IL-2:BOP DLC poll

[Widar]

Feel free to add comment to your vote in this thread!

[Dave1978]

Sounds like a whole new game to me that list!

All i want is to option to change the controls! fix that and the game is perfect.

[Widar]

Sounds like a whole new game to me that list!

All i want is to option to change the controls! fix that and the game is perfect.

For that I should have added an "other..." option, but 10 is the maximum amount of options one can include in a poll.

By changing the controls I gather you mean remapping the controller buttons etc.?

[FOZ_1983]

The option for "german cockpits" shouldnt really be in the poll should it?

they are coming soon enough anyway, so we wil get them.

[Widar]

The option for "german cockpits" shouldnt really be in the poll should it?

they are coming soon enough anyway, so we wil get them.

As far as I remember, Anton has stated that in the October 2009 DLC cockpits will probably only be included for "some" of the German fighter aircraft, not "all" of them! The "most important" I think he actually wrote if I remember correctly, specifically the Me109.

So that is why I included the option for "all" the German fighter cockpits in the poll, I specifically mean for "all" of them to be included in a DLC in that poll option. It would have been even better if I would have called the German cockpit poll option "axis" instead of German because there is an Italian fighter in BOP as well, it seems I made a slip of the keyboard there.

[FOZ_1983]

fair play.

Though chance are we wouldnt get cokcpit for ALL, if we did they may not be 100% accurate, but something to look at least, so its all good.

Would be nice to have a ME110 cockpit. I've quite enjoyed flying that crate.

[loopdreams]

You forgot the "moon on a stick" option, there.

[King Jareth]

can you crash into the stick on night missions?

[Arnow]

I voted for "cockpits for all german planes". In fact this should be for "all planes", since some allied planes don't have a cockpit either. But this is not a priority.

In fact, i think we should set our expectancies to a lower level....

Don't forget Anton said in the "german cockpits" thread that they would work on some of the most important german cockpits (i.e Fw 190 and Bf109). We can still try and ask for more, but i doubt the devs will release DLC like cockpits at the same rate songs are released for "Guitar Hero" or "Lips".

Il2 BoP, alas, is not GTA IV, in terms of profitability. I think they will keep new campaigns and stuff like that for a future game, which i hope will exist.

So, my opinion is, DLC will be, at best (and i sure hope i'm wrong ;)): a few german cockpits, maybe 2 - 3 new planes, new mission pack.

Anyway, the game is so great, i'll survive if there is nothing of this! :)

Note that this is only my opinion, i MAY be a little pessimistic ;). But but by far i prefer that to disappoint!

PS: sorry if my english is not really good, i'm french ;)

[Widar]

I agree that almost any cockpit for an aircraft is better than the virtual one, especially when flying in simulation mode.

I really hope BOP sells well and is played a lot on-line as well. If so, we can expect more and better DLC I suspect.

I for one have no problem with more expensive DLC for a game that is so unique on a console as BOP is. "Decent-player-base X more-expensive-DLC" might be a viable alternative for BOP DLC as opposed to "Huge-player-base X low-price-DLC".

But this all depends on how many people a "decent" player base constitute.

Playing a good flight sim on a PC is really great, but enjoying a console flight sim in the comfort of your living room on a large HD screen is something else. So maybe there is a chance here to get a decent amount of the old school PC flight simmers over to the console.

Also, if BOP players can get most of their on-line friends to buy and play BOP, then we can expect more and better DLC I think.

[daryld12]

