out of money, its impossible. So u are doing something wrong. Wat units u using? for example in my actual game, im playing on impossible, just discover Reha and have about 1,4 million of gold. And i rarely lose units. If i were playing on normal, sure i will have about 3 million or more. And believe me, is too hard to lose just 1 dragon. Now that ive played toons of games, i am sure when i tell u that i never get 1 dragon killed. And yes, the treasure chest ability is a must if u see u cant raise your gold. It can give u more than 5000 gold per battle.

[Razorflame]

i loose a couple of low level units rarely, mostly i never loose units.
Its not my problem thė game is tedious :( ( maybe because devs got a ton of complains about "the legend" being not challeging enough(for geeks :) so thats why they made a sequel a lot harder)
p.s. if you fight an ordinary battle, you loose one or two dragon or 3-5 low level units, for about the same amount of gold.2dragons ~ 25k gold.Its the same or more than the loot you get from the fight.
p.p.s. pls dont suggest for me to dig a chest each round...

3x chest with an average of 1000~2000 gold

x 200 battles
do the math

[N3MES1S]

3x chest with an average of 1000~2000 gold

x 200 battles
do the math


2x chests, not 3.

[N3MES1S]

I don't see the problem with that. I beated Zig-Zag with a single stack of Green Dragons. Unless you are doing a speed game, it's perfectly reasonable to scour later islands before doing boss battles in the first few islands.

I didnt mean the green dragon of the cave, i meant other level 5 units.

[clinek]

ok here is my strategy. Get all dragons (black,red,green, and bone) and an archdemon. that way you can cast fear on any unit who will kill anyone of your dragons or archdemon (archers mainly) and burn the rest with fire rain. Run away from all dangerous units who get close to you and make sure that you utilize the fear spell as much as possible. the dragons all have the rechargable abilities so you can run in and kill the enemies then run away again. Just make sure you dont attack any big groups with your normal attack unless of course its an archmage, priest, or inquisitor with your black dragon. Its that simple. you wont lose any units ever and you will constanly be making money by killing troops. dont waste your time with asassins or any units like that. any enemy hero who cast a lot of magic spell (geyser, fire rain, ect), put all your units into a castle but one stack of black dragons. Kill the archers asap while running away from all the other units and periodically using the dragons fire ability.

[Heroe]

3x chest with an average of 1000~2000 gold

x 200 battles
do the math

I wrote - dont suggest the gold digging strategy!!!
I hate to play a game with forced strategy.Im looking for a ways to play a game and be happy without spamming the same strategy over and over and over again.

[N3MES1S]

I think at level 19 he doesnt discovered Sheterra, Reha, Montero, Uzala, etc, so the strategy must be applied on the troops he get right now. But i dont think the problem is the strategy at all, cuz its too easy not to run out of money specially on easy-normal, and with royal griffins is even more easy to advance. Use royal griffins in 2 stacks, and summon avenging guards, and put the avenging guards in front of archers so they can shot, for example, while u are using your range units (or take the avenging guards to the centre of the battle). Use paladins + inquisitors, and take the inquisitors always behind the paladins. And wtf, u have demonologists??? man, summon demons. With demonologists, inquisitors and paladins U CAN LOSE MONEY, its impossible. Something is very very wrong. U know u can resurrect troops with demonologists, inquisitors and paladins right?

[clinek]

what would be better 2 trols or 50 royal snakes?
royal snakes big time ^^

nonsense. If your are a mage then you have access to a wide variety of spells at this point. Keep only the stack of trolls, nothing else and attack a creature guarding the maps. Make sure you fight this stack ONLY AT NIGHT TIME! put them in a corner, cast fear on some of the archers so that they can do no damage to you, cast stone skin and magic spring on the trolls, while periodically casting spells that will poisen or burn the enemy with a huge stack. you will not win with just the power of your spells or brute force but if your facing 100 knights, you can burn and poisen them and at least 10 will die each turn just from that. its unreal how much damage a huge unit takes just from being burned or poisened. Each round, the trolls will heal themselves restoring thier health back to 100% while widdleing away the troops who are attacking you head on. This way, you lose zero units (maybe one if careless at one point) and you get access to other lands after you pick up the map so that you can pick up some of the better units like dragons and archdemons. The reason why im saying this is because i have had terrible luck in one game but i used this exact strategy to beat a 157 knights, 230 griffins, 211 inquisitors, and 600 robbers. i continuously casted fear on the inquisitors, and had only the griffins and robbers attack me. I was level 13, had like 14 or 15 intellect, around 60 mana, and 0 attack and denfense (I HAD THE WORST LUCK WITH ITEMS), and only 3 or 4 trolls. that was the most epic battle ever but that strategy works. Keep in mind that you can also cast fear on any unit in thier army which completely disables them for 4 turns! The game is not always... well, is never about brute force. When you are playing as a mage, its all about strategy.

