UFO's and extra-terrestrial life

[Oldschool61]

Originally Posted by patrat1

the way i understand it, there is no void beyond the universe.

because there is no beyond, outside of the universe. like i said, there is no outside.

at least thats my understanding of it.

Isnt thisthread about UFO's?? What does the size or speed of the universe have to do with UFO's??? Start a new thread on the origins of the universe already!!

[patrat1]

Originally Posted by Oldschool61

Isnt thisthread about UFO's?? What does the size or speed of the universe have to do with UFO's??? Start a new thread on the origins of the universe already!!

actually the size and speed of the universe do have to do with the chances of there being alien civilizations out there. most people consider ufos to come from alien civilazations if im not mistaken.

but your right, we are getting off topic with discussing whether theres an outside or not to the universe. so i'll desist in discussing it further.

[Wolf_Rider]

Originally Posted by Oldschool61

Isnt thisthread about UFO's?? What does the size or speed of the universe have to do with UFO's??? Start a new thread on the origins of the universe already!!

well... it all sorta, kinda, ties in together

[CharveL]

When the whole credibility thing comes up I can't help but think of the airline pilots who were reporting over comms about this UFO until they started to come in to land and realized against the treeline it was a piece of wheat stuck to their window.

Or that cop that chased Venus down winding roads for half a state not realizing it was him that was moving not his foo fighter.

[hiro]

there is a possibility of UFO's . . . I think there is. Do i believe those alien shows?

Nope. Not since the alien autopsy hoax and the pictures of triangular shaped aircraft that looks like have blue.

Or the one with the cylindrical shaped rocket that burned and gave radiation burns to the witnesses (US govt testing of nuclear jet engines . . .) and how brilliant and awesome coloring the exhaust was . . .


astronomers are discovering more solar systems with a sun with a planet in the habitable "ring"* for earth based life.

*orbit / zone / distance from sun to sustain life without frying or freezing it


But alien life may have a different set of natural boundaries and laws set up for it and may not require the same habitable ring


At the same time sun dancing making lights on off your canopy can explain
that bend the laws of aerodynamics as human aerospace vehicles are capable



And why do you have to bring religion into this. The Christians have 1 UP in this area because TONS of credible witness to weird things, like WW 2 nuking and the only building left at ground zero was German Christian missionary home or how they have tons of saints where their bodies are uncorrupted for hundreds of years.



Human understanding only gets us so far. We don't know everything, nor will we ever be.

That's why its in the human spirit to question, to ask, to seek. And sometimes some shortchange by finding the quick answer or making up truth.

[Oldschool61]

Originally Posted by hiro

And why do you have to bring religion into this. The Christians have 1 UP in this area because TONS of credible witness to weird things, like WW 2 nuking and the only building left at ground zero was German Christian missionary home or how they have tons of saints where their bodies are uncorrupted for hundreds of years.

Well since you asked, because people believe in there mythological person despite no evidence yet make fun of UFO's when there are hundreds of credible witness's.
And contrary to your claims of evidence there is none despite your wishfull thinking. I have been researching mythological deities for several years and everyone has ended up being false or just another myth.

We nuked Germany in WW2? I thought that was Japan. Witness to something rare is not proof of anything. Saints are normal people.
If that is your standard for evidence than by your definition UFO's are 100% real.

[SEE]

UFO's, ET life and the mysteries of the universe are fascinating topics. When I look up in the middle of the night I am looking back in time. How far back in time depends on the distance of the star or galaxy.

It may well be that what I am looking at no longer exists or something that does exist in my present time period has yet to appear. Life may well have established itself but what I and observatories see is the historical past not the present.

I saw a documentary on SETI and the search criteria is extremely narrow in terms of the Radio Frequency that is being searched for. SETI may never actually reveal or find evidence as it is has to work with assumptions.

Me, I keep an open mind. Charles C Clarke said something along the lines that the implications for mankind were equally imense if we were not alone or discovered that we were alone!

My only encounter with UFO's was during the weekend at 1-30 am.................on the Syndicate server!

