Friday 2011-02-04 Dev. update and Discussion

[swiss]

Originally Posted by zapatista

this might make the concept easier to understand

I do understand what you said.
Unfortunately I can't reproduce your resolution, I got a 22"/1680 here.
However I tested 1280 vs 1680. On both resolution the plane in the distance had the size of two pixels.

Maybe I screwed something up while taking the screenshots(dont think so tho')...
Anyway; here are the shots and the ntrk, 7.55mb zip
http://rapidshare.com/files/447028204/ss-and-ntrk.zip

[zapatista]

can you just post the shots here in the thread ?

easier to see and discuss

[swiss]

Originally Posted by zapatista

can you just post the shots here in the thread ?

easier to see and discuss

I just dropped the resolution down to 800*600.
This pixel doubling does not happen on my screen.

Would you mind posting your config, the resolution part?

[swiss]

Originally Posted by zapatista

can you just post the shots here in the thread ?

easier to see and discuss

Your wish is my order.
(Thanks for making me do that :/)




Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[zapatista]

you need to compare it at 1/2 your native resolution
and i am presuming you are changing the resolution in the game not just altering your monitor

[swiss]

edit:

Why don't you use your 25xx resolution on the screen of a movie theater, your pixel will have the size of a pack cigs(CHEATING!).
There is no way to determine who you display the game it within the software.

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by swiss

I cant go higher than 1680 or lower than 800.

if you cant 1/2 your resolution to compare how the il2 aircraft dot doubles in size,, you should be able to at least notice that with the lower resolution the larger pixels show a larger il2 aircraft "dot" on your screen now :]

that is the exact principle at work, and it really shouldnt be the case in 2011 with the next gen sim

btw, i just noticed that with the monitor size you are using this probably means it is a 6 bit colour monitor (TN technology based), rather then most other lcd's which are normally 8- bit color (and MVA/PVA or IPS technology). the people who complain the least about il2 distant aircraft visibility are oddly enough often people with inferior monitors (dont mean to diss your hardware there). because these 6 bit monitors have significantly more problems displaying shades of grey, they constantly flip between several states of grey in a more noticable transition (compared to the smooth gradient on an 8 bit monitor), with TN based monitors this is known to add a slight "glitter" effect to the grey/black pixels it is trying to display (and this makes these 2/4 pixels representing a distant il2 aircraft stand out more, particularly if it is a moving object against a differently colored background, like green tree foliage or snow etc)

didnt mean to go all technical in minor detail, but i can post some illustrations about this known effect on 6 bit monitors later if interested

for now, just notice how the pixel size has increased with the lower resolution, making the 2/4 pixel object physically larger and easier to see on screen (btw my earlier screenshots posted were taken in 4.08 iirc). i havnt noticed anybody commenting the dot's had changed to 2 pixels since then, but it is possible (dot visibility has not increased since then, if anything worsened, so i havnt looked at it any closer since). the argument is still exactly the same however, 1/2 your resolution and the "il2 dot" is 2x the size, giving you a clear advantage online in a competitive environment (if all else is equal)

[swiss]

Originally Posted by zapatista

if you cant 1/2 your resolution to compare how the il2 aircraft dot doubles in size,, you should be able to at least notice that with the lower resolution the larger pixels show a larger il2 aircraft "dot" on your screen now :]

that is the exact principle at work, and it really shouldnt be the case in 2011 with the next gen sim

the argument is still exactly the same however, 1/2 your resolution and the "il2 dot" is 2x the size, giving you a clear advantage online in a competitive environment (if all else is equal)

Again: What if someone uses a beamer? He will have a 100" screen, huge pixels.
Cheating, right?

giving you a clear advantage, if all else is equal

It will never be fair - ever.
Unless Oleg sells some standard systems too and locks out everything else.

I recently noticed you can exploit the fact some ppl play with crappy GPUs.
When they are close on your tail, fly low over the water surface and fire into the sea like there's no tomorrow.
In case he really has an old card, odds are he will get a sideshow when flying through the fountains.


You see everything is different.
GPUs, screensizes and and resolutions, internet connection etcpp.

there is however an even bigger problem then that. these little 4 pixel dots still dont accurately represent what most real ww2 fighter pilots could/would see from their cockpits ! if il2/BoB is claiming to be a simulator then it is critical in my opinion this most important issue has a high priority (and oleg in the last few years has answered positively he is aware of this problem and is trying to correct it for BoB/il2).

Are you seriously saying the size of a pixel, in relation to displayed distance in game, vs reality is wrong?
You had to consult an astrophysicist to notice?

This is absolutely of the highest priority!
How could anyone possibly enjoy the GAME with such a flaw???

Maybe you should consider moving, a real simulator is not going to fit on your desk.



6bit/8bit:
I have no idea what your talking about.
In the settings menu it says something about true color, 32bit.

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by swiss

I do understand what you said.
Unfortunately I can't reproduce your resolution, I got a 22"/1680 here.
However I tested 1280 vs 1680. On both resolution the plane in the distance had the size of two pixels.

Maybe I screwed something up while taking the screenshots(dont think so tho')...
Anyway; here are the shots and the ntrk, 7.55mb zip
http://rapidshare.com/files/447028204/ss-and-ntrk.zip

the key point for using comparison screenshots is that:
1) the distant aircraft you are looking at must indeed be a dot (so past the lod model drawing distance, for single engine fighters this can be up to 2000 m or so)
2) have your monitor FoV correctly set for the monitor size so ingame objects are displayed in 1:1 ratio compared to real life, dont use a zoomed in/out FoV setting
3) use in cockpit viewing of the distant object, external views can distort and magnify
4) use 1/2 your native resolution to compare the 2 screenshots