Fixing Starting Daert / Bagyr

[MattCaspermeyer]

Well, as it turns out I couldn't do no loss with the above setup.

There are two few Orc troops and too many of the Elf / Human troops in the Shelter. I was actually able to do every single fight (including the big Spider stack in the Catacombs) no loss until I got to the Elven / Human stacks in the Shelter.

I had gotten Diversion level 2, even, but 2 Traps are not enough.

So I realized that there is really only one way to do this fight with Bagyr and that is to give him the Trap spell so that he can work on his Trap medal and get it to Level 1. Then he'll have at least 3 traps when fighting the Elves / Humans and with the ability to cast more he can then cause enough damage to win with the troops that I changed above.

So I put this to practice and started a new game. I had changed Bagyr's starting spells from above to be such that he starts with Trap as a spell and all his other spells are scrolls. I also swapped the Goblins out for a single Catapult and increased the starting Furious Goblins that you can get from 8 to 10 to 12 to 16 so that I could see if he could get more money with more numbers. As it turns out, I don't think it makes a difference.

I also added the Clay Bowl to the Troll Shop and I also got the Warm Mittens as the random Level 1 Viking item. With these two items, Bagyr was +10 Mana.

There are two things that you can do in Tristrem at the start, and that is: 1) work on your Trap medal and 2) farm bodies for money with your Furious Goblins. You can also take advantage of a Dryad and use your Furious Goblins to keep killing her summoned Thorns. I was able to get about 6,000 gold in one fight this way (and I actually had quite a few low gold acquisitions, like 80 or 90 gold for a body). You can actually do this in the game without any changes, but the problem is that there is really nothing to buy in the shop with that money.

At any rate, I didn't do so hot on my trapping in Tristrem, but I got it to 4 kills (I was hoping to get to 6), but I had over 10,000 gold from the money from the bodies, quests, etc.

In the Catacombs, I was much better and got Trapper Level 1 medal. This is similar, to Neoline's playthrough in that you need to get Trapper at least to Level 1 and you should be able to get Diversion Level 3. With Bagyr and the changes I made, it is possible to get Trapper Level 1 and Diversion Level 1 at least (and hopefully Level 2) by the time you get to Level 5. It depends on how the Spirit Runes fall, but in both games I got Diversion Level 2 when Bagyr was Level 5.

So this time, I had purchased 5 Orcs (for a total of 7) / 1 Orc Scout (for a total of 2) from the Troll shop and I had 2 Catapults, 2 Veteran Orcs, 4 Spirit Talkers, and 1 Shaman as well. I ended up putting the Orcs and 1 Orc Scout in reserve until I faced the Elves / Humans in the Shelter. I then switched the Spirit Talkers to reserve and I had enough Leadership (you need almost 400) to command 2 Orc Scouts.

My winning army through Whitehill was 2 Catapults, 7 Orcs, 2 Veteran Orcs, 2 Orc Scouts, and 1 Shaman. I actually had enough Magic Runes by Level 6 to put 1 point in Bibliophile and 1 point in Distortion if I wanted to, but decided to save the runes until I get to Portland. As an alternate, I also could have put 1 point in Meditation and 1 point in Order. I think this gives good variability on the Magic Skill Tree.

Playing this way is fairly challenging and allows you to start with 1 new troop and acquire another in Tristrem. I think it is much more fun than the current setup for Bagyr.

As an aside, I don't think it is possible to do no loss on impossible with Bagyr with the stock game files even if you are able to get Level 1 Diversion when he reaches Level 3 because there are not enough fights with just 1 Trap to get your Trapper Medal to Level 1. That would be the only way to do Bagyr no loss as his starting units are too weak.

From this playthrough, I learned quite a bit of Bagyr's starting situation and from this I made the following changes:

• Spells:
  • Trap: 2
• Scrolls:
  • Call of Nature: 3
• Total Points = 5

You are only going to cast Trap because that is the only way to get your Trapper Medal up to Level 1 and it does more damage than any other spell @5 Mana a cast. Also, this spell seems well suited for an Orc since I can see them using this. I think giving him Animal Call works for well for beyond Whitehill as he won't be able to learn any spells until he reaches Level 6, which is essentially just before Whitehill.

Bagyr's starting army is now:

• 1 Catapult
• 2 Orcs
• 1 Orc Scout

I also decided to just given him the Wooden Breastplate and Orc Warlord Helm at the start since they are pretty insignificant items and he should have some armor and a helm to go with the sword since he's a Warrior.

