Sure hope Oleg gets with the program

[nearmiss]

Avimimus

It is good that we (the real people of our different countries) can talk and know that the people is not the problem. It is the greedy people that are power and money hungry that keep everything at odds. They manipulate media and politics to satisfy their special interests, and there is no regard or respect for "the people" on either side of the situation.

The internet is a good thing, because we can know our friends (the people) in Russia, Greece, etc., are not about hating and being suspicious of each other.

As an American I hate it that people in other countries speak against my country. America is a rich country, but there are other rich countries as well. America gives more financial and charitable aid to troubled nations than all the rest of the world's countries combined. That should speak to people about putting our money where our mouth is. Yet, we are constantly maligned and no one speaks of the facts... what their own country doesn't do.

If America didn't do the charitable things we do... who would do it, Japan, Germany, China, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Dubai, Taiwan, etc.? No one would do it, all they do is change the subject and give a pittance (inadequate help) to meet the need. So, they let America do it and then rag on us for whatever reason they can conjure up to get away for putting up (making an effort to really do something).

Also, to clarify... Please note I said,"Radial Islam" not Islam. There is a difference.

[FA_Retro-Burn]

It doesn't matter what we all think. The political leaders will play the queen's gambit and we all pay. It is amazing to me that in the Sim arena, that we all have a darn good time on-line with people from all different backgrounds and not really let that bigotry slip through. At least in this world, we try to do the right thing no matter what flag we may be under.

[Baghr]

I have read the messages here and all have merit and a good point.

I am an American and have respect for all those that give it back or whom diserve it. I too am a Veteran having served 15 years in the United States Army. During this time I completed one tour in Iraq, getting into Baghdad the day the statue of Saddam was pulled down. More on this later. To reflect back, I spent a large amount of my youth preparing for a war against a foe I had never met for the good of our country, while never thinking twice about what I was doing, and I was proud to do so. During those years I traveled to different countries for different reason and have found interesting comparisons and people in all.

I feel there is nothing more honorable than a person willing to give his life and serve for the good of his country, regardless of the country. I will also say that freedom and peace is cherished by a soldier regardless of country. No person cherishes peace as does a soldier.

I do not find it amazing, but rather typical that people from different countries can get along regardless of their political bearing or place of birth, if the persons involved have the capacity to respect one another other on at least a human level. I have been truly humbled by others that have so little, but so much at the same time.

I went to Iraq ready to oust the leader and right his wrongs, a truly idealist mindset from a person that did not have one idea about the middle east culture he was stepping into. As in all countries, I met the good and was subjected to the bad, and still felt compassion for the general person in Iraq. I truly felt honored to meet what I considered heros; those who understood what they had to lose by working with the Americans while they attempted to rebuild their country in the way they could. I was also a student of many there, understanding that my idea of freedom was not the same as theirs.

I met a proud and respectful people, but also a population that had known war and its terrors for many years, and knew what it took to survive. People that had been filed with empty promises before, and knew what could be lost by posting an aleagance without forthought of its consequences. I met honest people and was kissed on the cheek and thanked for ridding sadam and his people, then heckled and hated for the same within the hour. But one thing I learned was people can generally get along if placed one on one in a room with an open mind. I find it funny that politicians cannot do this simple task that the lowest level person can seem to be able to do. How bold of me to think I can go into a country and change their way of thinking to my values, and think this is for thier good. To me that is not what freedom is about, but the opposite. I have no greator respect and appreciation than for the people of my great country and what it was built on, but at the same time I am disgusted on some of the perversions I have to be subjected to under the name of freedom to express themselves. I could go on regarding this point but I will choose not to.

The United States has not had a great track record as stated in following through with its intentions, which is as much to blame on the public as it is on the politicians involved. I think it is unreasonable to make blanket statements regarding a population, never the less a countries veiw or stand on something, as there are too many variables. There has always been sabre rattling between the countries, and the cold war was fought and won through economics rather than bullets shot. I am not a smart enough man and certaintly do not have enough information to make an informed decision on whether America should have gotten involved in Iraq, nor do I have a solution on how it should be ended. I hate to see anyone die before their time, but would gladly lay my live down in the name of freedom and for my country that I cherish. Do not ask me how to explain this as I cannot. I would truly hate to see another setback in communications involving the people of Russia and the United States.

One thing I believe in is that good people die during a war, and to educate yourself in anothers culture will make you a richer person in the long run, while breaking down the barriers of ignorance. I do not wish harm to my brothers and sisters living in other countries, as we are all humans and many times even share the same interests, as seen at this website and many others like in on the web. I can totally understand the aprehension of the Europeans regarding the missiles in Poland, and I remember a Cuban incident that was not tolerated by American when the tables were turned the other way. How can I expect one to live or follow a different standard that I do?

As stated, I too have learned much about the Russia's involvment in the second world war through my interest in this sim, which is much more than that, but is truly a gateway for international relationships and understanding. I just hope I am able to teach my children of some of these valuable lessons of toleration.

Baghr

[Chivas]

Nice post Baghr

I believe people are the same no matter where they live. There is good and bad in all of us but we understand what is right by treating others as you would hope they treat you. Our main endevor is to put shelter over our heads and feed our families. We come together in groups usually for a common purpose, but sometimes leaders of these groups subvert that purpose to fit their own agendas. The group can subvert the individuals natural instinct to do right.

[Blackdog_kt]

Baghr, that's an amazing post. I always hoped that people are not all the same and we can't confine them to simple stereotypes, thank you for reaffirming my beliefs in the positive side of human nature. I think there's no greater strength of character than conceding the benefit of doubt to a person with an opposing viewpoint, trying to see both sides of the coin so to speak (or all sides of the rubic's cube in the case of politics )

People go to wars and come back all sorts of different than before they went there. Some will come back as weak and ravaged men, others will become cold blooded killers and some will be turned into mere animals, functioning only on the instinct of survival. It's good to know that some people actually come back wiser for all the difficulties they've had to go through.

