Any plans to finally get a re-crypting?

[Storebror]

That's good to know, thank you for your statement mkubani.
Now that there have been users who improved AI for modding communities already, I guess that since you don't want to squeeze them out, there'll be a way to get hands on the DT.dll sources?
After all, otherwise anything being done in DT.dll would be out of reach for mods then, which would mean nothing else but the "e" word, and that's something we just ruled out, didn't we?

Best regards - Mike

[EJGr.Ost_Caspar]

This is in fact not of our concern. The DLL is not encrypted in any way. People in the know will easily access it, if they want to. So do as you please, but don't expect us to help on modding. We have by far enough to do already.

[CWMV]

Originally Posted by SAS~crazyflak;

Ok, gents, please! could we at least let ONE week (actually, preferably more) pass before tearing everything apart? :-\

TD might be generous, but they are still (human) people, and emotions could get touched. Please don't over abuse of what seems a green light from their part.

.....

[Nuke]

Originally Posted by Storebror

Sweet, we're turning in circles.
My offer stays valid: Show me how you cheat with your modded game on a crt=1 or crt=2 server and I'll come back here to tell the world you're right.
No need to go on arguing FC, just show it.

I feel like you are ignoring the fact FC might actually have access to the source code of the game as a TD member...

I do not, but as I understand what CRT protection does is this: when the CRT option is enabled on the server, it will send request(s) to the client (either when joining the server or regularly) to check the 'integrity' of the client game files. This only works if some 'data' files are modified (SFS files holding aircraft and modelling data and logic). The game being hacked means that whatever the server ask, we can lie to it. My client can tell that my files are intact while they are not.

A couple of years back a friend and I were kind of shocked by the news spreading that SFS protection is broken and cheats started to flow online. We wanted to prove it and we created a simple engine hack (with tools found online), which we successfully demonstrated on War Clouds (informed the admin team). The server I believe was running with CRT=1 at the time though.

So I would like to join FC: if you want to believe that CRT=2 can protect you, be my guest...

Nuke

[EAF331 Starfire]

Originally Posted by EJGr.Ost_Caspar

Well... I for myself like to check occationally, how public oppinions have developed over the time... so threads like this one are still interesting to me (if you can read beside the harsh tones).

Ill two cents but you have to sort the meens out yourself since I don't know a what encryption does to the game.

I and my fellow Sqd mates in EAF like to fly Scorched Earth campaign.
(I might be overexplaining this to much. Sorry if I sound condecenting)
This requires us History mod (HSFX), since the database behind the planning website need to 100% combatible with objects in IL-2.

Most of us fly Ultra Packs as well.

We like features that enhances realisme. To most of us the work of Olegs team and Team Daidalos are the soul and groundwork behind all the mods we fly.

We all have the install dance; Some because of their lack of computer skills and some because we have to use non-flying time to keep them flying

I wishes where horses I would wish for a perfect game where the Sim was updated automatically over the internet and mods was simi-automatically installed, just as it was in the FPS "Joint Operations" by Novalogic.

I would wish for a Sim that had a campaign system like Falcon or Enemy Engage. Grapihs like real life. Full size maps. A campaign system like SEOW.


But I guess I will have more luck by wishing for peace on earth

[swiss]

Originally Posted by jermin

Finally, I suggest with a win-win solution for the re-crypting of IL2. Mod community can still mod 4.101 (or 4.11) as they like. But starting from 4.12, IL2 will be encrypted to save the dying online community.

Fact is it's the non-mod servers which are dying, not the mod ones.
If you care more about a clean game than beautiful smoke and hi-res cockpits, then fine, fly offline.
Who gives a sh1t about the cheaters out there? They are in the low one digit percentage. If you get killed it's usually because your gunnery or SA sucked once again - happens.
When I was new to the game I've seen cheaters all around me. Now, over a 1000 hrs later I realized it usually was due to my crappy skills - sometimes it turned out the guy with the incredible FM were actually two different planes.
This is game, not online cash poker.

Originally Posted by Storebror

Sweet, we're turning in circles.
My offer stays valid: Show me how you cheat with your modded game on a crt=1 or crt=2 server and I'll come back here to tell the world you're right.
No need to go on arguing FC, just show it.

