New P-40 FM

[KG26_Alpha]

When introduced in the North Africa campaign 1941, the Bf109's flew above them and dove into the P40 formations below,
the Warhawk was a medium to low altitude aircraft which was exploited by the Luftwaffe.

Roll and turn all you like its what they did to avoid the BnZ tactics from the Bf109's

[ElAurens]

Tell it to the 325th.

[horseback]

Tell it to the 325th.

Exactly. RAF & Commonwealth units in North Africa converted to the Lend-Lease P-40s directly from the Hurricane in the early cases, and the LW jumped on them hard right away, before they figured out what its advantages were and what they could or should do with it.

USAAF units flying P-40s from Torch and later were often unpleasantly effective from the Luftwaffe's point of view. These pilots were quite experienced with the capabilities of the Warhawk and more aggressive in the bargain. If the attacking 109 driver didn't notice the star on one wing vice the roundels on both, it could turn out to be a bad day for him.

The new in-game FM seems to require more trim adjustment, including a new demand for aileron trim. It does still have a pretty good roll, although it lacks the 'head of a pin' balance of the FW 190A series. The 'M' model is also a good deal more 'peppy' in the sense that it is faster and better accelerating than before.

Still has that glass jaw Allison though.

cheers

horseback

[KG26_Alpha]

Originally Posted by KG26_Alpha

When introduced in the North Africa campaign 1941, the Bf109's flew above them and dove into the P40 formations below,
the Warhawk was a medium to low altitude aircraft which was exploited by the Luftwaffe.

Roll and turn all you like its what they did to avoid the BnZ tactics from the Bf109's

Originally Posted by ElAurens

Tell it to the 325th.

"It entered combat in April 1943 and began escorting medium bombers, flying strafing missions, and conducting sea sweeps from bases in Algeria and Tunisia.
The group participated in the defeat of Axis forces in Tunisia, the reduction of Pantelleria, and the conquest of Sicily.
The 325th received a Distinguished Unit Citation (DUC) for action over Sardinia on 30 July 1943 when the group,
using diversionary tactics, forced a superior number of enemy planes into the air and destroyed more than half of them.
The group did not fly combat missions from the end of September to mid-December 1943 as the 325th converted to Republic P-47 Thunderbolt aircraft and moved to Italy."

This ??

[JtD]

El, as you know I spent a lot of effort in research for the updated P-40 FM - regarding the turn rate, there's no way that physics allow any of the modelled P-40's to sustain a turn as well as say a contemporary Hurricane or a Spitfire did. It's just a ton too heavy for it, or it lacks 500 hp. What it has is plenty of fuel and good control characteristics, so with low fuel, with not ace quality pilots in both aircraft, it will be able to close the gap. It's also possible that in practice US pilots violated the boost limitations, closing the gap even further. Probably wrecked one or two engines as well, but the dead can't tell their stories, only the survivors will. As the early P-40's lacked ABC, the Allisons could produce 60"+ at sea level, instead of the 40some they were cleared for - and it is a documented fact that some units did. This would basically give them the extra hp they need, at a high risk of engine damage.

However, in game all aircraft come with ABC and the aircraft are not modelled to represent field mod abuse, but best documented performance on official specs. Guess it is like IceFire said - we'll have to wait for the N. It will have the M's power (which is pretty good already), at far less weight, and should be real fun to fight with.

[horseback]

The 325th got a lot more "ink" than the P-40 groups that preceded it into North Africa, partly because the leadership was as colorful as the group's markings, and partly because the 325th continued to score in the air-to-air arena while the other groups were concentrated on air to group tasks. However, it is clear that the USAAF operated Warhawks were flown more aggressively than Commonwealth Kittyhawks and that they were a surprise to the JGs in N. Africa which saw P-40 series aircraft in terms of bull's eyes.

JtD, math aside, the P-40 like the P-36/Hawk 75 before it had well balanced controls, a very good roll rate at most speeds and a superior dive acceleration that resulted in an excellent zoom climb; an experienced P-40 driver could humiliate the average Spitfire or Hurricane (not to mention Mustang) pilot fairly easily if he knew what he was doing.

cheers

horseback

[ElAurens]

Alpha, that is the one major engagement that was quite successful for the 325th, to be sure, but their overall record with the P40 vs. the 109 was indeed better than their Commwealth counterparts. They simply had more seat time in the aircraft. The 325th. were also the first unit to use 1000lb. bombs on the P 40.

JtD, as you probably know from the often circulated Allison document, there were many units, both in the Pacific and North Africa running up to 72 inches of manifold in their modified P40s. They didn't all blow up doing this either. Of course those were desperate times early in the war when the Allies were searching for any advantage to survive.

The Allison V 1710 is a more robust engine than the Merlin, this is a fact. To this day you will find Merlins in unlimited class air racing using Allison connecting rods because they are stronger than the Rolls Royce units.

Looking forward to the N model.

[JtD]

Originally Posted by horseback

...an experienced P-40 driver could humiliate the average Spitfire or Hurricane (not to mention Mustang) pilot fairly easily if he knew what he was doing.

Same is true vice versa, because usually the experienced guy knowing what he's doing beats the average guy. At least, the P-40 is good enough to allow for that.

Originally Posted by ElAurens

... there were many units, both in the Pacific and North Africa running up to 72 inches of manifold in their modified P40s. They didn't all blow up doing this either.

No, of course, the increased boost did help them to significantly improve their chance of survival overall. I just meant to say it wasn't risk-free.