BETA PATCH v.1.08.18956 - August 3, 2012

[CaptainDoggles]

Originally Posted by Trumper

If you want reality i doubt 20 minute dogfights were anywhere near the norm.

They're still hella fun, though.

[jf1981]

Originally Posted by Winger

The tell me what must be changed and please sum up under the line for example like this:

Increase levelspeed at all heights RESULTING IN Higher Topspeed at all heights as expected by the true figures, that is at least 290 mph SL and 350 TAS at 17'000 (ex. from Spit Mk I with normal boost of 6 1/4)

I really wonder what we will see afterwards. I am sure there stands something like this:

Increase RS RESULTING IN RS value per the historical datas

Increase TU RESULTING IN a realistic and historical TU value in particular above 17'000 ft and up to 30'000 ft

Increase VW RESULTING IN an accurate (and sustainable !) VW value that does'nt harm the engine after just 5 minutes (sik)

Increase XY RESULTING IN an historical and realistic XY value, obviously

Winger

Welcome

PS for your information, 109E and Spit Mk I are a match unlike the current state. I feel a turtle in the Sky, did'nt you notice the 109 dancing over British aircrafts ?
If you have a good and generally easy experience in a 109 versus Hurri and Spit, I do not doubt your qualities, but expect there are some other reasons underlying

[Winger]

Originally Posted by jf1981

Increase levelspeed at all heights RESULTING IN Higher Topspeed at all heights as expected by the true figures, that is at least 290 mph SL and 350 TAS at 17'000 (ex. from Spit Mk I with normal boost of 6 1/4)



Increase RS RESULTING IN RS value per the historical datas

Increase TU RESULTING IN a realistic and historical TU value in particular above 17'000 ft and up to 30'000 ft

Increase VW RESULTING IN an accurate (and sustainable !) VW value that does'nt harm the engine after just 5 minutes (sik)

Increase XY RESULTING IN an historical and realistic XY value, obviously


Welcome

PS for your information, 109E and Spit Mk I are a match unlike the current state. I feel a turtle in the Sky, did'nt you notice the 109 dancing over British aircrafts ?

When all Brits always start at Hawkinge with loads of 109s above them with tons of energy no wonder. Just start in in the NE at Ramsgate....

I had a fight against a spit yesterday. Close to ramsgate at almost even energylevels. I had a sligh advantage. We were "dancing" like 10-15 minutes in like 2,5-3km height. I could hardly get into good firing position and i am not the best shot there is. This spit did NOT AT ALL look to me as if it had any engineissues.
I went vertical after each attack and he avoided hoizontally each time. The Spitpilot certaily knew his way around. We fought until he got help from another spit. I had to run then since my fuel went empty.
There felt nothing wrong for me in this fight. Just like a fight in this height has too look if two experienced pilots face each other and one of them has a slight energyadvantage.

If he had only a little more enginepower he would have just outclimbed me while turning and avoiding my attacks leaving NO OPTION for me but to run. And i got the impression that THAT is what red pilots want.... And sorry, if that happens it comes VERY close to a "confirmed kill" button

Winger

PS: i the on the other had had a fight against a spit on the deck. I was diving after him. He realized i was there and pulled so hard on his stick into a loop with a diameter of like 100m. LOL i mean - is there any maneuver that bleeds more energy at once? Surely i had easy game with him since i went straight up conserving my energy to prepare the next slash. I am sure he thought his spit was totally underpowered when in reality he was just a *PEEEP* poor pilot.

[jf1981]

Originally Posted by Winger

And sorry, if that happens it comes VERY close to a "confirmed kill" buttonWinger

Dunno what this is actually.

One way with spit is or used to be in reducing the rpm and opening up the boost cutout, as the FM does'nt handle this case as harmul.
Now in 109, if you make gentle turns and use some particular tactics, it's possible to gain in energy and end up dive-zooming quite soon.
Nevertheless, all aircrafts should have their climb rate and level speed, dive speed, tuned correctly.
If, of course, you try following the Spit in his turns, you just would waste your energy and would get cought.

[Winger]

Originally Posted by jf1981

Dunno what this is actually.

One way with spit is or used to be in reducing the rpm and opening up the boost cutout, as the FM does'nt handle this case as harmul.
Now in 109, if you make gentle turns and use some particular tactics, it's possible to gain in energy and end up dive-zooming quite soon.
Nevertheless, all aircrafts should have their climb rate and level speed, dive speed, tuned correctly.
If, of course, you try following the Spit in his turns, you just would waste your energy and would get cought.

confirmed kill button is a sarcastic phrase by me. Sorry, i am German so its not easy to tell you what i mean with it. Something like this maybe?
Allies that want a better spit are for me like dogs that want bones with feet that carry them to the dog to be eaten.

Winger

[camber]

Originally Posted by Winger

When all Brits always start at Hawkinge with loads of 109s above them with tons of energy no wonder. Just start in in the NE at Ramsgate....

