Vulcan to the Skies

[Sternjaeger II]

Originally Posted by cheesehawk

Same thing restoring a 109, or a Do-17 (or a 1931 car) would be. Having something old, and keeping it around.

No, it's not, not when it runs as such prohibitive costs. Unfortunately there's nothing glorious about the Vulcan, obviously it strikes the British aviation enthusiasts imaginary collective, but as Swiss said I'd rather have a Concorde than a nuclear bomber that only dropped some bombs on the Falklands..

[robtek]

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

No, it's not, not when it runs as such prohibitive costs. Unfortunately there's nothing glorious about the Vulcan, obviously it strikes the British aviation enthusiasts imaginary collective, but as Swiss said I'd rather have a Concorde than a nuclear bomber that only dropped some bombs on the Falklands..

As you aren't paying for it, what is your interest here, beside trying to ruin other peoples fun?

[Sternjaeger II]

Originally Posted by robtek

As you aren't paying for it, what is your interest here, beside trying to ruin other peoples fun?

1) I'm tired of people begging for it (or making profit off it for the matter). Every given airshow I have attended this year there were the vulcan to the sky trust folks begging for pennies. You can't secure a good sponsor after 4 years of operations? Give up.

2) With so many planes that need care and attention out there, the Vulcan was the last thing to be worried about and keep airborne. It doesn't represent anything important, or better, it represents a questionable time in history.

Someone somewhere really wanted to fly this plane, and they set up all this charity malarkey to bring the plane back to the sky, but alas, the guy behind this thing had little or no understanding of the ginormous costs behind such a venture..

[Sternjaeger II]

Originally Posted by cheesehawk

But how they ask for money, and their desire to restore something lost are two different things. Even though they go hand in hand, the desire to bring something old back to life, and preserve it IMO is a good thing, regardless of what it is. Even though somethings might be mundane (say you're trying to restore a Roman village to preserve it for history), there's still a story to be told there. Don't confuse the money side of it with the actual project. You might not see anything heroic about the Vulcan, yet it was still a part of a history that will be lost to generations eventually. I've helped my dad restore countless old cars throughout the years, some were classics, some would make you scratch your head and say "Why THAT car?", but I found that even the crappiest car had a history that I learned to appreciate when restoring it. One I wouldn't have known otherwise, and learning about it, I shared it with freinds and people who were interested. (For example, ask most Americans about Austin Healeys, or original Austin-Minis, or Lancia Stratos and they know nothing, it wasn't an American car, or a famous brand/type, yet I learned how they worked and why they made their own niche working on some my Dad found.)

that's all very true, and I do my fair bit of car restoration too, but you're not going out asking for millions of pounds to restore it though, are you? It's a balance between costs and importance, and the Vulcan is not that important, period.

[bongodriver]

Whats the difference if people pay the money willingly?

[bongodriver]

there's enough material and info to make an airworthy one, especially with that kind of money. With 4 million quid you'd build back a whole Stirling and the maintenance costs would be a tenth (if not less!) of the Vulcan one.

Like I said....if it offends you that the Stirling is under represented then start your own charity to build a whole one.....you know.....just like a certain group of Vulcan enthusiasts.

still need to meet a pilot who didn't think his ride was the best in the world

I guess you need to meet more pilots......I have met plenty that hated some of the aircraft they flew

and for a good reason I think, there's nothing glorious about those years.

Who says it's all about glory, it mostly represents a time when the UK had the capability....you know.....like the same reason we have the HMS Victory, if it is in bad taste to represent something that has a shady past then I'd suggest taking a disk cutter to every Luftwaffe machine in existense.......non?

I haven't said I don't like it, I think it's not necessary for it to fly if every season we have the same pathetic plea for money going on..

every aircraft flying in the world is being kept aloft by money........what option do they have?

Taurine manure, you still need to plan for something like this in a sound way, it's not like your garage restoration of a Morris 8. They hired staff to do this job, it became a full time employment for people.

You obviously know little about the whole thing.. the "mysterious" donation of large chunks of money are a good way of avoiding taxes... do I really have to explain this?!

You mean like the £25,000 donation that your own linked Stirling restoration mentions? I clearly have a better grasp of things than you credit me

I doubt it. I personally flew on the Lufthansa Ju52 in two occasions, they treat it like a plane of their fleet.

Interesting......it was a very different story for the Air Atlantique DC 3's and 6's, but I guess it's because they are not German, and just for your info I used to work for Air Atlantique.

That's nonsense, I'm talking about keeping things feasible and not wasting so much money for the revenue and entertainment of a few folks. To them it's not a hobby, it's a business.

Bovine excrement......it's all a hobby, the entertainment is for the airshow public in the UK (who are the ones paying the money you resent).....Vulcan plc.....please!!!

As long as tax money isn't being used, why would anyone care what they're doing? They could be collecting money to build a Millennium Falcon for all I care.

[Sternjaeger II]

Originally Posted by bongodriver

Like I said....if it offends you that the Stirling is under represented then start your own charity to build a whole one.....you know.....just like a certain group of Vulcan enthusiasts.

it was just an example man.

I guess you need to meet more pilots......I have met plenty that hated some of the aircraft they flew

you know exactly what I meant. It's not like you love all the planes you fly with, but if your career highlight was with that batwing of a plane, of course you're gonna have fond memories of it. I have to admit I found its cabin a bit claustrophobic, but then again that's me..

Who says it's all about glory, it mostly represents a time when the UK had the capability....you know.....like the same reason we have the HMS Victory, if it is in bad taste to represent something that has a shady past then I'd suggest taking a disk cutter to every Luftwaffe machine in existense.......non?

Yeah, there's always this dusting off of the past glories, it recollects with what we were saying some time ago with Bewolf: you cling onto the past and can't let go. The Vulcan is a minor chapter of history, do we really need to pump 4 and a half million pounds in it, then ask for more? It's not like it's gonna get cheaper to run in the future, can you really justify such an expense to keep that thing airworthy?

every aircraft flying in the world is being kept aloft by money........what option do they have?

that is a lot of money to keep one aircraft airborne.

You mean like the £25,000 donation that your own linked Stirling restoration mentions? I clearly have a better grasp of things than you credit me

Oh yeah, I'm sure it compares well with the millions that went into the Vulcan

Interesting......it was a very different story for the Air Atlantique DC 3's and 6's, but I guess it's because they are not German, and just for your info I used to work for Air Atlantique.

Well, as you know the Germans know how to do things properly, it's only wars they can't quite get their heads around

Bovine excrement......it's all a hobby, the entertainment is for the airshow public in the UK (who are the ones paying the money you resent).....Vulcan plc.....please!!!

nope, it's a job. Check out their website, the amount of sponsors, the online shopping links, and they still beg for money.. it's like trying to patch up the Titanic breech with a plaster..

[Sternjaeger II]

Look, never mind, you just see the glamorous side of it, I unfortunately saw the not so fancy murky side, and I'm not enthused about it, simple as that.

[bongodriver]

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

Look, never mind, you just see the glamorous side of it, I unfortunately saw the not so fancy murky side, and I'm not enthused about it, simple as that.

Yeah....of course you did.......what an ex Vulcan pilot stole your girlfriend?.....you were standing in the middle of Port Stanleys runway in 82?......some of the restoration crew mugged you and emptied your wallet?