Your favourite WW2 guns

[haitch40]

just doing something like the favourite plane thing
my favourite guns were
1. hispano 20mm cannon good accuracy rate of fire and firepower
2. the 75mm cannon like the sniper of the sky

[The_Goalie_94]

Gattling gun on the A10...or a nuke does fine...;)

[P-51]

six M2 Browning machine guns :twisted:

[The_Goalie_94]

Ok guys, face it...a flamethrower on a P-51 in NAZI ZOMBIES would be sweet...:P Or a helicopter...

[haitch40]

ww2 aircraft guns only

[Soviet Ace]

1 × 20 mm ShVAK cannon,
2 × 12.7 mm Berezin UBS machine guns

[trk29]

ww2 aircraft guns only

Edited thread title.:)

[David603]

1 × 20 mm ShVAK cannon,
2 × 12.7 mm Berezin UBS machine guns
1x 20mm MG 151 cannon and 2x 13mm MG 131 machine guns will do me fine. That said, a Spitfire XIV with 2x 20mm Hispano cannon and 2x 12.7mm M2 is also good, though I really want one with 4 Hispanos.

[juz1]

did the germans ever mount the flak88 on a plane? Just wondering cos they mounted it pretty much on everything else!
________
COLORADO MEDICAL MARIJUANA DISPENSARIES (http://colorado.dispensaries.org/)

[Soviet Ace]

1x 20mm MG 151 cannon and 2x 13mm MG 131 machine guns will do me fine. That said, a Spitfire XIV with 2x 20mm Hispano cannon and 2x 12.7mm M2 is also good, though I really want one with 4 Hispanos.

Having 4 Hispanos would put a serious damper on your planes speed and maneuverability. I mean if you've ever held a real 20mm round, it's not light. So going up against a Me-109G-2 or maybe a FW-190A-5 would be dangerous, unless you were good enough to get on their tales first. And basically do some hit and run attacks.

But nothing can beat the maneuverability/handling of my Yak-3 :P :cool:

[SleepTrgt]

Yea im interested to see the yak-3 aswell, it sounds like thats gonna be the perfect plane for me.

[Soviet Ace]

Yea im interested to see the yak-3 aswell, it sounds like thats gonna be the perfect plane for me.

It's the best plane for anyone interested in light aircraft as well. Easy handling, quick maneuverability, and good guns. It's the best Soviet fighter made. That is, the La-5F is second in my book.

[David603]

Having 4 Hispanos would put a serious damper on your planes speed and maneuverability. I mean if you've ever held a real 20mm round, it's not light. So going up against a Me-109G-2 or maybe a FW-190A-5 would be dangerous, unless you were good enough to get on their tales first. And basically do some hit and run attacks.

But nothing can beat the maneuverability/handling of my Yak-3 :P :cool:
I did say the Spitfire XIV, the Griffon engined version, which has enough speed and climb performance not to need to get into a turning fight, and even then it is a pretty good turner. Anyway a Hispano 20mm cannon is only 10 pounds heavier than a .50cal M2(same amount for a pair of .303s too), and the 20mm ammo is heavier but this is balanced by not carrying as many rounds (20mm=120 rpg vs .50cal=250rpg) so the overall weight gain is not that much. At a guess (I'm not working out how much each ammo and gun option weighs in my head), an XIV with 4 Hispanos would be around 20-30 pounds heavier unloaded and about 50-60 pounds heavier with ammunition than one with 2 Hispanos and 2 .50cals, which seems worthwhile to me considering the firepower.

When flying the Spitfire XIV, I will mostly just rely on BnZing my enemies because the combination of a 448mph top speed and an instantaneous climb rate of more than 5000ft per min (4580ft per min sustained climb at sea level) is just about unbeatable, but if engaged at a disadvantage the XIV is still a good enough turner to beat out the Fw190 and Bf109 (same goes for any American fighter with comparable straight line performance) with little difficulty, and there isn't a prop engined fighter around that can follow the XIV in a steep, climbing turn.

