GTX 580 question

[Forcavitale]

Hi !
Im planning to buy a GTX 580 but im a bit worried if it will run well cause i only have a Corsair CX 600 with 40 amps on the 12+v(in fact it meets the minimum requierments for this card). Does anybody here have any experience of the 580 and a similar PSU?
Forca

[KG26_Alpha]

Hi !
Im planning to buy a GTX 580 but im a bit worried if it will run well cause i only have a Corsair CX 600 with 40 amps on the 12+v(in fact it meets the minimum requierments for this card). Does anybody here have any experience of the 580 and a similar PSU?
Forca

Personally i would say no............but read below.

This link helps with recommended PSU for SLI but you can get an idea of recommended specs.

http://www.slizone.com/object/slizone_build_psu.html

These links have some info regarding your PSU

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/318100-10-corsair-cx600-good

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/319264-10-what-card-corsair-cx600

[Forcavitale]

Thank you very much im gonna look in to those links

[Jatta Raso]

trust me, you need a new PSU. i had a NOX (not he greatest i know) 630W, brand new, bought a GTX 570 (Phantom, Gainward, not the 570 reference layout, consumes roughly as the 580) and whenever my GPU was stressed my system would power off; analyzing with GPU-Z, i'd read in the log that the power down would always occur after a few minutes over 95% GPU stress, when the card was at its peak of power demand

i found that this happens mostly because as the video card tries to get more power for its needs, the under-powered PSU probably diverts energy that is needed for the CPU or MOBO, and as the MOBO detects that as a dangerous power fluctuation, for stability's sake shuts down the system to prevent damage.

that never happened with CLoD (that was back in march) as it never showed that much GPU demand, but with Crysis, Crysis 2, Witcher 2, any recent power demanding app, it was a constant... i'd get 5-7min play then blackout.

then i decided for a new Corsair TX 850W, 115€ here in euroland, but worth every cent; never regretted its cost, first class quality, all problems gone for good

[T}{OR]

In general, provided that you won't OC neither your CPU or GPU 600W PSU is more than enough for this card.

However CX series from Corsair is no where as good and is known to be a "dodgy" series of PSU-s.

If you can afford it, something from AX series from Crosair (re branded Seasonic with 7 year warranty and cheaper). This should cover all your needs.

If not, then HX or even refreshed VX v.2 series will do just fine.

Or just get a Seasonic PSU and be done with it. :)

[Forcavitale]

Well since the only game i play nowadays is clod, maybe i could give it a try with my old PSU, otherwise there is a corsair tx 850 for 120 euros

[KG26_Alpha]

Well since the only game i play nowadays is clod, maybe i could give it a try with my old PSU, otherwise there is a corsair tx 850 for 120 euros

So long as nothing goes bang and damages anything :)

I prefer to use Enermax with their 5 year warranty on the higher end PSU's..

http://www.enermax.co.uk/

Recommend at £125.75* Plus shipping cost

http://www.fotemia.co.uk/enermax/netzteil-700w-modu-87-87-gold-atx12v-v2-3-en/?utm_source=googlebase-co-uk&utm_medium=psm&utm_campaign=netzteil-700w-modu-87-87-gold-atx12v-v2-3-en&edate=2011-12-05&pv=acogkq

[Insuber]

Look at my signature ... 200 h of CloD and not a single power issue ... with a three years old 550W PSU.
Believe me, the power calculations done by PSU manufacturers have only one goal: sell more expensive units.
Your PSU is OK.

[ingsoc84]

I should be upgrading to a gtx 580 with 3 gig soon..figure..more ram the better...but will wait till around xmas or right thereafter and hopefully catch some sales.

[Forcavitale]

Thank you all for your help guys. Actually i been reading a lot about this as well and i have found lots of users with GTX 580 and a PSU like mine, so i think im gonna give it a try, but it is gonna have to be the 1.5 GB Version the 3GB is to expensive

[335th_GRAthos]

it is gonna have to be the 1.5 GB Version the 3GB is to expensive
What is the price difference???


And how much does the GTX570 2.57Gb VRAM cost???


