Anti-epilepsy filter?

[Bwaze]

Luthier wrote on Sukhoi.ru forum at 19:38 GMT (sorry Google translated):

In our game there is a wonderful new feature that saves you all from epilepsy. It is made at the request of the Western publishers, Yubisofta.

Since epilepsy is caused by a rapid flashing of the facilities, and flight simulator is basically a genre of fast flickering objects, the epilepsy caused all: propeller, shooting, explosions, sun, flying airplanes, transportation machines, entry into the hangar, flying at low level, and etc .

Despite the fact that in the old IL-2 it was more an epileptic, new requirements were introduced only last year. We perelopatli entire game because of this unfortunate epilepsy.

The main protivopripadochnaya shell, which is above everything that was done two weeks ago, the total despair. It compares each previous frame with each frame and compares the brightness of the pixel by pixel, and if it is too large, averaging pixels to give pleasing epileptic-limits. This crap brakes at the ground, and does not work with cards SLI. Off with her we can not yet make it optional, too, can not yet.

Without it Yubisoft refused to publish the game.

But as the 1C in general all the same, cause you have a game fits or not, we are urgently looking for a way to cut it all on the Russian version. It is necessary to assure Yubisoftu and give them a check that off in Russia will not allow Western epileptic somehow disable this thing at home.

This sounds realy incredible. :( Isn't the "Will induce epilepsy" enough? Hard to believe, since for instance cigarettes which we know KILL can be sold without problem.

[JG52Uther]

Not really sure what he is saying.They have done something to the game to prevent epilepsy but it causes issues with the game?

[Bwaze]

Yes, as far as I understand there's a filter that prevents quick changes in brightness by smoothing the transitions to be more friendly to persons suffering from photosensitive epilepsy.

This filter was requested by Ubisoft, and cannot (must not) be switched off. It breaks SLI compatibility and lowers performance.

[T}{OR]

This filter was requested by Ubisoft, and cannot (must not) be switched off. It breaks SLI compatibility and lowers performance.

Swell...

[JG52Uther]

:(

[T}{OR]

What boggles the mind (not in this case where Ubi is involved) is why it must not be optional. This just goes along with the well known phrase by A. Einstein:

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

... provided that the feature and above report is true. :)

EDIT: Can we have the link to the thread/post luthier made at Sukhoi.ru forum? Thnx.

[Hecke]

What the hell?
We have to suffer from performance issues in order to not get sick of epilepsy?

[bw_wolverine]

It's lamentable. There's GOT to be a way for some talented individual to figure out how to disable this thing once we've had the game for a while.

This is like forcing me to ride my bike with training wheels on it because some people have inner ear infections.

[Richie]

Yes, as far as I understand there's a filter that prevents quick changes in brightness by smoothing the transitions to be more friendly to persons suffering from photosensitive epilepsy.

This filter was requested by Ubisoft, and cannot (must not) be switched off. It breaks SLI compatibility and lowers performance.


That's basically right. I've got it but it's been very much under control for years now. I told my Neurologist how many hours I sit in front of this monitor playing IL-2 every day. He replied "You really are better"

[Winger]

Well, if theres no sli support now they pretty much ruined it for me and 1000s of others. Well, just another MORONSDECISION from ubisoft.

Winger

[kalimba]

All 1C have to do, if that is true, is to let someone leak a "fix" thru non-officials sites...That way Yubicrap would not be liable in case of a legal problem...

Salute !

[Bwaze]

It seems they are trying to resolve the issue within days:

If it could be a warning. You can not imagine how much blood has spoiled us this epilepsy over the past three months. For all those usilisya that we spent on it, you can write a little new game.

We hope to resolve these issues within days rather than weeks.

Exactly say that epilepsy always poporchenny propellers. Rotate them to the murder rate and transparency of their wildly high, and this fix will not let us.

I am afraid that the news about my epilepsy little to reach someone, and it is this damn feature we will respond very strongly. But we had a choice of either doing it or do not release the game in the west - that is, there was no choice.

[T}{OR]

The more I re-read the first post I think this must be a joke of some kind...

Unbelievable, to say the least.

[Vevster]

All 1C have to do, if that is true, is to let someone leak a "fix" thru non-officials sites...That way Yubicrap would not be liable in case of a legal problem...

Salute !

Seems that 1C also included in their version.
Why would that be if it is only Ubi requesting it?

[Lensman_1]

Can we have the link to the thread/post luthier made at Sukhoi.ru forum? Thnx.

Page 5, about halfway down.

http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sukhoi.ru%2Fforum%2Fshowthread. php%3Ft%3D67803%26page%3D2

This is VERY serious because a lot of people are relying on SLI to get decent performance for this application. You're absolutely correct that it should be optional. This is a genuine potential deal-breaker.

[SG1_Gunkan]

Is the first time i hear about the antiepilepsy filter. It's so rare, don't you think?

[Opitz]

OK, so now we know who is responsible - it is evil Ubisoft! But this epilepsy explanation doesn't solve this:

If you are installing from CD spilled some mistakes, but Steam still installed and put the game by downloading something else from the network. Folder with the game weighs 3.95 GB. Version 1.00.13716

System:
CPU: Core i5-2500K 3.3@4.5GHz
MB: ASUS P8P67 PRO
Memory: 2*2 Gb DDR3 Kingston "Hyper X" KHX1600C7D3K2/4GX
Video: CrossFireX 2*ATI R5850 1024Mb 256bit DDR5
SSD: Intel X25-M SSDSA2MH080G2C1
Audio: Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium SB0880
OS: Win7 64bit

NOT PLAYABLE

Profile video settings - average. Smoothing is "On." How to turn off completely - do not understand. Average FPS about 21-25 in a single mission over England, not in the city, as well - villages, woods in some places, grass ... Frequent dropdowns of 10-15, maximum 41. In a collision with the ground subsidence FPS to 3-4 for a few seconds. Friezes, jerks - not comfortable. On trees plane not beating, setting realistic. Significantly slows the cursor on the screen, move it is not convenient.

Processor almost doesn't run! Maximum load up to 25%!

Memory usage 70-80%

CrossFireX - does not work!

If you select the pilot was a flight no longer went there.
When you configure the video was freeze for 15-20 seconds.
Mission training takeoff not started
Steam annoying, press shift + tab, to record the FPS, and the windows of stim ...
Alt + tab does not work correctly, the full switch to Windows does not happen and the game is not minimized.

Disappointed very much. I hope to optimize the game and drivers

Sound by the way is NOT from IL2 - liked it.

original in russian here - http://www.sukhoi.ru/forum/showthread.php?t=67803&page=6

[T}{OR]

It seems they are trying to resolve the issue within days:

If it could be a warning. You can not imagine how much blood has spoiled us this epilepsy over the past three months. For all those usilisya that we spent on it, you can write a little new game.

We hope to resolve these issues within days rather than weeks.

Exactly say that epilepsy always poporchenny propellers. Rotate them to the murder rate and transparency of their wildly high, and this fix will not let us.

Correct me if I got it wrong - they spent last 3 months implementing this feature while they could have used the time to squash bugs and further polish/optimize the game, work on missing features etc...??

[BadAim]

Political correctness has no rationality requirement.

[Zappatime]

See link below, Ubisoft are mentioned as being one of the first to change their testing procedures on games due to this campaign for epilepsy testing/warning etc:

http://www.epilepsy.org.uk/campaigns/lobbying/video-games

[Vevster]

Correct me if I got this right - they spent last 3 months implementing this feature while they could have used the time to squash bugs and further polish/optimize the game, work on missing features etc...??

Problem is , they also say that it is something new.

If it's three months old, it's hardly new.

[kalimba]

Seems that 1C also included in their version.
Why would that be if it is only Ubi requesting it?

My guess, and it is a guess, is that while there were implementing this s###T into the code, they did also some optimizations and corrections across the whole game and they were rushed to release it...Now, if I understand correctly, they will try to "remove" the filter part for the russian version...Would it be released as a patch ? If so, it would be technically possible to fix our versions too, as long as its illegal and unsupported by 1C...

Salute !

[Opitz]

It is hard to believe this "anti-epilepsy filter" was enforced on Oleg team by Ubisoft... Come on, we all know that flight sim is not mainstream game, right? And there HAS to be an agreement or statement of work between Oleg and publisher. It is not so easy to enforce such as change just three months before "going live"...
It is not possible to find anything regarding epilepsy on the Ubisoft Corporate Site... On their place I would sell it via press conf for sure to increase the sales...

What's the next reason why this game is just so unfinished?

[Shrike_UK]

You can get an epileptic fit from turning on a lightbulb or driving a car, and watching TV. Games always came with a warning on. That was suffice. If people ignore the warning, they have no right to sue anyone.

If its true that game performance has been sacrificed for this, then at least give us the option to turn it off

I've played IL2 for like, 12 years or something like that, it never gave me epilepsy

[Heliocon]

THEY CUT OUT SLI TO PUT IN THIS CRAP? You got to be kidding me, this is completely moronic. Hey guys - good luck with the next gen engine, no sli = a game that is going to have SERIOUSE problems in the future since everyone is moving towards more but low power gpus (crossfire/SLI). This is absurd, 1. why is this even a problem? Why would it stop SLI? Why wasnt this looked into by a lawyer?
2. get rid of ubi for crying out loud!
3. THIS is why games contain box warnings saying that it may cause seizures, make people sign a use policy with a explicit warning about epilepsy on it. What a retarded mistake.

[Sneaksie]

I'm sure that Luthier will clarify this, but as i understand the game uses a full-screen routine (shader i assume) that compares EACH pixel in two subsequent frames to make sure there are no sharp changes in brightness. If there are sharp changes (and almost all in the game has these sharp changes - dark planes on bright sky), this shader makes the brightness change more subtle to not to cause a stroboscope effect.
As you can see, this should increase load on GPU and potentially is uncompatible with SLI rendering (or make SLI slower than a single card) since you can't just render on two GPUs - you need to compare results of this rendering and then alter them.

[Il2Pongo]

They way they could make sure that
"western epileptics cannot disable it at home" is trigger an epileptic fit inducing flicker when you try to disable it, and move the button, so they cant click it with their eyes closed.

This is the sadest news I have ever read on this forum. Amazing, no wonder Oleg wants to hang up his sim making keyboard.
To work so long on getting the maximum detail in for the perfect frame rates and then have this done to you.

Amazing.

