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| IL-2 Sturmovik The famous combat flight simulator. |
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#1
11-15-2009, 07:39 AM
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This thread got me to sign in again and make a comment - probly 2 years since that happened.
Historical is the key for me. The missions probably were very similar. You were not a fighter pilot one day and a bomber pilot the next. Even the fighters were trained in certain areas and armed as such. But it's a game so... What I want to see. A mission with a soul. Just a little tidbit of info came get you into the flight. Your wingman is a noob...watchout for him. Topcover for a HE115 searescue of a fellow pilot. Running into an ace you have been briefed on. Scramble for takeoff.. a damaged bomber is heading slowly back over the Channel to France...get it .. cover arrive historical radio chatter. I want to make a kill/damaged claim after a mission. 
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#2
11-15-2009, 09:35 AM
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Good idea, Ilya. Thanks for asking for input.
Nothing really new from me, but to repeat some of the suggestions I've seen in this thread and like: - Secondary explosions. A stick of bombs from an He-111 walking across an airfield, and plowing up nothing but dirt until one bomb hits an ammo bunker. There's nothing better than instant feedback on your targeting. This could apply to ammunition and bombs inside airborne aircraft, too. Nothing gratuitous, but where appropriate for the amount of damage taken, and the explosive nature of the point of impact. - Fratricide. This might be annoying (especially if it's your wingman shooting you down by mistake), but from reading historical accounts, this happened fairly often. Give us a reason for all the recognition stripes and colors, besides really cool paint schemes from the skinners. In other words, make the Ai make human-like mistakes, instead of computer-like mistakes. To steal a line from the beginning of 'Rustler's Rhapsody': "For starters, maybe he wouldn't be so damn perfect all the time." - For historical accuracy, some squadrons during some periods will have the same mission type day after day. Others will be more dynamic, and controllable by the player. Examples of the latter include Rhubarb, armed recce and Frei Jagd type missions. Motorcycle gang tactics, cruising an area armed and looking for trouble. - After a swirling dogfight, finding a friendly Ai fighter and joining up on him for mutual support while leaving the area. - I'm not sure how to implement it, but if players on non-recce missions see something of interest, give them the opportunity to report it, and possibly have that report generate a mission to attack it (or at least photograph it) later. This might encourage folks to look around, instead of just droning from waypoint to waypoint. For example, while escorting bombers to airfield target X, the player notices a supply dump 5 km south of the target airfield. Or a group of ships in port making steam in preparation to depart. - Lost aircraft going the wrong way, and occasionally landing at the wrong field. This happened with allied aircraft landing at a different (friendly) field fairly often, and much more rarely with aircraft landing at an enemy airfield. - The ability to commandeer a subordinate's aircraft after yours has been damaged, or suffers a mechanical problem before takeoff. Rank Has Its Privileges, though this could have repercussions on the junior pilot's experience and skill. - I like the idea of landing to rescue a downed squadron-mate too. This opportunity would be historically very rare, and very difficult. That would be the bottom line for most of these "holy sh**" moments in general. They should be rare enough to be realistic, but not so rare that the player never encounters any of them. One of your biggest tricks is going to be finding the balance between over-saturation, and historical rarity. Good luck, and I look forward to your efforts. Last edited by blottogg; 11-15-2009 at 09:37 AM.
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#3
11-15-2009, 11:54 AM
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- Water falling over the windshield when you pass through a water column created by a bombas explosion over water. It could even make your engine couf or shut it down, if you absorb too much water.
I dont know the techinical detail of how much water the engines could absorb without shutting down. To all people asking for AI mistakes, please, be carefull with what you ask. Because later on with the sim in our hands, we start to get threads everywhere complaining about "stupid AI shot me down", or crash over a mountain or the ground when it was chased by another aircraft, or complaining that they don't shoot down anything, or that they shoot down everything before i get the chance to shoot down an aircraft, and so on.
