Daidalos Team's Room -QUESTIONS AND REQUESTS ONLY on IL2 Authorized Addons

[Zorin]

...next week
...Monday

Why?

There is no point in posting this. It only shows that, like all the previous work (4.09b is around since a year or so?), it gets stuck at the last stance and results in blame on Oleg and team.

Just release it, doesn't matter when, but don't talk about it like you would be in control.

[HanzBlixz]

"(4.09b is around since a year or so?)" --> 12/2007
http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthr...highlight=beta

Yes... wouldn't want to rush anyone. 2 weeks for sure...

[MicroWave]

Originally Posted by Zorin

...next week
...Monday

Why?

There is no point in posting this. It only shows that, like all the previous work (4.09b is around since a year or so?), it gets stuck at the last stance and results in blame on Oleg and team.

Just release it, doesn't matter when, but don't talk about it like you would be in control.

Which part of If Oleg agrees, you do not understand? Can't you accept the fact that people are not available all the time?
And what does 4.09b has to do with it? It was released, wasn't it?
News about 4.09 final is around for about a month and a half.
We've been toying with Release Candidates in the meantime.

[Zorin]

MicroWave,

it is not about me not understanding, not the slightest. All this is about, is learning how to handle future affairs.

The whole point it: Stay with truth and hard facts. Never, publicly, venture of into the field of speculation. It never will do you or anyone any good.

You showed your work and got everyone excited. The next step and the only feasable in my opinion would be the release. Every question about the when should be answered: On release day. Period.

That saves all involved a lot.

You can make people very happy by having them come home and surprisingly find that the producte is released. They didn't know when to expect it and are just genuinely happy it is there.

Yet, the policy around here (Daidalos excluded for now)is to get tangled up in hints, dates, what-ifs and occasional promises that get everyone full of anticipation only to be met by dissapointment. Now, whatever is released will be met by a customer who is already in a state of "this better be good cause I have been fooled time and time again" - naturally resulting in a reception that ain't true to the actual quality of the release. So the developer can only lose.

(May I remind you of the Slovakia crew who was about to release their maps on their own because they were so fed up with the final being not released since 2007...)

[nearmiss]

Originally Posted by Zorin

MicroWave,

it is not about me not understanding, not the slightest. All this is about, is learning how to handle future affairs.

The whole point it: Stay with truth and hard facts. Never, publicly, venture of into the field of speculation. It never will do you or anyone any good.

You showed your work and got everyone excited. The next step and the only feasable in my opinion would be the release. Every question about the when should be answered: On release day. Period.

That saves all involved a lot.

You can make people very happy by having them come home and surprisingly find that the producte is released. They didn't know when to expect it and are just genuinely happy it is there.

Yet, the policy around here (Daidalos excluded for now)is to get tangled up in hints, dates, what-ifs and occasional promises that get everyone full of anticipation only to be met by dissapointment. Now, whatever is released will be met by a customer who is already in a state of "this better be good cause I have been fooled time and time again" - naturally resulting in a reception that ain't true to the actual quality of the release. So the developer can only lose.

(May I remind you of the Slovakia crew who was about to release their maps on their own because they were so fed up with the final being not released since 2007...)

This is standard kinda stuff since the first patch release for IL2 1.0.

It is the same kind of stuff that has plagued every game developer since their first mention of a patch or any kind of upgrade.

Best practice is like Oleg's responses. He responds when he feels the need and releases stuff on his schedule... regardless of how much heat is put on in the forums.

Here is a best response ---

Zorin, I know where you are coming from, its even worse with Oleg and SOW, he promises stuff then it never gets mentioned again and we have to act like he never said it in the first place, because if you do happen to ask "what happened to the website?" then your a whining kid!!

You gotta love it here....

[Chivas]

I don't see a problem. Oleg has stated that he's building a cinematic Battle of Britain simulation. An engine not only for BOB but every other theater, with room to grow beyond just a combat flight sim. He's mentioned possible release dates and web sites, but he understands as do most of the community how complex and difficult this task will be. Just because a few in the community can't see how complex the task is, or are just unwilling to cut some slack, so be it. It won't effect sales whatsoever, even most of the negative vocalists will end up buying the sim. No problem.

[MicroWave]

Originally Posted by mkubani

We would like to see the 4.09 being released next week. Please just be patient. We had to finish the job. Today Oleg has received the last file from us - 4.09 Guide PDF with 130 pages.

If Oleg agrees, we will make the PDF available for download on Monday. The patch should be coming shortly after depending on the workload/availibility of MG's programmer.