[MadBlaster]

This was posted on the russian forum. I take it to mean we can turn the filter off. Fingers crossed.:)


1. Message from Youss
fellow vacationers relax comrades!

the incentive disable the storage of the configuration in the cloud.
measure our own FPS (in the running game, Shift + Tab, fps START SHOW, Shift + Tab) - write.
conf.ini find the file in the user profile c: \ users \ pupkin_i_i \ documents \ 1c ... \ il2 sturmovik ...
in the config file, find line
antiepileptic =... and correct to the antiepileptic = 0, save config measure our FPS, and legate of the result here.

waiting for replies have done.

[julian265]

What a load of crap. I'll be disabling that "feature" at the first opportunity. Filters like this should be optional and implemented on graphics cards, rather than individual titles.

[Hecke]

Where is the f***** problem.

Get the XXXX optional. Everyone suffering from this can help him self by switching on and the rest can play with better framerates.

[major_setback]

I want an 'anti-drunk' filter.
I often find that the game just doesn't handle too well after a few beers. It would be nice if it could be tailored to account for bad judjement, blurry eyesight, uncoordinated movements, and sick on the keyboard.
I eagerly await the development team's response.
:-)

[trumps]

YUP... ubifools ineptitude is beyond legendary! what a pack of assclowns!!!!

[Il2Pongo]

"“If games are pre-screened, the odd problematic sequence can be taken out,” she explains, “but I don’t want the games spoiled. We’re talking about the odd second or two here and there. No one will find the game any less fun or exciting.”
"

sure, a real time world being generated in 3d and take out a few problematic scenes.

[Opitz]

If it is just a parameter in the config, which can be easily switched off, why it is not switched of in 1C distribution??? Only Ubisoft wanted it. But Oleg knew how it will damage the game but he still left it for the fellow Russians? Come on, I don't believe it at all...

I just don't understand why you jumped on the bandwagon to blame Ubisoft... It is 1C who is selling it on russian market now and what they sell is really, really bad product...
this is soooo unprofessional of the Oleg team... they kept quite, let the people to buy and order and suddenly when Russian starts to complain russian producer is blaming foreign distributor... nice manipulation...

[Vevster]

If it is just a parameter in the config, which can be easily switched off, why it is not switched of in 1C distribution??? Only Ubisoft wanted it. But Oleg knew how it will damage the game but he still left it for the fellow Russians? Come on, I don't believe it at all...

I just don't understand why you jumped on the bandwagon to blame Ubisoft... It is 1C who is selling it on russian market now and what they sell is really, really bad product...
this is soooo unprofessional of the Oleg team... they kept quite, let the people to buy and order and suddenly when Russian starts to complain russian producer is blaming foreign distributor... nice manipulation...

I am going to give a plus one on that.
1C has launched the game.

Ubi does not seem to be too eager to launch it that quickly.

[Hecke]

The question is:

Will it be switchable for the UBIS*T version aswell?

[l3uLLDoZeR]

Did anyone else see the fps from that rig?
i2500k at 4.5ghz and a 5850 .....not playable at times then up to 20-25 fps.

If that can't run it then WTF can? Don't ruin this game!

[6S.Manu]

Did anyone else see the fps from that rig?
i2500k at 4.3ghz and a 5850 .....not playable at times then up to 20-25 fps.

If that can't run it then WTF can? Don't ruin this game!

The trailers weren't so bad... neither were the demos at Igromir.

Ubi can GTFO.

It's unbelievable!

[Opitz]

I am just speechless...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEsDs-l9LHA

first - FPS
second - sound
third - unintentional ramming by left wing to cut the enemy plane in two pieces and still flying

[spw]

1C and UBISOFT ! PLEASE get serious! i am an adult (33 yrs old) and i dont care a sh. for epilepsy. i play on pc since i am 9 yrs old. WTF is goin on?

i just bought ati hd6990 and i cant disable crossfire there so WTF??? 540 euro for nothing? ARE YOU SERIOUS ?

ubisoft already killed silent hunter series with romanian amateurs tryin to make a work of professionals.PRIVATE persons,modders like grey wolf team did far better on silent hunter 3 than your paid monkeys on the next parts!!

and now you lay your silly ,smelling shadow on il2 /CoD?

plz tell me this is a bad dream and lemme wake up!

plz tell me,should i cancel the preorder with my card forcing crossfire 24/7?

i play bad company 2 on 32times antialiasing etc etc

BULLSHIT! antiepileptic muahahahahaahah cmoon gimme a break...really

crysis 2 is console,CoD non crossfire,dragon age 2 sleep pill from consoles...should i sell my freakin PC ? my KIDs play consoles but I HAVE THE MONEY and i mostly use it for me :grin: :grin:

1C you are defending the last real PC playgrounds.you have a sim community.usually grown up guys that established themselves. and then you put in a feature that KILLS all the enthusiasm? sorry,plz ban me but you all are clowns!

[JG52Krupi]

I am just speechless...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEsDs-l9LHA

first - FPS
second - sound
third - unintentional ramming by left wing to cut the enemy plane in two pieces and still flying

To be honest im not,

1. His GPU is old, and we dont know what settings he is using. + a patch is coming out tonight.

2. Wait and see before jumping to conclusions.

3. Aircraft fuselages are really quite weak and the bf110 has lost a large portion of its wing, check out the roundels position with the right wing. It may have not chopped through an aircraft in real life but it could have caused enough damage to reduce its structural integrity. To see this we would need a third person perspective.

[JG52Krupi]

1C and UBISOFT ! PLEASE get serious! i am an adult (33 yrs old) and i dont care a sh. for epilepsy. i play on pc since i am 9 yrs old. WTF is goin on?

i just bought ati hd6990 and i cant disable crossfire there so WTF??? 540 euro for nothing? ARE YOU SERIOUS ?

ubisoft already killed silent hunter series with romanian amateurs tryin to make a work of professionals.PRIVATE persons,modders like grey wolf team did far better on silent hunter 3 than your paid monkeys on the next parts!!

and now you lay your silly ,smelling shadow on il2 /CoD?

plz tell me this is a bad dream and lemme wake up!

plz tell me,should i cancel the preorder with my card forcing crossfire 24/7?

i play bad company 2 on 32times antialiasing etc etc

BULLSHIT! antiepileptic muahahahahaahah cmoon gimme a break...really

crysis 2 is console,CoD non crossfire,dragon age 2 sleep pill from consoles...should i sell my freakin PC ? my KIDs play consoles but I HAVE THE MONEY and i mostly use it for me :grin: :grin:

Isnt Crossfire the same as SLI, so do you have two 6990's?

[Sven]

guys this over at sukhoi

ellow vacationers relax comrades!

в стиме отключаем хранение конфига в облаке. the incentive disable the storage of the configuration in the cloud.
меряем свой фпс (в запущенной игре шифт+таб, fps START SHOW, шифт+таб) - записываем. measure our own FPS (in the running game, Shift + Tab, fps START SHOW, Shift + Tab) - write.
находим файл conf.ini в профиле пользователя c:\users\pupkin_i_i\documents\1c...\il2 sturmovik... conf.ini find the file in the user profile c: \ users \ pupkin_i_i \ documents \ 1c ... \ il2 sturmovik ...
в конфиге, находим строчку in the config file, find line
antiepileptic=... antiepileptic =... и исправляем на antiepileptic=0, сохраняем конфиг and correct to the antiepileptic = 0, save config
меряем фпс, и отписываем о результате здесь. measure our FPS, and legate of the result here.

жду ответов проделавших. waiting for replies have done.

looks like you can turn it off.

[JG52Krupi]

guys this over at sukhoi



looks like you can turn it off.

Thanks for the heads up Sven.

[Hecke]

looks like you can turn it off.

... in the russian version... but who knows if these UBIsuckers force us to use it

[6S.Manu]

Shame on you!

I'm blind and I'm pleased that Ubisoft requested the implementation of that enjoyable voice who can help me flying over the cliffs of dover.

God bless Ubi.

[Tree_UK]

Guys, I dont think that UBIsoft have banned SLI/Crossfire, it simply a case of Cliffs of Dover not meeting the required standard, Luthier as said that they are working on a fix which to me says that its a developers issue rather than a publisher's. Otherwise there would be no point in fixing it if SLI/Crossfire was banned.

[Flanker35M]

S!

Just make game available to west from 1C, problem solved. PayPal or similar as payment method. Really if this was enforced and causing delay of CoD, then what can one say. Actions speak for themselves :(

[6S.Manu]

Guys, I dont think that UBIsoft have banned SLI/Crossfire, it simply a case of Cliffs of Dover not meeting the required standard, Luthier as said that they are working on a fix which to me says that its a developers issue rather than a publisher's. Otherwise there would be no point in fixing it if SLI/Crossfire was banned.

LOL @ your new avatar Tree! :D

To me this is an useless standard: cigarettes... it's written that smoking is dangerous, but they still let me smoke them.

[JG52Krupi]

I have seen soooooooo many threads about how SLI/Crossfire does not work... its usual that they add SLI and Crossfire support/debugs at a later date.

Lets be honest if it runs bad on a SLI/Crossfire turn one off for the game and it should run fine... also a common occurrence.

[Sven]

... in the russian version... but who knows if these UBIsuckers force us to use it

That's something to take in mind indeed:(

[6S.Manu]

S!

Just make game available to west from 1C, problem solved. PayPal or similar as payment method. Really if this was enforced and causing delay of CoD, then what can one say. Actions speak for themselves :(

Bingo!!!

[Baron]

To be honest im not,

1. His GPU is old, and we dont know what settings he is using. + a patch is coming out tonight.

2. Wait and see before jumping to conclusions.

3. Aircraft fuselages are really quite weak and the bf110 has lost a large portion of its wing, check out the roundels position with the right wing. It may have not chopped through an aircraft in real life but it could have caused enough damage to reduce its structural integrity. To see this we would need a third person perspective.


Im giddy from seeing the Bf110/Bleinhem NOT blowing up upon contact + the 110 CAN fly with a portion of its wing missing.


Allways 2 sides to a coin :)

[JG52Krupi]

Im giddy from seeing the Bf110/Bleinhem NOT blowing up upon contact + the 110 CAN fly with a portion of its wing missing.


Allways 2 sides to a coin :)

Yes, look at this.

http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww140/_Flattop/BobKingsAvenger.jpg

i was trying to find the Claude with its wing missing but stumbled upon that image instead, perfect example.

Some info, on the avenger for those interested.

http://flattopshistorywarpolitics.yuku.com/topic/238/A-Strike-on-Chichi-Jima

[luthier]

I want to confirm that everything said here is true, we have implemented some drastic features for anti-epilepsy protection which are affecting FPS and killing SLI support.