Anyway, like you said, hit and run is the way to go. Erich Hartmann got 352 victories that way, and I have probably got even more using similar tactics in Il2, though I have definitely "died" a lot more times than he did :cool:

[SleepTrgt]

It's the best plane for anyone interested in light aircraft as well. Easy handling, quick maneuverability, and good guns. It's the best Soviet fighter made. That is, the La-5F is second in my book.

Yea, im more of an all round pilot, Can see the good things about BnZ but it really isnt for me.
I also like that the guns are more in the center!

[David603]

It's the best plane for anyone interested in light aircraft as well. Easy handling, quick maneuverability, and good guns. It's the best Soviet fighter made. That is, the La-5F is second in my book.
I like the Yak 3 when it comes to getting into a real dogfight, its a very nimble plane that can more than hold its own against my usual favourite TnB fighter, the Spitfire IX, but its doesn't suit my style of flying as well as the Bf109G does. The Fw190A8 is also pretty effective against it, because one burst from 4 20mm cannon plus 2 13mm MGs has a nasty habit of ripping wings and tails off planes or just blowing them up.

[Soviet Ace]

I wish they would have had a FW-190A3, rather an A5. I think considering the gun armaments and weight, both the Yak-3 and FW-190A3 would be a good turn and burn dogfight match. The A5 would be OK, but it does have a bit more weight than the A3.

I prefer to turn and burn with my enemies, rather than hit and run since you don't loose sight of your enemy as easy, and can calculate his moves fairly well.

[SleepTrgt]

Yea same reason i dont do well in BnZ aswell, lose sight of enemy too fast.

[The_Goalie_94]

ww2 aircraft guns only



Way to ruin the fun...

[thundermuffin]

Yea same reason i dont do well in BnZ aswell, lose sight of enemy too fast.

thirded. I honestly have very little clue how the vets of IL-2 are so good at that. ONLY using sight on what is nothing close to the resolution of the real-world is mind-bending. Honestly, those IL-2 Aces should be in the sky right now, defending their countries :P

[SleepTrgt]

I dont think they see their enemy, they feel them.
Or like some guy in "dogfights" said: I can smell them.

[The_Goalie_94]

thirded. I honestly have very little clue how the vets of IL-2 are so good at that. ONLY using sight on what is nothing close to the resolution of the real-world is mind-bending. Honestly, those IL-2 Aces should be in the sky right now, defending their countries :P

They to fat to do that...

[David603]

I wish they would have had a FW-190A3, rather an A5. I think considering the gun armaments and weight, both the Yak-3 and FW-190A3 would be a good turn and burn dogfight match. The A5 would be OK, but it does have a bit more weight than the A3.

I prefer to turn and burn with my enemies, rather than hit and run since you don't loose sight of your enemy as easy, and can calculate his moves fairly well.
Okay, a brief description of the Boom and Zoom tactics I use when I fight in Il2, particularly when flying 109s. I like to hang around airfields, and hit people as they take off, or while they are still climbing to altitude, moving to the "combat zone" etc. I will fly high above the general dogfight and pick off players who are busy fighting someone else, or who haven't spotted me. I will stalk enemies and have the patience to wait until they are in a vulnerable position. I won't stay and fight unless an enemy is definitely isolated and I know I will have time to kill them and regain position before anyone else comes along. Otherwise one pass is all I will take since the Bf109G is generally inferior to most of its opponents in a turning fight, though I will follow an enemy that breaks away long enough to get one firing pass. If this cannot be achieved without losing a lot of speed I will zoom climb back to altitude and go look for someone else to pick on, or wait for someone else to start attacking "my" victim.

Hmmmm......I wonder why no one ever says "that was a good fight" or "good game" after matches :)

[Soviet Ace]

thirded. I honestly have very little clue how the vets of IL-2 are so good at that. ONLY using sight on what is nothing close to the resolution of the real-world is mind-bending. Honestly, those IL-2 Aces should be in the sky right now, defending their countries :P

Because most Jet Jockies nowadays aren't real pilots. (My cousin is in the Air Force so don't say anything). The last of the dogfighters was during the Korean War, when you didn't have to flip a little switch and lock onto some guy with a heat seeker.