Originally Posted by Zorin

So, it is Monday and I think someone said there would be a handbook published today? Or was it a "olegish" remark barely resembling a real world "There is a handbook but god don't think anyone would now when it will be released"?

Nope. Noone said there will be a handbook published on Monday. Martin said there might be a handbook published on Monday.

Originally Posted by Zorin

I didn't intend to be pushy, they shall take their time, really. BUT why didn't they learn to NOT give any concrete dates for a release? Honestly, if one can learn one thing from the development history of this game - it is exactly this.

No concrete date was given, neither for the handbook or for the patch.

Originally Posted by Zorin

...next week
...Monday

Why?

There is no point in posting this. It only shows that, like all the previous work (4.09b is around since a year or so?), it gets stuck at the last stance and results in blame on Oleg and team.

Just release it, doesn't matter when, but don't talk about it like you would be in control.

Again you seem to be focused on just 3 words although it is clear that Martin's statement is not offering such promises that you imply. Also Martin's full statement was quoted twice before your reply.

Originally Posted by MicroWave

Which part of If Oleg agrees, you do not understand? Can't you accept the fact that people are not available all the time?
And what does 4.09b has to do with it? It was released, wasn't it?
News about 4.09 final is around for about a month and a half.
We've been toying with Release Candidates in the meantime.

Originally Posted by Zorin

MicroWave,

it is not about me not understanding, not the slightest. All this is about, is learning how to handle future affairs.

The whole point it: Stay with truth and hard facts. Never, publicly, venture of into the field of speculation. It never will do you or anyone any good.

You showed your work and got everyone excited. The next step and the only feasable in my opinion would be the release. Every question about the when should be answered: On release day. Period.

That saves all involved a lot.

You can make people very happy by having them come home and surprisingly find that the producte is released. They didn't know when to expect it and are just genuinely happy it is there.

Yet, the policy around here (Daidalos excluded for now)is to get tangled up in hints, dates, what-ifs and occasional promises that get everyone full of anticipation only to be met by dissapointment. Now, whatever is released will be met by a customer who is already in a state of "this better be good cause I have been fooled time and time again" - naturally resulting in a reception that ain't true to the actual quality of the release. So the developer can only lose.

(May I remind you of the Slovakia crew who was about to release their maps on their own because they were so fed up with the final being not released since 2007...)

Truth and hard facts are that you overstretched one statement beyond limit.
Advertising and estimates of release days are part of the gaming industry.
Without it there would be no people coming home and finding the product released because they wouldn't know about it.
I don't want to comment about Slovakia crew. I've seen pictures of them and I'm scared.
FYI, Martin, the guy whose statement you massacred, is part of that 'Slovakia crew which is fed up with the final being not released since 2007...'.

P.S. I'm posting as part of Daidalos Team and I don't know what's the policy of any other developer regarding Il-2 or any other product you might be referring to. And they don't like me in Daidalos Team, but that's another story.
Oh, and handbook and patch are to be released, in all likelihood and if all goes well and there are no unforeseen problems or disasters, when Oleg says so.

[mkubani]

Originally Posted by MicroWave

And they don't like me in Daidalos Team, but that's another story.

Who doesn't like you? We all do.

Anyway Zorin, we have an internal rule in our team that whatever we decide to do, we deliver at one point. We have started working on 4.09 in the end of 2008 and the public announcement was done over 6 months later (after first beta testing that proved to be solid) in the end of July. That's only 2 months ago. We did not mention any dates on purpose in order to avoid speculations. And don't forget, it's a hobby for us, not a paid job. We are developing it, but we are also the customers.

The problem is that people can never be pleased. You either don't give enough information or you give too much information. Great, so make your choice. People have been wondering and asking how we stand with 4.09 release. I think it was normal and polite to reply to them honestly and with our best estimate. That's what we are trying to do in this thread. If it is an information overload for you and would like to be kept "in dark", well you can always just skip this thread.

And yes, I am just that Slovak guy with only "empty promises" who by the way has modelled about 100 new buildings for Slovakia map. And I am a patient person I suppose.

[WWFlybert]

the cynicism is amazing in here, it's a free patch and people are still having fun with 4.09b1m as I see it, 4.08m is still commonly used, not to mention the 'm**' word.

what I'm curious about, is that just a few weeks ago, the next upgrade patch was going to be 4.10 .. then it changed to 5.0

4.xx would be upgrades to IL-2 1946 .. so ..

would not 5.0 be considered a major revision usually reserved for new DvD type size ?