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#4
11-15-2009, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
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#5
11-15-2009, 04:16 PM
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1\Few against Many
A common place of the BoB was that often few Spits and Hurricanes were sent to intercept huge gaggles of German bombers and fighters. Imagine popping out of the clouds just to see several miles long of tight bombers formations, with fighter covers already diving on you. I had that thrill with Shockwave's Battle of Britain II, watching dozens of enemy planes sailing among beatiful towering clouds. The Tally-Ho! of the squadron commander gave me that "Holy ...t!" feeling, that I can remember even so many years later. Something similar is magisterially described by Pierre Clostermann in the last chapter of his "The Big Show", when they attack a Norwegian base among swarms of enemy planes. 2\Sector Control I believe also that, as Feathered suggested, realistic radio comms from the Fighter Command and Sector Control, vectoring you to the bandits, will add a lot to the immersion. BoB on british side was all about Fighter Command, early wake ups, readiness in the dispersal barrack, calls from the phone, up in the air and then the voice of the controller on the radio (maybe with real Fighter Command characters like "Woody" Woodhall). 3\BBC A funny fact, related by Brian Kingcome, was that the first radios were shortwave, and one could tune them in flight, so Kingcome used to tune on the BBC channels to listen to a popular songs program during the long and tedious convoy escorts ... all that ended at Brian's scorn, when VHF sets with fixed frequencies were fitted in the planes ... Regards, Insuber Last edited by Insuber; 11-15-2009 at 04:42 PM.
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#6
11-15-2009, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Hence my comments about Vera Lynn. 
__________________
 Personally speaking, the P-40 could contend on an equal footing with all the types of Messerschmitts, almost to the end of 1943. ~Nikolay Gerasimovitch Golodnikov
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#7
11-15-2009, 05:15 PM
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1. Oxygen system failures on high altitude (often in early months of BoB on Hurricanes Mk1)
2. More things to break in cockpit (like electricity fail, sparks from gauges etc.) and more available mechanical failures 3. Viewable pilot's hands and legs inside cockpit (and an ability to turn it off, just like in DCS) 4. Feeling like you're only small gear in war machine (lot of action everywhere) 5. Movie actions (just look at Call of Duty series - these guys are masters in emotion creation) 6. Bad airfield conditions like mud etc (hell for late german pilots) 7. Human animation (this Euphoria is great) 8. "Beepers" used by RAF to identify squadrons on radar 9. Full weather implementation 10. Crew members moving, talking, screaming inside planes 11. Every button available to click, everything available to turn off or turn on! Every gauge working! Just full working cockpit! 12. Bailing out and falling on a parachute - everything in 1st person perspective 13. Heavy pilot's breath in cockpit while under heavy G, wounded etc 14. Lot of radio communications, i dont want to hear 20 times same text in one mission PS. Sorry for my poor English
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#8
11-16-2009, 06:31 AM
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-aircraft jumpseat position
-panorama view in ATC tower -fly airship or yacht with a girl for holiday sightseeing -photo wall in pilot club -checklist before flight -operational AAA gun -fuel dump when airborne -newspaper or aircraft flight manual reading during bomber flying -signal flare before takeoff -swim to float plane for rescue （perhaps after signal flare） -parachute diving training -lubricant oil maintenance -fueling ......