For the Troll Shop, since I gave Bagyr the 2 Orc items, I removed them and I added Trap and the Clay Bowl as items you can purchase. Trap is 10,000 gold, and so you'll only be able to get it if you face a Dryad in one of the 3 Elven stacks in Tristrem. I think this is a neat stretch goal to see if you can farm money from a Dryad long enough to be able to purchase it. If you can, then no loss will be easier, but since you don't necessarily get the Warm Mittens, you may only have +5 Mana (although you'll probably want to put a point in Meditation to get another +6 (I didn't do this in my playthrough above, though, but with +10 Mana I didn't need it)).

So here is what you can get from the Troll Shop now:

• Items:
  • Neutral Level 1 item
  • Viking Level 1 item
  • Clay Bowl
  • Trap
• Scrolls:
  • Stone Skin: 1 to 2
  • Berserker: 1 to 2
  • 2 random level 1 scrolls: 1 to 2 each
• Units:
  • 2 Jotuns (no change)
  • 1 Troll (no change)
  • Either: 6 Spirit Talkers, 3 Catapults, or 5 Orcs
  • Either: 3 Veteran Orcs, 2 Shamans, or 1 Orc Scout

Lastly here are the units you acquire on the map (all have changed):

• 12 to 16 Furious Goblins
• 1 to 2 Veteran Orcs
• 4 to 6 Spirit Talkers (Goblin Riders)
• 1 to 3 Catapults
• 1 to 2 Shamans

This gives enough variability to be able to have a slightly different army makeup through to the Shelter and Whitehill from start to start.

Also, you use all the units, not a single one is useless (although it makes sense to disband the Furious Goblins to make room for the other troops once you're done farming money with them in Tristrem).

The big thing here, is that you have enough variety and power to your starting troops so that you can actually do all the fights through Whitehill no loss impossible. It should be quite challenging, but not as frustrating as the current start for Bagyr.

If anyone is interested in playing this setup, let me know and I'll bundle the files into an ultra-tiny mod so that you can try it!

/C\/C\

[DGDobrev]

I really like the lineup you set up for Bagyr, same with Daert. It makes complete sense to play to both heroes' strengths, and I absolutely don't get how the devs put them at a such huge disadvantage. Keeping in mind what I have been reading in the forums pre-launch (like Daert having Necromancers too), it seems like those were last-second decisions. I wonder why, really.

I sure hope the devs are reading up on your tests and will adapt accordingly. Otherwise we can do it ourselves

[reinartz42]

I cracked open the ses.kfs file too. I wanted to adjust the starting game as well. Made a thread about it but apparantly I can't post yet for some reason.

Do you know where the wife/slave, pet/spirit, and older troop files are? The only ATOM files I've found are the new units, I can't find imps, demonesses, vampires or anything except the new stuff.

[MattCaspermeyer]

They are in data.kfs.

/C\/C\

[MattCaspermeyer]

Okay, by the way, I finished my Daert start through Whitehill no loss with the changes made above. The only fight I couldn't do was the big Spider stack in the Catacombs. I think you need Evil Book Level 2, but I was 1 Magic Rune short @level 4. So on I went and I was able to do all the other fights no loss through the first Whitehill stack. Since you can return here anyway, I don't think it is a big deal if you skip that stack.

It is more challenging than with 5 Vampires (obviously, I guess), but still fairly doable with skill.

It was fun to play the Female Vampires (I had not even really used them in my Neoline playthrough, although I had purchased a few from the Vampire Lady in Monteville).

Even though they have higher leadership, they are actually not as good as regular Vampires in small numbers because you can't use their Call ability because there are too few of them and the enemy has too many units. Also their Long Attack is really not very useful either and they can't increase their numbers if you lose one. The transformation into a cloud ability is useful, especially for getting an Evil Book close to the enemy.

Nonetheless, it is fun to play them this way and it is also neat to use the Cursed Ghost's Ghost Cry ability and their Life Steal is just enough to be useful even if they have low numbers. One thing weird, though, is that if you lose one, I haven't been able to get them to increase their numbers (something seems bugged here as I thought it used to work).

Anyway, I might do some minor tweaking to Daert / Bagyr, but for the most part, I think these are winning combinations. If the devs frequent the forums, I certainly hope they use this to patch the game such that both of these classes have a chance for no loss through Whitehill just like Neoline on impossible difficulty.

