Reviewing Luthier's roadmap

[addman]

Originally Posted by Bobb4

When an obvious fanboi, and believe me I was one stops playing a game they have spent years dreaming about playing, that is constructive critisim at it's best.
I fly IL2 everyday, if I am not flying IL2 I am flying RoF. I am not flying Clod and have not flown it since two days after installing the last patch.
If I as an avid flightsimmer feel let down by the lack of sound in multiplayer (and please the morons who say but they are working on it need to ask themselves one simple question, how the hell could such a glaring error have escaped even the poorest of quality control.) For that matter how the hell did this game even get the green light from Ubisoft in the first place?
To say i am bitterly disappointed in the game would be an understatement.
The fact that I come back to the forum every now and again is in the hope that Liuthers road map actually is going somewhere.
You read thread after thread, all complaints, whines and moans and you have to say to yourself, surely someone in the remnants of Maddox Games should be actively engaging the community timelining when things will be fixed.
And honestly when you have to show pictures of your team hard at work, that is a sure sign the community have stopped believing a word you say.

But yes, I will be back next week and Clod remains installed on my computer in the hope that some uber patch will be released that lifts this brilliant shell of a game to where it belongs, as a classic, a living masterpiece.

My original post was an honest statement, nothing else.
When a game developer starts losing people like me, they are in trouble because I live eat and breath flight sims. Trust me I have every copy of IL2 ever released. I have downloaded almost every mod. I have thousands and thousands of hours flight sim flight time and yet in clod I only have 40hrs plus some change.

+1 and great post. I could just copy and paste it and call it my own. I am the IL-2 series. When someone like me starts doubting the development team then that's a sign -FOR ME- that something is wrong.

[ParaB]

Originally Posted by Bobb4

When an obvious fanboi, and believe me I was one stops playing a game they have spent years dreaming about playing, that is constructive critisim at it's best.
I fly IL2 everyday, if I am not flying IL2 I am flying RoF. I am not flying Clod and have not flown it since two days after installing the last patch.
If I as an avid flightsimmer feel let down by the lack of sound in multiplayer (and please the morons who say but they are working on it need to ask themselves one simple question, how the hell could such a glaring error have escaped even the poorest of quality control.) For that matter how the hell did this game even get the green light from Ubisoft in the first place?
To say i am bitterly disappointed in the game would be an understatement.
The fact that I come back to the forum every now and again is in the hope that Liuthers road map actually is going somewhere.
You read thread after thread, all complaints, whines and moans and you have to say to yourself, surely someone in the remnants of Maddox Games should be actively engaging the community timelining when things will be fixed.
And honestly when you have to show pictures of your team hard at work, that is a sure sign the community have stopped believing a word you say.

But yes, I will be back next week and Clod remains installed on my computer in the hope that some uber patch will be released that lifts this brilliant shell of a game to where it belongs, as a classic, a living masterpiece.

My original post was an honest statement, nothing else.
When a game developer starts losing people like me, they are in trouble because I live eat and breath flight sims. Trust me I have every copy of IL2 ever released. I have downloaded almost every mod. I have thousands and thousands of hours flight sim flight time and yet in clod I only have 40hrs plus some change.

Couldn't agree more.

I haven't been that disappointed with a sim since Micropose's "1944: Across the Rhine".


I

[furbs]

Well...this is the last time for a patch before the US release. lets hope enough is fixed.

[addman]

Originally Posted by furbs

Well...this is the last time for a patch before the US release. lets hope enough is fixed.

Agreed let's all hope for the best for the next patch.

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by whatnot

What exactly in postings like:



Helps the game succeed or is constructive? I agree that it's important to share the concerns, bugs and dissapointments in an attempt to influence and inform the dev team. Maybe you should post them even a few times to make sure they're acknowledged by atleast someone.

But lurking around the forums repeating the same mantra over and over again, or as in this case: just hanging around to be able to post that you don't play the game anymore is just sad. What the hell can one achieve with that except to look for revenge of some sort to dry the tears.

But there is no denying that the biggest fail has been communication. Maybe it's a known decision as the percentage in these forums are just a drop in the ocean compared to the masses not worth the effort, maybe it's just inability to do a decent customer service which is not unheard of with dev teams. Whatever it is, it's a fail.

First things first, I didn't post that (I can't tell whether or not you were alluding to an idea that I posted that, and thus supported that sentiment.)
However, I explained that in my posting; it is only when there is a lack of correspondence from the team (or tangible steps to improvement) when constructive criticism breaks down and postings like that appear. In short, it is not constructive; however, it could easily be used in an opinion poll to show the discontent for CloD. Clearly these users want the game to work: they wouldn't be hanging around here if they didn't! But rather than post useless dribble about how much of a fan-boi they are and how much they love the game, they choose to highlight the flaws (mostly large ones) and, in this case, show how such flaws are putting them off even playing the game.
It gives the team nothing useful to work with, other than the incentive that people are not playing the game, and that apathy could very well take hold. I doubt that many would become apathetic (if a monster patch came along that dealt with everything, everyone would be wrapped) however it is naive to believe that criticism wouldn't entail, purely for the fact that most people realise the game could still be bettered, and if it can be bettered, then why not better it?

