Spitfire why so popular??

[Robotic Pope]

The MkVIII Spitfire was a better plane than the MkIX and is supposed to be the nicest all round spitfire to fly.

The MkIX was afterall only ment to be a short term fill-in until the MkVIII was ready for production and only had a slightly strengthend MkV airframe which wasn't really strong enough for the extra power of the Merlin with the 2 stage supercharger.

[Soviet Ace]

Actually, the Mk IX replaced it and played more of a major roll in Europe for british pilots, than the Mk VIII. and the Mk IX was a much more successful plane than the Mk VIII which was actually more of a foreshadow plane, as the Mk IX was more enjoyed and thought of as better than the Mk VIII. But most of the Mk VIII's were issued in the Pacific, and fought against the Japanese in Australia and Burma etc. And also, the only Spitfire to outclass the Mk IX was the Mk XIV, because of its engine and handling etc.

[redtiger02]

The hurricane wasn't great. It was adequate and above all it was cheap. The Spitfire was fast and highly-maneuverable, but it suffered from a very limited range. Now as for Operation Torch and the entire North African campaign, the hurricane was generally sent to attack convoys and was only marginally effective against tanks. The primary air-to-ground fighter in North Africa was the Curtis P-40. The Hurricane was indeed very nimble due to a fabric construction, but that also killed it. It took the Germans less than a week during the Battle of Britain to figure out that just a couple of incindiary rounds would turn it into a flying piece of bacon. The British approached North American in an effort to get them to open a new factory to create more P-40s to replace the severely outdated Hurricane. Instead, North American promised an entirely new design and delivered the first P-51 Mustang prototype in 121 days, fitted with the same Allison engine that powered the P-40. Mustangs being the dominant plane in the European theater aside, the Spitfire was still used to tremendous effect and proved to be a highly versatile airframe, seeing service well into the 1950s.
As for night intruders: early in the war, while the Mosquito was still in development, a small number of Hurricanes were sent out to test new techniques for night-fighting. However, they weren't very successful and were eaten alive at the hands of Luftwaffe pilots who had been perfecting night-fighting tactics for years. The Mosquito was by far the most versatile airframe produced during the war. It had far greater capacity than the Hurricane, flew faster, flew longer, killed more Germans. It was in effect the first stealth fighter, since early radar couldn't detect the limited amounts of metal incorporated into the airframe. Point being, the Hurricane is great as an icon, but even he RAF will tell you it was severely outdated at the very start of the war. It was just available in quantity and it was cheap and easy to produce. The Spitfire and Mosquito will always outclass it in every area except turning radius. But, exactly how much good does it do you to be able to out-turn everyone when a single incindiary round can torch you on a regular basis? You will only be so lucky so many times.

[David603]

Originally Posted by redtiger02

The hurricane wasn't great. It was adequate and above all it was cheap.

Replace cheap with available and you are correct.

The Spitfire was fast and highly-maneuverable, but it suffered from a very limited range.

A combat radius of 410 miles (Spitfire MkV) is perfectly adequate for an interceptor, the P51D can only double that even with drop tanks.

Point being, the Hurricane is great as an icon, but even the RAF will tell you it was severely outdated at the very start of the war. It was just available in quantity and it was cheap and easy to produce.

Outdated at the start of the war!? So in 1939, which of the Bf109E1, P36 Hawk, Fiat G.50, A5M, Ki27, and I-16 were superior to the Hurricane?

But, exactly how much good does it do you to be able to out-turn everyone when a single incindiary round can torch you on a regular basis? You will only be so lucky so many times.

Only the Hurricanes rear fuselage was covered with canvas, and Hurricanes proved rather more durable than either the Spitfire or Bf109.

[FOZ_1983]

Originally Posted by redtiger02

The hurricane wasn't great. It was adequate and above all it was cheap. The Spitfire was fast and highly-maneuverable, but it suffered from a very limited range. Now as for Operation Torch and the entire North African campaign, the hurricane was generally sent to attack convoys and was only marginally effective against tanks. The primary air-to-ground fighter in North Africa was the Curtis P-40. The Hurricane was indeed very nimble due to a fabric construction, but that also killed it. It took the Germans less than a week during the Battle of Britain to figure out that just a couple of incindiary rounds would turn it into a flying piece of bacon. The British approached North American in an effort to get them to open a new factory to create more P-40s to replace the severely outdated Hurricane. Instead, North American promised an entirely new design and delivered the first P-51 Mustang prototype in 121 days, fitted with the same Allison engine that powered the P-40. Mustangs being the dominant plane in the European theater aside, the Spitfire was still used to tremendous effect and proved to be a highly versatile airframe, seeing service well into the 1950s.
As for night intruders: early in the war, while the Mosquito was still in development, a small number of Hurricanes were sent out to test new techniques for night-fighting. However, they weren't very successful and were eaten alive at the hands of Luftwaffe pilots who had been perfecting night-fighting tactics for years. The Mosquito was by far the most versatile airframe produced during the war. It had far greater capacity than the Hurricane, flew faster, flew longer, killed more Germans. It was in effect the first stealth fighter, since early radar couldn't detect the limited amounts of metal incorporated into the airframe. Point being, the Hurricane is great as an icon, but even he RAF will tell you it was severely outdated at the very start of the war. It was just available in quantity and it was cheap and easy to produce. The Spitfire and Mosquito will always outclass it in every area except turning radius. But, exactly how much good does it do you to be able to out-turn everyone when a single incindiary round can torch you on a regular basis? You will only be so lucky so many times.