[Heroe]

wow, how many levels you got from that one battle? :)
p.s. i recommend trex, because they attack, they eat, and they attack again :)
p.p.s. where are nekromancers, im levl 26 and i havent found any of them..also i havent found ancient vampires too :( a shame..At such level i have only a few usefull spells and havent found my favourite units :( and at this level i beated the legend.. yeah :D

[clinek]

your ideology is great but you dont get a trex until reha which is really late in the game. They are good units but they give dragons bad morale so i never use them. Im pretty sure i gained 2 or 3 levels just from that one fight though. necromancers are incredible units but you cant ressurect them so they really dont help on a no loss challenge. Plus, they got rid of the tolerate skill in AP which really pissed me off so the only undead unit i use are bone dragons in correlation with the other dragons. They really increased the stats of bone dragons since they were so weak in KB:TL so now i like them. Also, you dont need any useful spells until the end of the game. As long as you have poisen skull, fear, magic spring, and fire arrow, your in the clear at any point before elon. vampires are too slow and when you change into a bit they suck so i really dont use them either. Stick with high hp, level 5 units who can run away when your in a bad situation i.e. dragons and archdemons:cool:

[Heroe]

well i got trex at lvl 18 or so.. i was happy when i found out on my own, that i can sneak here and there... its a shame in AP devs FORCED! us to use sneaking too much...
trex are in samman castle ;) in demon island.

[clinek]

thats weird, ive never seen them there. a tirex in the demon land... thats like finding a soccer mom in a crack house

[Heroe]

thats weird, ive never seen them there. a tirex in the demon land... thats like finding a soccer mom in a crack house

in shettera island, there is a beasts lair, there is a samman or similar nick, where you have to kill him, but also he has nice load of units, and a lot of t-rex.. so.. thats where i found them early in the game.
And yes, i was suspicious about all living things against amellie, where demons walk with peasants and undead!, black dragons live in taverns, and some old villagers grows ROYAL! griffins ( yeah, royal.. :) )

[clinek]

i know right. since when do dragons hang out and drink beer at taverns ha ha

[N3MES1S]

nonsense. If your are a mage then you have access to a wide variety of spells at this point. Keep only the stack of trolls, nothing else and attack a creature guarding the maps. Make sure you fight this stack ONLY AT NIGHT TIME! put them in a corner, cast fear on some of the archers so that they can do no damage to you, cast stone skin and magic spring on the trolls, while periodically casting spells that will poisen or burn the enemy with a huge stack. you will not win with just the power of your spells or brute force but if your facing 100 knights, you can burn and poisen them and at least 10 will die each turn just from that. its unreal how much damage a huge unit takes just from being burned or poisened. Each round, the trolls will heal themselves restoring thier health back to 100% while widdleing away the troops who are attacking you head on. This way, you lose zero units (maybe one if careless at one point) and you get access to other lands after you pick up the map so that you can pick up some of the better units like dragons and archdemons. The reason why im saying this is because i have had terrible luck in one game but i used this exact strategy to beat a 157 knights, 230 griffins, 211 inquisitors, and 600 robbers. i continuously casted fear on the inquisitors, and had only the griffins and robbers attack me. I was level 13, had like 14 or 15 intellect, around 60 mana, and 0 attack and denfense (I HAD THE WORST LUCK WITH ITEMS), and only 3 or 4 trolls. that was the most epic battle ever but that strategy works. Keep in mind that you can also cast fear on any unit in thier army which completely disables them for 4 turns! The game is not always... well, is never about brute force. When you are playing as a mage, its all about strategy.

+1. I always pick up trolls if i can, they are awesome units. With a mage, u can cast watever u want on trols (stone sking, divine armour, etc) and make em almost impossible to kill healing themselves on every round and casting fear on enemie troops. Having trolls on early-mid island is a great luck and having trex is a bit overpowered at level 18 xD.

[Zechnophobe]

Yeah, late game Tirex's aren't as awesome as Black Dragons, but are a whole lot of whoop at around the 2k leadership mark. Just like Red Dragons.

[Razorflame]

never used trexes before:P

i always found them pretty weak xD

[clinek]

never used trexes before

i always found them pretty weak x

agreed. I was really dissapointed in the lizards as a whole. None of them are really all that useful for no loss. Sure mark of blood is a good skill for guargonas (however you spell that) but they are level 3 units and that only leaves level 1 and 2 units to cast fear on. the rest are pretty shitty. towards the end of the game, you never fight an enemy group who is not marked as being impossible. They have a huge advantage as far as brute force is concerned so sending in units to fight head to head is suicide. Thats pretty much what the lizard race is all about; brute force. if you put trex's in your army you have between 10-20 depending on what heroe class you choose and most armies in reha have at least 30 in thier army. Thier initiative is ok, thier speed is ok, and thier attack/defense is ok for a level 5 unit, also, they give your dragons low morale. it would be awesome if they could fly though :grin:

[Razorflame]

i found the birds always ok units

their egg is awesome for blocking

but overall

only 2 usefull units for lizard;-)

and trex ain't one of em xd

[Zechnophobe]

Tirex is actually one of the best level 5's until you get to the point in the game where enemies can actually kill them in a single attack or two. The built in ability to fully heal makes them darn efficient for no loss games. Their like Giants crossed with Trolls, and move a heck of a lot further.

Not good for morale though.

