Contact sight problem.. really something to patch!!

[AMVI_Superblu]

I agree with you guys that we need a fix for the contacts disappearing at medium / short range but i'm really disappointed on reading about the "active label" stuff explained by Manu.
You can't simulate what the pilot see that way just because every pilot is different!
They were not able to see all the same thing at the same distance.
The best would be a progressive LOD that's trimmed with distance increasing/decreasing based on current distance from each object (ground, static, A/C etc.).
This would allow you to see what your eye can see (if your eye can see 1 pixel you will see it, if you cant see things smaller that 2 pixels you wont see it and so on).

S!

[6S.Manu]

Originally Posted by AMVI_Superblu

I agree with you guys that we need a fix for the contacts disappearing at medium / short range but i'm really disappointed on reading about the "active label" stuff explained by Manu.
You can't simulate what the pilot see that way just because every pilot is different!
They were not able to see all the same thing at the same distance.
The best would be a progressive LOD that's trimmed with distance increasing/decreasing based on current distance from each object (ground, static, A/C etc.).
This would allow you to see what your eye can see (if your eye can see 1 pixel you will see it, if you cant see things smaller that 2 pixels you wont see it and so on).

S!

What about using the sight skill of an average WW2 pilot?

Anyway, for example, the ac is a pixel at 20km, at 15km, at 10km, at 2km: after that distance you have the first LOD who's still so little that it's melted with the ground. You don't see the ac if his LOD is flying over the ground and the texture of this is not flat: it's still a moving pixel between thousand moving pixels. It happens a lot with detailed maps of IL2 (the new ones)... in the oldest map we had not this problem until if not over the forest. The hardware and our eyes are so different since the last have so many functions to keep definition and focus on a object.

The LOD method you are talking about is the one they use since IL2: use 3 level LODs or 10 level LODs you still have the plane melting with that ground if you're at more than 500m... damn, during the "Big Week" SEOW we fled together I had P47s diving from 6km and after 5 seconds (since they were faster than me) they were disappearing! The second time I landed in the middle of the mission since I wanted to launch the monitor our of the window. And what about the direction of the bombers? we had a only pair of seconds to align ourself because the transition between single pixel to first lod was so violent and you have not enough time to make a good headon.

And anyway if you have not a dedicated SDK for LOD management is really a lot of work for the 3d guys: in that way you can forget the number of ac we have in IL2. Of course I hope that they have an SDK for this purpose...

However it's not that my idea is easy to develop... I'm quite sure it's not, but at least it can reproduce a more realistic hunting experience. That's not "pixel" hunting...

[phoenix1963]

On the plus side of the argument for the dots: I was delighted by the change in dotrange settings on ATAG. The other night I saw a formation of bombers at altitude, the dots seemed to almost merge in a similar way to RL when you can't quite resolve the dots.

It really felt like BOB at last.

Still some phantoms to get rid of though.

56RAF_phoenix

[phoenix1963]

A quick fix would be a MIN_DOTRANGE and MAXDOTRANGE with a smooth alpha transition between them.

56RAF_phoenix

[sorak]

Wish the servers would setup the icons on all the realism servers because of this.. Like replica's Dogfight server.. If you set the icons to appear at a really close distance.. at least you will be able to see what would be obviosly visable during real flight.

Also if you dont have a Head tracking system setup (i dont) its even more impossible to keep the planes visable. As soon as you use the hi-hat pan views to turn your head.. it moves so fast and to much.. you lose your target everytime you move your head in a direction

[David198502]

i dont like the idea of labels or some zoom function to make contacts easier.in my view, it should be hard to spot and track enemies in certain situations.i think it was that way in real life, and its half of the challenge in a combat flight sim.
the only problem we have now, is the code which needs to be changed.
one can see planes easily in a distance of ~50miles as black dots, but when you get closer to a distance where the first manouvers of combat start, the enemy begins to flicker and totally disappears for some seconds.
i think contacts in far distance, should be even harder to spot, than what we have now in game, and the closer contacts should not disappear.thats the only problem we have and that has to be solved.
for the labels or zoom function...im fine with it, as long as it is optional in the realism settings.i dont want to fly on servers where everybody can use this function, while i would refuse to use this kind of cheat, and therefore putting myself in disadvantage.

[335th_GRAthos]

Originally Posted by AMVI_Superblu

we need a fix for the contacts disappearing at medium / short range

+1

It happened to me on the ATAG server yesterday.
I was following a dot, I had an alt advantage.
Then, closing in, the dot disappeared. I made two rounds trying to find out whether it was my eyes that were playing jokes on me or whether it was a ghost dot.
Not seeing anything, I changed course going back home....only to find out 30sec later a bandit on my tail


It really needs some improvement!


~S~

[ACE-OF-ACES]

Originally Posted by 335th_GRAthos

It happened to me on the ATAG server yesterday.

I was following a dot, I had an alt advantage.
Then, closing in, the dot disappeared. I made two rounds trying to find out whether it was my eyes that were playing jokes on me or whether it was a ghost dot.

I have had the same thing happen many times, and not just with this patch, from day one.

I am not sure that they disappear from the game or just from my view.. Because one time I did see them appear to disappear, only to look much harder and see that they were still there, just very Very VERY faint. If that is the case each time than the problem is in how the 'dot' transitions occur. As the distance changes, the game loads different LOD of the plane.. Clearly during one of these transitions color of the dot goes from a 'dark' dot to a different color.. And depending on that color the plane can seem to disappear!

As noted, sometimes I can see them after the transition and sometimes I don't so maybe sometimes they do actually disappear from the game?

In either case, they really need to work on those transition colors, it should go from dark to not so dark to light.. not dark to light.

[Insuber]

Originally Posted by 335th_GRAthos

+1

It happened to me on the ATAG server yesterday.
I was following a dot, I had an alt advantage.
Then, closing in, the dot disappeared. I made two rounds trying to find out whether it was my eyes that were playing jokes on me or whether it was a ghost dot.
Not seeing anything, I changed course going back home....only to find out 30sec later a bandit on my tail


It really needs some improvement!


~S~

I had the same experience several times. In Il2 it doesn't happen. Did you notice if it's related more with blue planes or red planes? imo it happens with spitfires and hurricanes, maybe it's the type of skin ...

[6S.Tamat]

one fast solution waiting for a better one should be to leave the dot closer crossing the lod


distance x = lod only
distance x+ = dot and lod
distance X++ = dot only


i know that there is a better solution, like refining the lods and the distancies, but that one seems to be simplier, cause you need to modify only few parameters for all the planes insthead to modify all the lods