Over-revving the FW 190 D9 1945

[Woke Up Dead]

I like you Jumo, you're evenly balanced with a chip on each shoulder. I also admire your ongoing quest to use your hard-gotten knowledge to one day win an online duel.

If someone else would like to use this thread in this forum to exchange ideas, theories, or simply point out what I'm doing wrong if this over-revving is not a bug, then I'm all ears.

[Bolelas]

But you do make use of manual prop pitch, correct? If you dont, i think you should.
You keep the MW50 turned on the entire trip?

[Woke Up Dead]

Originally Posted by Bolelas

But you do make use of manual prop pitch, correct? If you dont, i think you should.
You keep the MW50 turned on the entire trip?

No I don't use manual pitch, and I guess I probably should. It's just one of those situations where if I have a capable pilot in an La-7 behind me I'd like to fiddle with the controls as little as possible. It's nice that the German planes have all those automatic features, not having to worry about pitch or radiator settings in combat helps to make up for them being less maneuverable than a lot of opponents. And yes, I keep the MW50 turned on throughout the dive.

Also, it just seems odd that this would be a problem for this specific plane only, none of the other similar late-war German planes will wreck their engine in this manner, they'll just get an overheat message at the worst. I don't think any of the fast late-war US, USSR, or UK planes can wreck their engine in a single dive either. That's why I'm wondering if this is a bug or a feature.

[RPS69]

Just one thing... why are you keeping engine on max power after final speed is achieved?

I'am very confused with that. There is no point on throwing energy away, you will actually be charging the system, instead of increasing speed.

The big problem with any propeller is it's final speed. You could still accelerate, because your frame is damn good, but the propeller is a huge hindrance at high speeds. Also, keeping the throttle at full power at 900Km/h seems preposterous!

If you keep your engine at max power until the end of a dive, I will tell you that if there is a bug, it is with the planes that won't overheat, and they all should get engine damage. Check the RPM's of both planes and see the difference, but I doubt you will gain nothing by keeping the throttle at max power to the end of the dive.

[IceFire]

Originally Posted by Woke Up Dead

I like you Jumo, you're evenly balanced with a chip on each shoulder. I also admire your ongoing quest to use your hard-gotten knowledge to one day win an online duel.

If someone else would like to use this thread in this forum to exchange ideas, theories, or simply point out what I'm doing wrong if this over-revving is not a bug, then I'm all ears.

Might be a silly note but you're engaging MW50 at low RPM yes? Otherwise you will surely destroy the engine one way or the other.

So... spawn at low alt, low rev, engage MW50, throttle to 110%, climb to 5000 meters, then dive back to sea level and try and make 870+kph without destroying the engine? Missed anything? Rads to auto?

Might want to give this a few tries again and see what my results are now.

[Woke Up Dead]

Originally Posted by IceFire

Might be a silly note but you're engaging MW50 at low RPM yes? Otherwise you will surely destroy the engine one way or the other.

So... spawn at low alt, low rev, engage MW50, throttle to 110%, climb to 5000 meters, then dive back to sea level and try and make 870+kph without destroying the engine? Missed anything? Rads to auto?

Might want to give this a few tries again and see what my results are now.

That's right, I know about not engaging MW50 at high rpm.

Spawn at low alt, low rev, engage MW50, throttle to 110% but you'll have to reduce it later to climb to 5000 meters without overheating. Dive back to sea level, see how long you can hold it over 850 or even over 750km/h without destroying the engine. Rads to auto.

Manual pitch and rads to open will probably solve the problem, but you'd think the automatic features should know how to protect the engine, they do in all earlier German planes.

[IceFire]

Originally Posted by Woke Up Dead

That's right, I know about not engaging MW50 at high rpm.

Spawn at low alt, low rev, engage MW50, throttle to 110% but you'll have to reduce it later to climb to 5000 meters without overheating. Dive back to sea level, see how long you can hold it over 850 or even over 750km/h without destroying the engine. Rads to auto.

Manual pitch and rads to open will probably solve the problem, but you'd think the automatic features should know how to protect the engine, they do in all earlier German planes.

I'll try and do this in the next couple of days... see what my results are doing this exactly. See what we might come up with collectively.

[Woke Up Dead]

Sorry RPS69, what do you mean by "final speed?"

I'm pushing the throttle as long as I can because the enemy behind me is likely doing the same. The engine and propeller may be very inefficient at those speeds, but I need to squeeze out every last km/h and fly faster than the La-7 can dive, and as long as the engine doesn't cook then throttle to the wall is the way to do it. Reducing prop pitch may give me more speed at those extremes, and that's where the automatic systems in the German planes work very well, except apparently in the 190-D9 1945.

[RPS69]

Check engine RPM´s.

Compare it with the other 190D9 model.

What I mean, is that there is a point that the plane speed on a dive is beyond the engine+propeller efficiency. You are not squeezing more speed, you are reducing it. To achieve more speed, you need to feather the prop.

Also, stabilizing the plane at the end of the dive should be much more difficult with a high reved engine, than with a moderating one. High revs generates a huge gyro effect, who will increase resistance to vector change.

To report this as a bug, it will be better to check planes RPM, and the clock who shows the prop pitch. If both planes show the same behaviour here, then I would look for how much overreving you are applying, but I would expect every plane to seize it´s engine after that kind of mistreatment.

[Bolelas]

If you are trying to find a bug (or a non-bug, jusk like RPS69 said), thats ok.
But regarding the engine management (at lest in game), in a very steep dive just like the ones refered here, you only have to profit by using manual prop-pitch. Over-reving doesnt only mean overheating, but also means loss of power. When the manuals refer the best power RPM it means below that RPM you have less power, and above that RPM you have also less power.
Beside that (at least in real aircraft) the blades turning very fast smash the air instead of mooving the air away properly. (Someone correct if i said something wrong- Not expert.)

I remember on a spanish server, (gRiJ), once after everybody left, we stud only 3, and instead of dogfighting we went for the "airshow" manouvers, follow the lider, smokes etc. We were chasing this spanish "gRiJ Torero", we all in bf109, and after the third dive i heard my friend engine go dead! (he was just on my side) Then i asked: No manual Prop-pitch? He was on auto. He never used manual.

If you dont have one extra axis lever for prop-pitch (witch is very intuitive to use), and if you are using keys, remember that you can adjust that prop pitch value before changing it to manual.
Most times people change it straight on the 100% mark, and the engine imidiatly over-revs! If you use a key to +pitch, other to -pitch, click e.g. 8 or 9 times the -pitch key, before you pass to manual. If you have lots of speed and throttle on, press more times, than, after passing to manual, check RPM, and adjust if necessary. When you start climbing get ready to adjust again, or pass to auto prop-pitch again. Here you must anticipate, or you will lose precious RPM. The value of manual pitch will stay exacly where you left it when you passed to auto.

I know most people sure knows this, but hope someone will learn from here. Thank you people.