Unless I had a time machine, then I probably would try to become a real fighter pilot. :D But until then, I'll sit back and enjoy Il-2 on my TV :cool:

[Soviet Ace]

Okay, a brief description of the Boom and Zoom tactics I use when I fight in Il2, particularly when flying 109s. I like to hang around airfields, and hit people as they take off, or while they are still climbing to altitude, moving to the "combat zone" etc. I will fly high above the general dogfight and pick off players who are busy fighting someone else, or who haven't spotted me. I will stalk enemies and have the patience to wait until they are in a vulnerable position. I won't stay and fight unless an enemy is definitely isolated and I know I will have time to kill them and regain position before anyone else comes along. Otherwise one pass is all I will take since the Bf109G is generally inferior to most of its opponents in a turning fight, though I will follow an enemy that breaks away long enough to get one firing pass. If this cannot be achieved without losing a lot of speed I will zoom climb back to altitude and go look for someone else to pick on, or wait for someone else to start attacking "my" victim.

Hmmmm......I wonder why no one ever says "that was a good fight" or "good game" after matches :)

Nice :D

[Flanker15]

Okay, a brief description of the Boom and Zoom tactics I use when I fight in Il2, particularly when flying 109s. I like to hang around airfields, and hit people as they take off, or while they are still climbing to altitude, moving to the "combat zone" etc.


That's naughty, I got kicked for doing that.

My favorite BnZ tactic that works almost always when you encounter a TnB pilot:
Fly head on to the enemy plane, when they try to shoot you dive underneath their plane. Then pull into a steep climb and after you've climbed a good distance over your origonal hight slide over into a dive. Almost always the TnB pilot will start turning on the same alititued when you dive under them, so this manuver will put you in a high energy dive on a low energy truning or confused pilot. He'll be moving so slow you're going to tear him up 9/10 times.

[mondo]

Having 4 Hispanos would put a serious damper on your planes speed and maneuverability.

Tempest V did just fine with 4 Hispano MkV's. Thats the equivilent weight of fire is 12 .50's. And the Tempest V is a serious WW2 hot rod.

[mondo]

thirded. I honestly have very little clue how the vets of IL-2 are so good at that. ONLY using sight on what is nothing close to the resolution of the real-world is mind-bending. Honestly, those IL-2 Aces should be in the sky right now, defending their countries :P

Years of practice, knowing your plane and learning about convergence. Its actually much easier than a knife style dogfight as your prey usually don't know your about to fire on them so isn't manouvering.

[wannabetheace]

But nothing can beat the maneuverability/handling of my Yak-3 :P :cool:

yep, I'm totally in favor or u on this :cool:

[David603]

That's naughty, I got kicked for doing that.
I don't see that it is actually wrong, there is nothing in the "rules" of combat that says you can't shoot down planes before the pilot thinks he is in danger and I don't actually fly over the airfields themselves because of the flak. Anyway I don't tend to stay in one place long enough to get people really annoyed about picking on planes that have just taken off. For example, I will fly towards an airfield, knock down the next plane I see taking off and then move out to the transit to combat zone and trying to catch someone heading towards to combat, and then go back to a position above the main dogfight. This way there is less chance of someone who might be stalking me getting a good firing position and using my own tactics on me.

[juz1]

I don't see that it is actually wrong, there is nothing in the "rules" of combat that says you can't shoot down planes before the pilot thinks he is in danger and I don't actually fly over the airfields themselves because of the flak. Anyway I don't tend to stay in one place long enough to get people really annoyed about picking on planes that have just taken off. For example, I will fly towards an airfield, knock down the next plane I see taking off and then move out to the transit to combat zone and trying to catch someone heading towards to combat, and then go back to a position above the main dogfight. This way there is less chance of someone who might be stalking me getting a good firing position and using my own tactics on me.