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#9
11-16-2009, 01:46 PM
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Been thinking a bit about how one might make multi-crew aircraft more interesting. Especially with regards to the roles crew members should play. AI Flight Engineers should tell you when an engine is overheating. A navigator should man a turret if a gunner is killed or wounded. All crew should be given some awareness of the outside world and be able to report on it. Below is how I hope a mission in SoW might play out:
Inter-Service Communication & Crew Management and in SoW... You are flying the latest mission in your Blenheim bomber's single-player dgen campaign. It is September 1940. You are with 53 Sqn based at Detling. You mission brief is to patrol a section of occupied coast on a line from Ostend to Zeebrugge, and on up to Middleburg. On the Met screen (a handy innovation for SoW) you can see that there is expected to be 8/10th cloud all the way. Not bad, you tell yourself. Your orders are to return however if cloud cover is insufficient. 53 Squadron has taken a beating in the last few weeks. The Blenheims stand little chance against determined fighter attack, and on this mission you will be flying alone. A look at the Nav-screen (another first for SoW) it shows the Navigator's suggested course for the patrol. Looks okay, but you move the return waypoint near Middleburg a little further West. No need to tempt fate... In the air, you see that the weather is much as the met boys predicted. Eight-tenths, down to about 3000ft. You cross the coast near Ramsgate, skimming in and out of the cloud base. You key in your first instructions to the crew. This is done in a similar way to which you communicated to AI wingmen in the Il-2 series. Hitting the Tab key, you go to the Crew-All list and select the command to instruct them to report on all Land-Sea-Air contacts. The AI crew's reaction time in searching if you choose a specific area to search (air, for example) is much faster than all at the same time, but on this show you'll be needing a good lookout. Far out into the Channel now. The AI navigator gives you a course correction. Steer one-one-oh. You look down at the compass. Must have wandered off a bit... You put on a bit of right rudder and the nose of the Blenheim comes back around. "On course" says the Navigator approvingly. At almost the same moment, the wireless op/gunner suddenly calls out, "Ship to starboard!" Where? You dip the wing and peer out through the cloud and mist. Can't see anything. The gunner's skill in identifying sea and land targets isn't the best. He is just a gunner after all, and his experience level has been modelled appropriately. The AI navigator/bomb aimer however is more informative. "I see it" he says. "Bearing fifty" "Destroyer, one of ours!" You look in the direction indicated. Ah, there it is. Very pretty. Still a ways off though. Might as well say hello... Throttles forward, you sweep down with the intention of giving the Navy a damn good beat up. You are speeding towards the destroyer when suddenly the ships guns open up. A burst of AA appears to the right, and then suddenly another burst much, much closer, accompanied by the dry rattle of shrapnel. Oh, for F**k sake! You pull up and bank away from the destroyer. At the same time showing the roundels on the bottom of your wings. A few more shots, and the gunfire ceases. Ships in Sow have a likelyhood of aircraft recognition based on variables of distance, weather and angle. Circling the destroyer at a more respectful distance, you see a light flashing from the bridge. "Ship is signalling..." reports the AI Wop/Gunner. "Message reads: Apologies. Be advised, enemy aircraft in the vicinity..." No future in that, you tell yourself. You hit the Tab key again and bring up the commands for your navigator, requesting a heading to target. Within moments you are back on course, climbing back up towards cloud cover. A moments consideration and you also change the crews lookout instructions. Telling them to concentrate on seeking threats from the air. Not a minute to soon either... "Fighter, Fighter! Break right Break right!!" calls your gunner. As you throw the bomber into a steep bank, the rear gun begins to clatter . A dark shape booms over the top of your canopy and disappears into the cloud above. "Lost him..." says the gunner. Engines screaming, clawing for height, the first wisps of cloud sweep past... ================================================== ===== The inclusion of crew interactions and management is similar to what we have now in the way we instruct and deploy AI wingmen in Il-2. I think it would be a great boost to the immersion in SoW if these things can be expanded and added to the single and multi player experience. Their inclusion would have great potential in adding the soul that is badly missed in the genre. 
Last edited by Feathered_IV; 11-16-2009 at 01:50 PM.
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#10
11-16-2009, 02:46 PM
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One thing I sometimes found immersion killing in IL2 was the lack of an obvious sense that you had touched down. Would be great if there was much more feedback that
A) made it clear you had landed B) gave a sense of how well you had landed. This feedback would come via sound and be anything from a real thud and bounce to a gentle kiss and be accompanied by a POV movement rangeing from a slight nod to a head forced into your lap for a real monster cock up......
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Hybrid Mode
