more realistic in some ways with the early il-2?

Slechtvalk · #1 01-19-2011, 09:50 PM

In the first versions flying, shooting and climbing was way different. Headons and shooting was futile, and you just wouldnt do it, since you would waste precious ammo.
Then with some patch all that changed, later on the rudder also changed really and deflection shooting much more easy..
Shooting with a p39 cannon and hitting a plane, not many could..
I can remember climbing with my lagg for ages to get above a hill, suddenly all that changed as well.. it's not problem at all anymore..

The rudder control on the ground was more easy though, I could do some acrobatics on the ground, in fact I felt in total control, and now it got some lag feel to it and just slow, using brakes the whole time to counter it...With a heavy bomber it's really funny how heavy the control got...

So just wondering is it now really more realistic then back then, and will it be about the same with this new il-2?, I guess it will be, still love the game but it was weird how many things changed so big..

Not that this is a new question for me.. but never found an answer.

Avimimus · #2 01-19-2011, 10:33 PM

Maybe you got more skilled? The LaGG-3 was too light in the original Il-2 (they added a lot of weight to it part way through development)

Although, I must admit that Il-2 was in many ways more polished - the engine had been built for a study sim and the game was still something of a study sim. Things like the altitude limit, the low detail ships, the AI behaviour and the formation sizes all make perfect sense for an Il-2 sim.

Chivas · #3 01-19-2011, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slechtvalk

In the first versions flying, shooting and climbing was way different. Headons and shooting was futile, and you just wouldnt do it, since you would waste precious ammo.
Then with some patch all that changed, later on the rudder also changed really and deflection shooting much more easy..
Shooting with a p39 cannon and hitting a plane, not many could..
I can remember climbing with my lagg for ages to get above a hill, suddenly all that changed as well.. it's not problem at all anymore..

The rudder control on the ground was more easy though, I could do some acrobatics on the ground, in fact I felt in total control, and now it got some lag feel to it and just slow, using brakes the whole time to counter it...With a heavy bomber it's really funny how heavy the control got...

So just wondering is it now really more realistic then back then, and will it be about the same with this new il-2?, I guess it will be, still love the game but it was weird how many things changed so big..

Not that this is a new question for me.. but never found an answer.

The Flight Model will be more complex. It was intersting that awhile ago Luthier mentioned he almost had to learn how to fly all over again. It should be fun learning intricacies of the new flight model.

WTE_Galway · #4 01-19-2011, 10:38 PM

The original IL2 was far HARDER, just getting a 109 off the ground was a challenge for new players.

However it was harder because the original FM had errors . The original was not more realistic, just harder to fly.

Azimech · #5 01-20-2011, 12:55 AM

I respectfully disagree completely. I often switch between 4.10 and 1.0, just to compare.

You have aileron & rudder trim on all planes. The stalls are like FSX compared to what we have now. Flaps jam at higher speeds, there's no working prop pitch other than automatic, the AI is even dumber. Ground friction is not there, you just receive some virbrations while driving & sightseeing through the countryside at 100 km/h. Bouncing on the runway is much more foregiving. All planes have WEP, etc.

Taking off in a 109 needs rudder trim because rudder alone is not effective (error). After that, taking off is like taking off in a Cessna.

Just did a scramble in 1.0 with full switch in a G2 against an "ace" La5FN. The La was hard to catch due to speed and cornering but once I got on it's tail, it reacted like the AI rookies we have now. Then I did the same in 4.10 (only speedbar). Really working my ass of there, much less forgiving, but much more feel what the machine wants to do and how to respond. Though I have to say centering in 1.0 doesn't work anymore so I had to switch force feedback off and ride the buffet on sound. AI is still dumb though.

And than that enormous dot you see from 10 km away. in 4.10 I'm constantly panning and searching the skies and still get jumped.

In 1.0 Doing a snap roll in an A4 is impossible, getting out of a spin is harder. But you can even easily do a cornering fight at ground level against the La, and the A4 can be thrown around like an F4, just losing a lot of energy in the process. The only way to do that in 4.10 is with scissors.

The overall feel is much more plastic than we have now, nowadays it feels much more alive. Tougher nut to crack, but much more fun.

Slechtvalk · #6 01-20-2011, 05:54 AM

Ok overall its much better I agree. Don't have old il-2 to be really sure/compare, but I felt strongly that shooting became much more easy suddenly and never understood why.

Shouldnt have posted this though, was late

Igo kyu · #7 01-20-2011, 01:49 PM

I remember in 1.0 you could take off from a crashed aircraft, with a bit of a jump. Was very unrealistic but I sort of liked it.

Jumoschwanz · #8 01-20-2011, 02:20 PM

Sure some versions of IL2 Sturmovik are harder to fly than others, but unless you have hours in a real WWII aircraft, or maybe some civvy aircraft, then you are not really qualified to comment on which is more 'realistic".

I know real pilots that fly IL2. One says it is damn good the way it is now.

I have been flying IL2 since 2001. I still have the original IL2 on my hard drive and fly it now and then. It is different and it is harder to get things done, but the new one has so many improvements I will take it over the original for sure.

Those of use that have been flying IL2 for ten years have much more experience than any WWII pilot ever had. Combine that with the lack of fear of death, and we are absolute magicians in our digital aircraft. If someone did what we do for real in an airshow somewhere in a WWII fighter it would make the news all over the world.

It is the amount of combat experience that is unusual for most IL2 pilots to have. In WWII most of the pilots were kids, scared shitless half the time and without a small fraction of the combat experience that IL2 sim pilots have under their belts.

I was reading in an article on P-40 fighter aircraft where there is only one recorded example of a pilot recovering one from a spin under 5000 feet altitude and living to tell about it. I know that I can do this easily in IL2, but it could be as much my great experience and lack of fear of death and panic as it is the IL2 flight models. I have nothing to lose when I fly, sitting in comfort in my home at a desk.....