Defiant modelled in COD is incorrect

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

I have been reading a book about the 'Boulton Paul Defiant',it's a very informative read and has a wealth of photos and colour plates within it.

Something that became blatantly obvious from opening the first few pages is the actual model depicted in the Battle Of Britain is quite different to the model we have within COD.

Basically the model we have in COD has a canopy that slopes downward towards the gun turret,at the time of the BOB this canopy was parallel against the gun turret,not sloping,making it look quite different,in appearance.This picture depicts what it should look like.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/135/45277686.jpg/

This picture shows us what we have modelled in COD,nice but not historically correct,shown using Shado's superb 264 Squadron skin.Boy this skin is fantastic,and would be further enhanced with a correct Defiant model.Please note the incorrect sloping canopy.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/64/photo1513b0cd847207f058.jpg/

What we have in COD is a much later design Mk Defiant that certainly did'nt appear until after the BOB,whilst I'm not advocating that it be fixed immediatley it would be nice if it could be fixed sometime in the future.

Ok I know this is only a small feature that is incorrect and there are far more important imperfections that need to be addressed before this,but youd've thought that all those hours team Oleg spent studying these aircraft that they would have made sure the aircraft were correctly and historically modelled.

After all I've only studied this book for an hour,now how many years has this sim been in the making?

Ok there's some more useless infomation for ya;)

[senseispcc]

I have been reading a book about the 'Boulton Paul Defiant',it's a very informative read and has a wealth of photos and colour plates within it.

Something that became blatantly obvious from opening the first few pages is the actual model depicted in the Battle Of Britain is quite different to the model we have within COD.

Basically the model we have in COD has a canopy that slopes downward towards the gun turret,at the time of the BOB this canopy was parallel against the gun turret,not sloping,making it look quite different,in appearance.

What we have in COD is a much later design Mk Defiant that certainly did'nt appear until after the BOB,whilst I'm not advocating that it be fixed immediatley it would be nice if it could be fixed sometime in the future.

Ok I know this is only a small feature that is incorrect and there are far more important imperfections that need to be addressed before this,but youd've thought that all those hours team Oleg spent studying these aircraft that they would have made sure the aircraft were correctly and historically modelled.

After all I've only studied this book for an hour,now how many years has this sim been in the making?

Ok there's some more useless infomation for ya;)

It is not incorrect it does not show the difference between the Defiant in takeoff and landing mode with turret parked and the slope behind the pilot up and locked. And the combat mode where the slope behind the cockpit was in a down position like shown in the game.


Have a nice game :cool:

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

Sorry,not sure what you're saying here friend,you're English is confusing,but I can assure you that the model is incorrect,very definitley.Are you referring to the flight model or the physical model?

I'm refering to the physical modelling/shape of the aircraft,not how it performs aerodynamically.

[No145_Hatter]

you're English is confusing . . . asure . . . definitley . . . refering

Pot. Kettle.

[Blackdog_kt]

I think he means that retracting the turret into the cruising position doesn't result in the sloped parts of the canopy raising like they should (which would give the appearance you describe) or that the turret doesn't even "park", but that the in-game 3d model is always depicted with the canopy fairing for the turret in the down/combat position, which gives the characteristic sloped shape.

[VO101_Tom]

After all I've only studied this book for an hour, now how many years has this sim been in the making?

LOL, you should read more :cool:

[Bryan21cag]

oh i get what hes saying lol i was confused too.

It looks like the turret itself actually raises up and down inside of its sleeve. it pops up out of its hole to shoot bad guys and then ducks down again for less drag when cruising.

The one in game likely does not have this function giving the impression of a different version maybe.

[robtek]

I think the "connection" between cockpit and turret is meant.
In cruise-configuration this connection is horizontal, in battle-position the back is lowered so it is sloped then.

[VO101_Tom]

I think the "connection" between cockpit and turret is meant.
In cruise-configuration this connection is horizontal, in battle-position the back is lowered so it is sloped then.

Not only between the turret and cocpit, but the top of fuselage too. Rectraction of these fairings by means of pneumatic jacks allowed the turret to traverse.

[Friendly_flyer]

I think the "connection" between cockpit and turret is meant.
In cruise-configuration this connection is horizontal, in battle-position the back is lowered so it is sloped then.

Actually, it's the oter way around. The tower stais put, but fairings between cockpit and tower and tower and tail are lowered to allow the gun the widest possible field of fire.

[Freycinet]

Comedy of errors :)

Defiant with fairings lowered:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_kIWY2DV0KnE/SIPvR_-H8AI/AAAAAAAAA5I/jD-UQWHIdpQ/s400/Boulton-Paul+Defiant.jpg
http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/fileadmin/historyLearningSite/bpaul.jpg

Defiant with fairings raised:
http://www.timemoneyandblood.com/images/aircraftBritish/Defiant.jpg

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

Thanks for pointing this out Freycinet,I had'nt realised the fairings could be raised or lowered,you learn something everyday and I had'nt realised this before.

I just thought we had two distinctly different aircraft here,those fairings completely change the profile of the Defiant,top stuff mate I appreciate the reply to my thread.:grin:

[BigPickle]

what about the end of the fuselage right before the tail, all the photo's show a regular even decent towards the tail, the one in game just drops down lower before the tail. what is the reason for this?

[adonys]

I've noticed that too, but I think it's related with a specific angle of view.

[BigPickle]

nah no chance its a definate change in shape rather than an optical effect.

[Al Schlageter]

http://www.the-blueprints.com/blueprints-depot-restricted/modernplanes/modern-bm-bz/boulton_paul_defiant-02065.jpg

Notice the fairings are in the up position. In the down position there would be a definite change in the slope.

A better drawing, http://aircraftdrawingsdownload.com/files/defiant.pdf

[BigPickle]

No I'm talking about the rear of the fuselage by the tail it appears that it is a difference between a Defiant I and Defiant II, the II has the regular sloping fuselage.

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

Yeah,the model we have in COD has both fairings in the lowered position,I understand this now,I do hope that they make the Defiant flyable,and that if they do,they incorporate the lowering and rising of the fairings within the controls.

I can't believe I thought that there were different models,I just assumed that there was two diffrent aircraft marks,lol.

My sincere apologies to Luthier and team,how could I doubt you,you're aircraft are spot on.

[Friendly_flyer]

They could perhaps implement the fairings as air-breaks: Up is off, down is on. One of the problems of the Daffy (and Skua) was that lowering the fairings for action would severely hit speed. Being slightly oldish, they would have problems keeping up with "modern" designs like the He 111 and Ju 88 as it was, lowering the fairings would really give them problems.

I really hope they make it flyable!

[Plt Off JRB Meaker]

On further reading of my book'Boulton Paul Defiant by Mark Ansell,the fairings were incorporated,so that the air flow was'nt interupted through the rudder.

Apparantly they had major problems aerodynamically as soon as the turret was fitted.