If UBI's DRM scheme is unacceptable...

[The Kraken]

Originally Posted by KG26_Alpha

You only own the right to use it under their terms and conditions.

Indeed. And those conditions get successively worse for the customer. And everyone's cheering about that

[Wolf_Rider]

this the from the last game I put in, which hasn't varied much since the first, many many years ago...

3.LICENCE CONDITIONS

3.1Except as expressly set out in this Licence or as permitted by any local law, you undertake to use the Program for your own personal use, and you shall not:

(a)use the Program, or permit use of the Program, on more than one computer, computer terminal, or workstation at the same time;
(b)make copies of the Program or any part thereof, or make copies of the materials accompanying this Program except where such copying is incidental to normal use of the Program or where it is necessary for the purpose of back-up or security;
(c)use the Program, or permit use of the Program, in a network, multi-user arrangement or remote access arrangement, including any online use, except as otherwise explicitly provided by the Program;
(d)sell, rent, lease, sub-license, distribute, loan, translate, merge, adapt, vary, modify or otherwise transfer the Program, or any copies of the Program, without the express prior written consent of XXXX;
(e)not to make alterations to, or modifications of, the whole or any part of the Program nor permit the Program or any part of it to be combined with, or become incorporated in, any other programs;
(f)not to disassemble, decompile, reverse engineer or create derivative works based on the whole, or any part, of the Program nor attempt to do any such things except to the extent that (by virtue of section 296A of the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 198 such actions cannot be prohibited because they are essential for the purpose of achieving inter-operability of the Program with another software program, and provided that the information obtained by you during such activities:
(i)is used only for the purpose of achieving inter-operability of the Program with another software program; and
(ii)is not unnecessarily disclosed or communicated to any third party without the XXXX’s prior written consent; and
(iii)is not used to create any software which is substantially similar to the Program.
(g)remove any proprietary notices or labels from the Program or otherwise modify the Program without the prior written consent of the XXXX; and
(h)exploit this Program or any of its parts commercially, including but not limited to use at a cyber cafe, computer gaming centre or any other location-based site. XXXXX, may offer a separate Site Licence Agreement to permit you to make the Program available for commercial use; please refer to the contact information below.

3.2You acknowledge that the Program has not been developed to meet your individual requirements and that it is therefore your responsibility to ensure that the facilities and functions of the Program as described in the Documentation meet your requirements.

3.3You acknowledge that the Program may not be free of errors or bugs and you agree that the existence of any minor errors shall not constitute a breach of this Licence.




and is pretty much standard... and excepting for points 3.2 and 3.3, is almost word for word identical to that of the EULA for a $30k motion control program I use in theatre

[yellonet]

Originally Posted by The Kraken

Indeed. And those conditions get successively worse for the customer. And everyone's cheering about that

Exactly... makes you wonder

[yellonet]

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

@yellownet

the oignal part you probably missed was, "2. I want to be able to play the game on the go (offline)."
and the response was "Hmm, who plays a flightsim "on the go"? I sometimes bring my Nintendo DS or PSP around on trips or whatever but even those are cumbersome and especially the PSP takes a good time to load some games. So if you are on a business trip or something you actually bring your huge-*ss gaming laptop with you? You're gonna need a joystick, where do you put your HOTAS or even a "smaller" joystick? in your back pocket? They won't even fit in a small suitcase! Ok, presume you DO bring all that stuff with you on your trips, most hotels (even cheaper ones) have free Wlan."

You've done yourself a misservice with your response to that

No I didn't miss that, but you may have missed the meaning of my answer.

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

let me ask you on your "The point being, when you buy something you should be able to use it as you see fit."; do you complain because you have to use nVidia drivers with nVidia cards, and have no option to use ATI instead... and vica versa?

That's hardly the same thing, DRM isn't something that is a vital part of the product, the product works just fine without it, DRM is just added afterwards in order to control how the product is used. How would you like it if that nVidia card would only would let you run games that had paid off nVidia to be "nVidia certified" for instance?

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

Or, (this bit is for yellownet as well) with your shiny new car... that you've replaced the engine and running gear with the engine and running gear from another manufacturer and wonder why the dealer you've bought car from won't honour your shop warranty?

Again, that's not the same. We're not talking about changing the product and then making a claim against the publisher/seller, it's just about being able to use the product the way you want to without being forced to be online or being forced to install software that you have no control over and that can pretty much do anything in your system without you knowing it.

[Avimimus]

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

I hate to rain on your parade there buddy, but how did you extrapolate all that from my post you quoted?

out in the rural or remote community of Canada? how do they get their email then?