If it wasnt great then they would of ceased production. It carried on until wars end, why? because it was a useful aircraft to have.

Operation torch, i guess you never met the hurricane MkII armed with four 20MM cannons and 500lb bomb? the hurri bomber as they were known, did a excellent job. During and following the five-day El Alamein artillery barrage that commenced on the night of 23 October 1942, six squadrons of Hurricanes claimed to have destroyed 39 tanks, 212 lorries and armoured troop-carriers, 26 bowsers, 42 guns, 200 various other vehicles and four small fuel and ammunition dumps, flying 842 sorties with the loss of 11 pilots. Whilst performing in a ground support role, Hurricanes based at RAF Castel Benito, Tripoli, knocked out six tanks, 13 armoured vehicles, ten lorries, five half-tracks, a gun and trailer, and a wireless van on 10 March 1943, with no losses to themselves.

only the rear fuselage was mostly fabric, you mention the down side but what about the good points? the armour plating behind the pilot to protect him?

Hurricane night intruder missions were extremly successful!! ever heard of Karel Kuttelwascher?? a czech pilot who flew night intruder missions in the hurricane over france.

Could the de havilland mosquito land and take off from a carrier? nope (though a model was designed for this but never mass produced due to wars end i believe). The mossie was superb, and was even a great dogfighter, but the hurricane was far more versatile, helped of course by its thick sturdy wings.


out dated at the start of the war?? hardly. It was obsolete as a fighter by 1941 but not out dated at all.

[PF_Lizard]

Originally Posted by skullblits

Spitfire why so popular??

Cos Hurricanes is sh*t innit!

[haitch40]

Originally Posted by PF_Lizard

Cos Hurricanes is sh*t innit!

some1 should sticky that thread

[Robotic Pope]

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

Actually, the Mk IX replaced it and played more of a major roll in Europe for british pilots, than the Mk VIII. and the Mk IX was a much more successful plane than the Mk VIII which was actually more of a foreshadow plane, as the Mk IX was more enjoyed and thought of as better than the Mk VIII. But most of the Mk VIII's were issued in the Pacific, and fought against the Japanese in Australia and Burma etc. And also, the only Spitfire to outclass the Mk IX was the Mk XIV, because of its engine and handling etc.

Sorry but thats just not true.

The mk IX was produced well before the VII and VIII as a stop gap. The VII was ment to replace the IX in high altitude interception with it's presurised cabin, and the mkVIII was to replace the mkIX as a dogfighter. Both the VII and VIII took alot longer to bring into production than was expected because of the amount of redesign needed both to the airframe and to the production tools of the factory. By the time the VIII was ready for production the airwar over europe was more or less already won and most of the mkIX's were being used as fighter bombers at that time. THAT is why all the VIII's went out to the middle east, far east and pacific.

The Spitfire mkVIII is the definative Merlin engined Spitfire, fully able to handle the extra power granted by the 2 stage supercharger.

The Spitfire mkIX is basically a mkV with a much more powerful engine. Its like a car that has had its engine modified for extra power but the brakes and suspension have been left as standard. Yes it will be fast, but it wont handle as well as a car that was designed to manage that amount of power.

[Soviet Ace]

Originally Posted by Robotic Pope

Sorry but thats just not true.

The mk IX was produced well before the VII and VIII as a stop gap. The VII was ment to replace the IX in high altitude interception with it's presurised cabin, and the mkVIII was to replace the mkIX as a dogfighter. Both the VII and VIII took alot longer to bring into production than was expected because of the amount of redesign needed both to the airframe and to the production tools of the factory. By the time the VIII was ready for production the airwar over europe was more or less already won and most of the mkIX's were being used as fighter bombers at that time. THAT is why all the VIII's went out to the middle east, far east and pacific.

The Spitfire mkVIII is the definative Merlin engined Spitfire, fully able to handle the extra power granted by the 2 stage supercharger.

The Spitfire mkIX is basically a mkV with a much more powerful engine. Its like a car that has had its engine modified for extra power but the brakes and suspension have been left as standard. Yes it will be fast, but it wont handle as well as a car that was designed to manage that amount of power.

I believe the MkIX Spitfire had the same Merlin as in the P-51D, and yes, the MkIX is basically the MkV, but with an improved engine and armament (If it was attached with the "E" wing). But the thing is, the MkIX was meant not just as a high altitude fighter, like the MkVII which was designed for high altitude combat, the MkIX was just a version of what the Mk XIV would become (substituted with a Griffon Engine). The Mk VIII was a good gun platform, but it did suffer some problems, where in the MkIX, the only problem was the "E" wing which put vibrations in the controls. If the MkIX was equipped with a "C" wing, then there were no problems with the gun mounting, and the plane proved very effective against the Luftwaffe. And also, out of hall the varient Mk Spitfires, the MkIX was the most mass produced Spitfire, which later proved itself flying with other nations in the late 40s-50s.

[FOZ_1983]

Wasnt the IX rushed into production to counter the threat of the FW190?

just a stroke of luck and pure genius that the IX turned out to be an extrordinary spitfire, making it an all round excellent bird. The best of the "war spits"