~S~

[GOZR]

Very good alternative and better IMO .. :) more Vram the better.
GTX570 2.57Gb

[KG26_Alpha]

Thank you all for your help guys. Actually i been reading a lot about this as well and i have found lots of users with GTX 580 and a PSU like mine, so i think im gonna give it a try, but it is gonna have to be the 1.5 GB Version the 3GB is to expensive

Remember for correct performance from your system you need stable quality voltage,
some here complain their pc's dont run CoD properly with the equipment they have,
its no surprise listening to them and the comments.

I have repaired many PC's with PSU faults because the user was told it will be "ok",
toasted motherboards, hard drives, CPU's & GPU's are not funny when all you have to say is "some one on the internet told me it was ok",
then dig into your wallet because of their wonderful advice.

The CX600 is a budget PSU

The GTX570/580 are high end GPU's

Just a heads up. :grin:

[Forcavitale]

So In other words i will buy this as well it about 100 euros over here:
http://www.inet.se/produkt/6911321/corsair-tx-750w-m-80-bronze-modular

[Insuber]

Remember for correct performance from your system you need stable quality voltage,
some here complain their pc's dont run CoD properly with the equipment they have,
its no surprise listening to them and the comments.

I have repaired many PC's with PSU faults because the user was told it will be "ok",
toasted motherboards, hard drives, CPU's & GPU's are not funny when all you have to say is "some one on the internet told me it was ok",
then dig into your wallet because of their wonderful advice.

The CX600 is a budget PSU

The GTX570/580 are high end GPU's

Just a heads up. :grin:

You are right, and advising for the most expensive solution you cannot be wrong, considering that there are no statistics about this kind of issues. Everyone makes his choices and takes his responsibilities. I'm happy with my VX550 and GTX580 after 6 months of intensive use, but maybe I'm just lucky.

By the way, I was speaking about power/amps, not quality of the PSU, which MUST be of a good brand such as Corsair.

[Jatta Raso]

take a look

http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp

gives results a little over the top imho but it's on the safe side, a good guide nevertheless; just remember that Watts don't make up for Amps ;)

[Insuber]

For amps and watts, better look at this one:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cases/display/system-wattage_9.html

Instead of foggy "calculations", some solid measurement under stress. It confirms that my VX550 is more than enough for my configuration... :-D ... and for the OP too :-P


Ins

[Jatta Raso]

550W and GTX580?? you're pushing your luck... corsair is a great brand but VX is entry series, with that power output i doubt you've ever played any really GPU-intensive game without any issue, talking Crysis 1&2, Witcher 2, Metro... CLoD won't crash, but then again it never really pushed the GPU that hard

anyway, using Prime95 (really?...) 3Dmark, FurMark, or WhatEverMark to measure extreme gaming power needs, that's exactly what i would call 'foggy'... no harm intended but i think you're misleading the OP

[Jatta Raso]

So In other words i will buy this as well it about 100 euros over here:
http://www.inet.se/produkt/6911321/corsair-tx-750w-m-80-bronze-modular

that's an excellent PSU, if you ain't gonna do SLI anywhere in the future, you're set up for life

[Forcavitale]

I actually decided to spend another 10 euros and i got a TX 850


---
I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=59.330489,18.028174

[Jatta Raso]

I actually decided to spend another 10 euros and i got a TX 850


---
I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=59.330489,18.028174

this one?

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story&reid=126

that's precisely what i've done back in April, was considering a Corsair 750W but for 10€ more i got the TX850; with the additional power headroom you should even get away with an SLI if you ever want it; others prefer other brands, that's a matter of preference, but as a fact, great choice ;)

[Insuber]

550W and GTX580?? you're pushing your luck... corsair is a great brand but VX is entry series, with that power output i doubt you've ever played any really GPU-intensive game without any issue, talking Crysis 1&2, Witcher 2, Metro... CLoD won't crash, but then again it never really pushed the GPU that hard

anyway, using Prime95 (really?...) 3Dmark, FurMark, or WhatEverMark to measure extreme gaming power needs, that's exactly what i would call 'foggy'... no harm intended but i think you're misleading the OP