If there is no change, then like @DGDobrev said I'll package the files up and post them here.

/C\/C\

[DGDobrev]

Maybe they decided to remove the numbers increase for the Ghosts, as it was too easy to overgrow a stack and lose control. Might just be a new change specifically for KBDS, as we are expected to play those units. This is both good and bad at any rate.

Technically, it could be fixed by adding the option to grow till leadership cap, or starting battle numbers like the vampires.

[MattCaspermeyer]

Daert and Bagyr No Loss Impossible - Giving Them a Chance Mod

This mod is only for use with King's Bounty - Darkside.

Tired of scanning saves for the right spell combination to do Daert no loss?
Tired of having Bagyr using uncontrollable stacks of spiders and snakes just to survive?
Tired of the fact that Neoline has a chance at no loss impossible with any start, but Bagyr and Daert don't?

Now you can actually play impossible no loss with either Bagyr or Daert, while still being challenged and at least trying all the fights from the start through Whitehill! You also get to start with new troops so that you can get a flavor of them right from the beginning of the game and Bagyr can play like a Warrior and Daert like a Mage and you'll be having fun instead of getting frustrated!

This is a very small mod that implements changes to balance out Bagyr and Daert so that they have a chance at no loss just like Neoline on impossible difficulty level.

Installation Instructions (note that my base Darkside folder is located here: C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Darkside\):

1. Extract the "mods" folder in this archive to: sessions\darkside\locations\ under you base Darskide folder (see above for an example of where it is located on my system) so that you have the following files:
   1. sessions\darkside\locations\mods\m_tristrem_start. embryos.loc
   2. sessions\darkside\locations\mods\m_vampire_start.e mbryos.loc
   3. sessions\darkside\locations\mods\hero.txt
2. Play the game! You should note that the starting scenario for Deart and Bagyr are now different, giving you new options and the chance for no loss on impossible difficulty!

Uninstallation Instructions:

1. Remove the mods folder from your sessions\darkside\locations folder (see above for where the base Darkside folder is located).
2. That's it!

Use at your own risk, but I sincerely hope you now enjoy playing as Bagyr or Daert!

If you have any comments or questions, please post them to this forum topic: http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=228683

Thanks, and good luck playing this mini mod!

Matt Caspermeyer

/C\/C\

This mod makes changes in the following files:

• sessions\darkside\locations\m_tristrem_start\m_tri strem_start.embryos.loc
• sessions\darkside\locations\m_vampire_start\m_vamp ire_start.embryos.loc
• sessions\darkside\ses.kfs\hero.txt

Here are the changes:

V0.1 - 2014-09-13

• m_tristrem_start.embryos.loc
  • Troops that will join Bagyr:
    • 12 to 16 Furious Goblins
    • 1 to 2 Veteran Orcs
    • 4 to 6 Spirit Talkers
    • 1 to 3 Catapults
    • 1 to 2 Shamans
  • Troll Shop:
    • Items:
      • 1 Neutral level 1 item
      • 1 Viking level 1 item
      • 1 Clay Bowl
      • 1 Trap
    • Scrolls:
      • 1 to 2 Stone Skin
      • 1 to 2 Berserker
      • 1 to 2 random level 1 scrolls of 1 to 2 each
    • Units:
      • Either: 6 Spirit Talkers, 3 Catapults, or 5 Orcs
      • Either: 3 Veteran Orcs, 2 Shamans, or 1 Orc Scout
• m_vampire_start.embryos.loc
  • Troops that will join Daert:
    • 2 Female Vampires
    • 2 Cursed Ghosts
• hero.txt
  • Bagyr:
    • Starting Army:
      • 1 Catapult
      • 2 Orcs
      • 1 Orc Scout
    • Spells:
      • Trap
    • Scrolls:
      • 1 Animal Call
    • Items:
      • 1 Wooden Breastplate
      • 1 Orc Warlord Helm
  • Daert:
    • Starting Army:
      • 1 Necromancer
      • 1 Cursed Ghost
      • 1 Black Knight
    • Spells:
      • Poison Skull
      • Stone Skin
      • Weakness
    • Scrolls:
      • 1 Frost Grasp
      • 1 Kamikaze
      • 1 Evil Book

Download the mod here and enjoy!

There is a newer version available here!