Some odd stuff happening... could be exploited though.

[DGDobrev]

OK, here's the deal... Right now I'm lvl 26 on the islands, I just took anga's ruby. So I swapped the tactics treatise I was carrying in my hero's artifact slot with Xeona's artifact slot that had some other simple item. I put the ring on my char and the treatise on xeona's artifact slot.

The treatise was in a bad shape already, it had only 5 morale, so I was prepared to suppress it soon, since it's easy.

The next battle the treatise's morale went to 0 and I suppressed it. I got some gold (8500 per victory), 409 XP (pitiful) and some rage.

BUT!!!

The treatise's morale remained 0 in xeona's artifact slot. I assumed I did something wrong and suppressed it again easily. But the morale still remained 0. I suppressed it a few more times and still got XP and money from it, while the morale was still 0.

I wonder if this happens with every item that has morale if it's put in the wife's respective slot or it's just xeona + treatise issue. It's woth the try, but I have few useful artifacts with morale, so I was wondering if anyone can confirm this odd thing.

If this is a bug that persists, one can easily get tons of XP as long and he/she's willing to waste a minute per battle for 409 XP (with learning lvl 3 though, will be less for a char without it).

I'm using nobilis' patch 1.7, if this helps.

EDIT: I think this can be exploited big time. I returned to my greenwort's save game before going to the islands since it was way too early in the day (and I would waste it for anga's ruby and then another one to get back). So I killed a few armies in the old castle in velarion, and that kicked me to 27. Then started suppressing from there, then went to the islands at the proper time, where I am right now. Getting from lvl 27 to 28 took 200 suppressings. From 28 to 29 I needed about 220 suppressings. Keeping in mind that you barely spend time on the game map (only to hit f5 and then get back into your inventory, each suppress takes only a few minutes worth game time. I usually do it in 2 minutes at most. So let's say 200 x 3 mins it's 10 hours. 220 x 3 mins it's 660 mins or 11 hours. From 29 to 30 it would take 250 suppressings. And I've got only 3/4 of my XP bar to fill till 30, and it's still close to 1PM. It's actually very tardy now, since I've been doing this the entire day (real life day, sheesh), but... It's rewarding and it's wasting little game time.

That also means 200 x 8500 = 1.7 mil gold. 220 x 8500 = 1.87 mil gold. 250 x 8500 = 2.125 mil gold. You may get different numbers, since I have the bonus loot skill, since I'm playing a paladin.

From 30 to 31 it's 850k XP, and that's 850000/409 = 2078.2 suppressings :P I won't do that even if I'm the biggest grinder in the entire game universe. Although it will be fun seeing someone hit lvl 31 on impossible :P

The conclusion is that with a proper time investment (especially when you have the spare time before traveling somewhere) and a good enough army to get you through the battle with no losses, you have some free XP to gain, as long as you're willing to invest the time. Personally, I'm a grinder and I don't like wasting game days, so that little trick is a nice way to compensate for the waiting.

EDIT 2: You can even minimize the time between suppressions if you pause the game after each suppress. Then save, open inventory (you're allowed that) and suppress again.

I'm starting to think that this is a really big exploit. What I can't confirm is whether it works with the other wives and with other items that have morale. I just discovered it now on lvl 27 with xeona as my wife...

[Razorflame]

i think this was already noted by ryastar
i think he used it to get mass rage before entering battles

it's the treastise thing that is bugged
and will be until a new patch arrives:)

[DGDobrev]

well... Until the new patch arrives, it's a pretty nice thing to exploit :)

[Elwin]

Yes i got same, but it doesnt depend if its on wife or not.

[Ryastar]

nope, wasn't me, I've never even seen this tactics treatise before, it hasn't shown up in any of my games.

I don't remember ever seeing anything about this trick before. It's rather broken. Good spotting, DGDobrev.

[Razorflame]

well sry then rya
but i had seen this before :)

[Metathron]

I don't like wasting game days

since I've been doing this the entire day (real life day, sheesh)

Yeah, as long as game days aren't wasted. :roll:

[Razorflame]

pretty sick shit :>

addict ^^

[DGDobrev]

Addict... Probably. However, even though I got up to 29 using that, I finally returned to a previous save game, because I didn't want to have a high score based on exploiting the game bugs. I posted it, and you can see that the battle count is only 498 (and the xp is a good amout over 30 because of the kids I had from rina before), which makes it clear that I didn't use this exploit more than 5 or 6 times.

But I most certainly think that if anyone wants to try his hand at the treatise, he's welcome to do so. It's very rewarding in terms of money and experience and it saves a lot of game time that would go to waste.

[Razorflame]

a bit lame but i also remember another items that could be suppressed but never got morale higher than 0 again

forgot which one though

[Elwin]

elven crown ...

[DGDobrev]

Elven crown? Ouch!! It's one of the best artifacts I have ever seen because of the leadership bonus. It's sad that it's also bugged.

[Calinda]

With 1.6 at the time when I played treatise wasn't bugged in such manner.