[clinek]

thats any level 5 unit though. If you get them early on, they are unbeatable. they would be useful if you got them in scarlet wind or something like that but for the most part, you dont get them until late in the game. the only useful ability they have is healing themselves by eating fallen troops. Lets face it, 10-40 damage, that is so useless. Sure it halves the action points of enemy units IF they have less leadership than your stack but how often does that happen when trying to kill the creatures that guard the maps. something needs to be done for them for them to be useful at all. I mean for gods sake, its a ******* t rex, the king of the dinosaurs, not a cat. Thier damage should be significantly higher than any other creature or something

[clinek]

wow this forum edited me saying f u c k, thats pretty gay

[N3MES1S]

Yeah, late game Tirex's aren't as awesome as Black Dragons, but are a whole lot of whoop at around the 2k leadership mark. Just like Red Dragons.

I prefer red dragons instead of black dragons by far. And i prefer Tirex instead of black dragons. Must be a taste choice. Trex are awesome units, maybe the most useful unit on lizards, and maybe one of the best level 5 units.

About lizard faction, they are as good as the others, stop saying dumb things like they are weak or something. U just need to apply different strategy if u play with lizards, and be aware of the morale.

[clinek]

i think the reason why most people prefer dragons over a trex is not really because of the damage or anything, but more so for thier ability move a great distance. you could put one black or red dragon against 100 trex's and they will win because they can "hit and run". Just keep running to the other side of the screen, wait for them to get close, then fly to the other side using your skill.

[Heroe]

nonsence.. you cant win having 1dragon vs 100trex..

[Razorflame]

a red dragon can ;-)

that's the dragon he meant
with the fire move ability ^^

[clinek]

nonsence.. you cant win having 1dragon vs 100trex..

o yes you can. i know because ive done similar (it was around 28 or so but it wouldn't matter if it was 10,000). all you need to do is stay away from them. Run to the other side of the screen, wait for the trex to move, use your fire ability (from red or black dragons), then run back to the other side. its actually really easy to do. This is why dragons are really good for no loss. When you take out the archers, you won the battle no matter how large the enemy troop size. All you need to do is keep the hell away from other units

[N3MES1S]

i think the reason why most people prefer dragons over a trex is not really because of the damage or anything, but more so for thier ability move a great distance. you could put one black or red dragon against 100 trex's and they will win because they can "hit and run". Just keep running to the other side of the screen, wait for them to get close, then fly to the other side using your skill.

yea and tirex cant counter-attack right?

trex are the best ground level 5 units in the game, it speed is awesome, and it doubles if it eat a corpse and health itself. I dont think black dragons are better than tirex.. can u heal black dragons? nop.. so they are dead. Even if they can hit and run, sorry. I played with black dragons and tirex in the same army, and tirex are more useful by far than black dragons. Almost for the strategy i was using at the time of that game.

[clinek]

ok let me clarify something about black dragons, they have 80% resistance to magic and fire attacks, they have high initiative, they have one of the highest action points of any creature, they have the most health of any unit in the game, they have extremely high attack and defense, each attack they can hit, and burn 2 units, they do insane damage especially to lower level creatures, they do fire damage which is great against massive groups of thorns/ents, thier skill is probably the second most useful in the game (i beleive red dragons have the most useful), they make all level 1-4 units drop initiative by 1, the voice of the dragon skill gives them 2+morale, they have decent physical damage resistance, and THEY ARE IMMUNE TO SPELLS! sure you cant heal them or cast beneficial spells on them but enemie heroes cant hurt them with spells. When you fight elenhel or any heroe that cast very damaging spell, they are not effected. you just fight heroes with one stack of black dragons and its game over for them. Using the right strategy with them, they are invincible, even if you only use one stack of them and no other creatures. there is no creature in the game who has as many possibilities as them. people who bash black dragons are ignorant of how powerful and useful they really are. I mean come on, when you go into battle, who would you rather face, 5 trexs, or 4 black dragons? As a mage, black dragons are the most annoying units to fight becase they are practically invincible and they kill most of your units before you even kill one of them. obiviously you must change strategies for certain battles but black dragons have more uses in more situations than any other unit out there. a very powerful and versitile unit

[N3MES1S]

As i said, i found more useful for me tirex than black dragons. And Ancient Ents has the most hp points in the game, not black dragons.

[Zechnophobe]

Yeah, either black or red can do it (Black just use their move/attack ability to fly over their heads at end of turn).

Black dragons kill the heck out of Tirexes. So do red dragons, which are also the same leadership.

[Razorflame]

on a side note on black dragons

isn't it possible to heal them

black dragon/shaman combo worked great in TL

don't know if this still works on AP

but then it possible to heal blackies xD
and then say GG no re to trex :D

[clinek]

why do you need to ever heal them? if you use them the right way and kill all the archers then simply run away from the melee units, you shouldn't have to worry about healing them ever. 1000 health alot for enemy units to take away from you especially after two spells are cast at the enemy. fear, firerain, geyser, ect can disable most threats before the enemy has a chance to attack

[Razorflame]

was just saying there was a way to heal blackies;)