The Blue Sun Mod

[Nat_Crelk]

Originally Posted by R@S

The new version has been released, check the first post for details.

Thanks for your work.
I start to play immediately !

Nat

[R@S]

Originally Posted by D_F_N

I told you so too! ))))

In your case I seem to remember you also said you hadn't actually played the mod, so how could I take what you said seriously

All kidding aside, glad you finally decided to join us.

[D_F_N]

This is a tl;dr message, so skip it if you dont have the time to waste reading it.

Well, Santa ... ehm R@S i mean ,
i was lurking since the first month the community moved here after the SF meltdown, but was (and still am) feeling shamefull for promising something that i didnt deliver. I did a big circle trying to find other games challenging enough but with disheartening results.

Which brings us to the "realism" non-issue.
The crowd here is mainly people about their 30s or 30+, or anyway 20+ and definetely not 12 year olds whose level of "challenge' can be broken-down to my-screen-goes-red-when-i-m-getting-shot-and-all-i-have-to-do-is-stay-covered-for-5-seconds-to-regain-health. Cause its too much for the dumbed down generation to get killed in-game, burst into tears and cry mommy afterwards.

Our fun derives from challenge.
Infinite ammo, 12gauge-sniper-machinegun-pistols or any other Uberweapon, holy hand-grenades, one-shot-kills on all body parts with 9mm pistol, fat man xplozions!!1, cheating AI etc etc are all challenge breakers and thus no fun.

Realism tweaked, mainly cause of in-game distance limitations, is the starting point for all of us. Sure there are taste differences to this level of challenge but they are minor.

I m sure the above are your thoughts too, as also of most of the forum members, so i will stop here and dont go into details.


D_F_N aka "tweaked, mainly cause of in-game distance limitations, realism freak"


P.s. Do you still see Local Integrated Software Architecture?

p.s. of p.s. Does anybody know what are the specifications of the sound files of the mercs?

[Dr.Q]

Well, the problem with the combination of weapons and a strategy/tactics game is, the firearms nuts are almost always mentally very poor. Just go and visit the Bears pit and their "political discussions", lol.

Having designed a few dozen classic-style "turn-based" boardgames before, I'm still very glad I've been a small part of the SOG'69 JA2 mod. You can see my ideas about a playable weapons mod there. I've tried the 1.13 mod but it was shite.. headshot orgies, inventory management and no entertainment value.

Originally Posted by R@S

Or as afp used to say, "it's dr.q being dr.q"

afp's E5 Immortal Badass and the 7.62 translation project were epic original work. He understood the basic premises of the game and never tried to change them. And we did have a lot of fun trolling the gun nutters and their demands for "realism"

Originally Posted by R@S

You have to forgive me, but I seldom take your criticism seriously

So thats why release after release there are the same errors in the ammo tables. Both the original items and those that were added have many switched-around or nonsense values. How about fixing these basic physical stats for more realism.

But I think if here should prevail this humorless mood and uninspired attitude, 7.62 may not be headed in a good direction.

[R@S]

Originally Posted by D_F_N

Our fun derives from challenge.
Infinite ammo, 12gauge-sniper-machinegun-pistols or any other Uberweapon, holy hand-grenades, one-shot-kills on all body parts with 9mm pistol, fat man xplozions!!1, cheating AI etc etc are all challenge breakers and thus no fun.

Couldn't agree more, the more challenging the more fun. But from the above examples I can only finger one issue with BSM and that is the .40 ammo is too powerful. As for the ranges, I only made some minor tweaks and you have to consider that the change goes both ways, the enemy shoots back, donchernow

Originally Posted by D_F_N

P.s. Do you still see Local Integrated Software Architecture?

LISA who?

Originally Posted by D_F_N

p.s. of p.s. Does anybody know what are the specifications of the sound files of the mercs?

The sound files are standard 705kbps wav files, nothing special. The comments needs to be activated in the RPC's source code. There are phrases for the situations where the merc can comment, just point it to your wav file like this;

phrase CommentSeeAnotherEnemy()
this.Say("Sounds\Mercs\NewMerc\01.wav")
end phrase

Anyone capable of extracting the voices from JA2? It would make the slaves more fun to have around

Originally Posted by Dr.Q

I'm still very glad I've been a small part of the SOG'69 JA2 mod

You can be proud of that, it's still one of the greatest mods for JA2 out there.

Originally Posted by Dr.Q

So thats why release after release there are the same errors in the ammo tables. Both the original items and those that were added have many switched-around or nonsense values. How about fixing these basic physical stats for more realism.

The reason I haven't changed any ammo settings are two-fold. Firstly, I myself haven't done any changes and I had help with the ones I've added. Secondly I can't see your problem with the 5.56 ammo, when I play it works as it should. Here's some pics that shows how I experience it:

First I shoot with the 885, I get the "normal" low damage when shooting at armored targets.


When I shoot with the 995 at the same armored target I usually get these values:



Could it be that you hit outside the armored area with the 885 and that makes it look like it works better than the 995? I think the 885 is supposed to do more damage than the 995 on unarmored targets, or is that a false assumption? Or do you mean that the FMJ has better penetration than the 995?

[Nat_Crelk]

Originally Posted by Dr.Q

How about fixing these basic physical stats for more realism.

But I think if here should prevail this humorless mood and uninspired attitude, 7.62 may not be headed in a good direction.

