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[guiltyspark]

I dont know where i read it , but it said that a single burst of cannon fire from a ME109 could down a B17

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by guiltyspark

I dont know where i read it , but it said that a single burst of cannon fire from a ME109 could down a B17

Likely.
There is a statistics about WW2 planes available.
I don't remember exactly, but in average it took no more 2 bursts from less than 100 meters to get almost any plane (without heavy armour at least, such as IL-2) down.
The real problems were: accuracy of those bursts and get on a shooting distance without being shot.

As an illustration.
One day, someone (it was in Britain, afair) discovered, that most (almost all) planes were repaired from wins and (much less) fuselage damage.
Not pilot, wing control, or engine. Mostly - wings.
And they almost started a project of improving wings armour! Until someone, discovered, that all repaired planes were actually returned to base planes.

Good (short) burst from even machine guns from small distance to plane's engine or pilot - very likely will destroy plane.
If it is cannon - you can destroy even wing (not talking that distance increasing).

[Skii]

The Me109E relied heavily on its cannon armament, 2 x 20mm cannon in each wing, secondary armament was 2 x 7.92mm machine guns above the engine. The ammunition for the 109E's cannons was limited to only 60 rounds per gun - so the pilot needed to be accurate to make his rounds count, obviously a hit by a cannon shell was more devastating than the .303 browning bullet fired by the 8-gun spits and hurricanes, but the respective total armaments of the 109 and the Spit pretty much balanced each other at the time.

Anton, I don't want to labour this point for much longer as I very much respect the work you and your colleagues have put in bringing this sim to the console market , and believe you me I'll be spending many as many hours in the Fw-190 as the Spitfire variants, but is there any chance of the Spit Mk1 being added as a DLC in the future ? A Battle of Britain campaign really needs the right key aircraft

[Anton Yudintsev]

It is possible.

[Skii]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

It is possible.

Good stuff, I'll take that as a glimmer of hope

thankyou

[Hineni]

Thanks, Anton. I can understand, from a gaming standpoint, the choices you have made. However, I agree with Skii. I would like the option of flying the correct period aircraft.

A Spitfire Mk I and Hurricane Mk I would be very welcome, either in an expansion pack or as DLC.

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

It is possible.

Good news thanks for reading my comments. I really respect that.

[Marchochias]

Originally Posted by Skii

The Me109E relied heavily on its cannon armament, 2 x 20mm cannon in each wing, secondary armament was 2 x 7.92mm machine guns above the engine. The ammunition for the 109E's cannons was limited to only 60 rounds per gun - so the pilot needed to be accurate to make his rounds count, obviously a hit by a cannon shell was more devastating than the .303 browning bullet fired by the 8-gun spits and hurricanes, but the respective total armaments of the 109 and the Spit pretty much balanced each other at the time.

The armaments themselves weren't exactly balanced, as you say, the cannons had very little ammunition. It might give the Bf 109 an advantage against the first fighter that it shoots at, but as soon as they run out of those 120 rounds, they'd be at a pretty big disadvantage against further aircraft with only 2 small machine guns.

If their positions had been reversed, imagine how long it would have taken Bf 109s with no cannon ammo left to shoot down even small bombers like the He 111, with only the two small machine guns.

Then again, they had some other advantages, like the fuel injecting and what not. My point is that not all of these factors can be represented accurately in a game.

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by Marchochias

The armaments themselves weren't exactly balanced, as you say, the cannons had very little ammunition. It might give the Bf 109 an advantage against the first fighter that it shoots at, but as soon as they run out of those 120 rounds, they'd be at a pretty big disadvantage against further aircraft with only 2 small machine guns.

If their positions had been reversed, imagine how long it would have taken Bf 109s with no cannon ammo left to shoot down even small bombers like the He 111, with only the two small machine guns.

Then again, they had some other advantages, like the fuel injecting and what not. My point is that not all of these factors can be represented accurately in a game.

The 109's had a stupid amount of ammo in their machine guns. They had a minutes worth or so. In my opinion, they could just spray and pray a bomber like this or-if they were good shots-focus it all on the engines

[Marchochias]

Originally Posted by philip.ed

The 109's had a stupid amount of ammo in their machine guns. They had a minutes worth or so. In my opinion, they could just spray and pray a bomber like this or-if they were good shots-focus it all on the engines

Spray and praying with 2 small caliber machine guns just isn't the same as spraying and praying with 8, like the Hurricane or Spitfire.

In my opinion, they just used the existing models from il-2 1946 but correct me if I am wrong

The original IL-2 for PC game out over eight years ago, the graphical fidelity on the aircraft models is much, much worse than what we've seen from BOP so far.

Look at these screens for example: the first one from IL-2 1946



It's an La-5 or La-7, right. Here's the closest BOP counterpart I could find.



Note the low resolution textures and low polygon model of the IL-2 1946 model, it looks horrible when compared to the high quality BOP model/texture. Notice how much more detail there is with things like the exhaust of the engine leaving a mark on the fuselage, and weathering of the wings. Really no aspect of the game's visuals can be compared fairly to an eight year old game.

Also, wasn't the original IL-2 made by a completely different developer? I don't know if 1C has the rights to assets made for that game.

About your suggestions overall, the reason I don't think they're that useful is because making new aircraft variants with different armaments, different textures, is a TON of work and expense, and to be entirely honest, completely unnecessary expense and work at that. Developers don't have unlimited time and money. They decided to make a model/texture of this Spitfire with this paint scheme and that armament, they aren't exactly going to make another one just because a few people would kind of like it.

Considering how few quality combat flight sims there are (I can't think of ANY other than the original IL-2, so less than 2 in 10 years including this game), it's not as if there are other games doing more than IL2 BOP or something. There aren't any other games anything like it in development at this moment, at least that we've heard about.