We CANNOT make these optional. That will allow an opportunistic or an unfortunate person suffering from epilepsy to sue Ubisoft for damages and literally close down the studio for good.

This was a stop-gap measure to make sure the game gets released. As I explained in the clumsily-translated Russian article, everything in our game causes seizures - gunfire, explosions, fire, sun passing behind canopy framework, etc. Basically flight sims are an epileptic's nightmare.

We'll work to improve the framerate and perhaps address individual issues individually as opposed to applying a single rough post-effect filter, but it is basically a very sad situation. Something completely unrelated and unexpected came to our sim with a giant axe and whacked at it at the last moment. We just didn't have time to properly address it.

[JG52Krupi]

Thanks for the reply Luthier, its a sorry world when people go around pruposefully starting lawsuits and while I am no fan of UBI I am aware that they will be the one that get it in the neck if any misshapes occur.

As someone has suggested, why can a pack of fags be sold with a mere warning and not the game... its a bizarre world we live in.

+ I can blame UBI for not telling you early so I can continue hating UBI anyway :D

[Dores]

Thanks for clarifying this Luthier. But does this actually affect how we see things in the game? Does it look worse with this epilepsy filter applied?

[archermav]

Crikey, that's some disappointing news my friend.

[WTE_Galway]

lol ... and people wonder why ubisoft keep declaring massive losses year in year out :D


Maybe ubi should release Cliffs of Dover as part of their new facebook game package, that will be elipsey safe for sure :D

[Tbag]

First of all, congratulations Ilya, Oleg and team! Thank you for keeping us entertained for the coming 10 years :)

Concerning the filter: This is very sad news! If I understand correctly, this measure effectively means you cannot modell anything in a sim that could cause an epileptic fit in reality. What a massive limitation for the future!

[JumpingHubert]

thanks for the info! Is it possible to deaktivate it "inofficial", maybe in config file? Only for the few non epileptic owners of this game? ;)

[T}{OR]

Thank you for posting info about this luthier.

A very unfortunate decision, to say the least. Franky I still can't believe this has been forced upon you guys.

[Sutts]

This is such complete bullsh*t. I'm beyond words.

[Bryan21cag]

almost sounds like an early jump on a pretty good April fools joke:) i certainly hope this is the case :P

[Thee_oddball]

Thanks for the reply Luthier, its a sorry world when people go around pruposefully starting lawsuits and while I am no fan of UBI I am aware that they will be the one that get it in the neck if any misshapes occur.

As someone has suggested, why can a pack of fags be sold with a mere warning and not the game... its a bizarre world we live in.

+ I can blame UBI for not telling you early so I can continue hating UBI anyway :D

"The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers". - (Act IV, Scene II).:mrgreen:

[Thee_oddball]

almost sounds like an early jump on a pretty good April fools joke:) i certainly hope this is the case :P

I was just thinking the same thing

[maclean525]

Maddox Games needs to discuss this with an attorney. Any epileptic can pick up any game and it can induce a seizure. Pretty much all games carry anti-epilepsy warnings and they are sufficient to prevent any litigation. IL-2 COD just needs to have the 'disable epilepsy filter' option buried in an ini file and as such the user has to take precise and deliberate action to change the option. There is not a judge anywhere that would rule against the game designer in such a situation.

At the end of the day they're being bullied by ubisoft to comply with their ridiculous whims and as a software developer myself I really, really feel for them.

Good luck Luthier, Oleg etc. getting this thing taken care of. We all have 100% confidence you will come up with a great solution that will solve this nasty problem.

[15JG52_Brauer]

Crickey - if UbiSoft sold light bulbs they would probably make the maufacturer encase them in non transparent material "just in case" -so is this the same for all new games being released from now on? :evil:

[LukeFF]

Ubisoft just continues to show why they are hated so much.

[Dano]

Don't be such a drama queen, you have the right to cancel so do so.

Luthier, would it not be at all possible to have some sort of DLC via steam that has a licence agreement on it to remove the epileptic filter?

[l3uLLDoZeR]

After reading all the facts and hearing it from the "horses mouth" I will NOT be buying this game. If patches make the frame rates more acceptable, then I will reconsider.

When I see i2500k at 4.5 ghz and a 5850 gpu...that is 20-25 fps at good times and down to 5 at the rough ones, i'm not sure how anyone will have an enjoyable experience playing this game.

[JG53Frankyboy]

i hope 1C has no further contracts with UBI for further CoD titles (read AdOns).
1C should go the way of worldwide puplishing this series via digital download. I dont like STEAM, but perhaps that causes less proplems than UBI ...

[Insuber]

Guys,

Don't be overly pessimistic. Luthier, you too you are probably tired, a good sleep and you will come back with renewed enthusiasm :)

IMO this means simply that we must wait some more time to have the problem solved. I'm confident that Luthier's approach - solve issues one by one as opposed to the post-effect, FPS killer filter - will fix this mess. It is technically feasible - true, Luthier? - it just needs more time.

I just blame the improvisation behind all that: either someone in Russia didn't read the technical requirements attached to the Ubisoft contract, or someone in France forgot to tell them.

Good night!
6S.Insuber

[Dano]

What are the new recommended and minimum specs with this in mind?

[Thee_oddball]

After reading all the facts and hearing it from the "horses mouth" I will NOT be buying this game. If patches make the frame rates more acceptable, then I will reconsider.

well we (USA)have almost a month to see how this plays out I really cant see there not being an option added to disable the feature...they will have to or it will kill the game :(

[Letum]

God damm Ubisoft...your doing this crap again?

This is why I didn't pre-order. Hope it can be modded out.

[ECV56_Guevara]

these are sad sad news...I understand Oleg now. Seems that who doesn´t understand customers is UBI.

PD: UBI se puede ir a la concha de su puta madre.

[Shrike_UK]

not only did UBISoft destroy Silent Hunter Series they also Destoyed the Rainbow 6 series, and i hear countless other PC Only titles.

It makes me wonder why did 1C sign up with UBISoft for CoD???? it is asking for trouble and makes no sense to a gamer.

I was hoping i could buy this Sim now, and just buy a GTX460 1GB G/card to replace my ageing 256mb X1950 Pro, which then would bring me above the minimum requirements as i have dual core 2.4 processor. I cant afford another pc yet to get a faster processor, and probably wont be able to for the next 6 months. So my small outlay for a new g/card was meant to enable me to fly for now. But now, with the epilepsy feature, being proccessor intensive, i might find i still cant run it???

[T}{OR]

Ubisoft just continues to show why they are hated so much.

Like a bad dream...


Maddox Games needs to discuss this with an attorney. Any epileptic can pick up any game and it can induce a seizure. Pretty much all games carry anti-epilepsy warnings and they are sufficient to prevent any litigation. IL-2 COD just needs to have the 'disable epilepsy filter' option buried in an ini file and as such the user has to take precise and deliberate action to change the option. There is not a judge anywhere that would rule against the game designer in such a situation.

At the end of the day they're being bullied by ubisoft to comply with their ridiculous whims and as a software developer myself I really, really feel for them. Do something but make it and optional feature.

Good luck Luthier, Oleg etc. getting this thing taken care of. We all have 100% confidence you will come up with a great solution that will solve this nasty problem.

I absolutely agree with the above. On what rights can someone sue you on account of human stupidity? Change the interface, redo the cover, put it on on the manual in bold red lettering - heck even replace the title with "EPILEPTIC WARNING".




I wish you best of luck in dealing with this. Even if you sort out FPS & SLI/CF problems, I wonder how will this affect overall graphical representation.

Words can't express the shock I am still feeling after reading about this two hours ago!

[Tree_UK]

ubisoft have applied this rule for the last 3 years how could the Dev's possibly overlook it. Incredible.

[furbs]

So how long has UBI had this new rule and how long has the COD team known about it?

Are you saying Luthier that the sim is handicapped for months to come?

Im sorry but something does not add up to me.
We get to know about this on release day??

come on...im not that green.

[Thee_oddball]

What are the new recommended and minimum specs with this in mind?
45.5GHZ CORE X10 CPU
ATI 69000 1TB mem
124 gigs of DDR50 1333333 RAM
1 terawatt psu (with 6 pin for video of course :))


I think that should about do it :shock:

[T}{OR]

ubisoft have applied this rule for the last 3 years how could the Dev's possibly overlook it. Incredible.

IIRC the publisher "was found" in October last year.

[CharveL]

Leave a comment on that epilepsy site like I did.

Paragraphs like this show more ignorance than insight:

John explains: “The original approach to broadcasting all those years ago was that prevention is better than cure. It was right for broadcasting and it’s also right for video games. We’re not asking developers to do anything that’s not already tried and tested. The technology has been around for a very long time. There are no expensive, difficult or cutting-edge things to be done – it’s boringly easy.”

[Sutts]

Lawsuits are killing off far more than games. It's complete madness. The West really does deserve to fail.

[Insuber]

Like a bad dream...




I absolutely agree with the above. On what rights can someone sue you on account of human stupidity? Change the interface, redo the cover, put it on on the manual in bold red lettering - heck even replace the title with "EPILEPTIC WARNING".




I wish you best of luck in dealing with this. Even if you sort out FPS & SLI/CF problems, I wonder how will this affect overall graphical representation.

Words can't express the shock I am still feeling after reading about this two hours ago!

Someone could simply ignore to be epileptic. One person in 4'000 can suffer from a seizure induced by light patterns. And also, someone can be an-alphabet. Or under 6 years old. Or not speaking the language of that version. Or ... you name it. A good lawyer can make a fortune out of this, in US but not only. More than that, Ubisoft wants to improve his public image after the Nintendo issue in UK, which caused a tabloid-galore.

Again, I blame only the very late action on this spec, maybe related with the late choice of the Western publisher.

Cheers,
6S.Insuber

PS: or, maybe, it's just an excuse for the low FPS ... just kidding ! :D

[Shrike_UK]

So, i guess we now call it IL2:EW (Epileptic Warning) :(

[MikkOwl]

This is horrific news. I have good hardware. I don't have epilepsy. Cannot stand low or uneven framerates. I don't want to edit an .ini file to turn off a filter but I guess I could go along with that solution, if it was there. I cancelled my pre-order. Will wait around and see if issues like these go away. Hoping for the best!

UBI's "Silent Hunter 5" was a sim I was looking forward to greatly (bought 3 and 4). I cancelled the pre-order when I found out about the constant-connection-to-UBI-servers. Rise of Flight I also skipped.