[Baghr]

Thank you for the kind words. I feel there are many more that feel the way I do than what you would believe.

I have remembered all my life my words that were once said by a very wise man (my Father)

"If you close your mouth and open you ears its amazing what can be heard if you try."

I have lived by this during most of my life and it so far has worked pretty well.


edited cus it didnt make sense-I must be tired.....

[Triad773]

Many like Pushkin; I myself like Dostoevsky.

I knew last week from growing up from Cold War generation shooting down American Satellite was nothing but old dog with new tricks. Well perhaps I show my age, as well as skepticism.

Here's hoping it all works out to everyone's satisfaction. The tables have turned after a fashion: before the US had all the money for weapons dev.- now, with Russia's oil and natural gas wealth (as well as China's cash influx from displaced work,) the situation is now reversed.

What brought down the Iron Curtain but lack of current resources? Who really knows what the future holds?

I'd just be happy to have a 4.09 final. Call me a simple man, but it is a means to happiness.

~S~

Triad

[Sir-Loopalot]

I like to see that a game can force people to think about politics.

To all the americans around here: Dont get me wrong, i like the USA and Canada, was there for several times and had nice days there with american friends, BUT:

The problem that i see is that every US citizen thinks that the US as a country are the
"good ones".
There are no "good countries" in the big game.( OK maybe Switzerland
Look at the "Weapon of Mass Destruction" thing with Irak.Ok, Saddam was an Asshole and the world has one Dictator less today, but The USA started a war based on a Lie.( BTW, the USA is the only country that used Nukes on civilians, TWICE!)
Look at the Vietnam War, where US Bombers dropped more bombs and agent orange on (mostly) civilians than every country dropped during WW2.
Look at the several Dictatorships that were supported by the US, in South America , Arabia and Asia, just to enforce US Interests.
Look at the Democratic Iranian President that was Kicked out of Power and replaced with the "SCHA" by the CIA in the 1950`s ( or 60`s dunno). And after the islamic revolution in Iran, the US Governement enforced both sides, the Iran AND the Irak to start a looooong war that killed hundreds of thousands.
Look at uncountable other occasions where the US of A started conflicts all over the world with the help of its numerous Agencies, just to enforce US economical or political goals.

I have to say it again, i like most of the american people i met since now, but i do not like the US as a global Player.
OK, other countries have done bad things too, ESPECIALY MINE, but there is no other country i know where nearly EVERY citizen thinks that all the wars were fought for good reasons.
I dont like the fact that most of the world hates America nowadays,i liked the world more when i was young and loved America without any doubts, but you will not win other countries hearts by intelligent-bombing the Haters away!
The US fought more wars in the past 100 years than every other country,and now they are the most powerful country in the world. And the most behated. Isnt that something to think about?

[Blackdog_kt]

I think it all boils down to being active as a citizen. You can't correct your country's wrongs on a global scale if you don't work in parallel to correct them on a domestic scale. America is a powerful country built on the honest sweat and toil of its people, but also on the blood of many people including their own. And it happens to a certain degree in every country out there.

Why is the US able to have such a powerful, professional army? Because it's the domestic policies that enforce this on the citizen. If i come from a disadvantaged background, more so for minorities, if i have no insurance, no job, no health care, no means to feed my family and no money to adequately support myself through college what are my options for a good and dependable paycheck? I either go for big money with an uncertainty factor by crossing to the wrong side of the law, or settle for less money but in a heavily regulated environment and enlist in the professional army. Or flip burgers for the rest of my life.

Professional armies are good for a country to have because the personnel accumulates training and experience, but a 100% professional army dilutes the basic idea behind an army. And that is that every man will do his part if the need arises for the defence of certain values and their homes. In the case of the US, a bunch of people will skip going to the army because they can afford a better standard of living and leave it to those with a higher sense of responsibility and those with no better means to pursue a career. In my humble opinion, a mix of drafted conscripts and professionals is best, because it will still accumulate the needed experience among its professional ranks, while still containing enough civilians to doubt and oppose its use as a mercenary tool for some powermongers that sit in an office and talk on the phone while we're out there getting killed. And while they can't do much while they are in the army, they still have something that worries the suits, a voice, a brain and a vote.

[Blackdog_kt]

Sorry if it seems i'm verbally attacking someone's country and/or beliefs, i'm just a bit frustrated lately with the state of things in general. As for the US in particular, i don't doubt one bit their contributions in various fields during the course of human history, but i still have to look out for the less than ideal events and discuss them with people so that something might be done.

The US is a very powerful country, but compared to some of the weaker ones out there it's still an infant historically. That is not meant as an insult, it just is that way, but metaphorically speaking to many of the Europeans it's like a toddler wielding a minigun. That's why you get all that flak, you make mistakes and hopefully learn as you go, but we all live on a single planet and the cost is usually shared between multiple parties against their own volition.

That being said, it's very funny that having studied the English language for 9 years i tend to write in a manner so complicated that i miss the point, while a simpler post like Avala's is all you need to get the message across

Most importantly, it's quite amazing that while this thread has been a bit heated (and i'm guilty of that as well), it hasn't degenerated to petty namecalling and primary school era insults.

I frequent other forums about games too and on most of them political discussion is strictly prohibited, because people can't contain themselves. Presenting a different viewpoint somehow equals a personal insult for some people. So, i am very glad to see that through our fascination with war history, studying why and how things went wrong in the past, we have all learned to disagree and still have a discussion for discussion's sake and not for the purpose of convincing each other at any cost