Mods discussion, links, etc

[Mick]

... I see SaQSoN, you are a smart guy, and me and others are dumb ones that understand nothing ...

You are right at least for one thing, it is sunday and I am not going to waste my time anylonger arguing with you ...

[Asheshouse]

Originally Posted by bf-110

IDK if IL2 engine can be hacked (that's a strong,nearly perjorative word here,sorry) to the point that Mach 1 and 2 jets,heat and radar seeking missiles and countermeasures can be implemented on the game without making all of them cheesy.

Great model!I hope it can be used by TD,as I saw some awesome Graf Zeppelin and Aquila models in SAS that could make it's way to 4.11?

And I know what is "no way" to be ingame.

Two totally different types of mod are described here. The jets, released as the IL2 1956 Pack are superbly made authentic models with extensive new coding to make the various systems work. I cant comment on the accuracy of the FM and weapons performance but I know that the creators went into great detail to try and achieve a high level of realism. However this is clearly well after the WWII era so probably not likely to be adopted by TD, even if the originators requested it to be.

The "Graf Zeppelin" and "Aquila" carriers are not authentic new models. They are simply repaints of the existing Illustrious carrier. Certainly very well done repaints but only paint mods nevertheless. Paint Mods have existed for IL2 aircraft for a long time prior to the modding breakthroughs but no one ever expected them to be incorporated into the core game. Why should that change now? There is always a lot of interest in these carriers for "what if" type scenarios but you need to remember that they were never even close to being operational. They mainly contributed to the Allied war effort by tying up material and resources which would otherwise have been used for other things. It would be more useful to have more carriers (and other ships) which actually saw operational use. -- HMS Eagle, HMS Ark Royal, HMS Furious, HMS Hermes, to name just a few.

The counter argument is that 1C saw fit to label a repainted KGV as an IJN and USN BB so why not include repaints for other vessels. In my view it would be wrong to compound the original mistake. Its maybe about time that those USN and IJN generic ships were replaced with something more appropriate.

I would be interested in knowing the historical limits TD would put on new models.
I guess the Korean era is out, but would they consider the Spanish Civil War period to be in?

[SaQSoN]

Originally Posted by Asheshouse

I would be interested in knowing the historical limits TD would put on new models.

1930-1946. Also, all Grumman-related projects (including ships) are out, even if they fit the timescale.

I don't think, anyone would be against SCW subjects.

[Asheshouse]

Originally Posted by SaQSoN

1930-1946. Also, all Grumman-related projects (including ships) are out, even if they fit the timescale.

I'm not an expert on the Grumman corporate history.

Does that mean a restriction on including warships built at the Newport News ShipBuilding Yards only, or were other ship yards included in the agreement.

Note: I realise that Yorktown, Enterprise and Hornet were all built at Newport News

[SaQSoN]

Originally Posted by Asheshouse

Does that mean a restriction on including warships built at the Newport News ShipBuilding Yards only, or were other ship yards included in the agreement.

This means, all ships built, or designed by companies, which at some point become part of the N-G corp. So, if a certain ship class was designed and first laid at, say, Newport News and then it's sister-ship was built at some other factory, not owned by N-G, the sister ship is still under the restriction. If it was otherwise - then probably, not. But still, DT was asked to keep away from all US ships.

[II/JG54_Emil]

Yet there are a load of Japanese ship you could work on.

Officially there are no IJN Cruisers in game etc.

[Asheshouse]

Originally Posted by SaQSoN

But still, DT was asked to keep away from all US ships.

Well that leaves no room for manoeuvre at all. --- at least officially.

At the risk of being quickly shot down - cause I'm no copyright lawyer.

I understand the legal position in the US to be along these lines:

For works published between 1923 and 1963, provided they were published with a copyright notice, the works had copyright protection for a term of 28 years. At the end of the 28 year period an extension of an additional 67 years could be requested, a total of 95 years.

If there was no copyright notice on the original work then they immediately became public domain.
If no extension was requested then they became public domain after the initial 28 years.

Plans of USS Yorktown held by HNSA (Historic Naval Ships Assoc) prepared by Newport News Ship Building Co are not copyright marked, therefore appear to be Public Domain.

Either way after 2041 all work produced up to 1946 becomes Public Domain, so not long to wait.

For any of the early BB's originally built in WWI the 95 years has already lapsed.

[Hans Burger]

We can discuss days and days on the subject without finding any compromises. One thing that DT can do to improve the game and without conflicts with external "moders", since tools are available and capacity also, is to update graphic engine and proc engine (multicore proc, sli,...).
This will be a big step forward and I am sure all FB community will recognize your leadership in this domain.
For the remaining, I am convinced that, all around the world, there are enough moders able to handle Java/C++ programing language, 3D, flight dynamics and knowing
enought about IL2 structure to improve, in these domains, this game.
At the end, all users will be satisfied and happy to have a game at 2011 standards. Moreover, each parts will work in a domain without interference with the other part.

[SaQSoN]

Originally Posted by Asheshouse

At the risk of being quickly shot down - cause I'm no copyright lawyer.

Well that's an interesting point, but the problem is not in how much NG claims are legitimate. As far as I understood from what Ilya and other people from 1C told me, 1C, back in PF days, was forced to make a contract with NG, under which 1C obliges to pay a certain amount of money for inclusion of any NG-related subject.
So, even if suddenly the copyrights will be stripped from NG, 1C still will be restricted under this contract.

This is what I know about it. I may be wrong though, since I never saw this document and have no idea what is in it actually. Nevertheless, there was clear and strict order from Ilya and earlier by Maddox, that DT should not touch any US ships, or NG related planes and cockpits.