I would like to see an option to remap the controls and be able to have the flight stick on the right controller analog stick. I also would like them to fix realistic and simulator mode with a free downloadable patch as the aircraft stall way to easy in those modes. I am a real world pilot and it is just not that realistic to stall at the mere brush of the stick and it makes me not want to play that mode at all. The bottom line is it has to be fun which the arcade mode is while still feeling real. Plus there are many ways to get out of a stall depending on how severe it is. A mild stall can be fixed by just pushing the nose down an adding power. It would be nice to be able to snap spin and even flat spin in one of the advanced modes as long as it held in the spin. I find the graphics very beautiful and a lot of times I just fly around with friends online landing,taking off and flying formation just enjoying the view. Some sort of replay/picture taking feature with editing would be nice to share all those glory moments. It could use the hard drive on the PS3 to determine how much you could record. I think the sense of speed and altitude in this game are the best and most realistic I've ever seen bar none and it all runs at a silky smooth frame rate. There's a lot of potential for this game to go even further with DLC and I for one would gladly pay for that. Cockpits for the rest of the planes that don't have them would be nice since that's the main view I fly in. More(different) explosion animations would be great. I also would like to see some sort of Pacific theatre with B-25s and Corsairs, Wildcats, Bearcats etc...Down the road or in a sequel it would be amazing to have a game like this become a sand box game. Imagine marrying this with a game like GTA4(only WW2 of course). You could land or parachute at an enemy airfield, get out and steal an airplane, shoot people on the ground, hop in a tank or truck, operate artillery guns, crash land a plane and get out, have two or more online people in a bomber to fly,operate guns ,bombs etc....The multiplayer would be insane and even more addictive with endless mission possibilities. Anyway I hope they continue mkaing flight games for the consoles. I have the first Sturmovik and Pacifc Fighters for the PC and now Birds of Prey for the PS3. I have "The Other" big flight sim as well and these blow it away. I think this company makes the finest flight simulations for console or PC period.

[dazz1971]

i voted for the single player mission/creator as one of the things i would like to do is have more options on the training mission like multi type missions eg fighter escort, bomber interception, bombing missions and stuff basicly so you could create your own single player mission :)

[Widar]

i voted for the single player mission/creator as one of the things i would like to do is have more options on the training mission like multi type missions eg fighter escort, bomber interception, bombing missions and stuff basicly so you could create your own single player mission :)

Let's talk about game, (...), please. Your opinions about game are (...) interesting for us and (...) useful.

Thanks for your vote.

Based on the partial quote of Kirill Yudintsev above, it seems that the opinions and suggestions of the customers are valued by the developers, so any vote on this pole or in the "suggestions to the developers" thread (sticky) will give us a chance to maybe have some influence on future DLC/sequel content. So the more votes and posts on this subject the better it seems!

[Robotic Pope]

I voted for multiplayer modes. I have so many cool idea's for new modes I can't write them all down.

[GabeFan]

I voted for a single-player mission editor and it seems like most people agree this would be a great feature.

A new single player campaign and single missions (Allied & Axis) would be great also...

[xX-SiLeNcE-Xx]

Oops, I voted for German cockpits, but what I really wanted was Bomber cockpits/gunner view, and a Co-op online Campaign. These two things would make this game the perfect flying game.

[Widar]

I voted for multiplayer modes. I have so many cool idea's for new modes I can't write them all down.

Thanks for the vote.

I voted for the "a m/c creator, German cockpits and a German SP campaign for 20+ Euro´s/Dollars" myself, but more multiplayer choices would have been my second choice.

If at all possible, write one or two of your multiplayer ideas down for the developers, you never know!

The first few multiplayer ideas I can think of are:

1- A "respawn off" setting for simulator team battle mode since otherwise the limited ammo/fuel option seems rather useless;

2- Maybe an aircraft landing and reloading option for simulator team battle mode at virtual airfields at the opposite edges of the maps protected by friendly Flak/AAA (to ward off cheap airfield kill stalkers) for 20+ minute online BOP duels, with points subtracted for each landing to award players that can finish a 20+ minute duel without reloading and rearming. I would rather see players retreat to refuel and rearm instead of them crashing on purpose because they have run out of ammo just to be rewarded with a brand new plane with a full load of ammo. This would cut down on the constant spray-and-pray-and-then-crash virtual pilots on limited ammo setting;

3- Asymmetric multiplayer modes, for instance where one side is made up of attacking bombers and fighter escort that have to bomb a target and inflict N % of damage on it and the other side made up of defending fighters that have to inflict N % of damage on the other attacker side;

4- A "Nationality" setting for simulator team battle multiplayer duels. It is really a pain at the moment to have to wait until you see the red or blue stripe on an aircraft in simulator because both sides are flying Spitfires for instance. It would be really really nice to know for sure that if you fly in a Spitfire and see another Spitfire at a distance that you are sure that that Spiffire is a friendly and do not have to close the range first to spot the red/blue stripe.

