variety in early recruitable troops!

[namad]

this game is the worst king's bounty yet in terms of this! 90-95% of recruitable troops in the first 3 maps are the same 7-10 units! the 4th map adds 1or2 new ones? this amount of randomness is just way too little in my opinion compared to legends or AP!!! give me some CHOICES some variety! king's bounty games have good replayability due to randomness, EXCEPT warriors of the north's first several hours doesn't!

[Razorflame]

amen to that lol:)

[camelotcrusade]

Yes I completely agree. I am considering buying KB for a friend as a present but I don't want to give WoTN because the early experience isn't what I like about it. How they didn't notice it I'm not sure. Must have been a conscious decision to make use Vikings, I don't know.

What I also want to know is - can any modders change this? Or is it beyond what mods could do? Would be nice to have more variability.

[namad]

buy your friend legends or crossworlds, they're both AMAZING GAMES and cheaper anyways!



now here's the question though... on island 5 does it open up? island 4 stops being all about vikings but in my first playthrough at least island 4 only adds a couple new units and repeats the 1-4 non-vikings that existed across island 1-3 (wolves/bears/snakes/pirates)


if this game is just a LONGER game, with a boring opener ... then it might not be so bad? the boring nonrandom opener is better for a newbie because it's easier to balance? if the later areas fully randomize up maybe wotn will be the best game yet?



then again one beef I have.... you get the flying horse after like 1hour of play, instead of MANY... this means you never have to do dangerous dances around the island, killing what you can to access things you need, avoiding things... all that tension and overworld map puzzling is gone! that said I think they plan to make use of FREQUENT underground areas to prevent this from ruining the entire pace? and that said... flying horse early on? FREAKING AWESOME! the movement system was never that strong so the flying horse cuts down on some tedium, but it also means I never have to fight a strong enemy while weak enemies still exist!


this means I've been able to kill all the weak enemies first, and by the time I get to the strong ones they're only "equal" earlier flying horse means easier play...then again islands 5-x might have dastardly huge underground areas with highly random play


edit: BTW units in wotn are just flat out better than ever before, they've redone old units as well as added new ones and they've tweaked abilities and stats so that previously awful units have a few new tricks up their sleeves, if I could start wotn on island3 instead of island1 I might LOVE IT

[camelotcrusade]

Interesting points, I could see where it might have been intentional. I prefer variety always, though, because it increases replay and fun factor for me.

I also love all the new abilities pumped into units and wish I could play Crossworlds with them. Maybe they will introduce a platinum version on steroids with all the new unit changes... I'd probably get it. I do know not everyone feels this way tho... one of my friends was just complaining he thought it was too much, and that lower level units should be simpler instead of having pages to read for every single unit. Not my feeling, but I understand what he's saying.

And don't forget... new abilities also means more bugs.

[saroumana]

This could be corrected by mod. When i'll have finish Wotn, i'll make a new version of more randon shop.

[namad]

Interesting points, I could see where it might have been intentional. I prefer variety always, though, because it increases replay and fun factor for me.

I also love all the new abilities pumped into units and wish I could play Crossworlds with them. Maybe they will introduce a platinum version on steroids with all the new unit changes... I'd probably get it. I do know not everyone feels this way tho... one of my friends was just complaining he thought it was too much, and that lower level units should be simpler instead of having pages to read for every single unit. Not my feeling, but I understand what he's saying.

And don't forget... new abilities also means more bugs.


yeah like the bug wherein the skald unit, if it uses it's 1 ability it will crash the game like 30-90% of the time, and it won't crash till a minute later so you can't even figure out that's the cause of the crash till you come to this forum?



hmmm I do love how in homm3 low level units are simple... but I'd say in king's bounty there really aren't any low level units, you don't "level up" to access more powerful units! you just randomly find them, you can have nothing but high level units on island 1or2 (at least in crossworlds highly random play) it's just you have powerful units, or plentiful units, the plentiful units typically both DEAL and TAKE more damage! and the 'plentiful' level 1 units ...while they may have lots of abilities now, they're still simpler than level 5 units! comparing wotn to legends I'd just say say each level of units has two or three times as many abilities now! but a lot of abilities are highly thematic and not that critical, especially on lower level units, minor bonuses aren't key? I find I really like the vikings units, I might even choose them if I had more variety, I just wish I had more freedom to find synergy with a half viking half non-viking army (at one point I was using bears, ancient bears, berzerkers, axe throwers, and soothsayers) ... then "plot happened" and I couldn't replenish my bears and I had to go back down to using slingers... slingers....are...awful! they do less damage than almost any weak ranged unit I've ever had before... I much prefered bowmen or...uh... goblin throwers... or even skeleton archers? maybe that's just me though... I also find the slingers ability is AWFUL it does so little damage there is absolutely never a case in which I use it and it does more damage than a basic attack would?...why...bother? if I can hit 3units with it, it should outdamage my normal attack, it's got a reload, it's supposed to be special? raaaage skalds are bugged and can't be used, slingers stink, the other vikings are great... but for the first two islands I only had vikings/berzekers/axe thowers and soothsayers!