I didn't think camping/spawn kill was possible in il2....I was wrong....;)
________
Town car (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Lincoln_Town_Car)

[David603]

Tempest V did just fine with 4 Hispano MkV's. Thats the equivilent weight of fire is 12 .50's. And the Tempest V is a serious WW2 hot rod.
Yes, and the Hispano has a very similar muzzle velocity to the .50cal too, which makes an excellent gun for putting down targets at long range. Love the Tempest V, it is one of the absolute best low altitude fighters of the war, but I haven't seen it so far in Birds of Prey. Now that, and the Spitfire XIV would be DLC I would be quite happy to pay for.

[David603]

I didn't think camping/spawn kill was possible in il2....I was wrong....;)
Camping, no, I am moving around a lot, just trying to keep a good position, its really more like flanking, or real life sniping, which is very different to what you will see in Call of Duty.

Spawn killing, not really, if I go for someone taking off the guy has at least a minute to live because I won't come into range of the flak guns on his base, because these going off would alert him to there being an enemy in the immediate area and ruin the kill :)

[juz1]

[QUOTE=David603;90644]Camping, no, I am moving around a lot, [QUOTE]

this ain't no copter game...


my mates and I used to call your kind of tactics "Steve Davis"...

if it works for you fine, but if a tactic stops the fun if everyone does it then its not quite cricket....

and moving camping is called "patrolling" in some quarters...time to break out the rpgs and noob tubes ;) stat whores get special attention !

just sayin...play it how you wanna...:grin:

just me and you logged on!! Night Night...
________
Toyota kz engine specifications (http://www.toyota-wiki.com/wiki/Toyota_KZ_engine)

[mondo]

I didn't think camping/spawn kill was possible in il2....I was wrong....;)

Think of it differently. Its a valid tactic and was used extensivly. The 2nd TAF and 9th AF specialised in this sort of thing.

What it boils down to is the defending airforce should protect its airstrip.

[David603]

this ain't no copter game...


my mates and I used to call your kind of tactics "Steve Davis"...

if it works for you fine, but if a tactic stops the fun if everyone does it then its not quite cricket....

and moving camping is called "patrolling" in some quarters...time to break out the rpgs and noob tubes ;) stat whores get special attention !

just sayin...play it how you wanna...:grin:

just me and you logged on!! Night Night...
I don't mind if everyone uses these tactics, I know how to use them and how to counter them, though it would cut down on some of the easier kills if people were more aware of their surroundings and position.

I suppose it is the airborne equivalent of sniping, which I suspect isn't much fun for the troops on the other end. However, it isn't impossible to counter, all you need to do is climb to altitude yourself when you get a chance and then come looking for me, I'm quite happy to engage in such 1v1 altitude fights with little or no chance of outside interference. Also, if I was really being unsporting, I would fly a jet and use the same tactics, they are even better in this role and virtually impossible to catch.

Anyway, would you mind defining moving camping, it seems like a contradiction in terms to me. Are you saying trying to retain an altitude advantage over you enemies is camping?

Also, I don't get the Steve Davis reference. Would you care to elaborate?

[Flanker15]

Think of it differently. Its a valid tactic and was used extensivly. The 2nd TAF and 9th AF specialised in this sort of thing.

What it boils down to is the defending airforce should protect its airstrip.

It's ok in some missions where everyone agrees to it and it's a special mission circumstance (a historic recreation for example)

On almost all servers there's a gentleman's agreement not to, as people play to dogfight each other and getting shot up when you can't fight back yet over and over isn't going to be a good experience for anyone.
Most of the time when it happens you can't rely on other planes to protect the airfield as they'll be miles away in an engagement or stuck on the ground with you (as your allies get shot down they end up stuck with you until the whole team is getting shot to pieces by vulchers).
You are allowed to attack planes on the ground with bombs and rockets if it's your mission to attack the airfield however.

If you end up getting vulched repeatedly a last resort tactic is:
Change to a bomber of some sort and outfit the largest bombs available (you know where this is going). Sit on the ground and wait for the offending aircraft to come in for a pass and as he moves over you, drop the bombs. The wonderful shrapnel system in Il-2 will swiss cheese his plane and send him into the ground (netting you a kill). Then you just change back and take off.