You're right mate, FurMark is not realistic, it pushes too much the PC with respect to a video game. It's not realistic, but on the excess side.
On my PC? Crysis 1 and Witcher 1, no problem. Full detail. And CloD is not a GPU intensive game? You are kidding. Anyway go for 1200 W, if you like, or whatever. And trust PSU manufacturers' "calculators", whose goal is just to sell you extra copper and increase margins.
BTW I would be happy to see some measurements, instead of the usual blabla. Measurements like these ones, for instance:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/balanced-gaming-pc-overclock,2699-15.html#

And look at the peak power, with Crysis @2560x1600, on an OC'ed i7920 with a GTX295 OC'ed, notoriously an energy hog vid card. What? ONLY 440W? So, no harm intended, but who's misleading who?

No really guys, be serious, and use your head ...

[Insuber]

Or, you may want to look at a test system with a GTX580. Taken from guru3D (http://www.guru3d.com/article/geforce-gtx-580-review/7):


GeForce GTX 580 review
By: Hilbert Hagedoorn Edited by Ian R Barling | Published: November 9, 2010 Power consumption

Let's have a look at how much power draw we measure with this graphics card installed.

The methodology: We have a device constantly monitoring the power draw from the PC. We simply stress the GPU, not the processor. The before and after wattage will tell us roughly how much power a graphics card is consuming under load.

Our test system is based on a power hungry Core i7 965 / X58 system. This setup is overclocked to 3.75 GHz. Next to that we have energy saving functions disabled for this motherboard and processor (to ensure consistent benchmark results). On average we are using roughly 50 to 100 Watts more than a standard PC due to higher CPU clock settings, water-cooling, additional cold cathode lights etc.

Keep that in mind. Our normal system power consumption is higher than your average system.

Measured power consumption

System in IDLE = 187W
System Wattage with GPU in FULL Stress = 447W
Difference (GPU load) = 260W
Add average IDLE wattage ~ 20W
Subjective obtained GPU power consumption = ~ 280 Watts
Mind you that the system wattage is measured from the wall socket and is for the entire PC. Below, a chart of measured Wattages per card. Overall this is much higher than reference, this is due to an increased GPU voltage to allow easy overclocking and the standard higher clock frequencies.


Again, 440 W, full stress, increased GPU voltage, power hungry i7 965/x58 ...

Also:


Here is Guru3D's power supply recommendation:

GeForce GTX 580
On your average system the card requires you to have a 650 Watt power supply unit.


So you're right, maybe, I'm a little bit short (but games don't stress the PSU as the FurMark tests), but my advice to keep the 600W PSU was perfectly legitimate. Or at least, guru3d and I are wrong, and you are right.

Cheers!

[Jatta Raso]

maybe i should have cleared that i meant the 550w being just short of the border case for yours and OP 580GTX, 600W i'd say, IF it's a quality PSU; trying that with cheap manufacturer will give issues; anyway i never meant the need over 750W. so 550W i believe may work ok, as long the PSU really is a quality one.

about CLoD, well it's GPU demanding, but i don't see it fully stressing it like other games do; in other words, it needs and will use all GPU power it can get, but doesn't seem to be working with the video card very effectively (or so it was just after launch); neither do i have much faith in 3D benches, although it is a measurement, just not so representative of the randomness that occurs in a video game

anyway, i'm sure the OP gained some insight looking at everyone's replies

[Insuber]

maybe i should have cleared that i meant the 550w being just short of the border case for yours and OP 580GTX, 600W i'd say, IF it's a quality PSU; trying that with cheap manufacturer will give issues; anyway i never meant the need over 750W. so 550W i believe may work ok, as long the PSU really is a quality one.

about CLoD, well it's GPU demanding, but i don't see it fully stressing it like other games do; in other words, it needs and will use all GPU power it can get, but doesn't seem to be working with the video card very effectively (or so it was just after launch); neither do i have much faith in 3D benches, although it is a measurement, just not so representative of the randomness that occurs in a video game

anyway, i'm sure the OP gained some insight looking at everyone's replies

I agree with you!