[DGDobrev]

Yeah, absolutely. But in 1.6 mirabella was bugged... but there was still a mod that you could get her without any problems. IT would appear that 1.6.5 may prove to be the best patch in terms of correct gameplay.

I agree that 1.7 introduced some nice additions and corrections, but it also bugged a few things :)

[Vilk]

elven crown ...

That's dependent of some condition, I checked save game and as I remember I had it to zero but removed it to get back morale 80. And that was with 1.7 update of retail version (not stream).

[DGDobrev]

In any case, although I said I won't... I'm working on lvl 31, suppressing the treatise like crazy in front of king mark's castle :D

It takes like 60-120 seconds real time to do a suppress with the fast animation mod for the spirits. It's fun actually... to be on the way to 31 on impossible when the general opinion is that it's unreasonable :P

And besides, the battles are so easy and fast. A few slashes, time back, ressurrection if necessary and all over again.

It will take some time, but that's a big challenge and I'm determined. And besides, I needed like 1850 suppressions before ending the game, now seeing the xp bar, I think I need like 800 more. I'll do it these days I guess...

[Elwin]

I abandoned this idea very fast .. too boring ..

[Razorflame]

but a good way to beat calina's record by getting level 31 and beating the game in 6-7 days :>

[DGDobrev]

This can't be done :) Each suppression takes about 1-2 mins of game time. Before I finished the game my XP count was only 4k less than calinda's, BUT... I needed like 1850 suppressions. Even if I lose 1 min per suppression, that's 1850 minutes or 30 hours. That's over a day.

So Calinda's score is safe and sound, and I still think it's the best possible. I think I have like 700 suppressions left... And the way this is going, I'm going to lose at least 2 days in doing that, so I'll end up at day 13 I think. We'll see... I'll post the score and the stats after I'm done. With a bit of effort, I should be ready tomorrow... but we'll see.

[Razorflame]

make a new game and try it out ASAP :>
get the XP :>

[DGDobrev]

I won't do that. Even if I do, the best I can finish is day 9 in that case. It would be a big waste of time. I'm doing the suppressions for fun now just because I haven't decided what I want from King's bounty next.

I'm not sure how this "hero level and completed quests +2%" counts in the formula. Doing the formula Calinda posted:
(game days * difficulty)
100 + [(100 - 9)*4] *3.64 = 1688.96

I can't figure out what this 3.64 is and how the char's level counts in it.

EDIT: Interesting. I was doing some tests between the suppressions. If I do the 2 quests I didn't do and lose 1 day, my top score of 1623 actually becomes 1627. In any case, I'm only about 600 suppressions to go :P

[DGDobrev]

Well, I finally suppressed that item long and hard enough to get that level 31 on impossible :P

The suppressions were easy and quick, because I had my powerpuff girl party waiting in greenwort.

So who says going to lvl 31 on impossible is unreasonable? ;)

I'll add screenshots of this feat to the post. It took exactly 1831 or 1832 suppressions to get to that elusive lvl 31. You will see a ton of 1623 scores in that screenshot... Please ignore them. Those were my tests to analyze what impacts the score and how.

Now I can happily remove win XP and go vista. I got my 4GBs of RAM (my XP doesn't support 4 gigs and uses only 2 of them) today as well as Armored princess demo in russian, which is pretty fluent. So far KB: AP looks great.

For those who hadn't had a glimpse of AP, I'll use my own thread to go off-topic and give you some impressions. I can also make a few screenshots if you want. I just don't know if it's appropriate to make a thread in the KBTL forums about KBAP :)

The plot is that Baal's demons invade greenwort and king mark sends Amelie through a portal to save her. Although everyone shows confidence that the battle will be won, it actually looks hopeless.

Amelie can once again play 3 classes:
Warrior - a kinda dark red haired girl in a girlishly tough red armor
Paladin - a blonde girl with an elegant blue armor with holy crosses
Mage - a sexy skimpy dressed brunette girl

Some of the artifacts are the same as KB: TL. Other just have the same picture with different properties. There are also new ones added. My favorite banner of true faith for example now gives 20% crit to the paladins (a variation of the knights in KBTL, although the knights are still there) as well as some other bonuses, but still gives 10 mind runes after 60 victories.

Attributes now have bigger impact on the game. Intellect for example improves the spell damage by 5% per point of intellect. Every 7 points additionally improve the spell damage by 15% and every 20 improve the spell duration by 1 turn. Rejoice mages :P

Levelups are faster and provide more runes, since there is a ton of new skills. Also there is only 1 class-specific skill now. Warriors retain rage with anger as usual, mages have higher magic and paladins get the crappy Resurrection skill which brings to life 60-80% of the losses of a random troop in battle. Once again the paladins get the worst skill there is :P

Spirits of rage are replaced by a dragon that has unique abilities, some close to that of the spirits of rage: like putting up a wall, chargers for mana (it has a different name), it can attack monsters and such. Just like KBTL there is a skill that makes the little dragon get levels much more quickly and uses rage for its skills. The dragon levels up to 60 just like amelie.

There are some new monsters and some of the old ones have new portraits. Not big of a deal here. Traveling between islands, continents and such is governed by a special time system (3 hrs, 6 hrs, etc) and doesn't take a full day nor can be exploited like in KBTL where you could travel in 6:55AM and end up on the same day in 7AM.