[haitch40]

or u can get a bomber with tones of guns and use it as an AA site

[Soviet Ace]

If I meet any of you online, and you try to BnZ me (David :P) you better make sure I get shot down, or I'm coming for you :P :D :cool:

[David603]

If I meet any of you online, and you try to BnZ me (David :P) you better make sure I get shot down, or I'm coming for you :P :D :cool:
What with? :) You have to catch me to kill me, or be pretty good at snap shots, and the closest even a La-7 comes to matching performance with a 109K4 is below 5000ft where it is slightly faster in a straight line and only slightly worse at climbing. Above this the gap grows quite rapidly, with the K4 having 40mph top speed and over 1000ft climb per min over a La-7 at 20,000ft. The gap in performance to a Yak 3 is even bigger.

Tell you what though, if you want a TnB fight I'll fly a Spitfire XVI and you can fly a Yak-3. Pretty good match up, I think you would agree.

[Soviet Ace]

Between a MkXIV and Yak-3? That could be interesting, but I think a MkIX Spit would be a better match.

[David603]

Between a MkXIV and Yak-3? That could be interesting, but I think a MkIX Spit would be a better match.
I said Spitfire XVI, not XIV, which is a bigger difference than the numbers make it look. You're right though, a XIV is an even better energy fighter than the 109K, so that wouldn't really be evening out anything:)

The XVI is basically a Packard Merlin engined IX, and I want it because the Birds of Prey version has a cutdown rear fuselage and bubble canopy that the BoP version of the IX doesn't have. Not really anything else to pick between them, because the Rolls Royce and Packard versions of the Merlin are pretty much the same and a real life IX can have all the same features as a XVI.

[Soviet Ace]

The MkXVI is a Packard Merlin MkIX. But either way, when you over shoot in either a MkXIV or MkXVI whatever, I'll get you while trying to recover :P

[David603]

The MkXVI is a Packard Merlin MkIX. But either way, when you over shoot in either a MkXIV or MkXVI whatever, I'll get you while trying to recover :P
Not the XIV, because I wouldn't get into a turning fight with a Yak-3 flying that. Now a XVI (lets call it a IX to avoid confusion), then maybe, but I'm pretty good at using a high yo-yo not to overshoot, and years of BnZ have taught me how to get out of situations where I might overshoot and end up sitting in front of an enemy.

[Soviet Ace]

I would tell you what I do to counter a high yo-yo, but I'd rather show you. :D

[David603]

I would tell you what I do to counter a high yo-yo, but I'd rather show you. :D
I'll be watching, but when you are preparing your performance I should warn you the spectator seats in this kind of demonstration sometimes have an unexpected habit of changing their mind about which angle the show would look best from and aren't afraid of late minute changes. The audience is also prone to throwing abuse and 20mm cannon shells onstage if they don't like the way you are doing it.

[Soviet Ace]

We'll see. But I think you'll be surprised at my counter of the high yo-yo. I actually learned it from an interview on WW2 Dogfights. It wasn't the History Channel series "Dogfights" incase you were wondering. I can't recall the name.

[David603]

Would it by any chance be dropping the flaps to landing and throttling back so the enemy completes his manoeuvre and finds himself sitting right in front of you?

[Soviet Ace]

I told you, I'm not telling. It's a secret that I will unveil on release day :cool:

[David603]

I told you, I'm not telling. It's a secret that I will unveil on release day :cool:
Ok, I can live with that. My online avatar on the other hand.........

[mondo]

It's ok in some missions where everyone agrees to it and it's a special mission circumstance (a historic recreation for example)

On almost all servers there's a gentleman's agreement not to, as people play to dogfight each other and getting shot up when you can't fight back yet over and over isn't going to be a good experience for anyone.

It usually in the server rules and I don't go on those servers ;) I tend to fly on full switch servers (zeke vs wildcat for instance) with maps that have decent AA emplacements so you have to work with others to take them out first.

[Almighty Blighty]

ww2 aircraft guns only

http://samilitaryhistory.org/vol124lw.html

sorry, i had do do this

EDIT: it is my favourite gun though.