About benches, they stress the system at constant full load, while games have ups and downs. Well, apart from CloD ... :-)

[Insuber]

Everyone must consider that the copper reserves will last from 25 to 60 years. Everyone can do a little thing for our sons. Bigger PSU=more copper.

[recoilfx]

You guys are funny. I am running on a 460w PSU here with a 570gtx.

i5 2500k at 4.3ghz. 570gtx at 830mhz. Rock solid(except for CLoD, which doesn't like my card OC'ed, or it CTD).

Granted, this is one quality PSU (Seasonic ss-460fl)..

[Jatta Raso]

430w anyone?... (sarcasm)

[GOZR]

TX 850 is a good PSU for sure.

[Insuber]

You guys are funny. I am running on a 460w PSU here with a 570gtx.

i5 2500k at 4.3ghz. 570gtx at 830mhz. Rock solid(except for CLoD, which doesn't like my card OC'ed, or it CTD).

Granted, this is one quality PSU (Seasonic ss-460fl)..

Quality instead of quantity. Unfortunately, on the other hand the forums are full of people who - in good faith - support the inflationist PSU manufacturers' commercial strategy. it's all based on so called "calculators", duly inflated to sell more copper, and on the bad experience of someone with low-end PSUs. "I've seen a friend who fried the MB because of the low power PSU blah blah blah!". Normally no details whatsoever are given.

This widespread attitude is really impressive, it has probably to do with some sort of psychological pitfall in men's brain. Bigger is better! ;-) And marketing is more powerful than the experimental results. Money is yours, so no problem, except for the useless depletion of copper resources.

Cheers!

[Jatta Raso]

it's only rational to go for a safe margin, knowing that most PSUs are not very good and have in reality an output below advertised; add that all PSUs do degrade performance over time and having a borderline PSU is asking for problems; in the long run most hardware failures (toasts) come from a defective power supply, that is known for fact, at least among ppl who do not mystify these things. but then again, everyone is master of his decision, as the risk is always on the betting side..

[recoilfx]

Quality PSU is always a must, I didn't advocate for crappy PSU.

However, having anything >500w quality PSU for one 580gtx is excessive.

Alright, time for empirical evidence.
My system is currently this:
4ghz i5 2500k (lowered the clock last night because I wanted turned some fans off for quieter operation).
570 gtx
1 90GB SSD
8GB (2x4gb)
1 120GB SSD
1 2TB HD
GA-Z68MX MB
3 fans running (in quiet mode).

Using Killwatt, I get this:
Idle is <80 watts.
Black death track on CloD never tops 280 watts

Remember this is wall draw, not output. It's efficiency is at around 90% at that wall draw, so the actual PSU load (using my sloppy math) is 252 watts. That means during gaming, the PSU is only at ~50% load. Average load would be even lower!

I think my system is running fine with a 40% margin buffer. If a PSU degrades that much within its life time, then it s a crappy PSU people shouldn't have bought in the first place.

What people should really doing is buying PSU that will give them the best efficiency given their components, and right now, for one GPU system, no more than 500watts (for a quality PSU).

[Insuber]

Quality PSU is always a must, I didn't advocate for crappy PSU.

However, having anything >500w quality PSU for one 580gtx is excessive.

Alright, time for empirical evidence.
My system is currently this:
4ghz i5 2500k (lowered the clock last night because I wanted turned some fans off for quieter operation).
570 gtx
1 90GB SSD
8GB (2x4gb)
1 120GB SSD
1 2TB HD
GA-Z68MX MB
3 fans running (in quiet mode).

Using Killwatt, I get this:
Idle is <80 watts.
Black death track on CloD never tops 280 watts

Remember this is wall draw, not output. It's efficiency is at around 90% at that wall draw, so the actual PSU load (using my sloppy math) is 252 watts. That means during gaming, the PSU is only at ~50% load. Average load would be even lower!

I think my system is running fine with a 40% margin buffer. If a PSU degrades that much within its life time, then it s a crappy PSU people shouldn't have bought in the first place.

