Where are the new maps?

[CzechTexan]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

I find that hard to believe, since there are so many excellent mapmakers on SAS and literally dozens of completed modded maps.

While I don't want to start an argument or waste TD members time, I'd be interested in their analysis of why certain modded maps don't make the grade. If nothing else, it would be instructive to new mapmakers as to what they need to do.

I'm also wondering if TD isn't being a bit sensitive over what constitutes copyright. At least in the U.S., you can claim that it is an original work of art if you modify a someone else's work in a significant fashion. For example, taking a copyrighted Google Earth image, cropping it, editing it to make it consistent with 1940s era terrain and otherwise manipulating the image in a photo editing program ought to be good enough to make it an "original work of art."

I have a WIP map of the Kweilin-Changsha region of China on SAS.
TD has strict requirements for maps and that's why it's harder to do them for TD. Example is all rivers at zero altitude is very difficult to do in mountainous maps where elevation is significant from one side of the map to the other.

Also, not getting textures from Google earth (or other places) puts a damper on map building for TD.... how else can good decent real-life looking textures be made??

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by CzechTexan

Example is all rivers at zero altitude is very difficult to do in mountainous maps where elevation is significant from one side of the map to the other.

That's also just WRONG! Rivers flow downhill for a reason! Of course, TD does say that there can be exceptions for tarns and the like, so it makes sense that a river flowing through the mountains could be above zero altitude.

Is there any particular reason why rivers all have to be at zero altitude?

Originally Posted by CzechTexan

Also, not getting textures from Google earth (or other places) puts a damper on map building for TD.... how else can good decent real-life looking textures be made??

Satellite and aerial pictures released by various governments are inherently copyright free. They're just not as readily available as Google Earth images.

And, as I said in my earlier thread, arguably cropping, tiling, retinting and photoshopping an existing photograph turns it into an original work of art.

[MicroWave]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

That's also just WRONG! Rivers flow downhill for a reason! Of course, TD does say that there can be exceptions for tarns and the like, so it makes sense that a river flowing through the mountains could be above zero altitude.

Is there any particular reason why rivers all have to be at zero altitude?
...

The game engine renders properly only water at zero altitude.
Even on high altitude lakes you can see that the shadows are wrong (for example Slovakia).

Here is something for you all to do during the summer. Make a list of best MOD maps and suggest them here. Imagine that only top 2 on the list will make it into official patch. So argue among yourselves why your favorite ones should be on top. Bear in mind that they should satisfy conditions posted in this thread before. Of course, some deviations are possible (I don't see a reason for winter version of objects on Pacific maps).

[Fenrir]

Originally Posted by MicroWave

The game engine renders properly only water at zero altitude.
Even on high altitude lakes you can see that the shadows are wrong (for example Slovakia).

Here is something for you all to do during the summer. Make a list of best MOD maps and suggest them here. Imagine that only top 2 on the list will make it into official patch. So argue among yourselves why your favorite ones should be on top. Bear in mind that they should satisfy conditions posted in this thread before. Of course, some deviations are possible (I don't see a reason for winter version of objects on Pacific maps).

Ok Caspar.

Top of my List would be Maraz Central Med Map - the scope for Malta and North African theatre action from 1940 all the way to 1943 is too good an opportunity to miss; where else are we gonna use that lovely MkIII Wimpey?

Second place would be a Cross Channel map. and I'm thinking GilB57s Western Front Map would be the most excellent choice - scope for the heavy bomber boys and fills a gap between the Normandy maps (D-Day) and NW Europe - lets face it, the stock Ardennes map, whilst a useful filler over the years is an undersized and ageing entity; the 1:1 scale of GilB57s lovely map really puts it in the shade.

Also would like a winter version of the Norway map; given the majority of anti-shipping action took part during the autumn and winter of 1944-45 it seems a shame we don't have the opportunity to skim between snow capped Nordic peaks as we dodge the Kreigsmarine flak gunners!

[Juri_JS]

As much as I like to have new maps in the game, but maybe TD should first concentrate on adding new textures for the old maps. The textures of the Pacific maps are the worst in my opinion, some of them have completely wrong textures, like Chichi Jima or Okinawa.

New textures can make an enormous difference, just look at the retextures Cyberolas has done for the stock maps.