Hi everyone !

I don't wanna take part of something which exceeds me but, maybe, your point of view depends on what you mean about "realism".
Doesn't it ?

In every game I played before (without regarding the kind of games they were and in their Vanilla or Modded versions), I everytime noticed that those games / Mods reflects their creator's point of view.

Why after all, BSM couldn't be in that way too, reflecting R@S' and other BSM team members point of view about 7.62 ?
Mods rely on the work of a team who wants to lead some game into some direction.
But effectively I agree with you in the fact that their works rely on some other members giving their own two cents.
And also, I consider that as a kind of "way to give a little hand" for mods' active players (like me) to give their feedbacks in order to help as far as they can, other members work.
Some players may be pleased and some other may be not. That's a game after all. And I try to always be gratefull for the time I can enjoy some game.
But I agree with the fact that everyone has his own definition of what a "realistic" or a "funny" game is.

As R@S said before, some guys are already working on a new weap / ammo tab.
They are working on something which will reflect their own sense for that game.
As far as I'm concerned I would be proud to help if only someone takes some time to explain how that works to me and how have I to give my help.
But for now, as I have not something interesting to propose, I will wait and see how things goes on.

I hope I don't have hurt someone, and if I have, please, excuse me.

Thanks

Nat

[R@S]

Originally Posted by Nat_Crelk

I don't wanna take part of something which exceeds me but, maybe, your point of view depends on what you mean about "realism". Doesn't it ?

That's very true, we all have different expectations of what constitutes a realistic game. I just get very annoyed when people look at the numbers in the ini files and then because they don't look "real" they think it doesn't actually work in a realistic manner. As an example of this, take the mp5a5 and hk53a2. They both have an accuracy of 38, but due to the difference in caliber they are actually accurate at different ranges. There are many examples like this where the ini files lie and one has to actually play the game to figure things out.

Originally Posted by Nat_Crelk

As far as I'm concerned I would be proud to help if only someone takes some time to explain how that works to me and how have I to give my help.

You just start working on the models and if I can help with anything let me know

Anyways, I had some time last night and made some "fixes" to the AMMOINFO file, and since I also discovered a bug with the Level Up system I need to release a fix. The bad news is that a new start is required so if you've gotten far in your game you shouldn't install this fix. Just beware that when spending level up points and you browse back you might not get to spend the last of the points until the next level up event. My vulcan logic failed me on this one

BSM 1.5 Fix 1

[Nat_Crelk]

Originally Posted by R@S

Anyways, I had some time last night and made some "fixes" to the AMMOINFO file, and since I also discovered a bug with the Level Up system I need to release a fix.BSM 1.5 Fix 1

Firstly, thanks for your answer.

Secondly, I was wondering what were the tweaks you made in the AMMOINFO.ini and in the WEAPONINFO.ini ?
I know how that files work but I don't really figure out what are the changes you made ?

I started working with 3DSM last night. I try to understand how some parameters are working but I found many tutorials on the net which are very helpfull.
But I keep your proposition of help in mind as soon as I adventure myself in the hard jungle of serious modeling.

Thanks

Nat

[D_F_N]

@ Santa R@S

Those were random extreme examples just to show that we are all like-minded here, so there is no realism issue. Nothing to do with BSM, sorry for not clarifying.
And what has Darwin to do with this?

Who?!!? Copenhagen? Wasnt there also that actor, i dont remember his name, from a show called coupling IRC?

i dont know about Ja2 sounds but could i interest you in another character?

Btw, the ammo/clip/magazine limit applies to general items (uniforms, mines etc etc) also? And cant that limit be bypassed by the same technique as the weapons limit?

[R@S]

Originally Posted by Nat_Crelk

Secondly, I was wondering what were the tweaks you made in the AMMOINFO.ini and in the WEAPONINFO.ini ?
I know how that files work but I don't really figure out what are the changes you made ?

I lowered some stats on machineguns and did some tinkering with the .40 s&w, gave the lapua it's correct weight and some other tweaks.

Originally Posted by D_F_N

Those were random extreme examples just to show that we are all like-minded here, so there is no realism issue. Nothing to do with BSM, sorry for not clarifying.

Hey, I'm just glad I've managed to stay clear of the most of those issues And you know from our previous discussions on the matter that you are willing to suffer more realism than I in a game like this, I'm just looking for a challenging fight with cool guns

Originally Posted by D_F_N

Who?!!? Copenhagen? Wasnt there also that actor, i dont remember his name, from a show called coupling IRC?

I must talk a lot of BS and can't remember half of it. I do remember telling you about my friend who's a spitting image of Jeffrey in said show, always there to say the wrong thing at the wrong time

Originally Posted by D_F_N

i dont know about Ja2 sounds but could i interest you in another character?

Sure, I'm intrigued. I'll try to set up my messenger system again so we can discuss it further, I'll try to do that later this week.

Originally Posted by D_F_N

Btw, the ammo/clip/magazine limit applies to general items (uniforms, mines etc etc) also? And cant that limit be bypassed by the same technique as the weapons limit?

Sure, it can be done but some special knowledge in hex-hacking is required. Deadhead and another guy, can't remember his name, did it but decided to export those values to a new dll file. IIRC it was just a matter of increasing the allocated memory for the file/function from 256 to 4096.