What people should really doing is buying PSU that will give them the best efficiency given their components, and right now, for one GPU system, no more than 500watts (for a quality PSU).

Amen! Quod demonstrandum erat ... Thanks God I didn't "mistify things" ... ;-).

Have a nice flight mate!
Ins

[Jatta Raso]

take note:

Seasonic ss 460W - 160,55 €
CORSAIR HX-650W - 114,60 €

being Corsair a renowned brand and HX a professional series, it's worth noting that Seasonic ss costs way more while offering considerably less power; this happens because this given Seasonic PSU is one of the most expensive € for W in the market; so you can get away with it because it's absolute top of the line and, regarding it's output, extremely expensive as well.

this "it's their money and their choice" argument is a 2 sided coin; to give an example the Seasonic ss 460W offers the utmost efficiency and stability; a 115€ Corsair TX 850W, while not as good is a quality one and can SLI 2 GTX 580; the Seasonic cannot.

bottom line is, if you go for nothing but the absolute best then about 450W will suffice; go for a good mid-range and 550/600W mark, depending on quality, is perfectly reasonable and recommended; go for entry series, 600W may lead to trouble (and above that as well)

p.s. - i just can't understand how someone could disagree on this, especially if they have a GTX580 and 550W PSU on their sig...

[Insuber]

take note:

Seasonic ss 460W - 160,55 €
CORSAIR HX-650W - 114,60 €

being Corsair a renowned brand and HX a professional series, it's worth noting that Seasonic ss costs way more while offering considerably less power; this happens because this given Seasonic PSU is one of the most expensive € for W in the market; so you can get away with it because it's absolute top of the line and, regarding it's output, extremely expensive as well.

this "it's their money and their choice" argument is a 2 sided coin; to give an example the Seasonic ss 460W offers the utmost efficiency and stability; a 115€ Corsair TX 850W, while not as good is a quality one and can SLI 2 GTX 580; the Seasonic cannot.

bottom line is, if you go for nothing but the absolute best then about 450W will suffice; go for a good mid-range and 550/600W mark, depending on quality, is perfectly reasonable and recommended; go for entry series, 600W may lead to trouble (and above that as well)

p.s. - i just can't understand how someone could disagree on this, especially if they have a GTX580 and 550W PSU on their sig...

Nice try to turn tables ... but I'm happy that we agreed, in the end. It is useless to go for a 750W, lest an 850W for a single GTX580. OP's CX600 was good enough.

Cheers,
Insuber

PS: BTW you cannot compare the prices of a fanless PCU with a traditional one ... ;-)

[Jatta Raso]

lol, as funny as this is one must let it drop eventually

cheers,
Raso

[Heliocon]

Hi, as a owner of a 480 and now a 580 overclocked I can say that I would strongly suggest against this, not only will you be pushing the limit with a standard clocked card it could pull excess power away from other needed computer hardware components (but never heard of someone willing to buy a 580 and not a decent PSU though).

[CWMV]

Hi, as a owner of a 480 and now a 580 overclocked I can say that I would strongly suggest against this, not only will you be pushing the limit with a standard clocked card it could pull excess power away from other needed computer hardware components (but never heard of someone willing to buy a 580 and not a decent PSU though).

Amen. AX1200 is on the way in prep for my planned duel 580 setup.

[ingsoc84]

As soon as the 3 gig 580's drop a tad..I'll get one.they are about 570 US right now..that is pricey...wish I had known..as I paid 350 for my 570....which is not even 4 months old...wish I could sell it and put the money into the 580..:(

[Heliocon]

As soon as the 3 gig 580's drop a tad..I'll get one.they are about 570 US right now..that is pricey...wish I had known..as I paid 350 for my 570....which is not even 4 months old...wish I could sell it and put the money into the 580..:(

Try paying $400 for ram 1.5 years ago which now goes for $75 :rolleyes:

[Insuber]

Hi, as a owner of a 480 and now a 580 overclocked I can say that I would strongly suggest against this, not only will you be pushing the limit with a standard clocked card it could pull excess power away from other needed computer hardware components (but never heard of someone willing to buy a 580 and not a decent PSU though).