Map retextures can also be an opportunity to add winter versions of existing maps (Norway, Berlin, Kuban, etc.)

[CzechTexan]

Originally Posted by Juri_JS

As much as I like to have new maps in the game, but maybe TD should first concentrate on adding new textures for the old maps. The textures of the Pacific maps are the worst in my opinion, some of them have completely wrong textures, like Chichi Jima or Okinawa.

New textures can make an enormous difference, just look at the retextures Cyberolas has done for the stock maps.

Map retextures can also be an opportunity to add winter versions of existing maps (Norway, Berlin, Kuban, etc.)

I agree. If it's possible to get the new B.O.Moscow and Donbass maps with their textures into IL2 then I'd like to also see those textures replace the ancient stock textures. At least then all the east front maps would look similar.

Actually, the biggest eyesore, in my opinion, is the old city textures...I can live with the other fields textures. Stock Cities need to be replaced with B.O.Moscow and Donbass city textures. That is not a hard thing to do and they are actually very similar in layout.'

MIXX's Khalkin Gol and ZaPolare' (Murmansk) maps are also very good maps. I'm not sure if they meet requirements but they are much better than the stock maps of those regions. I have never made missions for the stock Khalking Gol map but I would love to use Mixx's map.

[KU_Rigamortis]

The right area of this map would be a very nice addition. I've seen a similar version in HSFX modded squad events. Perhaps a banned subject of conversation like the Channel map, sorry if that is the case.




Also, I wish the Truk Lagoon (LS) map in HSFX would be added. That map is a great template for some very fun battles that don't involve flying 50 minutes to reach a target.

[IceFire]

Originally Posted by CzechTexan

I have a WIP map of the Kweilin-Changsha region of China on SAS.
TD has strict requirements for maps and that's why it's harder to do them for TD. Example is all rivers at zero altitude is very difficult to do in mountainous maps where elevation is significant from one side of the map to the other.

Also, not getting textures from Google earth (or other places) puts a damper on map building for TD.... how else can good decent real-life looking textures be made??

Glad to have you here CzechTexan. I've seen some of your stuff and it looks good!

Google Earth is of course copyrighted. We may be able to make use of government aerial photo archives that are in the public domain to help in making new textures. Some photoshop work to make them more than just a black and white overview could be used to make some great stuff.

Here's where it would be useful to have some teamwork. I know there are artists who are very good at making repeating textures. If we can combine their efforts with map makers then we can really get something going here.

The river thing is a pain. You can see why it doesn't work quite properly on maps like Slovakia and Burma... engine limitation and a usability issue when you're flying near such water. I'm wondering if TD would be amenable to exceptions in certain circumstances.

[Cloyd]

Originally Posted by IceFire

Glad to have you here CzechTexan. I've seen some of your stuff and it looks good!

Google Earth is of course copyrighted. We may be able to make use of government aerial photo archives that are in the public domain to help in making new textures. <snip>

Massachusetts, where I live, provides its aerial photography for free for anyone to download. Not surprisingly, Google uses this imagery (that my state taxes helped pay for) for Maps and Earth. Doesn't stop Google from slapping their copyright on the imagery that they didn't produce or pay for. No slam on Google necessarily, I love Google Maps and Earth, I use them all the time for work. But, I think it's a bit of a stretch that they get to claim rights to my screengrab from their free viewer programs of imagery that they do not own or produce. F'n lawyers!

Cloyd

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by Cloyd

Massachusetts, where I live, provides its aerial photography for free for anyone to download. Not surprisingly, Google uses this imagery (that my state taxes helped pay for) for Maps and Earth. Doesn't stop Google from slapping their copyright on the imagery that they didn't produce or pay for.

So, this means that we just need to find the materials that Google Maps has ripped off.

Paradoxically, a Google Search on "Copyright free Satellite Images" pays good dividends, at least if you're willing to dig. Look for images taken by government-owned satellites such as Landsat or IKONOS.

Here's one decent source that I found.

http://earthexplorer.usgs.gov/

Even better, this site lets you search images by year (good for getting older maps which show certain parts of the world before massive development) and even by month!

Here's another royalty free source, with open license:

http://www.openstreetmap.org/

And another:

http://landsatlook.usgs.gov/

There are probably others.