got jarls at end of island2, never got warrior maidens... rambling rambling rambling

[camelotcrusade]

This could be corrected by mod. When i'll have finish Wotn, i'll make a new version of more randon shop.

Yes please! I don't mind waiting longer to have more options for useful/powerful units, but I feel we should at least have more options for the early units we are supposed to make do with. :)

[Kel]

now here's the question though... on island 5 does it open up? island 4 stops being all about vikings but in my first playthrough at least island 4 only adds a couple new units and repeats the 1-4 non-vikings that existed across island 1-3 (wolves/bears/snakes/pirates)

Well, i do not think that there are less units available in WotN than in AP on the first islands. It just takes more time to finish the first islands. For example i got engineers and alchemists on the second island.
But to answer your question, "island 5" is darion (greenwort, verlorn, arlania and marshan swamp). So you will see many new units, for example my current army is composed of paladins, ice dragons, royal thorns, jarls and rune mages (rune mages are changed from CW).

[Darkeonz]

The random generation is what keeps king's bounty fresh, and I do agree it's a bit of a problem in this version. Doesn't seem nearly as random

[Zhuangzi]

As said above, I think the problem is that the first four islands really take a lot of grinding to get through, and you are basically locked into using Vikings during that time. I'm really looking forward to getting back to adventuring around Arlania, something you could never do in AP/CW. But yes, slow start and lots of grinding. I suspect that new players wouldn't mind as much, being new to the whole thing, for but us veterans it's a bit on the boring side...

[namad]

Well, i do not think that there are less units available in WotN than in AP on the first islands. It just takes more time to finish the first islands. For example i got engineers and alchemists on the second island.
But to answer your question, "island 5" is darion (greenwort, verlorn, arlania and marshan swamp). So you will see many new units, for example my current army is composed of paladins, ice dragons, royal thorns, jarls and rune mages (rune mages are changed from CW).

okay thank heavens just one more to go!


it's not that every game doesn't start you out with some boring fixed group, sure they do, but typically after a bit it opens up, it seems like this game opens up at island 5, (4 long islands you can clear out fully) as opposed to in other games where it'd be after 1-3islands which were shorter (less fully clearable at first)


another thing is that getting the flying horse so early really makes things a grind! it's just a matter of picking the weakest battle, over and over and over and over, you never have to fight a really hard battle in order to get past a choke point on the map in order to access more loot/shops/weaker enemies like was common in the prior series... although hopefully with underground sections they can bring this tension back even in a game wherein you get teh flying horse super early!

I liked it in crossworlds where you got the flying horse, say maybe halfway in? sort of depending of course... that way.. by the time you got the flying horse you were mostly through most of the islands and you just had a lot of backtracking and partially explored areas to re-tread and you wanted to do it in a hurry as you'd been there before, so blammo flying horse! I mean just think... in final fantasy you never get the airship in the first town!

[saroumana]

Yes please! I don't mind waiting longer to have more options for useful/powerful units, but I feel we should at least have more options for the early units we are supposed to make do with. :)

No need to hurry. You must restart a new game after. ;)

[Mandea]

it's not that every game doesn't start you out with some boring fixed group, sure they do, but typically after a bit it opens up, it seems like this game opens up at island 5, (4 long islands you can clear out fully) as opposed to in other games where it'd be after 1-3islands which were shorter (less fully clearable at first)


a
you should be thankful, Kb: Legend never opens up :). it's way more linear. But you are right, this game opens up starting from 5th island.

it may be a grind or not. no one forces you to fly and just pick up the easiest fight. I think they did it like this so everyone can have a chance. You can make it as hard as you want, in the end.