5- Replace the "accurate position small red dot" on the in-flight map in simulator team battle mode with a "larger red dot" that "roughly indicates the area "where the enemy is but not their EXACT position. The way it is now, players can accurately and instantly find the exact location of their adversaries and then track the position of each adversary on simulator mode by constantly checking the map. This is fine for Arcade and Realistic mode, but not for simulator in my opinion. This way players still can find their adversary by checking the map, but not the EXACT position of that adversary. This could, of course, also be introduced in the form of a "setting" that could be turned on or off.

6- Have players on the same team in simulator team battle mode start in a finger-four formation instead of the current random start position right between the enemy. This way players can start flying in a leader-wingman team at the start of the online duel. This could also be introduced in the form of a multiplayer "setting" of course that could be turned on or off.

[xX-SiLeNcE-Xx]

wow, I really like the idea of #5. Add to the skill level needed to play Sim, and also make sure you communicate with teammates.

[Axe99]

I voted for multiplayer modes. I have so many cool idea's for new modes I can't write them all down.

Multiplayer modes would be great, but there's a real possibility of more people working on producing them than actually playing them*, so for this outing I'd highly recommend single-player.

*Given the lobby issues - using RF:G as an example - great game that sold hundreds of thousands of copies more than IL-2 (just because it's more mainstream, and was a recognised console brand - IL-2 is an all-round better game ;)), and because of it's lobby issues sold next to none of it's Multiplayer DLC pack because no-one was playing it online, despite it being one of the best online experiences released this year, when you could get a game (sound familiar?).

[GabeFan]

Multiplayer modes would be great, but there's a real possibility of more people working on producing them than actually playing them*, so for this outing I'd highly recommend single-player.


Agree 100%

[Flyboy69]

Not only would I like to have german cockpits, I would like to see
bomber cockpits and gunner views. Also maybe a replay cam like
on AC6.

[Reddisback]

I ant choose.. Between More FIghters and Bomber or new Skins for allready avalaible aircraft? I love both. You said that you posted that the Germanss are having their cockpit view, but that was allready planed so thats out of the question... I think i have to go for the Skins then?
I know this is a big issue on German Figthers, but as far as i'm consern, Germans aircraft of that time should have a Swastika? they aren't German with out them?

so I'm gonna choose for either the Skins, or New Fighters and Bombers!
( plus the screaming of the Stuka DiveBomber!!)

[edal86]

I am confused, DLC will have cockpits for all german planes?? I thought only for messerschmitt.

1. a couple of new planes would be great (at least 1 Italian)

2. cockpits to all fighters so there can be "locked cockpits" battles. (its a flight sim right?)

3. Skins

[Widar]

The last that I read about the German cockpit views from the developer posts is that they MIGHT make some German cockpit views for the "most popular" German aircraft and then the Me 109 is mentioned specifically by the developer.

So as far as I have been able to find out on the two forums on which the developer posts, they might make a generic cockpit view for the Me 109's.

That is the reason why I included "cockpit views for all the German fighters" in the poll.

[Lexandro]

I couldn't decide myself. So I went for the extra campaign option, since more missions is always a good thing.

[Widar]

It is interesting to see that the thing that only 1.67% voted for was the one that was made available as DLC: allied single player missions/campaign.

I don't count the two DLC aircraft, because usually these pre-order extra's are made available about 1 month or so after release.

I know that Anton Y. said that the DLC was made months ago, but still: know thy customer...

Of course, who cares what 60 people voted for, but still...

[MorgothNL]

How can you know your customer, before he is a customer :confused:
This DLC was already on the disk --> thus was already made before the game was released. Before anyone had the game, to tell them what they wanted in DLC.

Know thy customer? he would have to be psychic in this case ;)

I dont want to bitch at you. But there are too many people bitching at the devs with stuff they 'cant help'.
The 'but still: know thy customer', is as if you are saying they dont know anything about markteting. Maybe they didnt do the best marketing job, and the game is flawed, but you 'know thy customer' make no sense at all in this case.

Its like me now starting a poll 'what would you like to see in the title update'. If then everyone votes for 'a new game mode'.
a new game mode is not going to be in the title update, the update is already 'finished'. When it comes out, I should go: 'we wanted a new game mode, the update was finished and it wasnt in there, but still: know thy customer'.

It is the same.. the DLC was already 'out' when the game was released. No polls or customer feedback could have changed its content.

again, I dont mean to flame, I just think it is not fair towards the devs (who are really listening to our input, and they get 'degraded' with remarks like yours)

EDIT:
And right after the game came out, and we started asking for german cockpits (20% of the poll), the devs said they would add at least the 109's and probably the FW190.
So they do listened to their customer right after the release. Look at the title update, it takes 1.5 month before it is out. A DLC will take longer.