I try to judge fairly and see things from their perspective. I think UBI as a publisher has lots of money, brings us some good titles/franchises, but ultimately stand out as being incompetent. The marketing section seems to have no clue to how the market will respond to their bizarre decisions.

[Biggs]

well after readin all this im almost glad that Im not getting the game until the 19th...

I hope this all gets sorted out by then. :(

[gflinch]

Hey, I have hemorrhoids from sitting and playing il2 too much, can Ubisoft do something about this?

[Lensman_1]

2 Collectors Editions cancelled with GREAT sadness.
In the unlikely event that the sim is playable then I'll rethink my options but I can't risk £100 on a potentially unusuable game.

[Herra Tohtori]

My thoughts regarding this particular fiasco à la Ubisoft:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqghvckkERs


Hey, I have hemorrhoids from sitting and playing il2 too much, can Ubisoft do something about this?

I once got elbow bursitis for resting my elbow on table while playing IL-2! Class action lawsuit for not telling me that I should use padding under my elbow!

WARNING: FOLLOWING VIDEO MAY CAUSE PHOTOSENSITIVE APOCALYPTIC SEIZURE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeXQBHLIPcw

[Borsch]

I've just read another Luthier's post on Sukhoi forums and yes, this is indeed very serious.
Luthier stated that this epilepsy issue has forced them to completely irreversibly screw the representation of propellers- ruining their spin rate and transparency. This is already implemented and is not reversible.

Then we read here that they will have to now go through the rest of the game "fixing" things one-by-one. (Just like propellers:evil:)

THe current "overall fix" does not only concern SLI- it also causes freezes/fps drops for single card users when flying low for example.

Beta testers and people who played CoD at Russian gameshows say that even then the game was less jerky and better optimised . Epilepsy (as it stands now) has indeed impacted the game for ALL users. I thought it was a joke, but its pretty grave.

Source(Russian):
http://www.sukhoi.ru/forum/showthread.php?t=67803&p=1571060&viewfull=1#post1571060

[Luffe]

Hey, I have hemorrhoids from sitting and playing il2 too much, can Ubisoft do something about this?

Exactly. I demand that every CloD copy must be shipped with one of these:

http://www.hemorrhoidtreatmentxp.com/wp-content/uploads/aes/Hemorrhoid-Treatment-Instant-Relief_147.jpg

[Shrike_UK]

i would be risking a £150 graphics card upgrade for this game aswell as £35-ish the price of the game if it dont run on my AMD X2 4200+ processor. because i would only be buying the graphics card for IL2:CoD.

If anyone knows if my processor would be good enough can they please let me know, i have 2GB ram, and wouldve got a GTX440 card.

[Cowboy10uk]

Sorry to hear that Lensman, I really dont know what to do, On one hand ive waited so long for this, and I love the collectors edition extras, But on the other it sounds like it wont run properly after some stupid decision by Ubisoft.

All i can hope is a way is found to get rid of this damn filter and return the sim to what it should be.

Many Many yrs ago I know carmageddon was forced to change the people into zombies and green blood to get itself released, Within 3 weeks there was a leaked patch from one of the makers that returned the zombies into People and red blood. Its happened before, no reason it cant happen again in this case.

God I hope im making the right choice.

Cowboy10uk

[Blackdog_kt]

I want to confirm that everything said here is true, we have implemented some drastic features for anti-epilepsy protection which are affecting FPS and killing SLI support.

We CANNOT make these optional. That will allow an opportunistic or an unfortunate person suffering from epilepsy to sue Ubisoft for damages and literally close down the studio for good.

This was a stop-gap measure to make sure the game gets released. As I explained in the clumsily-translated Russian article, everything in our game causes seizures - gunfire, explosions, fire, sun passing behind canopy framework, etc. Basically flight sims are an epileptic's nightmare.

We'll work to improve the framerate and perhaps address individual issues individually as opposed to applying a single rough post-effect filter, but it is basically a very sad situation. Something completely unrelated and unexpected came to our sim with a giant axe and whacked at it at the last moment. We just didn't have time to properly address it.

That's pretty bad and i don't say this to blame you, in fact i can feel your frustration.

If they really did wait until the last possible moment to demand this feature from you they obviously don't know who they're messing with...the local forum forum brigade will swiftly migrate to the Ubi forums and start applying some pressure to put mildly, not to mention that we won't be arguing among ourselves this time :evil:

Let's hope a solution can be found. On the other hand, i don't really know what that would entail for the graphics fidelity of the sim even if frame rates are fixed.

[Cowboy10uk]

That's pretty bad and i don't say this to blame you, in fact i can feel your frustration.

If they really did wait until the last possible moment to demand this feature from you they obviously don't know who they're messing with...the local forum forum brigade will swiftly migrate to the Ubi forums and start applying some pressure to put mildly, not to mention that we won't be arguing among ourselves this time :evil:

Already there and shouting loudly, Any support would be greatly appricated. :)

[Tree_UK]

Ubisoft have had this development rule for over 3 yrs, its an oversight from the Dev's not Ubisoft.

[bw_wolverine]

If anyone can get this news out to sites like Kotaku and other mainstream game blogs, I'm sure they'd run it as a story.

[F19_lacrits]

I don't know if I should laugh or cry.. guess I'll do both at the same time!

[Katkatman]

These kind of thing purely a no-sens, The statistics are that there's about 40 millions in the WHOLE WORLD !!!!

Ubisoft will perhaps have few hundred (very optimist) more epileptic customers, but will lose Thousands of long time customers due to the obviously growing of the PC performance needed.

If it seems like,

"- Ok looks at the nice little green label on this car, it respect the environment
- Oh ! Great ! I want to buy one !!!

- Ah, but to drive it, you have to buy this and this and this and this ..."

You'll totally wrong, players don't need labels, they need to have efficient publishers, who know of what they're talking about ,what their decisions will make them appreciated or not.

Actually, Ubisoft is one of the most gaped publishers with communities, always looking for something "new" but they don't understand, that if their technology are new, our isn't, and people won't follow them because they simply can't .(K, ubi give me €Billion, and i could install my personal high speed internet)

As Oleg told us, it's the new standarts of the simulations, but did they(ubi) ever see what an aerial simulator require, to work ? This not a classic platform game for casual players, neither a burnout-like game, it requires an comp with complete good equipments.

Well that's a part of i wan't to tell for money brewers at ubisoft.

PS: don't forget the Guide dog with the collector edition, You never can tell:cool:....

[JG27CaptStubing]

This whole thing is silly and I'm not buying that I can't be made optional. This is the first time I've heard these types of measures are being implemented.

Retarded:rolleyes:

[Borsch]

Ubisoft have had this development rule for over 3 yrs, its an oversight from the Dev's not Ubisoft.

Ilya said that Ubisoft changed their policy on epilepsy 1 year ago. The change impacted on everything that was graphics in CoD. THe last 3 months of CoD's development were spent on matching the sim to the Ubisoft epilepsy spec.

Its all in this thread:
http://www.sukhoi.ru/forum/showthread.php?t=67803&p=1571060&viewfull=1#post1571060

[Thee_oddball]

Ubisoft have had this development rule for over 3 yrs, its an oversight from the Dev's not Ubisoft.

and a link to your proof would be greatly appreciated.

[Ploughman]

Ilya said that Ubisoft changed their policy on epilepsy 1 year ago. The change impacted on everything that was graphics in CoD. THe last 3 months of CoD's development were spent on matching the sim to the Ubisoft epilepsy spec.

Its all in this thread:
http://www.sukhoi.ru/forum/showthread.php?t=67803&p=1571060&viewfull=1#post1571060

Should've gone with a different publisher. I mean really. And not stating it before release even though they knew there would be a problem? Did they think nobody would notice? I'm disapointed. I'll stick with buying the game (I'd call it a sim but I think having being played, I'll stick with game) even if I won't be able to play it if only to support development, but this is pathetic and it's not just Ubi who're implicated.

[Borsch]

Should've gone with a different publisher. I mean really. And not stating it before release even though they knew there would be a problem? Did they think nobody would notice? I'm disapointed. I'll stick with buying the game (I'd call it a sim but I think having being played, I'll stick with game) even if I won't be able to play it if only to support development, but this is pathetic and it's not just Ubi who're implicated.

THey didn't state before release because theyr were working on it non stop, there is a 500mb patch launched already. They were hoping to sort things out before, or immediately after the launch of the sim. It didnt work out, the problem is here and its big.

There is hope that Russian publisher 1C will back down on this epilepsy crap. Where that would leave western gamers- do not know.

[Tree_UK]

and a link to your proof would be greatly appreciated.

Here you go from 2008. The dev's screwed up, Im sure in time they will work it out.

http://spong.com/article/15691/Ubisoft-is-Screening-Video-Games-for-Epilepsy

[6S.Manu]

Should've gone with a different publisher. I mean really. And not stating it before release even though they knew there would be a problem? Did they think nobody would notice? I'm disapointed. I'll stick with buying the game (I'd call it a sim but I think having being played, I'll stick with game) even if I won't be able to play it if only to support development, but this is pathetic and it's not just Ubi who're implicated.

Infact...

[Ploughman]

THey didn't state before release because theyr were working on it non stop, there is a 500mb patch launched already. They were hoping to sort things out before, or immediately after the launch of the sim. It didnt work out, the problem is here and its big.

There is hope that Russian publisher 1C will back down on this epilepsy crap. Where that would leave western gamers- do not know.

Explains why Oleg and Luthier disapearred four weeks ago. Good luck to them sorting it out. I wonder how their Russian customers feel having had their sim release screwed by a western publisher? It's clear that Ubi require this filter to be ON in any game sold in its sphere. That should solve the epilepsy problem as given its current state nobody will be playing it.

And I'd just like to add that making the game safe for epileptics is and admirable and righteous thing that should be an industry wide aspiration.

[Shrike_UK]

Cannot 1C re-release it themselves to the Western market? after all they are a publisher right? in a new fully patched up boxed version and do whatever they need to do graphically? we wanted the realistic flight experience, that is ruined with this propellor crap that Ubisoft want.

""Where it is not reasonably practicable to follow the Ofcom guidance, and where broadcasters can demonstrate that the broadcasting of flashing lights and/or patterns is editorially justified, viewers should be given an adequate verbal and also, if appropriate, text warning at the start of the programme or programme item."

Quite simply, IL2 is a realistic flight simulator and therefore as it is representing realistic flying of aircraft which will involved flickerring images as experienced by real WW2 pilots, this game is not suitable for viewing by people with epilepsy.

End of story, that warning would be legal!! there was no need to mess up the sim.

