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IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover Latest instalment in the acclaimed IL-2 Sturmovik series from award-winning developer Maddox Games. |
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#1
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I think Hitler believed after the 1938 crisis and the Western power stance on many deeds on his part that he would never have to fight France or Britain as they would just do what they had done before: protest and then accept it.
If I remember well, I once heard in a documentary that he was really surprised when he got the declaration of war from France and Britain. One may conclude from it that the German Luftwaffe and army was never actually meant to invade France, let alone Britain. It was done and attempted because facts were different from what was planned for and had to be accounted for by going into the offensive, trying to take out France and Britain, with what they had, before turning to their real objective. |
#2
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http://www.amazon.co.uk/First-Blitz-.../dp/0552155489
I can highly recommend this book to anyone interested in the German bomber campaign against Britain during WW1. As for Britain only winning due to bad German strategy... I lol'd. The Luftwaffe was getting its arse handed to it in June 1940 by the AASF and continental air forces. Where do you dream this crap up? Even the Polish Airforce did remarkably well against it. In 1939 the Poles managed to destroy 285 German aircraft, for a total 333 aircraft lost. Not bad for an airforce which was flying relics a which were a generation behind the Luftwaffe and outnumbered by almost 10 to 1. Sorry dude but your much vaunted Luftwaffe is just a propagandists dream. |
#3
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I feel slightly ignored ...
![]() On a more factual basis and hopefully on a less bashing tone that settled in a couple of threads ago (it closes in on youtube comment level): I too think that the Luftwaffe is usually overestimated. It had at the beginning of the war machines that outclassed usually the opposing types. They had a minor advantage in experience and tactics over a short time. This changed progressively with the campaign in the West, where they encountered the more advanced planes that were close or equal in performance and when the pilots gained more experience there. With slower pace the same happened in the Eastern campaign, when initially the Soviet planes were completely outclassed and pilot experience was bad. They cought up later. It ended up in a number game during the last stage of the war. PS: The German planes lost in Poland were mostly lost to ground fire not Polish planes that had been primarily destroyed on ground. Last edited by 41Sqn_Stormcrow; 06-04-2011 at 12:09 PM. |
#4
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Oh crap sorry mate, It's like playing tennis with someone who keeps lobbing tha ball at you. I just couldn't...
You know. My bad. ![]() |
#5
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"230 aircraft were destroyed in action, primarily by Polish fighters and anti-aircraft artillery."
- Cynk, Jerzy B. The Polish Air Force at War: The Official History, 1939-1943. Atglen, PA: Schiffer Military History, 1998 We'll split the difference huh? |
#6
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![]() Quote:
Quote:
From: The Luftwaffe in the Polish Campaign in 1939, by General der Flieger Wilhelm Speidel.
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Il-2Bugtracker: Feature #200: Missing 100 octane subtypes of Bf 109E and Bf 110C http://www.il2bugtracker.com/issues/200 Il-2Bugtracker: Bug #415: Spitfire Mk I, Ia, and Mk II: Stability and Control http://www.il2bugtracker.com/issues/415 Kurfürst - Your resource site on Bf 109 performance! http://kurfurst.org ![]() |
#7
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The fact remains that the Luftwaffe lost a lot of aircraft, both in Poland and in the Battle of France, that seriously degraded their abilities.
Add the losses between the time of Dunkirk and the "start" of the BoB in August and it is clear that the Luftwaffe could not sustain a campaign to "take" Great Britain. It's laugable to think that they could. The mistakes made by Hitler, Goering and the OKL only added to the issue. The Luftwaffe was a very young service. There was no depth of experience in their officer corps, unlike the RAF, which is of course the world's oldest independent air force. Like most of the German High Command, they suffered from strategic blindness. Too concerned with tactics and not enough with logistics.
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![]() Personally speaking, the P-40 could contend on an equal footing with all the types of Messerschmitts, almost to the end of 1943. ~Nikolay Gerasimovitch Golodnikov |
#8
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The Luftwaffe just a bunch on incompetent loons. The whole Army probably just Feldwebels like Schultz was. ![]() Well with such a bunch of really incompetent guys we gave you a pretty good fight for almost 6 years. |
#9
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That's about the only thing he got right.. He was a huge reason why the LW was so badly let down by it's commanders.
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#10
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France was another matter, there the LW indeed had serious losses, as a matter of fact it rivaled the losses as though the only serious was the bombers which strenght fell by about 200 aircraft compared to the begining of the campaign, but all other strenght was maintained or even improved. As a sidenote, they handed the RAF's and the FAF their respective assess (the former lost some 900 aircraft, the latter was simply annihilated) and were instrumental in creating a strategical position in Western Europe that was simply not going to change until the Americans entered the war. The French Army, the only one that could hope to defeat the German army was defeated, and the Brits were kicked out of the continent, and everyone knew they just can't come back on their own. Quote:
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Secondly that 'very young air service' had a top brass made up by people who were flying in combat before the 'world's oldest independent air force' came into being, with top/mid-level commanders like Moelders, Osterkamp Richthofen, Sperrle, Stumpf, Kesselring etc. who had seen actual combat flying and organisation in Spain. A little reading wouldn't hurt you as a matter of fact.. ![]() ![]() Considering how much younger and more inexperienced they were supposed to be, they seem to have built a better and larger air force on all levels by 1940.
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Il-2Bugtracker: Feature #200: Missing 100 octane subtypes of Bf 109E and Bf 110C http://www.il2bugtracker.com/issues/200 Il-2Bugtracker: Bug #415: Spitfire Mk I, Ia, and Mk II: Stability and Control http://www.il2bugtracker.com/issues/415 Kurfürst - Your resource site on Bf 109 performance! http://kurfurst.org ![]() |
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