I had a fight against a spit yesterday. Close to ramsgate at almost even energylevels. I had a sligh advantage. We were "dancing" like 10-15 minutes in like 2,5-3km height. I could hardly get into good firing position and i am not the best shot there is. This spit did NOT AT ALL look to me as if it had any engineissues.
I went vertical after each attack and he avoided hoizontally each time. The Spitpilot certaily knew his way around. We fought until he got help from another spit. I had to run then since my fuel went empty.
There felt nothing wrong for me in this fight. Just like a fight in this height has too look if two experienced pilots face each other and one of them has a slight energyadvantage.

Hmm, you are describing the fight reds are always complaining about! Let me try to explain it from a red perspective, as I've had plenty of them

I was fighting a 109 who started with slight advantage. Every time I turned into him he pulled up into a long zoom climb into the stall. If I pulled my nose anywhere near him, I stalled within a couple of seconds. I couldn't increase rpms above 2700rpm or use overboost because my engine would just blow a minute later. All I could do is pull a tight break and try to keep track of him, so I could break again at the right time. Every zoom got him more advantage and I never had even a chance of taking a shot.

Lucky he kept missing each time with the cannon and I just copped a few MG rounds. I just hoped I could keep this going until another Spit arrived. One appeared co-alt with him, so he turned away and disengaged and we didn't see him again as it we can't catch him at any alt.

I certainly don't begrudge you these useful tactics. I guess this match -up would be fine if it was historically correct for performance, but that doesn't seem to be the case. Of course demanding historically correct planes to have historically incorrect fights (1v1) is a bit funny anyway.

I just hope you weren't one of the 109 drivers lecturing me when I used the same tactics in the old Spit IIa Once I got a right earbashing in chat from Mk Mr X for dishonorably flying the IIa and ruining his technique, it was hilarious.

camber

[_YoYo_]

Tested the new patch. Just 20 minutes but good way.

B6, the first alpha/beta/gamma/sigma good patch. I can enjoy CoD again.
Just still no Cirrus clouds lik in 1.05.950:



Keep this level and thx. Waiting for the new improvmenets,

[Winger]

Originally Posted by camber

Hmm, you are describing the fight reds are always complaining about! Let me try to explain it from a red perspective, as I've had plenty of them

I was fighting a 109 who started with slight advantage. Every time I turned into him he pulled up into a long zoom climb into the stall. If I pulled my nose anywhere near him, I stalled within a couple of seconds. I couldn't increase rpms above 2700rpm or use overboost because my engine would just blow a minute later. All I could do is pull a tight break and try to keep track of him, so I could break again at the right time. Every zoom got him more advantage and I never had even a chance of taking a shot.

Lucky he kept missing each time with the cannon and I just copped a few MG rounds. I just hoped I could keep this going until another Spit arrived. One appeared co-alt with him, so he turned away and disengaged and we didn't see him again as it we can't catch him at any alt.

I certainly don't begrudge you these useful tactics. I guess this match -up would be fine if it was historically correct for performance, but that doesn't seem to be the case. Of course demanding historically correct planes to have historically incorrect fights (1v1) is a bit funny anyway.

I just hope you weren't one of the 109 drivers lecturing me when I used the same tactics in the old Spit IIa Once I got a right earbashing in chat from Mk Mr X for dishonorably flying the IIa and ruining his technique, it was hilarious.

camber

See? Thats what i am saying. WHY THE HELL should this fight not have been correct? I mean he started with higher energylevel. So if he does his job right its nothing but fine that you cant reach him. The other way around with a spit starting at higher energylevel the 109 would have been smoked in seconds if he didnt run. You reds already have your advantage: maneuverability. Broken down we have a turn and burner and a BnZ-Type plane here. And thats OK. I mean if you prefer BnZ then just get into a 109... Btw. the Spit this is FAAAAR better turning than the 109. And what you abviously want is a spit that performa better than the 109 so you can negate his energyadvantage just by a better engine. And thats plain wrong.

Winger

[CaptainDoggles]

Originally Posted by camber

Hmm, you are describing the fight reds are always complaining about! Let me try to explain it from a red perspective, as I've had plenty of them

I was fighting a 109 who started with slight advantage. Every time I turned into him he pulled up into a long zoom climb into the stall. If I pulled my nose anywhere near him, I stalled within a couple of seconds. I couldn't increase rpms above 2700rpm or use overboost because my engine would just blow a minute later. All I could do is pull a tight break and try to keep track of him, so I could break again at the right time. Every zoom got him more advantage and I never had even a chance of taking a shot.

Lucky he kept missing each time with the cannon and I just copped a few MG rounds. I just hoped I could keep this going until another Spit arrived. One appeared co-alt with him, so he turned away and disengaged and we didn't see him again as it we can't catch him at any alt.

I certainly don't begrudge you these useful tactics. I guess this match -up would be fine if it was historically correct for performance, but that doesn't seem to be the case. Of course demanding historically correct planes to have historically incorrect fights (1v1) is a bit funny anyway.

I just hope you weren't one of the 109 drivers lecturing me when I used the same tactics in the old Spit IIa Once I got a right earbashing in chat from Mk Mr X for dishonorably flying the IIa and ruining his technique, it was hilarious.

camber

Hmmm, your example is a fight where you started at a disadvantage and didn't get shot down but couldn't kill the other guy.

That's a really bad example if you're trying to illustrate how bad it is for RAF pilots.