[Tree_UK]

Ubisoft are not the publishers in Russia, well that my understanding so why they have put the filter on is very strange?

[Thee_oddball]

Here you go from 2008. The dev's screwed up, Im sure in time they will work it out.

http://spong.com/article/15691/Ubisoft-is-Screening-Video-Games-for-Epilepsy

thnx i found it aswell :) but this can all be laid at the feet of UBI soft, some kid with a nintendo DS has a seizure and UBI "voluntarily" goes overboard, even though there was no ....
Hodge's basic line, however, was that there is not going to be any legislation for video game publishers in the UK. She stated, "On the statutory safeguards, the General Product Safety Regulations 2005 make it compulsory for producers to place warnings and instructions on all consumer products, including video games

[Tree_UK]

Yeah but even so, the dev's dropped the ball big time on this one, blaming UBi is a bit lame.

[Shrike_UK]

And I'd just like to add that making the game safe for epileptics is and admirable and righteous thing that should be an industry wide aspiration.

+1 however this kind of thing takes time to implement. And UBI wouldve known that to enforce this on Ilya and Co. would cause a lot of problems particularily so late in development.

Also, no imagery on TV and PC can prevent Epilepsy, im sure that scientists can prove that, that is a total myth, and totally irresponsible claim. Just switching on a Nintendo couldve given that boy a seizure. Perhaps they should recall all TVs, PC Monitors, and Consoles aswell to make sure that the screens light up slowly... food for thought, i wonder how much that would cost them. no i doubt they would open that can of worms. Until someone sues over it.

[Kuky]

This sucks ass... so many years for this flight sim to be done and Ubisoft had to screw it up like this... I am not so sure now I will be getting this sim, I have preordered it last week and now I'll just ask for refund... this is not the way to go...

[Thee_oddball]

Yeah but even so, the dev's dropped the ball big time on this one, blaming UBi is a bit lame.

Some over stimulated red bull gulping twat has a seizure while playing some ridiculous nintendo DS game called Raving Rabbit and the room temperature I.Q. set over at UBI has a grand maul spastic reaction and cause's an avalanche of overkill and institutes some blanket policy instead of finding out if the game was REALLY the problem to begin with...and this was done even as the UK said that there would be no legislation.....

[ruxtmp]

Well this kills my thoughts on purchasing on release date in the US. Steam was already making me worried due to issues I had with COD MW, but after reading around the forums I thought it may not be as bad in CoD. This new feature kills it for me, I'll wait to see what people experience and make my judgement in December, the game should be in the bargain bin by then anyway. Also this gives me more time to save for a rig upgrade (looks like I'll need one anyway).

Now I am honostly looking forward to IL-2 4.11

[hashi]

Aw stink aye!

A note to people suggesting that the devs wont be sued...thats not the issue. The issue is that UBI fears to be sued. They fear that if they are sued, the company will die.
Thing is, with such a plociy implimented, the lack of sales for the product will likewise cause the company to die.

Remember what happened with GTA 4 SA with the "hot coffee". Even having the ability to mod the game and allow access to that disabled content was enough to have the game either reclassified, or even pulled from shelves.

There is a lot to consider with this, and a simple warning is not enough to stop vultures (sorry...litigation lawyers) from trying to make a name and killing for themselves.

I agree, it sucks, it is stupid, it is grossly over compensatory for the "protection" of a small minority (those who suffer from epilepsy).

[Shrike_UK]

Its much safer for a person to discover they have epilepsy when they are sitting at a computer at home rather than when they learn to drive, crash and kill several innocent bystanders.

[JG52Krupi]

Its much safer for a person to discover they have epilepsy when they are sitting at a computer at home rather than when they learn to drive, crash and kill several innocent bystanders.

Some how i can't see that as a good defense in a court room ;), but it would make for a good comedy scene.

[TUSA/TX-Gunslinger]

So let me ask the stupid question:

Why can't there just be a hazard warning label on the product?

Or a separate product line for epileptics?

S!

Gunny

[GnigruH]

So I came to see some vids and found out that they released an unplayable game.
Splendid.

Is it just me or this game is one step from a huge fail?

Let's hope this will be like rof. I am going to wait.

[jameson]

Subtext of all this whining is that epileptics should never be allowed to play video games. Any consideration of the less fortunate should be dismissed out of hand. Problem what problem....

[Thee_oddball]

so let me ask the stupid question:

Why can't there just be a hazard warning label on the product?

Or a separate product line for epileptics?

S!

Gunny

2004...

legal notice : “certain people are susceptible to epileptic attacks, or loss of consciousness when viewing certain types of flashing lights or other stimuli frequently found in our everyday lives.
Such people are exposing themselves to possible seizures when they play certain video games. These symptoms can occur in people who have no prior medical history or who have never had an epileptic seizure.
If you have ever demonstrated epileptic symptoms (seizures, loss of consciousness) in the presence of light stimulation, consult your doctor before using any video game.
In any event, please respect the rules concerning the utilization of video games:
- avoid playing if you are tired or lack sleep.
- make sure you play in a well lit area
- take a ten to fifteen minute break every hour.”

http://ubisoft-en.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/9875/~/ubisoft---epilepsy-alert

[kalimba]

So I came to see some vids and found out that they released an unplayable game.
Splendid.

Is it just me or this game is one step from a huge fail?

Let's hope this will be like rof. I am going to wait.

After what Luthier told us, it is clear that COD is a "unfinished product"...
It is about 3 to 6 months short of being fully optimised, wich corresponds to the time they spent " implementing" the filter code that creates all sorts of problems with the playability...
What will happen though , and could be devastating, is that the reviews from all specialised magazines and websites will probably be quite bad if the game runs at 20 FPS at medium settings... And my first reaction to Luthier's comments are probably the same as many fans here, is to wait and see...
And that is also critical....

SAlute !

[Targ]

The problem being that the "solution" to allow people that can go into seizure playing a vid game may ruin it for everyone else?

How very inconsiderate indeed.

[Thee_oddball]

Subtext of all this whining is that epileptics should never be allowed to play video games. Any consideration of the less fortunate should be dismissed out of hand. Problem what problem....

(game show buzzer and announcers voice) awwww wroooong answer but thank you for playing...bob tell jameson what a nice parting gift we have for him today....you've won an all inclusive trip to the OPTIONS MENU! where you will bask in the glow of the on/off switch for the epileptic filter.....

We want the option to turn it off Jameson

[kalimba]

(game show buzzer and announcers voice) awwww wroooong answer but thank you for playing...bob tell jameson what a nice parting gift we have for him today....you've won an all inclusive trip to the OPTIONS MENU! where you will bask in the glow of the on/off switch for the epileptic filter.....

We want the option to turn it off Jameson

Luthier said it can't be done...It is a safety guard...So if an epileptic (!!!)
,in a moment of distraction disabled the thing and got sic (!!!) ...Lawsuit !

SAlute

[Avimimus]

Prince Lev Nikolaevich Myshkin says "yes!" to new feature.

[Tacoma74]

Hopefully this is something the modding community can tackle, as I highly doubt Ubisoft will allow it to be switched off. Or like some have said, to incorporate an option in the graphics menu to turn the filter off. But i'm afraid it would probably resort to using legal actions against Ubisoft which is pointless. It's all wishful thinking. Death to Ubisoft :)

[Herra Tohtori]

Subtext of all this whining is that epileptics should never be allowed to play video games. Any consideration of the less fortunate should be dismissed out of hand. Problem what problem....


No, the subtext of the complaints is that it's a disproportionate response to a problem that a small minority suffers from. I can totally support efforts to make games more accessible to everyone, but not at the cost of having to degrade the game for the rest of population.


It's the same as removing peanuts from peanut butter because there are people who could go into anaphylactic shock after eating peanuts, because they're allergic to peanuts, and then telling the rest of population that they need to also eat their butter without peanuts because they might spontaneously develop peanut allergy, suffer an allergic reaction of some strength, and subsequently sue the peanut butter company for gold.

Flashes, fast contrast changes and the like are going to happen in a flight sim. Removing that will remove essential parts of realistic graphical depiction of the simulator. Propellers, muzzle flashes, sun being obscured by cockpit structures, other airplanes or clouds, flying near buildings... there is simply no way to remove this without severly degrading the game itself.

Even worse, the filter is also affecting the gameplay performance of the game.

There is no logic in ubisoft's decision. Warning labels would be sufficient. Anti-epileptic filter would be laudable if it were possible to disable or if it didn't cause drop in performance or graphical quality. Since that is not the case, I'm not going to sit and calmly eat the manure that Ubisoft is shoveling to us. I'll be actively seeking ways to disable said filter, and if it's not possible to do by myself, I'll leave the game in my book shelf waiting for a solution to the problem, and if it never materializes I'll just play IL-2 instead - assuming the problems really are as severe as they sound like. Will have to wait and see for myself in-game.


At any rate, I am really sorry for 1C and Maddox Games, and I hope they will find some other publisher for outside Russia releases, as Ubisoft is clearly not at all interested or motivated in actually investing anything in your work. Between the lines, I can read immense frustration regarding the situation, and I really hope the situation can be remedied via later patches and releases.

Even releasing directly via Steam exclusively would be preferable to this sort of travesty, and I would never have thought I'd say this since physical copy of the game still has value for me over digital purchase, but Ubisoft's actions are simply deplorable, and I feel bad for giving any money at all for them at all - but I do want the game, and I want to support the devs.


Well, at least there's one bright spot in the end of the tunnel aside from the freight train approaching me at 120 km/h, and that's the fact that no one can take IL-2 1946 away from us. I am in fact almost certain that IL-2 will hold its own for quite a while, especially if the performance of CoD is significantly crippled by the anti-apocalyptic filtering system.

[ElAurens]

Gentlemen,

I urge all of you to cancel your pre-orders as soon as possible.

Money is all that UBI and 1C understand, so the only way to drive home our dissatisfaction is to cut off the money tap.

I have canceled both my pre orders.

Sorry Oleg, I truly am, but it's my money and I refuse to spend it on a broken product.

[Thee_oddball]

Luthier said it can't be done...It is a safety guard...So if an epileptic (!!!)
,in a moment of distraction disabled the thing and got sic (!!!) ...Lawsuit !

SAlute
i know.. i read that :) but curing the disease by killing the patient doesn't work either :)

[danjama]

Gentlemen,

I urge all of you to cancel your pre-orders as soon as possible.

Money is all that UBI and 1C understand, so the only way to drive home our dissatisfaction is to cut off the money tap.

I have canceled both my pre orders.

Sorry Oleg, I truly am, but it's my money and I refuse to spend it on a broken product.

