TBF Avenger and other planes

[Buster_Dee]

Originally Posted by Furio

That’s another type under the Gxxxxxn-Nxxxxxxp ban. I would shelve the whole night bombers-night fighters lot. Flying night interceptors would be simply to follow a different kind of mini-map, and then fire on a black silhouette barely visible in the dark. Flying bombers, it would be simply sit and wait for invisible fighters coming out from nowhere.

That’s my opinion, of course.

There's at least one problem with your assumption. I started learning to model for Target for Tonight, I have a radar background and, even as a Yank, the only theaters that REALLY interest me are the Commonwealth night bomber offensive, and the North-Atlantic U-boat defense. The only reason I model at all is that, after 20 years of waiting, I still hope. So, the one problem: if you tell me I will NEVER have my night bomber/night fighters, I'm taking my ball and going home.

[Buster_Dee]

Ok, maybe SOME daylight stuff is ok. I do love that B-26. All the talk about what could be "easily done" by using parts of other birds does not seem to include the B-26, which did have the same turret as the B-24 had (nearly identical).

But, I like the short-wing version in British service. There's is definitely something wrong with my allegiances.

The TBF? I fume to think about having it off-limits. NG was always such a stand-up company--clearly most concerned about giving fighting men something they could REALLY use and repair, giving their workers a real reason to be proud, and giving engineers a reason to do "right" things. I still can't put what happened with that company. An apology from them, and a thanks for all the model builders who became engineers, seems far more characteristic of their legacy.

Did you know that a Hellcat was bounce-tested from a ceiling? It was so rugged that the testers decided to have a little fun. I don't think the cat even noticed it was being abused.

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by Buster_Dee

The TBF? I fume to think about having it off-limits. NG was always such a stand-up company--clearly most concerned about giving fighting men something they could REALLY use and repair, giving their workers a real reason to be proud, and giving engineers a reason to do "right" things.

Yep. They got evil and corrupt starting in the 90s after the merger. Massive fines for various ethics and environmental violations. Grumman might have been a stand-up company, but Northrop wasn't so nice and Northrop bought Grumman, not the other way round.

My hope is that a talented modder will make high-quality flyable TBF cockpit and crew stations, and then go on to complete the entire run of Grumman fighters, starting with the F3F. Then, they'll finish off by making a really top-of-the-line fully flyable P-61 and the Ryan FR Fireball. This is a wish-list thread!

[IceFire]

Originally Posted by Buster_Dee

There's at least one problem with your assumption. I started learning to model for Target for Tonight, I have a radar background and, even as a Yank, the only theaters that REALLY interest me are the Commonwealth night bomber offensive, and the North-Atlantic U-boat defense. The only reason I model at all is that, after 20 years of waiting, I still hope. So, the one problem: if you tell me I will NEVER have my night bomber/night fighters, I'm taking my ball and going home.

I think we're close to that night fighter scenario. A map of somewhere in Germany, a flyable British bomber, set the lights low, a Bf110G-4 which we've already seen.... would give us some great night fighter/bomber activity.

The B-26 would be amazing however. Very useful over the Normandy map we already have.

[Furio]

Originally Posted by Buster_Dee

There's at least one problem with your assumption. I started learning to model for Target for Tonight, I have a radar background and, even as a Yank, the only theaters that REALLY interest me are the Commonwealth night bomber offensive, and the North-Atlantic U-boat defense. The only reason I model at all is that, after 20 years of waiting, I still hope. So, the one problem: if you tell me I will NEVER have my night bomber/night fighters, I'm taking my ball and going home.

Of course, I'm telling you nothing, being just a guy as all of you. In a perfect world, a perfect sim makes everyone happy.

[ElAurens]

The short wing B26 was also flown by the USAAF early on, and is my personal favorite of the B26 models because it had the best overall performance.

Yes it was tricky to fly for new pilots, even dangerous really, but as one pilot who liked the short wing version said, "it was a weapon". When flown by well trained pilots is was very good indeed.

Add the fact that it is just stunning to look at and it is a winner.

[Furio]

Originally Posted by ElAurens

The short wing B26 was also flown by the USAAF early on, and is my personal favorite of the B26 models because it had the best overall performance.

Yes it was tricky to fly for new pilots, even dangerous really, but as one pilot who liked the short wing version said, "it was a weapon". When flown by well trained pilots is was very good indeed.

Add the fact that it is just stunning to look at and it is a winner.

Wing was short and small. The early B26 was called “the prostitute” because it “had no visible means of support”. But you’re right: it was not designed for joyrides, and as a weapon it was really effective.

[Buster_Dee]

I think we were still in that phase of "almost" listening to British war experience, while they were just getting used to letting us find out some things for ourselves. It's amazing that the only flying survivor (that I know of) is the early, hot rod version.

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by Buster_Dee

I think we were still in that phase of "almost" listening to British war experience, while they were just getting used to letting us find out some things for ourselves.

I'd say that the major nation that get shortest shrift in IL2 is the UK.

There are many major British plane, tank and vehicle types that aren't represented, and the major theaters where the British fought (mostly) don't have maps. Many of the British planes chosen to be in IL2 were only because they were used on the Eastern Front. If it wasn't for Finland, we'd have no early war British planes at all!

Admittedly, IL2 was designed from a Russian point of view and was a healthy correction to all the Battle of Britain and "U.S.-conquers the world" sims, but I'd love to see a sim focused on the Mediterranean Theater from 1941-1943.

Plenty of air forces (Yugoslavia, Vichy France, Rhodesia, South Africa, Greece, Egypt and Canada in addition to the nations already in the game), many obscure battles, many obscure aircraft and vehicles to go along with the famous hardware, gorgeous terrain, often evenly matched forces - almost to the end.

[Furio]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

I'd say that the major nation that get shortest shrift in IL2 is the UK.

There are many major British plane, tank and vehicle types that aren't represented, and the major theaters where the British fought (mostly) don't have maps. Many of the British planes chosen to be in IL2 were only because they were used on the Eastern Front. If it wasn't for Finland, we'd have no early war British planes at all!

Admittedly, IL2 was designed from a Russian point of view and was a healthy correction to all the Battle of Britain and "U.S.-conquers the world" sims, but I'd love to see a sim focused on the Mediterranean Theater from 1941-1943.

Plenty of air forces (Yugoslavia, Vichy France, Rhodesia, South Africa, Greece, Egypt and Canada in addition to the nations already in the game), many obscure battles, many obscure aircraft and vehicles to go along with the famous hardware, gorgeous terrain, often evenly matched forces - almost to the end.

The list of British missing types is impressive. Most medium and all heavy bombers, all seaplanes, all transports. We have just one Mosquito and one Beaufighter models, but the Beau is the Australian variant. If I’m not mistaken, there is Tempest but no Typhoon, no ground attack Hurricanes (IId, IIe and IV), no Griffon Spitfires.
By comparison, Italian types are well represented, with a good choice of fighters and two out of three main bomber types. Regia Aeronautica just miss a transport (like the S82 Marsupiale, used also by Luftwaffe) and a seaplane (like the CANT Z506).

Looking at the British missing list I feel mixed emotions. The dreamer drools thinking at all those new types. The realist thinks that such dream is too good to be true and would be better to concentrate energies on more reachable goals.