But yes, I agree completely with your last points. I think that when there is a lack of communication, people expect a patch that will improve everything. Sadly, this is probably not going to be the case (I hope I'm wrong in assuming this).
Being a pessimist is depressing, but it saves for disappointment. Add this post to my ever-growing list of long-winded postings.

[carguy_]

Originally Posted by philip.ed

In short, it is not constructive; however, it could easily be used in an opinion poll to show the discontent for CloD.

In a poll you pick one answer and confirm it, period. The wortless moaning doesn`t serve any purpose here. To say otherwise would be stupid.

Clearly these users want the game to work: they wouldn't be hanging around here if they didn't! But rather than post useless dribble about how much of a fan-boi they are and how much they love the game, they choose to highlight the flaws (mostly large ones) and, in this case, show how such flaws are putting them off even playing the game.

You are right on. Those users DO want the game to work AND NOW. No patience, no taking into account that a flight sim is not an FPS, not thinking about that it is the only WWII new sim out there, no thinking that the team is not 100 men, no thinking that it costs less than a AAA title. In short, no thinking nothing, just demanding a perfect game. And yet even if they want it to work, they are hellbent on shutting it down using the word of mouth. Yes, we want it to work. Bot for the time being let`s flame the hell out of the dev team and shout out loud how we hate them. By George, I haven`t thought of that!
The patient users kept telling you to post constructive stuff and everytime you do, no one has any objections. When people read the same stuff about OLEG WAS LYING ALL ALONG for the 100th time, it is full understandable that you don`t deserve any kind of a polite answer. Highliting the flaws has ended a few weeks ago. If you don`t have anything more constructive to say but moan some more, you are going to be faced with an adequate answer.

It gives the team nothing useful to work with, other than the incentive that people are not playing the game, and that apathy could very well take hold. I doubt that many would become apathetic (if a monster patch came along that dealt with everything, everyone would be wrapped) however it is naive to believe that criticism wouldn't entail, purely for the fact that most people realise the game could still be bettered, and if it can be bettered, then why not better it?

You are wrong once again. Moaning is not criticism. It is moaning.

Being a pessimist is depressing, but it saves for disappointment. Add this post to my ever-growing list of long-winded postings.

Nice. Waiting for more I TOLD YOU OLEG WAS LYING threads.

Originally Posted by furbs

Well...this is the last time for a patch before the US release. lets hope enough is fixed.

Yeah i agree, if the patch to fix MP sound isnt in the American release then its goodbye CLOD.

[philip.ed]

In the opinion poll the answer, then, would fit into this category: 'we are discontented with CloD' (of course, is this opinion poll generated towards the academically minded, or the more simple mind individuals who need questions of less than 7 words? It makes a massive difference)

You miss the point; they want the game to run, but simultaneously they want feedback from the devs on how these issues are coming on. Complain all you want about how the devs shouldn't be held to account for issues like this, but it doesn't change the fact that without communicative support, the criticism will continue. If Luthier wrote a response detailing how they would deal with each issue, then we would know the team's approach and be able to take a step back, loosely-secure in the knowledge that the team were aware of the issues.

Moaning is not criticism. It's a negative response to an unfortunate and unwanted situation. In short, it highlights that change is needed.
But I stand by what I say, if I post a detailed topic about how the RAF flight kit is wrongly modelled in the game (despite the pages of information I sent to Oleg) that would be constructive criticism. There is nothing constructive about you moaning at people for moaning.

[bongodriver]

For me the moaning about people moaning is because the moaners have a weird idea that their moaning is going to be of some sort of interest in general, but in reality the moaning only appeals to other moaners and entire threads build up from the moaning club with the subsequent anti-moan moaning club obligedly countering the moaning with anti-moan.....moaning.

This is why in my oppinion there needs to be 2 dedicated forum sections, 1 for the 'moaners' and another for the 'anti-moan fanbois', they must be clearly labelled as to their function, in this way any wandering forum surfers will be able to pick and choose which sub section most appeals to their tastes.

[philip.ed]

No, people should just understand that the mature way of approaching someone who's been critical is to just leave them alone. And likewise for a 'fan-boi'. Obviously I'm probably being hypocritical in saying this, but it would help things. What annoys me is that people should be able to post what they want without questioning. Obviously certain posts may stand out as being outlandishly stupid, but if you're looking for a 'solution' complete seperation shouldn't really be initiated.

Personally, things are OK as they are; it's just internet banter.