[Widar]

How can you know your customer, before he is a customer :confused:
This DLC was already on the disk --> thus was already made before the game was released. Before anyone had the game, to tell them what they wanted in DLC.

Know thy customer? he would have to be psychic in this case ;)

No not really. Ever heard of "focus groups". These are specially selected people that represent "the majority of customers". Most game, movies, tv series etc. are constantly shown and presented to these focus group people.

There are certain area's where new products etc. are supplied to the so-called "average joe" in selected municipalities. Read up on it, there is a lot going on there even if you never heard of it.

So if someone missed the boat with a certain DLC, they had either the wrong focus group members OR the forum members on a certain forum do not belong to the focus group for which a game was made.

Snap je?

[DoraNine]

There's only three things I'd like to see -- and I don't see any of them in the poll. They would be:

1. Online Campaign Co-Op

2. Fix the performance and armament discrepancies on the German and
American planes.

3. Straighten out the "joystick" issues. The interface is BAD.

[MorgothNL]

yes I snap.

the 2 biggest poll choices are 'german cockpits' and 'SP mission editor'.
The devs already said the SP mission editor, is not something they can just add to this game, that is more for a sequel. So that one could not have been a part of DLC.

secondly, the german planes were never going to be playable, it is because of feedback that they made them playable just before the game going gold. So there was no time to make cockpits.

If you say 'it should have been in the game to begin with'. I can totaly agree there. But when you say 'it should have been in this DLC', I say no, it probably couldnt even have been. But most likely some of it will be in 'next DLC'

[jaywinner]

"other" i just want to customize my flight stick

[MorgothNL]

2. Fix the performance and armament discrepancies on the German and
American planes.

3. Straighten out the "joystick" issues. The interface is BAD.

I agree!
But I hope these wont be part of any DLC, but will just come with a game update. because these are not extras, but more like fixes.

If you have a xbox btw, joystick issues will not be straighted out, it is MS's job :(

[Widar]

There's only three things I'd like to see -- and I don't see any of them in the poll. They would be:

1. Online Campaign Co-Op

2. Fix the performance and armament discrepancies on the German and American planes.

3. Straighten out the "joystick" issues. The interface is BAD.

"Fix the performance and armament discrepancies on the German and American planes."

How true. When I made the poll, I did not know this however. Seeing some really weird things happening online regarding the performance of aircraft that I know a little bit about I wanted to know what was going on. After having done an insane amount of testing, as evident in one of my threads, I can say that you are absolutely right about point no. 2.

There really is so much potential in BOP and so much that is good in BOP that it really is a shame to have to conclude this. I believe that the US aircraft performance will be fixed, but I don't believe that anything will be done about the German aircraft, since I have not seen any remark from the developer on this. Really very disappointing, ah well.

Point no. 3 will also be addressed in one way or another, but point no. 1 will have to go to a sequel I think.

[DoraNine]

Don't get me wrong gents -- I'm not biased towards any country's machines, because I have an appreciation and interests for anything that flys and shoots -- but these Russian planes scoot around the skies like TIE Fighters and the Spifires and Hurricanes remind me of X-Wings. It's kind of driving the selection of planes you run up against in to the ground -- which makes the game tedious. Geeh, do I feel like trying to kill other La-5Ns and Hurricane IIs tonight in my Hurricane II -- like I did last night, and the night before that -- or do I watch TV? There's alot of times when I jump into a fight on any of the modes and the list looks like this:

Hurri II
Hurri II
La 5N
Spit IX
109 G6:confused:
La 5N
I-153
Spit II

For anyone whose introduction to these aircraft comes through playing this game - like my 12 year old nephew, he believes the Russians and the British were the only people who knew how to build an airplane. Its kind of silly. Hopefully some things like this will be smoothed out in the next version.

