Poll regarding Steam users - Page 25

Revvin · #**241** 03-14-2011, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellfire257

Regarding the Maths, even a 2% loss is massive. Lets say 1C sell 1,000,000 units. Now, factor in the lost sales: what is 2% of 1,000,000? 20,000. 20,000 units at £30 of revenue each is £600,000 lost. So, that is nothing, of course. Would you turn down £600,000 of revenue?

If I was as rude as yourself, I would say you're deluded. However, I will refrain since I respect you.

You assume that everyone who says they will not buy will stick by that and thus is a lost sale never gained when its highly likely having the game on Steam will see it gain some sales, perhaps even replace those who say they will not buy it on Steam.

Even the most ardent boycott groups have broken down once the game is released. I remember the boycott groups for Modern Warfare 2 and Left 4 Dead 2 being full of members who were seen playing the game on Steam days after they released, so much for their resolve.

palker4 · #**242** 03-14-2011, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick

I just wanted to BUY CoD, I was even ready to have to be connected once and ONLY once, to activate the sim upon install, and then use MY game whenever I want WITHOUT having that Steam thingie somewhere in my PC ...

I did BUY IL2 way back in 2001, and then everything published by Oleg ... but I WON'T BUY Cod with that totally USELESS Steam thingie ...

I guess you do not buy new games very often cause if you did you would have steam installed for quite some time

ElAurens · #**243** 03-14-2011, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by palker4

I guess you do not buy new games very often cause if you did you would have steam installed for quite some time

False premise.

I buy new games often, and I don't buy them on Steam.

Have any other baseless arguments you care to try?

Blackdog_kt · #**244** 03-15-2011, 12:59 AM

The following is directed entirely to the people who think that if they repeat something enough times, it will somehow gain more validity. It is by no means meant to insult or aggravate the people who can keep a cool head and be civil in expressing their opinions, regardless of whether they support Steam integration or not.

Ok, this is going around in circles so let's summarize.

1) A few uninformed people post inaccurate stuff about Steam.

2) A few Steam fans get their panties in a twist.

3) Lot's of other people on both sides of the argument who have something valid to say, can't get their point across because they are caught in the above stupid crossfire.

Instead of realizing that your opinion is not shared by everyone, some of you are going around brandishing e-peens the size of the Eiffel tower, ridiculing people with a different opinion and generally taking pleasure on forcing something you like on a bunch of people that will see absolutely no benefit from it, because it somehow makes you feel superior on the internets. You gain a big fat NOTHING, sweet f**k all, from forcing this on others and neither do the developers from having a bunch of unhappy customers and a near 20% drop in sales, but hey, why let common sense interfere with being on a good roll point-scoring on the forums

I'm generally a poster who can exercise some self-moderation and not fly off the leash at other people's necks but some of you guys (you know who you are) are both getting ridiculously zealot-like and making me dislike steam even more by association with your take it or leave it attitudes. In layman's terms you are of no help whatsoever, even in promoting your own opinion and favorite platform. If this was how Steam fans behaved, then i would hope i could turn turn off my buddylist, voice chat and whatever community feature they have implemented right off the bat, so i wouldn't have to talk to them when playing a game to have some fun and relax.

But you see, i happen to realize that not all of Steam's fans are as narrow-minded and petty as that vocal minority of zealots among the generally reasonable majority of Steam's advocates so i will refrain from tarnishing the rest of them with the brush you've chosen for yourself...which is exactly what you lack the common decency to do when you label everyone who is not interested in Steam as backwards grandpas playing sims in their basements while shut out from the rest of the world. Is this enough of a taste of your own medicine, language and manners or would you like me to continue?

And now that i got this off my chest and had the chance to vent some steam (ha! see what i did there?

), let's take a calmer look at what is such an easy concept to understand yet you refuse to do so (yes, refuse, because i sincerely doubt that something so simple is beyond the intellect of the average forum member here).

If you look at what the level headed, non-bashing people who don't want to use Steam have been saying all along, you'll see that

a) they are not really making any judgement about the quality of steam because they have limited personal experience (mostly negative, which is why they don't want to use it), they are just making an assumption that applies on the impact it will have on their personal gaming habits. Their Personal gaming habits, as in not yours.

b) they don't want to have to learn about Steam because

c) clear indication has been provided, coming from official sources to boot, that Steam doesn't bring anything new to the game, so it could very well be optional instead of mandatory

d) taking into account all of the above, they have questioned your motives to support forcing the use of this platform on the rest, when it's clear the game could function without it and sell better if both a steam and a non-steam version were marketed.

To this final point, NONE of you have managed to provide a satisfactory answer. So, I take there's not one then.

Don't go twisting things and telling me i don't want them to make money or how they earn more by selling through Steam, because that's exactly not what we have been saying. Of course, the rabid anti-steam hatred that some other people display makes it all the easier for you to discount our concerns by conveniently lumping us together with them, when it's clear that you have more in common among yourselves, if not in the point you are trying to push then certainly in the way you are going about trying to achieve it: by shouting a lot, orchestrating personal attacks on people who don't share your opinion and doing your damned best to keep opinions polarized and the community divided, instead of providing any semblance of a valid argument that could lead to a compromise that would benefit the greater part of the community and the developers alike. But seriously, who can blame you when you can just focus all your energy on making people accept what you say as truth no matter the cost and forcing everyone to use something that benefits you, in a way that benefits ONLY you

We have no problem at all if it's sold on Steam and you want to buy there, as long as we have a different version. And for the icing on the cake, you can't even order it on Steam yet yourselves and you'll have to also use Solidshield DRM on top of Steam. You are getting shafted too but you're so glad that someone else is also, that you just don't realize it (have a look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schadenfreude).

