Friday 2009-11-06 Screenshots Update discussion thread

[Romanator21]

Detail is always nice. I think the ships we are seeing right now are perfect. I'll bet you my copy of the game when it comes out that there will be people manning them.

But, when the request was made for seamen crawling around on the deck, tying ropes, etc, I had to laugh. That is what I call going 'overboard', if you'll excuse me. This is something a strafing aircraft is never going to see.

If you notice, a lot of the details are shown through bump mapping rather than true 3D. This reduces polygon counts, while still giving a very accurate impression of the object. This is perfect in a flight sim where you need the detail of ground objects that are being strafed, etc, but also to give the player a realistic field of view, which is on the order of several tens of kilometers.

For example, BoP has pretty scenery, but there is always thick 'mist' at just 10 km or so. It's impossible to see anything beyond this point, because the game doesn't render it.

SoW is going to have to render these things nearly to the horizon in some instances. But the pretty frame-rate hogging grass is not going to show up beyond, say 1 km, so it's not as big of an issue as some of you are making it out to be.

I have to say, that at times the ground models of some objects in IL-2 is not adequate, even at high speeds. A square train engine with a round texture doesn't cut it.

What I am seeing is a good compromise between FPS quality, and the realism of a true flight simulator. This has enough detail to look/feel real from any situation in the cockpit.

-Rant mode: Off-

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by Foo'bar

Don't you guys think that in a sim the level of details of every single object has to correspond to each other?

I wouldn't like a game where only the planes are looking phantastic while all other environment looks like Lego.

exactly !!

and obviously you will only see that level of detail when you are close enough to a few specific objects in your nearby visual field, and that is when it is important for immersion/quality that the objects look good enough to match the rest of the game. when you are seeing the closest LoD models in all their glory, yes it is important how detailed they look

when you are flying 1000 or 5000 meters over those same objects your pc only processes the distant low cpu/gpu LoD models which have very little or no detail and are just a generic shape, and it makes absolutely no difference to your pc how pretty they might look from 20 meters away

its a bit weirdo that some new visitors here now start to complain some of the ground/sea objects look to good ! there is a purpose to what oleg does in creating some of those detailed objects right from the start, which the old timer fan's already know, in that the game engine right from the start allows air/sea/land combat with planes, ships and ground vehicles (and for the teenagers who have trouble grasping complex idea's, no that doesnt mean a first person shooter !). neither does it mean that those additional sea/ground combat functions will be included right from the start, those are elements that will be worked on further once the game is released (and 3e party's can get involved in further).

right now those boats/ships have to be good enough to match the general detail of the rest of the game, and they do. once the sea/ground elements of the game are developed and become available, i am sure the ships will be worked on further to match the detail of the aircraft (which if you look closely, you can see they dont right now).

if you bail out of your aircraft and land in the channel, and have one of those fishing boats steam towards you to pluck you out of the water, then they look great ! nice work oleg

[proton45]

Someone is going to call me a "ki$$ a$$", but I have faith in Oleg...I have faith in the fact that Oleg has made one of the best (if not the best) flight combat sims ever. I have faith in his ability as a game designer. Oleg will not create a game that is so bogged down in detail and extras that it is unplayable. Olegs a smart guy and he will do right by us...we are not loosing anything with the addition of these "pretty" ground objects.

[airmalik]

Originally Posted by Insuber

Zapatista,

All my sympathy to you my friend, but as an "old visitor" and first hour fan of the IL2 series, apart from sharing Romanator's arguments, I feel entitled to clarify a couple of points:

1. OK for extreme detail everywhere: the more the better, but in real life you cannot have everything and now. Money, people and and time are finite quantities (my wife doesn't yet agree on the latter). Briefly, I prefer an additional flyable plane at the cost of a less detailed bycicle, or no bycicle at all ... not to speak about seamen tying ropes or other oddities.

2. I've nothing against posters asking about seamen crawling back and forth or dying in a gorefest of blood spatter, only I wouldn't like them to drive the focus away from planes, their DM, FM etc... But again, new visitors are most welcome, fresh blood for flight sims...