[haitch40]

http://samilitaryhistory.org/vol124lw.html

sorry, i had do do this

EDIT: it is my favourite gun though.

nice ok im going to change the rules a bit
i will allow any ww2 aircraft guns and what you might deem as super weapons past and present such as the nuke or mini gun all other weapons r not allowed

[Almighty Blighty]

oooooooooh, spoil sport :(

[Soviet Ace]

http://samilitaryhistory.org/vol124lw.html

sorry, i had do do this

EDIT: it is my favourite gun though.

All it is is a Naval gun on rails :-o

[SleepTrgt]

yea and twice the size of the biggest gun ever on a battleship!

[Almighty Blighty]

so, technically, not a naval gun then...

[Soviet Ace]

Well since the Kriegsmarine was all battered to hell, they couldn't actually build a battleship to carry the gun. So it was put on rails.

[SleepTrgt]

I dont think this gun would fit on a ship dude like i said its almost twice the size as the guns of the Yamato!

[David603]

It was never meant to be a naval gun. Read the article, it was designed specifically to break the Maginot line.

[Soviet Ace]

I dont think this gun would fit on a ship dude like i said its almost twice the size as the guns of the Yamato!

From what I read about German X planes etc. they were trying to come up with a ship that could actually carry a gun like this. I don't know if they ever made any blue prints, as in the book it doesn't show any.

EDIT: They also had an idea for a Super Tank known as P.1000 Ratte (Rat)
http://discaircraft.greyfalcon.us/picturess/rat200.jpg

[Steiner]

http://www.virtualpilots.fi/en/feature/photoreports/hallinportti2002/h_BK_mg151.jpg

[David603]

From what I read about German X planes etc. they were trying to come up with a ship that could actually carry a gun like this. I don't know if they ever made any blue prints, as in the book it doesn't show any.
Thats the H44 class, which was designed for 8 20in(50.8cm) calibre guns. This is a 80cm calibre gun.

[The Doctor B]

Hispanos are great!:grin:

[David603]

Hispanos are great!:grin:
Best 20mm cannon of WWII. In fact, the best gun of WWII for dogfighting.

[bird of bait]

i say the m2 brownings are the best allround guns they were used everywhere and when there are 6 behind you rattling you will crap your pants

[David603]

i say the m2 brownings are the best allround guns they were used everywhere and when there are 6 behind you rattling you will crap your pants
The only reason the USAAF and USN stayed with 6 .50cals as the standard armament for fighters during WWII was that the changes introduced to the Hispano to "Americanise" it made it very unreliable and prone to jamming. When the Hispano became sufficiently reliable and available in sufficient quantities (this happened very late in the war) it replaced the .50cals on USN aircraft.

[mondo]

The only reason the USAAF and USN stayed with 6 .50cals as the standard armament for fighters during WWII was that the changes introduced to the Hispano to "Americanise" it made it very unreliable and prone to jamming. When the Hispano became sufficiently reliable and available in sufficient quantities (this happened very late in the war) it replaced the .50cals on USN aircraft.

The US built there own version of it and uncharacteristically it was very poorly manufactured. Even the US made 20mm rounds were poor quality. Possible conspiracy! ;)

There was also logistical concerns, with a new weapon you need differnet training, different handling and packing...sticking with one gun and one type of bullet makes a huge amount of sense.

[BRIGGBOY]

yes i think so to and i was hoping the hawker tempest would of been in game or as DLC

[ButcherBird]

hows about that 37mm M4 cannon in the nose of the Bell P-39 Airacobra.

i know they could be prone to jamming, but that 37mm round certainly packed a punch when the cannon was functioning properly

[haitch40]

jeeze never thought this would come up again

[bobbysocks]

did the germans ever mount the flak88 on a plane? Just wondering cos they mounted it pretty much on everything else!

if they did would have to have been like a Puff the Magic Dragon...

love 6 50cals....But cant beat a mini gun... 6000 rpm! "GE, we bring good things to life"...haha

[stealth finger]

http://www.virtualpilots.fi/en/feature/photoreports/hallinportti2002/h_BK_mg151.jpg
Better walk softly with that bad boy!