I'll say it one more time

selling on Steam=good and we agree with it

selling ONLY versions with Steam bundled into them=bad, because apparently it causes 1 in 5 people not to buy the game on release if at all, cutting into the profits and long term expansion plans of the series

I'd say that if some of you still don't get it i can get my 5 year old nephew to bust out the crayons and draw you some pretty pictures, but we already established that a certain few don't get it simply because they don't want to

So, the way it will go from here on out is that those who don't like Steam and yet decide to buy the game will accompany you, voicing their complaints with the added say a legitimate customer has in the matter until it is either bypassed by the community, made optional by an official patch, or a commitment is made to have it as an option and not as a requirement for the next installment in the series.

It does annoy enough people to resurface later on and they will campaign for an option to turn it off just like any other customer of this title will ask for his favorite feature to be included at some point. I hope you like hearing about it gentlemen because it's not going away. Have a nice day

ElAurens · #**245** 03-15-2011, 01:18 AM

Blackdog, if you don't work for the diplomatic service of your government, you should.

Great post.

JG301_HaJa · #**246** 03-15-2011, 04:46 AM

+1 on that fact.
Very well spoken Blackdog.

Mick · #**247** 03-15-2011, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by palker4

I guess you do not buy new games very often cause if you did you would have steam installed for quite some time

... you guess right, IL2/FB is the ONLY game that I have, simply because I am only interested in warbirds games and IL2/FB is the very best of them all (which doesn't mean it is perfect...)

As for CoD I would like to simply BUY it, I mean the game not any other piece of software that is TOTALLY USELESS to play the game and has NOTHING TO DO with it in the first place ...

If this is possible then I'll BUY it, and it will become MINE, and I'll use it WITHOUT Steam authorization or whatever, otherwise it will remain on the shelves, and I will go on flying FB, I have enough campaigns to play it for years ...

I do NOT NEED Steam, it's as simple as that ... and I am ready to PAY a little bit more for a SteamLESS version of the DVD ...

Revvin · #**248** 03-15-2011, 04:22 PM

I've not really seen any good reason not to have Steam. Those against it will cite problems they had years ago with the service or some mysterious unnamed friend who installed Steam which then took over their PC and turned it into a devil worshipping silicon monster that ate their hamster.

Steam has evolved, its improved as most systems do. As someone who has used it since it first came into being because you had to install it for Half-Life 2 I've seen the many changes. It has been sometimes a little annoying. I recall buying a game a few years ago on CD that required Steam but instead of installing from disc it downloaded the whole game from the Steam server - not much fun waiting. Its improved though, recent games including one I installed today - Total War: Shogun 2 installed from the disc into Steam and it was flawless.

PC's are complicated things and you could try to devise the most foolproof system in history but you will never engineer out the rank stupidity of some portions of the human race. People have issues with Windows year on year with each new version and yet here we are still using it. You could argue its forced on us. Some people will have problems just installing IL-2:CoD in the first place but that’s not to say its a bad product. Steam gets some bad press for decisions made by the publishers and developers themselves. I recall someone making a point about ARMA II (may have been another game) having to download huge patches and not incremental ones yet most games on Steam do download small incremental patches, Steam distributes whatever the publishers or developers give to them to distribute so to me that an unfair criticism.

From the naysayers I see lots of angry bold type and caps-lock rants about having the right to this, that and the other. Read most EULA's and you'll see you only own the media the software is presented on with a non exclusive license for the software that may be revoked at any time. Steam does not ban or removed access to the system for no good reason. If it did it would not have the support of the biggest publishers in the gaming business and certainly would not have grown into the main digital distribution network it is with millions upon millions of satisfied customers.

People assume that the posters here saying they will not buy the game is already money lost to 1C. They will try to demonstrate this with maths based on figures pulled out of thin air. The reality is that Steam will draw new customers in too, perhaps even replacing the naysayers and more. Again some assume that those who say they won't buy will stick to that though even the most ardent boycotts have broken down with groups against Call of Duty and Left 4 Dead 2 saw many of its members playing those games on or after the day of release.

The benefit is quite clear. An online community under one roof. A system where you don't need to rely on support and updates to a a number of third party clients like Hyperlobby or XFire for example. Groups are already forming in the Steam community groups section to support this new game and I can see where people are playing if I want to join them. If I want privacy I simply sign out of the friends system or choose not to have it log me in when I start up Steam.

There is far too much name calling, people trotting out the tired old fanboy insult or suggesting those who like using Steam and are trying to put forward their happy experience with the system as being 'shills' and somehow being invested in the Steam service. Insults like that and calling Steam a virus really don't help give a balanced view.

zauii · #**249** 03-15-2011, 04:31 PM

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