As one of the authors of the posts about activity on shipping vessels, I feel I should clarify. I don't expect sailors on boats to be tying reefing knots, coiling neat piles of rope, knitting nets etc. What I would love to see is SOME activity on boats, airfields and cities. Sailors diving off boats when strafed isn't that far fetched if you consider that we had troops running away from convoys when attacked 10 years ago!

The fact that Oleg has mentioned busses that follow routes lead me to think that adding 'life' to the environment is something that he's interested in as well.

Lastly, I'm sure Oleg is quite capable of managing his priorities - posts by his fans may give him a sense of what we'd like to see but I doubt this would 'distract' him from his focus.

[HiWeee]

Great!~

[Oleg Maddox]

Originally Posted by tityus

Thanks for the update.

A couple of questions:

1. - I hope the stopped propeller when pause is pressed is configurable. It may not be always wanted when taking screen shots and so.

2. - Will it have a resource to export aircraft data so we can link with other peripherals and apps (as devicelink did, but more comprehensive - simpit intended)? Will it work also online?

3. - Could one watch a recorded track from another pilot PoV (inside his cockpit)?

From the past preview we saw, it will have moving air masses. so...

4. - Will it have gauges to provide windspeed, temperature and pressure? (high level precision bombing intended)

thanks
tityus

1. Yes we will solve this in future by one or other way.
2. We will have new device link. Probably it will work online as well.
3. Proabbly. Can't say now.
4. If it is in a cockpit - then we model it. In Sow now most gauges are working, if not all.

[Oleg Maddox]

Originally Posted by airmalik

The fact that Oleg has mentioned busses that follow routes lead me to think that adding 'life' to the environment is something that he's interested in as well.

I'm interested, but we can't make the sim another one year-two. So will be minimum at the beginning.

[Oleg Maddox]

Originally Posted by AFJ_rsm

Hi Oleg, hope you get well soon (or whoever in your family is ill).


The part of the boat that is underwater, and that we can see through the water, seems not to be affected by refraction. I know it's nit picking but I think it takes away from the overall realism of the image.

Are you planning on adding refraction to light passing through transparent materials?

Can't answer now. Maybe yes, maybe in future. There are different reasons to make it and to do not make. All such effects eat some time too much resources of computation. But our goal at first to get the realistic picture in air and what is really visible from air on the ground. There must be compromises becasue at first it is flight sim, and then - all other is secondary.

Even when I tell that AAA is controlable... this is not only for gameplay... this is for these that can't fly, but would try... and at least will be satisfied playing online for the AAA.

[Oleg Maddox]

Originally Posted by 13th Hsqn Protos

The barge could be a little sharper, but not bad.

What do you mean under term "Sharper" ?

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by airmalik

what I would love to see is SOME activity on boats, airfields and cities. Sailors diving off boats when strafed isn't that far fetched if you consider that we had troops running away from convoys when attacked 10 years ago!

The fact that Oleg has mentioned busses that follow routes lead me to think that adding 'life' to the environment is something that he's interested in as well.

yeps i am all in favour of those to, and i hope most of that is included right from the start

- civilian and military traffic on roads
- civilian and military ships going from point a to b
- ground activity at airfields, like fuel trucks, mechanics driving about, few jeeps with pilots heading to aircraft, emergency vehicles, food and drinks truck serving tea and sanwiches maybe
- ai aircraft taking of and landing if normal for that airfield, eg training flights for new pilots, a lost or damaged aircraft from another airfield making an emergency landing, new replacement aircraft being flown in etc..
- yes maybe even the odd bicycle with a pilot or mechanic on it
- men on the ai AA guns, first aid and fire trucks rushing to damaged aircraft coming in to land etc

in short, not the dead empty lifeless airfields we have now in il2, but an environment that gives a sense of life and vitality


Insuber, you must have put your sensitive pink nickers on today, because my previous post wast aimed at you but the person who was complaining oleg was including land/sea warfare elements and stated he'd prefer to play with other games instead (thinking amongst other things that oleg was making a 1e person shooter right now)