Originally Posted by RAW in SoV Forum

and another thing. crt=2 is not a panacea. it can be overcomed too. who knows how to do this - rules anywhere. As for me - i'm awaiting BoB, where all engine will be moved to the server side. this will make any cheating impossibile.

http://www.skiesoffire.org/phpBB3/vi...hp?f=30&t=1698

This guy got busted because he turned a i-16 into an i-180.
Feel free to PM him.

[Storebror]

Originally Posted by EJGr.Ost_Caspar

The DLL is not encrypted in any way. People in the know will easily access it, if they want to.

I hope you ain't trying to fool people. Getting back c++ code from a gcc compiled DLL is literally impossible. What you get back from disassemblers is plain useless. You can "access" that file as much as you can read tea leaves.
For the time being, the functions inside DT.dll are out of reach for modders, they can't modify what's inside. That's exactly the same result like if the same functions would reside encrypted (read: obfuscated) in java code.
In previous versions of IL-2, all the functionality which has now been sealed in that DLL has been available for modifications to modders, now it isn't anymore.
It's a valid question to ask what the intention of this step has been and what it will lead to for future versions. If it ain't about locking out modders, opening the sources would be the logical step which would take about a minute of the precious time of a TD team member.

Originally Posted by Nuke

we created a simple engine hack (with tools found online), which we successfully demonstrated on War Clouds (informed the admin team). The server I believe was running with CRT=1 at the time though.

War Clouds is a crt=0 server and AFAIK has ever been.

Originally Posted by swiss

skiesoffire

crt=0 again. No news that there are individuals who just can't hold back cheating on such kind of servers.

Best regards - Mike

[mkubani]

It's a valid question to ask what the intention of this step has been and what it will lead to for future versions. If it ain't about locking out modders, opening the sources would be the logical step which would take about a minute of the precious time of a TD team member.

Storebror, I will repeat myself: the DLL file is there for our technical implementation of AI and 6DoF. This is the only valid answer to you question. And for opening the sources, you well know our legal limitations. Thank you for accepting and respecting this.

BTW, if you constructive feedback regarding these two features (6DoF and AI), there are debugging threads on this forum - please post your suggestions.

[Nuke]

Originally Posted by Storebror

War Clouds is a crt=0 server and AFAIK has ever been.

It must have been CRT=0 or CRT=1 for a long while now, because they allow both modded and stock games (I believe this was a mistake by the way). I am sure there were times when they experimented with CRT=2, but it was abandoned because it:
1. did not help against cheaters
2. it added some overhead (to the server I guess), and caused problems to some people with legit installs.

I am not sure as I haven't flown online for a long time.

[Storebror]

Originally Posted by mkubani

the DLL file is there for our technical implementation of AI and 6DoF. This is the only valid answer to you question. And for opening the sources, you well know our legal limitations.

I'm repeating myself from elsewhere as well:
This answer is for someone who can't distinguish between donkeys and horses.

Let me raise a comparison and please let me take the liberty to invite you to consider this open minded, so maybe you get a clue of what this step of TD means to the modding community.
There's a house.
The house is your's.
In your house there lives a community of people, some of them call themselves "modders", other's don't carry any particular names but just live in there.
None of those people pays for living in there, they all payed for having access granted once, but now they're living in your house for free.
You like that house, you like the community living in there and you constantly try to repair and renew it. You're a little concerned about the community shrinking considerable lately, but you believe in being able to make the house comfortable enough to keep them in there.

Now once a day you consider to replace the entrance door of your house. Nothing special in itself, but the new door only allows you to enter the house when being naked.

Some of the people living in your house just don't care, others do, and particularly the "modders" ask you about why you replaced the door and whether you could grant them clothed access to the house as well.
Now your answer is "that's our door, we did it like that intentionally, like it or don't.".

It's your house, you're perfectly entitled to do with it whatever you want.
Just as a matter of fact, when you force your guests to enter naked, only nudists will remain as guests in the end and for nudists there's another much nicer house being built around the corner which has just been finished and will be polished to perfection soon.

Got it?

Best regards - Mike