As for the DLC -- I guess I'd vote for a German Campaign. What could be more challenging than flying against all the "superior" Russian and British machines:evil:

[fuzzychickens]

Don't get me wrong gents -- I'm not biased towards any country's machines, because I have an appreciation and interests for anything that flys and shoots -- but these Russian planes scoot around the skies like TIE Fighters and the Spifires and Hurricanes remind me of X-Wings. It's kind of driving the selection of planes you run up against in to the ground -- which makes the game tedious. Geeh, do I feel like trying to kill other La-5Ns and Hurricane IIs tonight in my Hurricane II -- like I did last night, and the night before that -- or do I watch TV? There's alot of times when I jump into a fight on any of the modes and the list looks like this:

Hurri II
Hurri II
La 5N
Spit IX
109 G6:confused:
La 5N
I-153
Spit II

For anyone whose introduction to these aircraft comes through playing this game - like my 12 year old nephew, he believes the Russians and the British were the only people who knew how to build an airplane. Its kind of silly. Hopefully some things like this will be smoothed out in the next version.

As for the DLC -- I guess I'd vote for a German Campaign. What could be more challenging than flying against all the "superior" Russian and British machines:evil:

But one shouldn't expect the american planes to turn like a 109 and esp like a la5/7.

That would not be realistic. For example, the P-51 will not and should not turn like a 109 at low speed simply because the P-51 wing design sacrifices lift for its ability to cut through air (laminar flow) and save fuel. It also weighs more (empty) than the 109 in addition to producing less lift.

Yea, some errors will be corrected I think regarding the weight on these planes and should improve the P51 some and the FW190s too.

Was the P-51 worse than the 109 in reality? Hell no, just in turning circles and climb. It spanks the 109 at high altitude with its speed and has huge range advantage.

What do you think the outcome of BOB would have been if the Germans had P-51s that had the range to escort bombers from France to Britian and back? Things could have turned out different for sure.

Like others have said, in flight sims, no one values their life - so turn fights are the norm. Hence, good turners seem superior in these games.

In reality, turn fights in WWII were not as common as suprise boom-n-zoom tactics centered around situational awareness and maintaining speed. Pilots who avoided furballs tended to live longer.

[Axe99]

It is interesting to see that the thing that only 1.67% voted for was the one that was made available as DLC: allied single player missions/campaign.

I don't count the two DLC aircraft, because usually these pre-order extra's are made available about 1 month or so after release.

I know that Anton Y. said that the DLC was made months ago, but still: know thy customer...

Of course, who cares what 60 people voted for, but still...

Hey Wildar, while internet forums are useful, they're hardly a good indication of the customer base - you normally find only a _very_ small proportion of customers on game forums, and they're usually quite unrepresentative of the broader population who bought the game. So I wouldn't get too worked up by any differences between the poll and what 505 do - they have broader access to things like multiplayer server/achievements/trophy stats, that give them a much better idea of how everyone is playing the game.

[tbtstt]

At present my first request for DLC (or rather a patch) is to unlock all the aircraft for offline use - when I feel like I'm getting the full game I paid for then I'd like to see DLC...

...In terms of DLC a SP mission creator would be fantastic. I don't know how easy that would be to implement, but it would be incredible if they could do it as the scope of the game would be massively increased - especially if they allowed SP missions to be shared!

More aircraft would be great, though I think I'd rather see full cockpits and detailing for the aircraft in game before they add any more.

[Widar]

Hey Wildar, while internet forums are useful, they're hardly a good indication of the customer base - you normally find only a _very_ small proportion of customers on game forums, and they're usually quite unrepresentative of the broader population who bought the game. So I wouldn't get too worked up by any differences between the poll and what 505 do - they have broader access to things like multiplayer server/achievements/trophy stats, that give them a much better idea of how everyone is playing the game.

On topic: Axe, in the upcoming DLC you would like to see…

Off topic: Are you trying to discourage people with your post from voting or airing their wishes on forums?

Regarding your post: How somebody “plays” the game and what they would like to see in it, or (dis)like about it are completely different things. They cannot be measured by the online data you refer to.

Axe said: “and they're usually quite unrepresentative of the broader population who bought the game” – and you have hard irrefutable evidence that undisputedly proves this to be the case in 100% of the cases in 100% of the times or are you just repeating something you read somewhere?

