MW50 -Secondary effects were cooling of the engine .

[WTE_Galway]

MW50 is not a magic cure all, it just made up for low octane fuel allowing more power with poor fuels.

How people got the idea it was some magical effect that allowed the pilot ten minutes of totally trashing the engine without damage is beyond me.

If your behaviour is bad for the engine without MW50 engaged such behaviour will be as bad or worse for it with the extra power MW50 provided.

The way some people talk you should be able to park a bf109 with chocks on the ground, run the engine up to full throttle and engage mw50 and then expect the engine to last ten minutes because the "book" said that was the maximum time for mw50.

Sillyness.

[Whacker]

Here's another idea. How about we try to take all the emotion and armchair mechanicness out of this and try and find some actual sources of data?

I started looking and found this link from the wikipedia DB601 entry: http://www.scribd.com/doc/71362812/1...r-DB-601-A-u-B

Can any of our german speaking friends lese through this bitte and then reporten zu backen hier was ist gesayin ist?

[Shardur]

Originally Posted by Whacker

Here's another idea. How about we try to take all the emotion and armchair mechanicness out of this and try and find some actual sources of data?

I started looking and found this link from the wikipedia DB601 entry: http://www.scribd.com/doc/71362812/1...r-DB-601-A-u-B

Can any of our german speaking friends lese through this bitte and then reporten zu backen hier was ist gesayin ist?

Very nice find, however this is a manual from 1940 so there is nothing about the MW50 or any other boost system in there.

This is not the same engine that was fitted with the MW50 later. This is the DB-601, the later engine that used the MW50 was the DB-605. This is the engine used for instance on the Bf-109E.

It says about this engine that you should not run the motor in low rpm before the start on the ground for very long (or not at all if possible).

For this engine rpm should never (ever) go higher than 2400.
In a dive rpm should be 2400 but rpm of 2500 are O.K. for 30 seconds or less.

Ladedruckerhöhung (WEP) Power of 1.4 ata at 2400 rpm should not be used for longer than 1min.
Full Power of 1.3 ata at 2400 rpm should not be used for longer than 5min.
Increased Power of 1.23 ata at 2300 rpm should not be used for longer than 30min.
Power of 1.15 ata at 2200 rpm or lower can be used indefinitely.

[Whacker]

OK, well then what about some of the data here: http://kurfurst.org/#engines

... ? I didn't find any DB605 engine manual scans after some brief searching.

[Shardur]

Unfortunately on that site is nothing about the MW50 apart from the mention that it is needed for the maximum power setting on some of the engines.

[Mustang]

Please we must be logic.
And use the brain


BF 109 - Have reserves Water/ methanol for 23 minutes

These boost only operate at full power, like a swich.

The fact is clear.

For the BF 109 the Luftwaffe said, for more than 10 minutes is dangerous for the BF 109 engine.

The fact is clear.

Under 10 minutes, you must use it, for full climb and full disengage, OR COMBAT.

That's as real as
Like Sturmovik was a flying tank.

[Mustang]

Please we must be logic.
And use the brain


BF 109 - Have reserves Water/ methanol for 23 minutes

These boost only operate at full power, like a swich.

The fact is clear.

For the BF 109 the Luftwaffe said, for more than 10 minutes is dangerous for the BF 109 engine.

The fact is clear.

Under 10 minutes, you must use it, for full climb and full disengage, OR COMBAT.

That's as real as
Like

The 156th Fighter Air Corps of the 4th Air Army was the next unit to receive the La-7 in October 1944. At one point during the month, they had fourteen aircraft simultaneously unserviceable with engine failures.
By 1 January 1945 there were 398 La-7s in front-line service of which 107 were unserviceable with engine failures

THANKS I HAVE LOW RATED FW 190!!!, AND SHORT RANGE MW50 !!


VERY GOOD !!!

EVERY DAY LESS PEOPLE ARE FLYING.

Ask yourself why

[Shardur]

Originally Posted by Whacker

... Show us some manufacturer's testing results to show that's how the DB605's really performed in the field when MW50 was used. ...

Originally Posted by Whacker

OK, well then what about some of the data here: http://kurfurst.org/#engines

... ? I didn't find any DB605 engine manual scans after some brief searching.

Your lower quote actually contains a link with manufacturer engine data on the performance of the DB-605 in various versions. What it does not contain is the info how long the performance can be sustained. So any specifics you want to know apart form that info?

[Whacker]

Originally Posted by Shardur

Your lower quote actually contains a link with manufacturer engine data on the performance of the DB-605 in various versions. What it does not contain is the info how long the performance can be sustained. So any specifics you want to know apart form that info?

Not me, Mustang is the plaintiff here. My only interest is improving the "realism" of our game by giving TD some potential hard data if there's something to be corrected, hence why I was trying to coax some actual references out of the situation. Beyond that, I'm pretty much over all this.

[HundertneunGustav]

whacker,

and if mustang is not proving his point about MW50 helping engine cooling, and thus getting a performance increase either in horsepower or maximum length of the WEP thing...

and IF he was a complainer...
or: about people in general that are complaining...

a) Data is Data, and Test Results. Just that. A must-have, a necessity to base Game performance on. If not, This would not be a simulator.

b) recommendations by the Luftwaffle are just that... like rules meant to be broken occasionally.

c) the state of the planes in the field was different than on the test tracks "back home" (note i say "different" - to encompass good and bad elements alike) the point is that in the field, where this simulation takes place, "the Data" can not be followed down to the last fraction of a percent. sometimes, planes are "uber", sometimes a plane "gets the shaft".
implementing the Data in the game works pretty well if you ask me.
zeroes turn on a dime, Mustangs are a handsful to fly, and a thud dives faster than a 2000lbs bomb. I-16 suffer from fuel cut-out, and the stuka is ridiculously slow. its all pretty close to the real thing.

d) red (corsair, Mustang) and blue (109/190) whining alike = game is in balance.

e) you don't like the game... go play with your dog. Or welcome to the SAS and Freemodding and stuff... "do -it-yourself".

in a nutshell, the CAPITAL and BOLD stuff is irrational and useless. Just noise.

about insulting TD...
i guess they need stronger stuff than than
"EVERY DAY LESS PEOPLE ARE FLYING"

Observe:
Every day i see half a Dozen Noobs pop up at the SAS, or old hands come back.
And no matter what the politics says: the Mod stuff is based on the TD stuff.
SO i figure: TD is doing a decent Job.
If it were xxxx, no more mods, no more new noobs.
Online or offline.

"less people are flying" is not an insult.
It is an exclamation that reflects the poster' s emotional state.
This is what it really does mean, in my opinion:
"Every day, i am less motivated to fly"
"every day, i am more frustrated because the holy data does not match my perfect flying"

That is not an insult.
That is path... err... Sad.



There is nothing gained from this topic. Its been discussed, and will continue to be discussed occasionaly. But, as you say: Good try to interpret the numbers by Mustang, but nothing really relevant to be found here.
Thread has turned towards drama and yelling, and.... that' s it.

This topic=

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