Daidalos Team's Room -QUESTIONS AND REQUESTS ONLY on IL2 Authorized Addons

[Furio]

Originally Posted by flying

What are you doing,DT?One years more,Where is the 4.10?Tell us,plz!

And what are you doing, Flying? Tell us plz!

[Hans Burger]

The last few pages are a perfect example why I never bothered with Mods:

Self-proclaimed experts who insinuate they've been fed pure wisdom instead of milk as a baby and who attack people bringing up very real concerns (DATA?).

I agree.
As soon a line of code (or data) is added, changed, … people doing that is a “self-proclaimed expert” and IMHO, modders but also DT enter in this case.
I don’t think is a good idea to separate people in two categories, modders on one side, DT on other side.
All these people try to improve IL2 and, at this point, maintain FB still alive. So, for me, real argumentation, can be only done around data and, probably, some compromises to implement them in order to match the game engine.

[_1SMV_Gitano]

Originally Posted by II/JG54_Emil

I see what TD is ignoring (in most replies in a very downward way).

That´s what is annoying.


I kind of like Pupos proposition.

why not get on TS and speak personally about the mentioned problems, that might weaken the fronts and can only benefit the IL2 community.

DT mail has been around for a while. We already adviced people to justify requests sent with hard data, and some did. Depending on manpower etc, some changes are being done. Please bear in mind that we do not have a public forum, which is good otherwise there would be hundreds of threads like this one, and we would spend most of time replying to questions, requests, etc.

[II/JG54_Emil]

NONE OF THE DATA IS FALSE!!!

The data presented is in game right now.

I personally don´t expect you guys to jump up correct things right away.
But explaining you won´t do anything since the info comes from a modder is ...


All the Data given is factual data and not fictional data as you would like to see it.

If you need a secretary who is making a list of the named bugs, just say so.
I wouldn´t like to do it, but before everything is forgotten and swept away, I will do it.

[flying]

Originally Posted by Furio

And what are you doing, Flying? Tell us plz!

What did you want to say?

[csThor]

All the Data given is factual data and not fictional data as you would like to see it.

No it is data from a "source" which can't be cross-checked and which may be based on faulty data to begin with. Do you see our problem? We don't know where that data came from (and I am not talking about Hades posting it here) and therefor we can't judge how reliable it is.

[I/ZG52_HaDeS]

Originally Posted by MicroWave

Where? He presented false and incomplete information about source variables without understanding what they mean. All of this flavored with wild accusations.

So do you call me a "liar" now? At first you said that things like the Sniper ShVAKs 20mm gunner in Pe8 is "not a big problem" and you did not deny the meaning of the "delta angle" error. So, if does not indicate the Accuracy (dispersion) of the gun, please enlighten us, oh wise one, please. We are 'imbeciles" so we rely on your wisdom. Please, what does the "angle error" mean?
And for bombs you said that it is the way they are, so you confirmed the data are correct. But now you come here and accuse me of being a "liar". Please, oh wise one, enlighten us what these parameters mean? Please do, since we are so ignorant.

Originally Posted by MicroWave

No matter how fishy they look (and some of them do look fishy) what matters is ingame performance (test), comparison to historical evidence and game limitations.

So, despite they "look" "fishy" they are "correct". And then, how come and in the 2001 Original IL2 release these values Did NOT look "fishy" ?
could you explain please? Since you are the wisdom-holder.
Moreover people DO confirm these largely false data. They can "FEEL" them but they have not the data to support their feeling. Now they have.
Could you also explain to us ignorants, the meaning of the Bomb values i posted? Please?

Originally Posted by MicroWave

We collect historical references on subjects we think might be wrong on our own.

Really? So, where are Your Historical sources for the pylons you made to weight 15 kilos? Can we see your "Sources" please?
Can we also see your sources that start the mentone bomb and rocket pylons to have Zero weight?
Moreover can you show us your "sources" that justify the Double-Penetration value of some Weapons? Lets say the ShKAS over the .303 Brownings. can we see that please?
Also, can we see your sources that proove the data from the 2001 release about Bombs as FALSE while the current game data be regarded as corrrect?

Originally Posted by MicroWave

If you want to see some issue addressed sooner, it is by far the easiest way for us if you perform ingame tests and provide historical documents. We don't care who provides those data if everything is reliable.

Please, as i wrote above: can we see your data about the 15 Kgs pylons and for the Zero-Weight pylons also? Also about the guns, Bombs, etc....

Originally Posted by MicroWave

That's the normal procedure for any "Bug report" for any game.
If you don't want to help, the issue goes at the end of the cue.

Many people have informed you for the many bugs that this game suffers, but you did nothing.

Originally Posted by MicroWave

Now, you tell me how you want us to respond when someone comes along and says "something looks fishy, fix it!"?

It does not only "looks" fishy, it FEELS "fishy", it IS Wrong! Like the overheating issues, the extraordinary destructiveness of Certain Bombs, Weapons, etc...

