CoD disappointing in skinning matters!

[major_setback]

You wouldn't need them to be editable. If they could just be turned off, then a skinner could add lines of choice. Though I think a problem could then arise because the bump mapping must align with the panel lines. So you would have to turn that off too...Oops

[cheruskerarmin]

THX for your replies.

Is there anyone amongst you who made skins for Il-2?

I and many others spent a lot of time making high quality skins for the IL-2 community. Fitting historical based campaigns with historical based skins of course is of interest for the single player only. There are many single players only i guess.
Behind all this work there's a lot of research work i think only those involved can imagine really. This is even fun for the bunch of mission builders and skinners, we enjoy the sim in this way too.
Creating each screw, each shadow and line all by ourselves was a real challenge - and looked far better than the most ugly default skins that
came with the game once.
The reason skins were more ugly when zooming in is the resolution of just 1024 x 1024 in the old sim. You couldn't get some details displaying well,
mapping with stretching and warping on some 3D models did their
cause too. This isn't a mistake of the skinner.


I think you all will see the ingame coded skin layers will again not look as well as high quality ones made by skinners. The game generated rivet/panel lines will i. e. always display on top of the skin file, you can't get i. e. selfmade paint chipping or weathering (i. e. exhaust smoke) on top of these then.
This reduces the possibilities of a realistic look.
Of course there are some mapping problems when making lines and rivets by yourself, these were
occuring in the old sim too. There are of course limits in anyway, not in skinning matters alone.

I'm not critizing the fact there is a game generated lines and rivets layer, but
i'm critizing it cannot be turned off optionally (thx major setback!). Why is this nonsense?
Why does it need ignorant or arrogant smelling replies?
They made it with the weathering layers too, can't be a big problem.

The fact it is wellknown for months now to be this way doesn't hinder me
to talk about it, and i can assure you there are many others who dislike this
too. The true reason behind this is to avoid or complicate modding - this is what i think.
I'm a non-modder and i'm quite sure it is just a matter of time when there are mods for CoD too.
The fixed rivets/panel lines will not prevent that.

[Buglord]

Hi cheruskerarmin (ive seen your work around ) , ive made over 150 historical skins for il2 plus many more for squads etc, & i was thinking of coming out of retirement to start skinning for COD but i have heard of this panel line problem & us skinners at ubizoo discussed this very problem a good while ago & they are also not happy , so im just going to wait till i have COD & see what i can do with it skinning wise.

[Il2Pongo]

How in hell would they implement the progressive weathering of aircraft over missions when someone can change the structure(rivets) of the aircraft...

Paint the thing. Thats your interest and your apparent expertise.
Paint goes on top of rivets.

Yes your hard earned expertise at making the rivet layers look good will not now be on display, your weathering will not be on display.

Want them to put in a rivet filter on top of the epilepsy filter to make a game just for you?

[Kikuchiyo]

Don't panels collapse now too? as in if a new skin shows panel lines that the game doesn't recognize you would end up with really weird mid/dual-panel collapses and what not?

[CharveL]

Yeah, like I want to see more bright red or landscape textured planes without panel lines & rivets to really give me that sense of immersion.

I think I would like to stick to the developer's method that at least puts proper panel lines over your Hello Kitty skin up there.

[Triggaaar]

Why are we getting these threads whining about this and that from people who've never posted here before?

[David603]

Originally Posted by CharveL

Yeah, like I want to see more bright red or landscape textured planes without panel lines & rivets to really give me that sense of immersion.

I think I would like to stick to the developer's method that at least puts proper panel lines over your Hello Kitty skin up there.

Yeah, now it will look like the real plane would if you painted it with a Hello Kitty scheme.

Which is still better than a plane shaped object in Hello Kitty colors

The new system will be great for people who, like me, can make a decent looking skin if they are using someone else's template (I can make my own templates, but they take 10s of hours and still don't look as good as the templates made by the true artists, so I stick to these and sometimes modify them a bit).

[Voyager]

Well, I've never created a skin for Il-2, because, while I would like a uniquely identifiable skin, I simply don't have the skill or software to do all of the panel lines, rivets, and assorted hardware that has to be drawn on the Il-2 skins.

I'm not talking "Hello Kitty" or the neon plane either, I'm talking about a slightly different camo job so when we're all lined up in a row, we don't all look like clones.

With this a competent skinner should be able to turn out a good looking skin in an order of magnitude less time, which means instead of focusing on making one fantastic hyper-detailed skin, you can make a unique skin for every aircraft in your wing, and be able to ID everyone by sight, rather than icon, or "Hey Fred, wag your wings."

Try it and see. It is awesome to see.

[cheruskerarmin]

Thank you very much for your replies.

@Il2Pongo, that's a good point!
But i can turn the ingame weathering completely off - if i like. So it wouldn't be necessary to have a fixed rivets/lines layer.

@buglords
THX, i know your works well . Surely i am late with my critics but i don't see
any reason to avoid discussing this matter (didn't saw the discussion before, sorry).

@Trigaaar
To your knowledge - made some few posts before and joined these forums
in mid january this year. Do you have something useful to say, 'senior member', instead of offending me because of opening a new thread here? This is a discussion forum isn't it?
Hopefully this isn't the way new members are treated here.

@CharveL
I assume you haven't seen any of my works nor do you know anything about
serious skinning and the efforts required. Did you make anything useful for the IL-2 community too so far? Did i offend you or other members in any way? 'Your Hello Kitty skin' remarking is indicating arrogance and nothing else.

@David603
That's exactly what i do, using templates. Altering things
how i like them or correcting mistakes, adding own stuff etc.
I didn't make own templates so far. Surely the fixed rivets/lines
are making things easier but i finally have to accept how they are done/appear ingame.

@Voyager
Very good points, thank you for this reply. Therefore i am specializing in making squadron skinpacks (if you like take a look at them at axis & allies paintworks), they are in my opinion much more useful than a
single individual one. Creating a base skin and then making some variants. Anyway - maybe you have to be a serious skinner yourself to understand you want to make the best out of a skin you can. I can't speak for anyone but for the most calling themselves serious skinners.


I have no problem if this matter isn't important to others or if you have another opinion. That's what
forums are for, different people - different opinions.

I'm not a member complaining generally about the new game, what i've seen so far looks very well in my eyes, great job. It's just this skinning matter disturbing me - like the very most of the skinners branch. If you would belong to them - it would most likely disturb you too.

ATB