"Hey" Axe, to be sure, nothing you mentioned in your post is not known to me already, still thanks for your kind and enlightening post. There is, however, no way for anybody of telling for sure if the BOP 1C forum members are unrepresentative of the focus group that it was aimed at, that have bought the game or that still MIGHT buy it. Word of mouth is also very important for long term sales, the sales life cycle of a product as you will. Don't forget that potential customers nowadays also frequent forums of games of which they are not sure whether or not to buy them. Not everybody buys a game on the release date. The question is: at which audience is BOP aimed. According to data from some game developers (i.e. Gearbox CEO), it is stated that more people still play single player than multiplayer. Even that more people played Halo 3 single player than online. The source for this data is the same source as 505 has access to. Halo 3 titles were, according to this source, also sold in numbers to customers that have no online connection and who therefore do not offer online data on achievements, multiplayer stats etc. And there are also players who don’t care about getting silly console achievements. So if all this is also the case with BOP, then 505 is in the same position as Gearbox, which undermines your statement. Then we are back at focus grouping again. Now there is much data out there on games development, focus grouping, marketing etc. to read up on. But like opinion polls, how much of it is actually a reliable source in real life? There are so many games that disappoint financially as a result of this “witchcraft”. Let’s for simplicity sake say that there are roughly the following kinds of game categories with respective audiences:

1. Fast sellers with a short term sales life span. Money on these must be made in about 2-3 months, after which nobody buys it on account of bad press, negative word of mouth, errors, shallowness etc. Usually these are fast paced, low intelligence, high controller skill, high fun factor teenager oriented games. These games are primarily aimed at the average teenager masses, that quickly move on to something new after a play through.

2. Fast sellers with a long term sales life span. Money on these will be made until the sequel comes out. Usually these are fast paced, low intelligence, high controller skill, high fun factor teenager oriented games. These games are primarily aimed at the average teenager masses, that keep playing a game until another a sequel/big title is released.

3. Average sellers with a medium term sales life span. Money on these will be made from a medium sized focus group that will play the game over a certain period of time. These quasi niche games are of medium game play difficulty and appeal to a certain audience, not the masses.

4. Slow sellers with a long term sales life span. Money on these will be made from a medium/small sized focus group that will play the game over a long period of time until the sequel comes out. These niche games are of medium/high game play difficulty and appeal to a certain niche audience, not the masses.

5. Bad sellers with a very short sales life span. The game was either a result of bad focus grouping, bad marketing, many game errors etc. or an unhealthy combination of these.

The question is at which type of people is a game aimed (focus group)? It is safe to say, as far as console games go, that the really big budget titles aim for category 1 and 2 and if things go bad they end up in category 5. These big budget titles don’t need forums that badly, but still make use them, since they have their game aimed at the masses that don’t frequent forums and for them the online data you refer to in your post is a lot more useful. They will sell in any event (cat. 1, 2) or maybe not (cat. 5). Now the real challenge are the niche audience games, they fall in category 3 and 4 and if things go bad they end up in 5. Category 4 and 5 games have special target groups, special focus groups. And concerning these, the forums offer insight in what some of their hard core fans want, especially for category 4. Now it seems that BOP was aimed at the following: category 1 (Arcade mode), 3 (Realistic mode) and 4 (Simulator). If so, than what is stated on this forum is most relevant for the BOP realistic and simulator mode, since the category 3 and 4 customers will move on when the game does not live up to their standards. If BOP was aimed primarily at category 1, than I fully agree the responses of the forum members are not that relevant. The thing about forums is: an important part of the people that frequent the category 3 and 4 game forums of a certain game are among the vociferous hardcore fans of a game, or they are people that take the trouble of letting the developer know what they like or do not like. Not many people take the trouble to do that, but it would be folly to call them unrepresentative when you have no measurable way to state that this is so for sure.

[Stanrosquain]

Frankly it does not bother me to pay 30 € (or 40 €) for a DLC containing the cockpits of all planes in the games (bombers and figthers) and a view of the turrets at the first person for bombers.
Unfortunately I don't think it will happen one day, I don't think developers and publishers would design DLC as complex of fear that it does not sell :(

[Ancient Seraph]

Frankly it does not bother me to pay 30 € (or 40 €) for a DLC containing the cockpits of all planes in the games (bombers and figthers) and a view of the turrets at the first person for bombers.
Unfortunately I don't think it will happen one day, I don't think developers and publishers would design DLC as complex of fear that it does not sell :(

Sadly, I agree. I think they'll take into account the problems of BoP and try not to make the same mistakes again in the sequel, but I doubt they'll make all the cockpits, correct every flight model, etc etc.