Ah... you don't get e-mail or you pull it in using an old dial-up modem (28.8k anyone?). If there aren't any land lines you can do point-to-point with short-wave radio. Of course, if you're in the high Arctic most Inuit communities have satellite, but the rest of us further south are screwed

However, you can install your software and even activate it in the city and then ship the computer to wherever you're going.

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

Or, (this bit is for Avimimus as well) with your shiny new car... that you've replaced the engine and running gear with the engine and running gear from another manufacturer and wonder why the dealer you've bought car from won't honour your shop warranty?

I don't like being a kept pet. I'd rather be able to fix things myself or have multiple sources of spares than have my activities "owned" by a warranty.

Similarly, I'd rather own my appliances than lease them. I certainly wouldn't want to give those running a warranty keys to my house and permission for them to muck about without telling me what they were doing or asking permission to enter the property.

This might be worth reading (in case you missed it):
http://web.archive.org/web/200502120.../emancipn.html

[Wolf_Rider]

so, what you seem to be saying is... you don't update your system and won't update your system/ game or sim in fear of that being too intrusive.
You also seem to be saying that while satellite connections exist all around you, you won't adopt the technology.
You haven't replied to your poor extrapolation of my post (ie where was automatic forced update mentioned?)and

and what has religion got to do with this?

[Avimimus]

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

so, what you seem to be saying is... you don't update your system and won't update your system/ game or sim in fear of that being too intrusive.

You also seem to be saying that while satellite connections exist all around you, you won't adopt the technology.

You haven't replied to your poor extrapolation of my post (ie where was automatic forced update mentioned?)and

and what has religion got to do with this?

Ah...

1) I don't like updating software if I can't look at the files being updated beforehand. The same goes for windows update (which can produce compatibility problems). I prefer manual installs. There is no reason why most updates to software would require you to download and run an executable (when a copy command or use of batch files would do). So, yes - depending on how the patching system works.

2) Adopting a satellite internet connection would cost thousands of dollars per year. The reason why Inuit communities get them has to do with resource extraction and the small number of communities in the Arctic (just over fifty settlements). I'm much further south.

3) Ah... I was just pointing out that I don't really like warranties and the automatic update and/or silently contacting servers that we see in Steam or some DRM schemes is much more like giving the support company permission to enter your house at any time, change things around (as well as look around) and possibly try to "fix" things which are already working and accidentally make them no longer work. Few people would accept this treatment in the non-digital world.

4) The document is actually the 1861 emancipation of the Serfs in Russia. The fact that it is couched in religious terms is a accident of history. The basic point is that we are accepting becoming tenants or even serfs in the digital world - while many of us seek to own our homes in the material world.

There is no reason why we should have to accept this double standard.

[proton45]

IDK why people are freaking out...I run a lot of different kinds of software and almost all of them required some kind of "online activation". Music programs, graphics and animation software all require some kind of internet connection to activate them...this is 2011 and pretty much all software is heading in this direction.

Its not really that big a deal...I dont really like the idea of "authentication/security programs" but, unless, they are a huge CPU hog that is running all the time, it doesn't bother me...

[The Kraken]

Do most of these installations also require a permanent internet connection to run and stop working when your connection or the company servers are down? As this is what Ubi has introduced last year as their superbly customer-friendly online service. And underlined more than once that they don't care if people complain about it; they'll keep using it for various titles as it provides so many superb advantages. Maybe over the years we'll learn to appreciate it - then we can say again, "everyone is doing this, so what's the big deal"

For CoD all indications are this will not be used, but until there's an official confirmation you shouldn't be surprised that people are cautious. And of course it's possible that a later mandatory update will insert this "service" into the game.

Hey it's all in the EULA and that must not be questioned!

[Wolf_Rider]

Originally Posted by Avimimus

Ah...

1) I don't like updating software if I can't look at the files being updated beforehand. The same goes for windows update (which can produce compatibility problems). I prefer manual installs. There is no reason why most updates to software would require you to download and run an executable (when a copy command or use of batch files would do). So, yes - depending on how the patching system works.

2) Adopting a satellite internet connection would cost thousands of dollars per year. The reason why Inuit communities get them has to do with resource extraction and the small number of communities in the Arctic (just over fifty settlements). I'm much further south.

3) Ah... I was just pointing out that I don't really like warranties and the automatic update and/or silently contacting servers that we see in Steam or some DRM schemes is much more like giving the support company permission to enter your house at any time, change things around (as well as look around) and possibly try to "fix" things which are already working and accidentally make them no longer work. Few people would accept this treatment in the non-digital world.

4) The document is actually the 1861 emancipation of the Serfs in Russia. The fact that it is couched in religious terms is a accident of history. The basic point is that we are accepting becoming tenants or even serfs in the digital world - while many of us seek to own our homes in the material world.

There is no reason why we should have to accept this double standard.

you've got some problems then, son and you still haven't explained your extrapolation of my post