Originally Posted by MicroWave

Our experience is that in 90% of cases such claims are false.

With such an attitude, i am not surprised

[ImpalerNL]

Documentation ive found about the bf109K4, shows the iL2 bf109k4 has a lower speed compared to the real bf109k4 data.

The blue line shows 100% power, ingame.
The black line shows 110% power with mw50, ingame.

Ive tested the ingame data provided by IL2 compare, and i managed to hit a "brick wall" at 3km with a topspeed of
~640km/h TAS. (at 110% power + mw50) This is also shown with the IL2 compare data.


The green line shows 100% power, real data.
The red line show 110% power with mw50, real data.

Aircraft takeoff weight is ~3400kg (including 400kg fuel) for both the IL2 bf109k4 and the real bf109k4.



In the second thumbnail ive included the real levelspeed data (green and red), with the ingame levelspeed (black and blue).


All speeds shown in the levelspeed graphs are TAS.

[Viikate]

Originally Posted by II/JG54_Emil

In fact TD, you do NOTHING at all!!!

You keep fussing about the bombs, while there is no comment about the guns the snipers, the non-overheat issues, wrong engines, wrong power settings, wrong cockpits, wrong FM, etc..

Do we really need be here on standby hitting F5 constantly in case Hades has posted something demanding for answers? I already answered to Hades that he is wrong about the maxDeltaAngle causing the sniper effect, but he refused to acccept this. Not my problem if Hades cannot analyse the code enough to find the real problem. Using same logic as Hades, I could equally say that if I set the ammo count to zero, the problem is fixed. So "the ammo count ALSO plays significant role in this aspect."

Wrong cockpits? Did I miss something?

For 4.09 TD proposed to MG that 15kg might be more better value for a generic pylon weight and it would solve the overweight problem of planes with lots of small pylons (8 rockets for example). Not that this was very relevant fix, since we planned already back then to set all individual pylon weights.

Originally Posted by I/ZG52_HaDeS

I asked WHERE did you find data or WHAT data did you find to make the majority of the Pylons in IL2 to weight from the 150kgs they weighted until 4.09b patch to 15 kgs in the latest. Again you provided No Data for this but only "demand" data from others.

Do you really think that there is actual data that states that generic weight for all pylons is 15kg. It's simple approximation based of the fact that most of the pylons are simple rocket rails or small wing bomb racks.

Originally Posted by II/JG54_Emil

Team Daedalus, you were the ones that the community hoped for to correct these errors and you could.
But you prefer to sit in your ivory tower and ignore all the named facts.

Well would you change something like the MK 108 power value just because someone states that:

"While historically 4 shots were needed to down a B-17.
In game you need around 10."

So the problem is with the MK 108 and not with the B-17 DM? If we would just blindly change the MK 108, it could have very dramatic effect when shooting small fighters.

BTW Emil. Are you 100% sure that the power variable in MK 108 round is the full weight of explosive content. When you view the decompiled code, you only see the final value of 42 grams. In the original source code the final value comes from formula or several values, just like the caliber (which has nothing to do with actual caliber).

So far this thread has provided ZERO real credible reference about any bomb blast radius. No real credible hard data, no change. TD gets huge amount of e-mails from people asking to change this and that. Most of them are asking us to change something that would have really big effects in game without ANY real references. Just like this thread lately.

Mods have a luxury of begin uninstallable (plus there are also many mods that restore the original FM or original weapon parameters). Any change in the patch is something that is permanent for the players who don't use mods. So we don't change something very lightly just because some guy comes here to say that he has decompiled the source code and knows that wrong variable X is causing problem Y.

[II/JG54_Emil]

Bug-List:

- many (often in game used weapons) don´t use historical values
- MK108 has less destructiveness than in RL(4 hit to down a B-17) in the weapons classes and in empirical testing (check Flying Guns of WW2, Anthony G. Williams / http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk / http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MK_108_cannon)
- MG151/20mm s.o., (5hits to down a fighter 25 hits to down a B-17 (check Flying Guns of WW2, Anthony G. Williams / http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk / http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MG_151_cannon)
- .50 cal Browning s.o.
- FAB bombs destruction radii are a lot higher in late game patches than i the first game releases without referencing how and why
(an interesting point here is that the first game-release had the MG151/20mm weapon-classes closer to RL than they are now)
- some Russian rear-gunners have 0 dispersion on mobile mounted gun
- La series uses later engines than available at the period
- I-185 71A the spawn temperature is beginning at 110°C and when heating up and when running up the engine the temperature runs down to 20°C and stays there.
NO OVERHEAT!
- Bf-110 G2 the ATA pressure is with 73% throttle indicating your are in the war-emergency-power.
- some of the Instruments put into German planes were not available at the time the plane was produced
- Bf-109 uses a ridiculous climb-rate that is one third bigger than in RL
- FW have too low acceleration at low speeds