Hear hear.

Boycott the game, don't give over any money until a satisfactory solution is found.

[Shrike_UK]

+1 Herra Tohtori spot on!

[MadBlaster]

I want to believe that this whole "anti-epilepsy filter" thing is a fake, phony marketing trick meant to lower any unrealistic expectations that guys have developed over the last few years.

Step 1 - Purposely release the game in an un-optimal state.

Step 2 - Make up a story that Ubisoft is responsible. Everyone hates them anyway and an "anti-epilespy filter" certianly sounds plausible.

Step 3 - Let the end user stew in low fps misery for a few weeks until all those unrealistic expectations go by the wayside.

Step 4 - Release a super patch that makes the problems go away.

My stomach is starting to hurt. They better get this fixed.

[highness]

i'm glad i haven't pre ordered il-2 from ubisoft/steam yet, and i will probably not be buying it.

i will try to get the russian verison instead.

[Thee_oddball]

Gentlemen,

I urge all of you to cancel your pre-orders as soon as possible.

Money is all that UBI and 1C understand, so the only way to drive home our dissatisfaction is to cut off the money tap.

I have canceled both my pre orders.

Sorry Oleg, I truly am, but it's my money and I refuse to spend it on a broken product.

does this rebellion need a theme song? :twisted:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xmckWVPRaI

[IceFire]

The only sensible thing to do is wait and see if they can remove the performance penalty or if it's possible to opt out of the silly filter. Extremely disappointed and I feel extremely bad for Oleg and Ilya and the rest of their team to be burdened with this news on what should be a time to celebrate several years of extremely hard work.

[jony_md]

Patience must be patient. We can not forget that the best game of its kind and that this study may depend on us, let the river flow. Soon we will enjoy a work of art.

Surely the team has already expressed his displeasure at Ubisoft.

When flying I will think about each aircraft that are members of Ubisot overthrown, That reassures me.

[Tacoma74]

Surely the team has already expressed his displeasure at Ubisoft.



Yes, indeed. Oleg made comments a few days ago regarding his displeasure with dealing with such hard headed imbeciles. It's too bad that Oleg will be walking away from the project after release to take more of a backseat position, but I can't say that I blame him. Hopefully there will be a good replacement that will serve the game justice. I'm not religious, but I pray everyday that this doesn't end up being another ruined game thanks to Ubishit.

Edit - I would like to add that the fact that we all must suffer from this is beyond me. It's a completely idiotic decision. Sorry to anyone who has Epilepsy, but it's ridiculous the way this has been forced upon us. It should be optional. End of story.

[Feathered_IV]

Welcome to Cliffs of Dover.... Loading

Warning! Anti-epilepsy filter is disabled. Do you wish to continue Y/N?

Easy.

[Bryan21cag]

45.5GHZ CORE X10 CPU
ATI 69000 1TB mem
124 gigs of DDR50 1333333 RAM
1 terawatt psu (with 6 pin for video of course :))


I think that should about do it :shock:


LOL ok this made me laugh out loud:) well done sir :)

[lbuchele]

It's a stupid decision.If you have Photosensitive Epilepsy you can have seizures by watching TV or even observe the sunrays passing thru the trees outside of a road when the car do a curve or even celebrating with your friends on a nightclub.
Children can have seizures watching an eletronic car with flashing light...
You cannot be blamed for that,it was not the manufacturer fault,because flashing lights do not CAUSE epilepsy,it only REVEALS a pre-existing clinical condition.
But who knows, maybe in the US legislation is made in a way that the political correct is in fact killing everyone liberty,a unexpected side effect.
Is like prohibiting chocolate cake because the world has diabetics...

[Blackdog_kt]

On a more positive note, now everyone knows how it feels to have something forced on you without the possibility of an option to turn it off :-P

[bw_wolverine]

On a more positive note, now everyone knows how it feels to have something forced on you without the possibility of an option to turn it off :-P


Yeah, and we're all having fits about it.

[Tacoma74]

On a more positive note, now everyone knows how it feels to have something forced on you without the possibility of an option to turn it off :-P
+1

My thoughts exactly.

[ATAG_Doc]

This is what you get when you elect people that feel the government can take better care of you than you can yourself. But I have bought CoD already back in Jan and still look forward to it.

[Bryan21cag]

Just got done reading all 15 pages worth of posts in here and all i want to do is beat the first epileptic i can find, to death with his own uncontrollably shaking arm :P lol just kidding........sort of :P


before you go all nerd rage on me :P
its a joke people...:)
they do have those in your country I am sure of it :)

Any way after seeing all of what has been done to IL2 over the years by private owners with missions, skins e.t.c I am confident that one of you super nerds will come out shortly with some form of magic that i can perform to take the whammy off of this wonderful new game:) i hope.....

[lbuchele]

Just to finish my argumentation: people who has epilepsy are so normal like you and me.
When properly medicated, they doesn't has seizures at all in most cases and can work,study,love,have children,etc...
Even so,there are SOME limitations.
You can't pilot a plane(but can drive a car if you are controlled) , you cannot dive or swim alone,etc...
But the limitation concerns to the patient , not to everyone else.
If I use insuline for example I shouldl not try to pass a law to force everyone to eat cakes with diabetic sweeteners...

[zapatista]

i am canceling my order as well till this is solved

the only hopeful solution i see for this is that for the russian market they will make this filter optional (or remove it completely) and put a warning on the box etc ... we can then download it online from russia, or buy it from a russian amazone site etc..

one issue people havnt mentioned in this thread yet, those in danger of having epilepsy induced are most likely people who dont yet know they have the condition or that they are predisposed to it (since epileptics generally will be told to avoid anything that involves rapidly alternating bright lights etc..).secondly, even "normal" people who are not epileptic can have epilepsy (or migraine etc) induced in them if you just expose them long enough to severe enough of a visual irritation of the right type (be this from games or other flashing lights etc).

point being: with these pc games (and movies etc) it is not a bad thing to have the game creators and programmers being made aware of some of these issues so that they take account of it where possible (meaning we might have slightly uglier prop spin, rather then more realistic ones that have an increased risk to them). and in the same way games/movies are screened by national censors for content and age rating, games could be screened for "epilepsy inducing rating" so that the worst visual effects that might be a problem are toned down.

sadly this is not how the risk reduction is being implemented, ubi seems to have located some half baked idea and is blanket implementing on all its products, even if it kills the game itself. dont have any illusions, ubi will not do anything to solve this (given their previous total disregard of customer interests, even if it completely kills a game series). our only hope is for oleg's crew to find a work around for the russian market, and us somehow getting a hold of that product line

meanwhile cancel all your orders and hit ubi in the only place they care, the sales revenue. buying directly from oleg in russia probably also significantly increases oleg's profit margin on the sale, so its supporting him in trying to find a solution

[manfromx]

I can't bring myself to cancel the preorder though I won't blame anyone who does. I've just been waiting too long. Its just a shame a project that has had so much dedication poured into it, has to be hamstrung with such a "feature". I'm just afraid they won't see the loss of revenue as anything other than a failing genre or too many darn pirates.

Whoever is running UBI really seems to like the dictatorship mentality. "Filter ON! No options!" "Internet Connection Required or we drop you! I don't care if you paid for it!"

I just hope some sort of solution can be worked out.

[Sleazy]

There is medical data that links cigarette smoking to lung cancer and another life threatening issues, however the cigarette companies are not liable for deaths related to smoking because there is a simple warning on the box.

Is Ubisoft really telling us that this can't be done for a video game?

Ubi really needs to understand that the demographic for this title is old enough to choose.

[Tacoma74]

I can't bring myself to cancel the preorder though I won't blame anyone who does. I've just been waiting too long. Its just a shame a project that has had so much dedication poured into it, has to be hamstrung with such a "feature". I'm just afraid they won't see the loss of revenue as anything other than a failing genre or too many darn pirates.

Whoever is running UBI really seems to like the dictatorship mentality. "Filter ON! No options!" "Internet Connection Required or we drop you! I don't care if you paid for it!"

I just hope some sort of solution can be worked out.

And at the end of the day it's all to no avail. They have effectively shot themselves in the foot. So much potential that has been set aside to please a select few. It's a sad day...

[manfromx]

They have effectively shot themselves in the foot.

They missed by about six feet at point blank by my guess then. Can't they do anything right ;)

[Tacoma74]

They missed by about six feet at point blank by my guess then. Can't they do anything right ;)

Sadly, no they can't. I say we all grab our pitchforks and torches and protest this nonsense. Kill UBI! Leave no survivors! :evil:

[Skoshi Tiger]

I want an 'anti-drunk' filter.
I often find that the game just doesn't handle too well after a few beers. It would be nice if it could be tailored to account for bad judjement, blurry eyesight, uncoordinated movements, and sick on the keyboard.
I eagerly await the development team's response.
:-)

This has already been implemented. You select complex engine mangement and if you can't get the plane started, your obviously too drunk!

Cheers!

[Meek]

I registered to say I won't be pre-ordering, I'm going to wait until I hear from other players or try a demo before deciding to buy or not.

Does the Russian version have English language support? I'm thinking of importing.

[Bobb4]

The earliest western release is March 31. I am sure by then it will be fixed.
This is going to be the best flight sim ever with or without people cancelling pre-orders.
You guys forget there are thousands of nerds out there with Ubi-rage and it will become an option one way or another :grin:
As with their imfamous DRM Ubisoft does listen, it just takes time.
relax cancel your pre-order and then re-order in a week or two. Whatever makes you happy just stop with the threats, cancel, don't cancel but really do we have to read about it here?
Go to Ubi zoo and tell them there you are cancelling, honestly thats the only place they listen if they actually do :grin:
As for me I am getting my boxed copy on April 1, its release date in South Africa and I just know if I am not happy then, a few weeks will not kill me until a fix is found.
Really, we are not talking some stupid movie here, this is what I do. I work so i can pay for my flight sim addiction. And come hell or high water I will get my fix :grin::grin::grin:

[Masi67]

What can I say goddammit!
Still I won't cancel order, just won't play the game. I was waiting for user tested specs. Now we know there ain't hardware which runs this game smoothly.

This really should be an option, just disclaimer in box and user manual that if you turn antiepilepsy off...

Just like in car mirros: "Objects in mirror are closer than it seems".

Cannot understand UBISofts policy to this issue, warning and option should be enough.

I did not know that UBI has this policy until now, as it is, I will not buy any games from UBI anymore. No matter the title.

Sad new for CoD :(

-Masi

[T}{OR]

Someone could simply ignore to be epileptic. One person in 4'000 can suffer from a seizure induced by light patterns. And also, someone can be an-alphabet. Or under 6 years old. Or not speaking the language of that version. Or ... you name it. A good lawyer can make a fortune out of this, in US but not only. More than that, Ubisoft wants to improve his public image after the Nintendo issue in UK, which caused a tabloid-galore.

Again, I blame only the very late action on this spec, maybe related with the late choice of the Western publisher.

Cheers,
6S.Insuber

PS: or, maybe, it's just an excuse for the low FPS ... just kidding ! :D

While this is true what you say - isn't thew game rated at 16+? How hard would it have been to include SOMETHING in the installation process (e.g. "WARNING: continue at your own risk, we are not responsible etc..."), or something in the interface, preferably before each mission loads...? Or just make it OPTIONAL, and gradually implement/perfect this feature with patches/add-ons??

I am sorry but logic eludes me here. How does breaking a functional product for the masses helps the minority out there that suffers from epileptic seizures? Unless I am mistaken, not ever other human suffers from this (e.i. 1 in 2).

Yeah but even so, the dev's dropped the ball big time on this one, blaming UBi is a bit lame.

For the first time I completely agree with you Tree. If this causes such a big FPS hit & hardware incompatibility, and devs have decided to not make it optional - why the hell wasn't CoD delayed???

Words can not describe my disappointment. I worked hard and saved enough money to build a high end rig just for this title. Now not only am I not going to purchase this (unless it gets fixed/removed), but I am having second thoughts about building a rig all together.

[julian265]

I want to confirm that everything said here is true, we have implemented some drastic features for anti-epilepsy protection which are affecting FPS and killing SLI support.
SNIP

I am disgusted to hear it, and feel for you devs who have put so much work into the sim, only to have a large, unnecessary hurdle brought up.

Does the Russian version (not published by ubi?) have epileptic protection as well? Does the Russian version work outside Russia?

[Tree_UK]

I dont buy the whole epilepsy thing, Oleg and Luthier, refused to show us any actual 'in game ' video or sound right up to release, well now we know why, the game runs bad, and yes i did tell you so, do you remember just how many times i kept asking for it . This Epilepsy thing is just a smoke screen to buy the dev's more time to get this game running, its never affected any other Ubisoft release and has been implemented since 2008. I dont buy it at all - oh Zapatrista eat your shorts son.

[z0ttel]

Does anyone know if this filter-thing has been introduced due to some laws and requlations or if it is 'just' an UBI-specific requirement?

Maybe it would be sufficient if the filter can be disabled only with some kind of 'special knowledge' like adding a certain registry key, adding a setting to a configuration file or something like that?

I know that those mechanisms are used to 'bypass' regulations on other products and as long as the solution is not obvious to the 'normal' user, I don't see a reason why this shouldn't be also a valid approach for this game. The filter will be enabled all the time, it can't be disabled by 'accident', but the user would still have the possibility to change this.

If it then would come to a law suit, UBI could argue that the game has been modified using 'special hacker experience' and so the case could be closed ;) I guess you can't be sued if you deliver software with undocument features/parameters and then someone smart starts using them, right?

;)

Btw, I'm still looking forward to my preordered CE which should arrive next week - although it will cost a small fortune here in Germany (about 70€). If this helps to support Oleg and his team (which made an amazing job) and to keep the IL2-series alive, that's a price I'm willing to pay :D

[gprr]

:(:(:(

Dspite Steam, was willing to DL CoD but as an hardware minded flight simmer and 1920x1200 LCD owner, NO!
Delaying my buy till this filter becomes an option and not mandatory!
Than will see the real diffrence between filter usage and W/O it.

GP

[kendo65]

Gutted, absolutely. What total madness.

I honestly don't know what is the best option here - some of you (understandably) cancelling pre-orders. My only concern is that we express our anger at UBI and don't hurt any possible future for the sim too.

This may be clutching at straws, but it is very early days. The people trying it out on their systems have had next to no time to play around with settings, etc, so it may be a little hasty to judge.

Anyway, support to the devs. Down with UBI.

[gprr]

I dont buy the whole epilepsy thing, Oleg and Luthier, refused to show us any actual 'in game ' video or sound right up to release, well now we know why, the game runs bad, and yes i did tell you so, do you remember just how many times i kept asking for it . This Epilepsy thing is just a smoke screen to buy the dev's more time to get this game running, its never affected any other Ubisoft release and has been implemented since 2008. I dont buy it at all - oh Zapatrista eat your shorts son.

You may be very very right:(

No cheers today

GP

[merlin1]

Delayed ?

http://il2sturmovik.ubi.com/cliffs-of-dover/en-GB/aircraft/index.aspx

[Masi67]

Delayed ?

http://il2sturmovik.ubi.com/cliffs-of-dover/en-GB/aircraft/index.aspx

No, they just haven't updated their pages:)

[Ltbear]

Not sure what to say, but i stick with IL2 1946 with the "cant talk about em" so far i have not seen something that "blew me away" and i actualy have been saving money up so i could upgrade the puter when i had the game.

Those 200$ will now go to upgrade the RC 1/16 tank park and i will add the T-34 and the jagdpanther..

Sorry Oleg and Co but will use a known frace....."Im getting to old for this shitzz"

LT

[Codex]

A NOTE ABOUT EPILEPSY
I would like to point out that epilepsy is a serious issue, people sometimes can go through their entire life never knowing they have epilepsy until they play a video game.

It may surprise some people to know that almost everyone, and I mean everyone, will have an epileptic seizure at least once on their life. These seizures will 99% of the time only last for a split second and you will most likely never know you've had one. But epilepsy has varying levels of severity, and as you'll know there are those people that suffer from its symptoms on a regular basis, sometimes hourly. If you've ever been close to someone or know someone who suffers from it, it is a scary experience to behold.

So ... I completely understand why Oleg and Luthier have to implement this limitation to CoD.

Now to my position on this ... I'm going to sound contradictory here but anyway ...

I want to confirm that everything said here is true, we have implemented some drastic features for anti-epilepsy protection which are affecting FPS and killing SLI support.

Well that is it then, this is a deal breaker for me. I'm not directing this at Oleg and his team personally, but I don't spend $$$$ (yes $thousands$) on having a high end gaming system with multi-gpu's to have my gaming experience nerfed by some legal - suit wearing - OMG we'll be sued - dickless yupi. This has just taken things too far, it is sufficient (in my eyes) to simply place a warning message on the manual and even a pop-up message on screen before the game starts. Personally I'd advise Oleg and Team to seek their own legal advise AND DITCH UBI ONCE AND FOR ALL!!!!!

It pains me to say this but I've cancelled my order. I'll stick with IL-2

P.S.

We CANNOT make these optional. That will allow an opportunistic or an unfortunate person suffering from epilepsy to sue Ubisoft for damages and literally close down the studio for good.

You make it sound like its a bad thing Luthier ;). Seriously, I understand and I feel sorry for you guys having to deal with this situation.

[mazex]

Ubisoft have had this development rule for over 3 yrs, its an oversight from the Dev's not Ubisoft.

Many notches up in respect for you Tree for this. A lot of game publishers have agreed to this due to pressure from legislators - so blaming Ubisoft is just silly. Look at this thread over at the Rift forum for example (major title released a few weeks ago - not published by Ubisoft!):

http://forums.riftgame.com/showthread.php?24979-anti-epilepsy-plea

When my youngest son was born he had serious epileptic seizures and was on so heavy medication for a year that his muscles where not developing and his lungs where filled with water as he was so heavily affected by it. I can tell you that was nothing I joke about these days...

Then I can agree that adding an option for users that want to disable it naturally would be the best solution. Be it in the config files if they cannot comply to the legislative demands otherwise.

[Tacoma74]

I dont buy the whole epilepsy thing, Oleg and Luthier, refused to show us any actual 'in game ' video or sound right up to release, well now we know why, the game runs bad, and yes i did tell you so, do you remember just how many times i kept asking for it . This Epilepsy thing is just a smoke screen to buy the dev's more time to get this game running, its never affected any other Ubisoft release and has been implemented since 2008. I dont buy it at all - oh Zapatrista eat your shorts son.

So it's a conspiracy then is it? I think it's more of a last minute deal. I don't see where you get such a crazy idea. Surely it wasn't planned to be implemented into the game until recently when Ubisoft got their greedy hands all over it. Last minute things like this often have bad side effects.

[DC338]

Does epilepsy filter also create CRAP sound?

[Feathered_IV]

I knew Ubi would fumble the release, but I never dreamed they could f *ck it up the arse to this extent.

That being said, I reckon the anti epilepsy excuse sounds like total bullish*t. Any other company would add a disclaimer in their terms and conditions that you agree too when you install. We're not getting the whole story here.

[waffen-79]

somebody post the link to the youtube video of "Hitler reacts to ubi anti-epilectic implemented in COD"

seriuosly, we have almost 20 days left, let's see if it gets sort it out

[combatdudePL]

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/8071032709/m/6751022719

Look at the bottom of thread

[Qpassa]

I hate Ubisoft so much

[Tvrdi]

do we have vids showing filter ON and OFF? I would like to know whats this all about...visually...

[mazex]

The ignorance shown in this thread is really depressing.

Besides, like pointed out by Tree, Ubisoft has been doing this for ALL their titles for three years, the same goes for Sony and many other major publishers. I don't know about EA. Have you noticed bad performance in all the other titles by Ubisoft or Sony for the last three years? They apparently managed to pass the tests without loosing performance somehow, with some exceptions like Wipeout HD for PS3 that Sony stopped and sent back to the developers before releasing it for not passing the same tests we talk about here - in 2008!

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/193765/news/wipeout-hd-delayed-for-failing-epilepsy-tests/

I sure hope that MG can address their performance issues, just like the other developers have done.

[Targ]

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/8071032709/m/6751022719

Look at the bottom of thread


Often it seems to take a week or longer for anyone to reply to her requests for information.

Let's hope we hear something much sooner.

[T}{OR]

do we have vids showing filter on and OFF? I would like to know whats this all about...visually...

seconded

[Targ]

The ignorance shown in this thread is really depressing.

Besides, like pointed out by Tree, Ubisoft has been doing this for ALL their titles for three years, the same goes for Sony and many other major publishers. I don't know about EA. Have you noticed bad performance in all the other titles by Ubisoft or Sony for the last three years? They apparently managed to pass the tests without loosing performance somehow.

I sure hope that MG can address their performance issues, just like the other developers have done.

I assume you have a link with some good information backing this claim up? Or is it that we are simply to ignorant for you to provide some links to back your claim up?

