BOB era "instrument" approaches

[jcenzano]

I just finished reading the book "Gun button to fire" written by one of the surviving members of RAF 249 sqn and, knowing quite well modern RL combat aviation, I was intrigued by how they did things back then.

One of my many questions arose when I repeatedly read how they where flying in very bad weather and landing back under such crappy conditions. But the author gives no deatils about how they did it.

I am quite illiterate when it comes to WWII aviation procedures and I was wondering if someone could point me out in the good direction to learn how they did this approaches in bad weather back then, so i can reproduce myself these procedures later on.

Appreciate your help.

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

Hi,in the Hurricane pilots manual for the MK1,Merlin II engine(what we have in COD)it states under the following for 'Approach' and sub sectioned under 'Flying in poor visibility':

'When necessary to fly at low altitude it is advisable to open the cockpit hood and lower flaps fully.In this condition a speed of 80-90 m.p.h.,A.S.I,reading may be maintained with engine r.p.m,of 1,700-1,800 without vibration and with good control.In addition ,some pilots prefer to lower the undercarriage'.

Hope this helps,just about to read that book too.My user name is Plt Off JRB Meaker he was with 249 Squadron so I am interested to see if he is mentioned in it.

On the 27/9/1940 after being hit by the crossfire from a Ju88 he bailed out only to hit his tail on doing so and died of his injuries,my username is a small tribute to guys like this.

[furbs]

One quite scary way ive read about for single plane approaches was to have a person standing on the threshold and wait until the aircraft was just above judging by the sound and tell the pilot to pancake by radio!
Not something i would like to try!

Sorry doesn't help you i know but interesting all the same i think.

[jcenzano]

Originally Posted by Plt Off JRB Meaker

Hi,in the Hurricane pilots manual for the MK1,Merlin II engine(what we have in COD)it states under the following for 'Approach' and sub sectioned under 'Flying in poor visibility':

'When necessary to fly at low altitude it is advisable to open the cockpit hood and lower flaps fully.In this condition a speed of 80-90 m.p.h.,A.S.I,reading may be maintained with engine r.p.m,of 1,700-1,800 without vibration and with good control.In addition ,some pilots prefer to lower the undercarriage'.

Hope this helps,just about to read that book too.My user name is Plt Off JRB Meaker he was with 249 Squadron so I am interested to see if he is mentioned in it.

On the 27/9/1940 after being hit by the crossfire from a Ju88 he bailed out only to hit his tail on doing so and died of his injuries,my username is a small tribute to guys like this.

Thanks for the reply.

I know you will enjoy the book.

I am specially interested on how they found the runway to land. Did they descent without any navaid until they could id a landmark??

If so, until what altitude did they descent in fog?? Did they have any external navaid back then? Did they fly just visual (navigationwise)?


Where can I found the Hurricane's flight manual??? Is it copiright free?

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

Originally Posted by jcenzano

I know you will enjoy the book.

Thanks for the reply. Where can I found the Hurricane's flight manual??? Is it copiright free?

Hi,sorry I can't give you more info,that's all I could find relevant to what your asking,they,I pressume must have got to their airfield using a compass bearing and nearing the airfield made a visual,I don't really know,sorry.What is for sure there was'nt any autopilot installed on the aircraft to assist.

Not sure about the copyright,but the MK1 Merlin II pilot notes are very rare,if you look on Ebay they're mostly all Mk2's which is a different beast altogether I think,so beware what you buy.

A few days ago some clown on Ebay was selling this MK1 version of pilot notes for £120,so they go for ridicoulous money.

Not sure if the MK2 pilot notes procedures are any different as I have never looked,but maybe some boffin on here will let us know.

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

Just found this,but you'll have to register I think to get it,if it's still available,but this is the one.See sixth reply.

http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/oth...nual-5066.html

[GraveyardJimmy]

Originally Posted by jcenzano

Thanks for the reply.

I know you will enjoy the book.

I am specially interested on how they found the runway to land. Did they descent without any navaid until they could id a landmark??

This was definitely a problem. I can't remember which book it was offhand, but there is a story of someone who simply couldn't match up the runway lights and his heading, not realising he was repeatedly coming in off line or across the runway and decided to fly off and try again.

It was only when he finally managed to land (running on empty or fumes) he managed to piece together his relation to the airfield he had been circling from what people told him on the ground.


I have also read that Q-sites ("An electrically lit dummy airstation for nighttime deception.") that used lights and flare paths not only confused German airmen, but also British flyers who weren't sure of their position. Apparently there were 100 of these so a lost pilot stumbling across one might momentarily not realise it was a fake.

[ATAG_Dutch]

Interesting topic.

Geoff Wellum in 'First Light' describes a particularly nasty sortie in bad weather in the 'Convoy Pair' chapter.

His r/t was also unserviceable, so no help from ground control in terms of vectors to base etc.

He got back safely owing to good knowledge of the local geography, coastline and landmarks, good navigation in almost blind flying conditions, and probably a good deal of luck.

[Artist]

Forsyth, Frederick. The Shepherd. 1976 (see wikipedia) comes to my mind. It (fictionally) describes how one plane (a Mosquito) guides another (a Vampire jetplane with complete electricity failure) through the fog down onto the runway. It's an "Xmas fiction" shortstory - but seems to claim at least some foundation in reality (Forsyth is a former RAF pilot).

[Damixu]

It's only my real life pilot guess but dead reckoning was the only way of apporaching back then. Unfortunately they didn't have any ILS nor anything close proximity fine grade radars/radio locators back then what we have now...