To Oleg or Luthier: 4.09 / mods question

[Feuerfalke]

Originally Posted by Feathered_IV

Never seen it so perfectly expressed before. Nice one BC

And look how much damage was done with fire, eventually leading to the destruction of the atmosphere and mankind itself.


It's all a question of perspective.

[csThor]

Bearcat

I think I have a better analogy: Imagine you buy something like a car, a TV, a hi-fi system, a computer, etc from a private person on the internet ... You bought it in good faith and are happy about the purchase. But now let us assume it turns out to have been stolen from someone else. According to german law you still had to hand it back to the original owner, despite your lack of knowledge. And you won't be compensated, either.

The fact remains that someone broke into the file protection and unlocked files which weren't supposed to be open. You honestly think any developer would approve this act retroactively by embracing what other people made of it? Wouldn't that be a sign to other folks that "anything goes"? It would certainly set a precedent which could hurt Maddox Games forever.

[LEXX]

Bearcat::

IMO the issue of cheating is now moot... Now in the future things may go south... but fore the most part I have not seen the cheating... Some of the things from AAA are just flat out EXCEDLLENT... like the QMB Plus... and the ability to change default skins... the flyable AI planes... all that stuff is great..

Yes, as I have always predicted at the unmoderated ubi forums (Oleg was ran out) where accusastions of "wanting to cheat online" or "wanting to kill the sim" were allowed and even encouraged to be made against Oleg's customers who asked for legitimate modding. However, there is an ironic side if Oleg hack-mods his own sim as suggested here...

Bear::

I hope that 1C will look at some of the stuff coming from AAA and incorporate what can be incorporated or at the very least give the nod to some of the stuff coming out of there... because it isn't all bad....

In general, it is believed that Oleg does NOT favour the modding through the use of the hacked tools. If Oleg takes into his sim one (1) mod or a derivative of a mod that was originally created by the hacked process, then Oleg personally approves the hack derived modding for me on a moral basis.

Oleg's apparent position against hack-modding process is the "moral" reason why I refuse to use any mods but then I don't play the sim anymore because I would like to mod it up! A central bank chairman may call this an irrational connundrum but it is one that could be resolved if Oleg takes into his sim, and so "approves," even one (1) mod or a derivative of it.

Then I can buy my upgrade, 1C gets a repeat customer, and I can modup some early Easter Front which Oleg abandoned long ago, and some Spanish Civil War. I'd like to see JG52_Tuckie's Spanish Civil War modding team come back to the living FB from TargetWare.

[II./JG1_Wilcke]

Interesting thread; good point LEXX. I too would have continued buying Olegs products. To this day I would still pay $30 or $40 or $50 for a Spanish Civil War Campaign based on the old IL-2 Engine! Or a North Africa Campaign or a Med Campaign. He could still be raking in the money on the old IL-2. I could be wrong?

Look at the MS Flight Sim market any single aircraft addon can cost $25 to $50USD.

Interesting thread! Oh I liked Luthiers post about the IL-2 source code going to 3rd party about a year ago! Was that leased or sold?

[LEXX]

Thanks! Here is Tuckie_JG52's TARGET SPAIN thread at the TargetWare forum. Last poast dates from over one year ago.


Tuckie (July 2003)::

Well, as you know in this forum, the Spanish Civil War Project has been moving into TargetWare.
~> http://www.targetware.net/modules.ph...iewtopic&t=196

Tuckie come home



Wow, I think Thor and I say the same thing, kinda. just...wow ... If Oleg does NOT approve of the generalized process of modding through the hacked tools, then I don't think he will add any of those mods to 4.09. But who knows...

[Sunchaser]

Oleg does not need to add any mods to 4.09, they are already being added to the 4.09 beta and in fact some of them require 4.09 to work.

[DuxCorvan]

Originally Posted by LEXX

Bearcat::
Yes, as I have always predicted at the unmoderated ubi forums (Oleg was ran out) where accusastions of "wanting to cheat online" or "wanting to kill the sim" were allowed and even encouraged to be made against Oleg's customers who asked for legitimate modding. However, there is an ironic side if Oleg hack-mods his own sim as suggested here...

Bear::

In general, it is believed that Oleg does NOT favour the modding through the use of the hacked tools. If Oleg takes into his sim one (1) mod or a derivative of a mod that was originally created by the hacked process, then Oleg personally approves the hack derived modding for me on a moral basis.

Oleg's apparent position against hack-modding process is the "moral" reason why I refuse to use any mods but then I don't play the sim anymore because I would like to mod it up! A central bank chairman may call this an irrational connundrum but it is one that could be resolved if Oleg takes into his sim, and so "approves," even one (1) mod or a derivative of it.

Then I can buy my upgrade, 1C gets a repeat customer, and I can modup some early Easter Front which Oleg abandoned long ago, and some Spanish Civil War. I'd like to see JG52_Tuckie's Spanish Civil War modding team come back to the living FB from TargetWare.

My feelings and thoughts, exactly. My only objections to Il-2 mods comes from their unauthorized, clandestine nature.

[skarden]

true suncahser but the big question is not if we CAN do it but if we SHOULD do it and I personly agree with BC on this,it wont happen(although I'd love to be wrong) but i still agree.

Thor i think BC's analogy is much better and more relevent and to be honest and unless you'v NEVER dropped litter,jaywalked or broken the law in ANY way ever i find it a bit hippocritical to keep coming back to the law side of it all.I dont mean offence(really i dont)but i cant think of another way to put it.

and as for fire?well it has caused much destruction(although mankind is still here) but it has also brought warmth,life and security to many the world over.
perspective IS a funny thing.

[SlipBall]

Why in the world should he ever accept any mod's...duh...it would be like
saying it's ok, Oleg accepted, now lets hack bob

[SlipBall]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

IMO the issue of cheating is now moot... Now in the future things may go south... but fore the most part I have not seen the cheating... Some of the things from AAA are just flat out EXCEDLLENT... like the QMB Plus... and the ability to change default skins... the flyable AI planes... all that stuff is great.. and IMO regardless to how the initial process was done... which is an entirely different issue.. credit should be given where it is due... not only to the AAA community admins for doing the job they do to foster an atmosphere where cheating is discouraged on their site.. to some of the flat out great stuff coming from there.

What this reminds me of sometimes is like Prometheus. He stole fire from the gods and gave it ti man.... Now prometheus in the eyes of the gods was wrong and needed to be punished... and he was.... layed out on that rock with the bird eating his liver for all eternity.. Hower the gods with all their power could not take fire back from man... and man could not be faulted one bit for using the tool provided by Prometheus.

I hope that 1C will look at some of the stuff coming from AAA and incorporate what can be incorporated or at the very least give the nod to some of the stuff coming out of there... because it isn't all bad....

With all due respect, I think that you should consider resigning your moderator position over at ubi...condoning hacking is a no no for the staff