With your money you do what you want, mate. As recoilfix wrote, with his system the peak power draw from the wall socket is 280 W. Make your math.

Cheers,
Insuber

[Jatta Raso]

a 450W will do, provided it's a superlatively good (and expensive) one; then if you o.c. an i7 and a gtx580 you will be pushing it to it's very limits; what's more, for somewhat less of its cost there are really good PSUs that will support an SLI or any O.C. that you make. you're money, your math...

[kestrel79]

I have a 1 gig ATI 5850. Will I see an improvement going to a NVIDIA 560ti? I've seen many good videos posted here from people with that card. Is it worth it to get the 2 gig version? I'd like to stay around $250 or under.

I've always been an ATI guy, what's the ATI equivilent to the 560ti? The 6850? How do both compare in CloD?

[Jatta Raso]

I have a 1 gig ATI 5850. Will I see an improvement going to a NVIDIA 560ti? I've seen many good videos posted here from people with that card. Is it worth it to get the 2 gig version? I'd like to stay around $250 or under.

I've always been an ATI guy, what's the ATI equivilent to the 560ti? The 6850? How do both compare in CloD?

you know, goggle really is your friend

http://www.nvidia.com/object/product-geforce-gtx-560ti-us.html
http://www.amd.com/us/products/desktop/graphics/ati-radeon-hd-5000/hd-5850/Pages/ati-radeon-hd-5850-overview.aspx#2

http://www.hwcompare.com/8916/geforce-gtx-560-ti-vs-radeon-hd-5850/
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/NVIDIA/GeForce_GTX_560_Ti/

maybe CloD will benefit a bit more, but i'd say anything short of 570 gives little to none upgrade in your case; the 560ti seems to be on 5850 hunting ground

the 570 1.3GB is around 300€ to start with; you will see real improvement over the 5850, but not to blow your mind; in your case i'd wait for the patch that is said to give maybe 50% more FPS, then about Q2 2012 the GPUs prices should fall a bit

[335th_GRAthos]

the 570 1.3GB is around 300€ to start with; you will see real improvement over the 5850, but not to blow your mind; in your case i'd wait for the patch that is said to give maybe 50% more FPS, then about Q2 2012 the GPUs prices should fall a bit


+1

I can only speak for NV cards, I have stopped buying ATI cards for this game for over 5 years now so my ATI knowledge is limited:

The card to buy today is: none! Wait for the next generation comming in a few months.

If you must buy a card and want to spend the least money possible the GTX560ti 2Gb VRAM is the cost consious choice

If you must buy a card and want to spend some money because you are an IL2 addict so you will be spending hours playing online then the GTX570 2.5Gb VRAM is the best choice

If you must buy a card and you do not care about money, the GTX580 3Gb VRAM is the only choice of card today, anyway you will buy a new card when the next NV generation is out in a few months.


My 2cents

~S~

[Flanker35M]

S!

I would agree with GR Athos, wait a bit and see how rumoured Kepler from nVidia will fare against the just launched 7900-series from AMD that beat down 580GTX(both 1.5 and 3Gb versions) in reviews. But without fanboism I can say we as gamers will have interesting times with the new GPU's pouring out. Just hope both driver teams + Luthier's team are up to it ;)

[Jack Morris]

I know this has probably been said already (even though I didn't see it while skimming through the pages). Make sure that it's the 3gb Version, the game uses 2.4 GB of that over London, and if you don't have that be prepared for a 50% FPS drop.

[priller26]

I am using the 3 gig 580, I find it works great for this and most any
other game, have not had any issues with it. I get very good frame rates
with this game, I am a bit wondering at why the rates drop to 7 or 9 when
I land and dust kicks up..but other than that, it works quite well. Paired
with a new Turtle Beach Z6a the sound is great!

[ATAG_MajorBorris]

Waiting for the gtx 680 will be a year I estimate. If the keplar dropped today it would be about 7/8 months for the first 680 and another 3/4 for the high end extreme editions. Thats the timeline for the last 2 card releases from nvidia(480/580):eek: