4.11 - AI debugging

[Aviar]

Originally Posted by FC99

It seems that problem with the trains is the old one, I tried it in 4.05 and it was the same as 4.11.1. Can somebody who have one of the older versions installed double check that.

Confirmed. I tried the same scenario (153's bombing an ammo train) in 4.08m and the 153's kept strafing the destroyed locomotive.

Aviar

[K_Freddie]

Not sure whether this has been mentioned (too lazy to read a 1000 posts )

Offline play:
I notice that on all Ace settings 4vs4, when getting onto any AI opponents tail, it's supporting number will be onto me if I don't hit my target on the first pass.
At the same time I ask my #2 to cover me.. he's nowhere to be seen ??, even after minutes of dodging the covering opponent.

Summary:
Target AI are able to work as a team more than your own AI = No good
This is not random, but every quick mission set.

[jameson]

Agree about Ai, sits in your blind spot and does nothing to help not even give a warning. If you're head of four, if you don't order them to do something they just follow you around, even if six enemy ai are shooting at you, lol!

[FC99]

Originally Posted by K_Freddie

I notice that on all Ace settings 4vs4, when getting onto any AI opponents tail, it's supporting number will be onto me if I don't hit my target on the first pass.
At the same time I ask my #2 to cover me.. he's nowhere to be seen ??, even after minutes of dodging the covering opponent.

Depends on the situation, he might have his own problems, be out of ammo or damaged. They were less agressive in 4.11 but in 4.11.1 there should be no difference between all AI flights and mixed flights.

Originally Posted by jameson

If you're head of four, if you don't order them to do something they just follow you around, even if six enemy ai are shooting at you, lol!

Than just order them to do what you want.

Originally Posted by Sita

i'm sorry if somebody already talks about it ...

i notice that TB3 no attacking ground target not by level bombing ...

now they do it like Il2 ... yesterday i watch like two TB3 keep the formation goes down from 2500 meters till 200 meters and drop bombs on the car convoy ...

Please, provide the mission and I'll take a look.

Originally Posted by Aviar

When I set up a similar situation in the FMB, I was able to sneak up on the enemy AI 6 without being 'seen'. (Test mission is attached if anyone would like to check it out.)

When I set up a similar mission in the QMB, the AI always knew I was behind him.

I'm not sure why the AI in the QMB seems to be programmed differently.

AI is the same but lot of AI code depends on random numbers which are not really random. Every mission will always start with the same sequence and unless there have been some events which break the sequence it will always play the same. In QMB type missions fight starts fast and there is no chance for that sequence to be changed.

So if you have a mission where AI decided to look at the area where your plane is they will do it every time you play that mission. For breaking the randoms quickly it's best to fire short burst with your guns.

Originally Posted by Juri_JS

I don't know if this has been reported before, but there is something wrong with the strafing behaviour when the leader of a flight is the human player. The AI planes of a flight that is lead by a human player will not attack ground targets, even when an attack command is given. This only happens when the planes are not equipped with bombs or rockets. Bomb or rocket attacks are correctly performed by the AI.

Tried your mission and AI attacks targets without any command.

When the human player is not leading the flight and is just a wingman, the AI will correctly do the strafing attacks, but the players plane will not take part in the attack when flown on autopilot.

Autopilot will not attack if you use unlimited ammo, it attacked correctly with limited ammo when I tried your mission.

FC

[Juri_JS]

Originally Posted by FC99

Autopilot will not attack if you use unlimited ammo, it attacked correctly with limited ammo when I tried your mission.

FC

For testing self-made missions I am always using the lowest difficult setting. Disabling unlimited ammo fixed the problem. Thanks alot for the advice FC99.

[Sita]

Originally Posted by FC99

Please, provide the mission and I'll take a look.

FC, sorry i started new company ( exactly same like that in i see this strange acting of TB3) and i think that mission was deleted ...

can give only ntrk records (((( sorry(

[K_Freddie]

Originally Posted by FC99

Depends on the situation, he might have his own problems, be out of ammo or damaged. They were less agressive in 4.11 but in 4.11.1 there should be no difference between all AI flights and mixed flights.

My #2 was happily floating around off to one side (watching the show ) while the only 2 enemy AI left were trying to do me

To add to this..
On a career, I was #4 and we attacked and decimated around 6 russki bombers. On looking at the track I found 2 yak escorts about 1000 feet above the bombers, that just went around in circles while we had 'lunch'.

Sorry have no tracks or saved stuff, but will save in future.

[FC99]

Originally Posted by Aviar

Confirmed. I tried the same scenario (153's bombing an ammo train) in 4.08m and the 153's kept strafing the destroyed locomotive.

Thanks for checking, fix ready for 4.12.

[Sita]

i'm sorry if somebody already talks about it ...

i notice that TB3 no attacking ground target not by level bombing ...

now they do it like Il2 ... yesterday i watch like two TB3 keep the formation goes down from 2500 meters till 200 meters and drop bombs on the car convoy ...

its not logical for this monster plane ...

[Whacker]

I'm going to toss this up here in this thread, even though it might be considered 1. controversial and 2. a feature request, but I personally mostly view it as "buggy".

Simply put, the AI has ESP and can detect you trying to sneak up on them, even if it's from a completely unviewable quadrant.

For example, if I set up a mission in FMB. Identical aircraft, say 109E-4's, theater irrelevant but I like sands of time. I'll start the badguy on a level flight at 1000 meters flying a perfectly straight and level track at say 300 kph. I'll start myself about 2km directly behind and below by about 200 meters. Proceed to "sneak up" on the badguy as best I can, staying directly below and behind, which I know for a fact is within the blind area. With full mouse of trackir movement, visibility in my approach area does not exist. One would have to turn the aircraft several degrees on the horizontal plane to see back directly behind. No matter what, if I execute a perfect approach completely in the blind spot, the badguy will always, always "detect" me and go defensive when I'm close enough. The detection range varies by skill as far as I can determine.

I view this as a bug, there is no possible way one pilot could detect another one sneaking up like that unless they did some active, conscious flight direction change in order to "clear six". One should be able to "sneak up" on another aircraft in blind spots if done correctly.

Also would like to reiterate that I realize AI development is difficult, imperfect science at best with everyone pissing and moaning about his or her particular desires, complaints, etc. Also realize there are other bigger fish to fry, like tweaking the jets a bit or who the heck knows what else.

Is there any way we could get something done to help address this in 4.12?