[CharveL]

Originally Posted by Oldschool61

Well since you asked, because people believe in there mythological person despite no evidence yet make fun of UFO's when there are hundreds of credible witness's.
And contrary to your claims of evidence there is none despite your wishfull thinking. I have been researching mythological deities for several years and everyone has ended up being false or just another myth.

We nuked Germany in WW2? I thought that was Japan. Witness to something rare is not proof of anything. Saints are normal people.
If that is your standard for evidence than by your definition UFO's are 100% real.

I really hate to harp on you Oldschool61, and respect your apparent strong faith in aliens, but when you come up with glaring logical fallacies all in one paragraph it's difficult to ignore.

You may want to hit the books a bit harder as there happens to be quite a few historically documented witnesses of the man "Jesus" and his cult than just the bible. Personally, I don't think he was the "son of God" but it doesn't mean he didn't exist.

But anyway, I find it amusing how you managed to miss that in your extensive "research" and yet are so willing to label UFO witnesses as credible and somehow make the leap of logic that alien visitations are more "true" because of this.

Be honest with yourself. You choose to believe in cow-punching, sky-dancing visitors from space simply on faith because of a preponderance of circumstantial second-hand stories by people you don't know, yet somehow are credible because of a badge or pilot's license.

The incredible irony here is that you are so quick to dismiss the experience of millions of people, from all walks of life including pilots and police, that claim personal experience of their God, yet will take perhaps thousands of UFO alien claims as somehow overwhelming evidence.

I'm fine with the fact you believe in alien flying saucers but from my perspective, and the standard of logical reasoning, it's just as likely there is a bearded man up there arbitrarily judging us as there are grey aliens with big eyes doing the same.

[Oldschool61]

Originally Posted by CharveL

You may want to hit the books a bit harder as there happens to be quite a few historically documented witnesses of the man "Jesus" and his cult than just the bible. Personally, I don't think he was the "son of God" but it doesn't mean he didn't exist.

.

Actually your mistaken about the historical evidence "documented witnesses" thats funny becasuse there are none. Debunking mythical christian deities has become my pastime since I dropped out of being a catholic sheeple. If one spends time with an open mind and see's the big picture with all the bad thinks religion has caused "hitler comes to mind" the more one see's that its all ancient mythology. There are several deities that have the nearly the same stories as Hesus. Horus , Mythra etc.. all born of a virgin, raised someone from dead etc hundreds of years earlier and same magical doings yet not one eyewitness.

[unreasonable]

Originally Posted by CharveL

I really hate to harp on you Oldschool61, and respect your apparent strong faith in aliens, but when you come up with glaring logical fallacies all in one paragraph it's difficult to ignore.

Edited for brevity..

I'm fine with the fact you believe in alien flying saucers but from my perspective, and the standard of logical reasoning, it's just as likely there is a bearded man up there arbitrarily judging us as there are grey aliens with big eyes doing the same.

Surely you do not mean this (if I am right in thinking that by "bearded man" you mean a conventional patriarchal deity)?

The existence of grey aliens with big eyes is an empirical issue - you assert (and I would agree) that there is no credible evidence for their existence. But without an assumption that life only evolved once in the universe there is surely a tiny possiblity that they are indeed there, watching and judging from behind their stealth fields, descending occasionally to probe the fundament of an unwary midwesterner.

By contrast, the existence or otherwise of a patriarchal deity is not an empirical matter of uncertain status. So probability does not come into it.

(Disclaimer: this comment should not be taken to be part of a religious discussion. It is a comment about what a religious discussion is).

So how can they be "equally likely"?

On another note it is surprising how long governments used to be able to keep secrets - take the Polish/UK cracking of the German Ultra code in WW2. Hundreds of people knew something about this and many a great deal, yet the general public and even professional military historians had no idea until sometime in the seventies, IIRC, when the records were released. In those days, when some elderly officer in a regimental tie sat you down and told you that you could never discuss your work even with your family, you did what you were told. Not sure how that would work now....