In order to open up new lands, you usually have to fight some monster that holds the map or you can kite it away from it and go steal it.

Another new thing is that this game has different badges, medals and such. For example, if you manage to get 10 victories without a single loss, you get +200 Leadership. If you pop up a certain amount of chests on the battlefield, you will get more +3% more XP per battle. All those medals and badges and such can be upgraded and you can get more leadership, more XP per battle and such.

So lets hope the English version of the game will hit the shelves soon. The demo has some bugs which for all I see are fixed. For example, 3 archers attack my thorns with fire arrow and inflict 12 damage and burn them. Suddenly the thorns lose like 40 HP's from the burning. For some reason burning and poisoning were bugged but they are fixed now.

To conclude, I can only say that KB: AP will be even better than expected and with better replayability due to the different kinds of builds and different skill setups one can get.

[Elwin]

. You will see a ton of 1623 scores in that screenshot... Please ignore them. Those were my tests to analyze what impacts the score and how.


what for? u havve it written below ranks dont you? :p

[Razorflame]

nice info about AP :)

[DGDobrev]

what for? u havve it written below ranks dont you? :p

I do. But I had to try out some different things. Like completing just before and after the day ends, with more or less quests completed, with the whole tournament completed, with some other things that I didn't know if they count as quests and such. I had to analyze which quests I have missed since I don't have a complete list here. That's why it was like that.

[DGDobrev]

OK, time for some more news about the Princess :)

Each skill tree has 14 skills now.

As soon as you do the thing you must do to complete a quest, you get the money, any other prize there is, and the XP. Most of the time you don't need to go back to the quest giver which is a real time saver. I'm sure they'll keep it in the english version of the game as well.

Multiple ressurrections to ensure a no losses win is getting very difficult now. Inquisitors have only 3 charges of holy anger and each nets 3-10 points of rage, not 5-10 as it was before. Magic spring still works, but it's going to be a very slow ressing, provided the enemy party allows a proper use of the spring - like no retaliation or ranged enemies... Probably this is because of the new medal for no-losses win in the battle.

Paladins, the new unit that looks like the Knight from KBTL also has limited ressurrection capabilities like the Inquisitor. The Inquisitor is still the better ressurrecter by far :)

Gaining a new level does not offer a selection choice what to improve. You get runes and a certain amount of leadership now. As usual, warriors get the most and mages get the least. It ranges from 20 to 40 on the lower levels.

Higher magic, meditation and concentration are moved to the very bottom of the mage tree. Now to get that faster mana regen on the map and in-combat mana regen you need a serious investment in the other skills first.

The skill that makes the warrior retain its rage longer is also moved to the very bottom of the tree. It also requires a lot of rune investment to get it.

Paladins ability "Runic stone" is gone now. They get some kind of "accuracy" skill which allows them to break the unnecessary items and get magic crystals and runes out of them. It's available to anyone who can afford it. The tolerance skill is also gone. They get a Persuasion skill which improves the morale (and I think initiative too) of various units - like humans, elves, orc and such. Also their class specific Holy Anger skill in KBTL is available to everyone now, just mage's alchemy. Iron fist seems to be gone in KBAP.

So the gameplay is going to be substantially different from KBTL as it seems now :)

[Razorflame]

thnaks man keep up the good work! :>

[DGDobrev]

I forgot one :)

If the enemies are weaker than you, now they run like you're the seventh ruler of hell :) You can stull pursue, engage and give them the right pounding they deserve :P

More stuff:
The dragon can summon allies on the battlefield. It can steal an egg from somewhere that hatches the next round, spawning 100+50% of the hero's leadership things (can be various creatures) - provided the AI doesn't destroy the egg. Even if it does, it's a nice way to take a few hits off your army. Besides, the AI is still a sucker for summoned units.

Some skills require the dragon to rest for a few rounds just like the spirits of rage. However, there is a spell with which you can awaken it and force your pet to use its abilities on the next round as well.

The XP per action of the dragon is fixed for all it seems, not like Reaper's soul draining, for example. On the tooltip of each skill the dragon has is written the amount of base XP it will receive for performing that specific skill. That's a nice addition. I only need to test whether the use of 3-4 different skills will net the combined XP from them. The skill that the hero has for pet training, which forces it to get more xp per use of ability doesn't seem to be taken into account in the tooltip though.

Another one - and HELL IT'S A BIG ONE!
The Paladin Amelie no longer gets a resurrection scroll at start as it was in KBTL's Paladin. She starts with heal and bless inscribed in the book and a peacefulness scroll
The Amelie Mage starts with fire arrow rather than fireball spell inscribed in the book.
The Amelie Warrior starts only with 1 haste scroll.

[Elwin]

Man btw all it was already written in KB:AP part of forum ... :P And waking dragon alows you to use 2 abilities in same turn ..

[DGDobrev]

Interesting, I can't see a KBAP forum anywhere on this site.

[Ryastar]

It's here:

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/forumdisplay.php?f=146