[mazex]

I assume you have a link with some good information backing this claim up? Or is it that we are simply to ignorant for you to provide some links to back your claim up?

Edited my post above with a link, you can sure find more yourself - my guess about the reason there are not so many to find are because this is handled internally, who would like to post stuff like that in public? I guess MANY developers have got their games back to re engineer them the last three years - but WHY would the developers or the publishers want to make that a public discussion like this? It sure as hell strikes back at themselves (both parties).

[csThor]

The decision makers at 1C really need to take a long hard look at ways to put their boot up Uselesshit's collective ass and kick em so hard that they reach a geostatic orbit. This "publisher" has caused nothing but hassle since they bought BlueByte over ten years ago ... and this abonimation is the latest straw. WTF is Uselesshit serving during its board meetings? LSD? :evil:

[Tree_UK]

And your UBISOFT fanboy jabbering is unbearable. As a cheated Silent Hunter V Customer I don't give a XXXX what UBISOFT has done or not ! I considered to break my personal UBISOFT boycott to support Oleg and his team, but if there is no fix until Mar 31st I won't buy the game....with tears in my eyes !

This is a joke post right? Mazex isn't a Ubisoft fanboy, your dealing with the facts here, Cliffs Of Dover did not meet the required Eplipesy standard that Ubisoft amongst others have imposed for the last 3 years, this is not Ubisofts fault, the dev's have screwed up, either that, or its an excuse for such a poor running game. Given the fact that they refused to show us any 'in game' footage despite repeated request from myself and others then it would appear that its a cover up for a poor running game. IMHO.

[kendo65]

The ignorance shown in this thread is really depressing.

Besides, like pointed out by Tree, Ubisoft has been doing this for ALL their titles for three years, the same goes for Sony and many other major publishers. I don't know about EA. Have you noticed bad performance in all the other titles by Ubisoft or Sony for the last three years? They apparently managed to pass the tests without loosing performance somehow, with some exceptions like Wipeout HD for PS3 that Sony stopped and sent back to the developers before releasing it for not passing the same tests we talk about here - in 2008!

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/193765/news/wipeout-hd-delayed-for-failing-epilepsy-tests/

I sure hope that MG can address their performance issues, just like the other developers have done.

The only thing I'd say in response is that apparently Ubi were only signed up fairly late. So, if they came onboard late last year it is entirely feasible that the situation is as described - and this whole issue was foisted on the devs at last minute.

[Vasilj_Mitu]

what bothers me here is why the hell did the MG guys kept their mouth tightly shut about that AE filter nonsense until the game was out in Russia?

[Jarsalla]

Ubi had sacks of gold in it's hands, but now it is slowly turning into pile of poo.

Still looking forward to see videos in youtube where someone actually flys the released sim and not some beta. After that I'll make conclusions whether or not I'm going to cancel my pre-order.

[mazex]

And your UBISOFT fanboy jabbering is unbearable. As a cheated Silent Hunter V Customer I don't give a XXXX what UBISOFT has done or not ! I considered to break my personal UBISOFT boycott to support Oleg and his team, but if there is no fix until Mar 31st I won't buy the game....with tears in my eyes !

I'm in no way a fanboy of Ubisoft or any publisher. In my opinion they are like the record companies and I would be happy if they where eliminated in the same way as we see the record companies are going these days with iTunes and Spotify expanding their market every day. I would be a lot happier to buy my games at online stores directly from the developers instead (like with the DCS titles)

I also bought SH V and sure as hell think that it was a real disappointment. SH III with GWX 3.0 is not - and that was also published by Ubisoft when no other major publishers where releasing serious sub sims any more...

What I do have a problem with is all the "i hate Ubisoft/DRM/Steam/everything" attitude here.

EDIT: And yes like I posted earlier here I have a son that almost died after serious epeleptic seizures that came three days after he was born. If you have children yourself and have been standing next to a bed with three days old baby with wires all over his head and 3-4 injections of heavy anti seizure drugs I guess you would have a bit more respect for companies that take this seriously. For a year he had so heavy medication that he could not even rise his head until he was 6 months as he had no muscles due to the heavy medication. Now he is amazingly enough fine They did tests for more than $50.000 and could never explain it - it just went away when he was one year old.

Now he is five and like to sit and play computer games with me, his older brother is not much for aircraft be he is. If you had a son like that - would you have the filter on or off? Would you appreciate that it was there? They have said they don't know why it happened - and it may come back... When being exposed to stuff like computer games for example. So then don't let him play then you may answer? But his older brother plays a lot like all of his friends.

So ????

[Matt255]

what bothers me here is why the hell did the MG guys kept their mouth tightly shut about that AE filter nonsense until the game was out in Russia?
It would've bothered me, from a developer/publisher point-of-view, if they would've done exactly that.

Not revealing that a software has issues/problems/bugs/"weird features" at release is the way it's been for decades, for good reason.

[kendo65]

...but it is very early days. The people trying it out on their systems have had next to no time to play around with settings, etc, so it may be a little hasty to judge.


further to that see Buzzsaw's post below

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?p=239179#post239179

Check out the comments of the guy who CAN run it.

'disabling dynamic weather'. Surely some of them can't be flying around with dynamic weather ON???!

Can they?

[Gourmand]

it's the first game anti-epilepsy-ready?!?
yeaaaah cool !!! or not...
we like FPS !!!!
it's must be a choice like " desactivate blood mod" for kid for exemple...

need a hack or good modder !!!!


i'm very disapointed...

i invit us to mail ubi if your game sucks with this feature !!!

[Fansadox]

Im sorry Oleg team but im not gonna buy a product from Ubisoft wich is made BROKEN the last few weeks to make UBI happy.

Either it works or it doesnt and it seems it doesnt... So either give me an option to turn it off or im simply not buying it with reduced FPS by some filter that 1 person of 25000 needs

And thats that.

[Vevster]

Does epilepsy filter also create CRAP sound?

+1

and crappy low level graphics

[mazex]

Im sorry Oleg team but im not gonna buy a product from Ubisoft wich is made BROKEN the last few weeks to make UBI happy.

Either it works or it doesnt and it seems it doesnt... So either give me an option to turn it off or im simply not buying it with reduced FPS by some filter that 1 person of 25000 needs

And thats that.

What the heck do you think you know about epilepcy? It is considered that between 0.5-1% of all people have it - but many don't know, until one day playing a video game or beeing exposed to other triggering factors.

[Codex]

What I do have a problem with is all the "i hate Ubisoft/DRM/Steam/everything" attitude here.

Well I for one hate UBI, but if you look through the many posts I've made on the past few weeks I've been pro "DRM/Steam/everything" but this issue is just nonsense.

The more I think about it the more I'm starting to question it. Why CoD and why now. There are many games released in the last three years by UBI that allow for Crossfire and SLI support.

I've just bought the entire Splinter Cell series (one of UBI's signature IP games) off Steam yesterday, just finished downloading them, and guess what they ALL support Crossfire. The Crossfire Icon is displaying the top right corner, so as far as AMD is concerned - my two GPU's are working in Crossfire mode. Splinter Cell Conviction, the latest chapter in the series, released in 2010 and it's using Crossfire! So I'm not buying the "simulation's have severe effect on epilepsy" argument. There something more to this.

[Fansadox]

What the heck do you think you know about epilepcy? It is considered that between 0.5-1% of all people have it - but many don't know, until one day playing a video game or beeing exposed to other triggering factors.

I have been playing videogames for 30 years and the only time i have been rolling uncontrolable is when i popped a bottle of Vodka so give me an option to turn it off.

[whatnot]

After six years of waiting we end up with crap like this, it's unbelievable! Not sure nor care who is the root cause behind all of it doesn't really matter.

This makes me want to go five-year-old on everyones' ass directly or indirectly contributing to this crap: I don't give a sh*t about the seizures of any epileptic person on this planet! Strap yourselves to your gaming chair and wear a helmet when starting up any game for the first time just in case! But legislators and companies, don't create directives that go overboard and affect everyone else. Make it optional, create 10-time approval clicking process, make players sign a paper before playing or whatever, but not this. (No crap meant to the ones suffering from the disease, but there are limits to everything.)

I'm sure there are million things in TV and real life that can significantly increase a risk of epileptic seizure. But I haven't seen much else than warnings texts so far. Just look at your average cartoon these days! It'll give an average grown-up a heart attack just to be in the same room.

All of this sure shows how the legal system is abused these days and companies need to prepare for the worse because of too many idiots and creed. Pouring hot coffee on yourself or giving a butcher knife to your kids to play with can make you rich unless some manual tells that coffee is hot and knifes are not toys. Jesus Christ!

One can argue that this can be an unforseeable adverse event for an individual not aware of his / her tendency for epilepsy. But so is marathon for a senior citizen in the form of heart attack or cerebral hemorage, and there they are running around with no legal responsibility attached to the organization arranging the event.

Before any solicitation takes place there should be a sanity board filtering out all the crap in a five minute session:

1) Did you die, get a permanent handicap or serious mental trauma from your incident?

2) Was the cause of the incident your own stupidity or lack of common sense or real neglect from the manufacturer of ignoring an true safety concern in the product or service in question?

If not, go cry somewhere else.

My pre-order will be cancelled today until reports of decent frame rates with decent settings on atleast a top-end PC.

And before smart asses start offering tissues and asking people to calm down I say that there is a limit to tolerance and mine was crossed here. Been all but supportive for my entire stay at these forums but with no smooth gameplay, there is no game for me. And I think there is every right to be upset even though it's 'just a game'. I atleast have been waiting for years to get my hands on it and will invest heavily on HW to be able to run it. So it is kind of a big thing!

Don't have enough information to know who's miss this is at the end of the day and I don't really care either. I just want it to be fixed before I'm chipping in to this party.

And I truly hope that these issues are mitigated in very near future and all of this will be put behind us as the stage fever driven anxiety attacks! :rolleyes:

[Tiger27]

This is a joke post right? Mazex isn't a Ubisoft fanboy, your dealing with the facts here, Cliffs Of Dover did not meet the required Eplipesy standard that Ubisoft amongst others have imposed for the last 3 years, this is not Ubisofts fault, the dev's have screwed up, either that, or its an excuse for such a poor running game. Given the fact that they refused to show us any 'in game' footage despite repeated request from myself and others then it would appear that its a cover up for a poor running game. IMHO.

Do you have proof that these are the facts, or of anything you are saying, how do you know what Luthier said isn't the truth ie that this was dumped on them late in development, do you have someone on the inside letting you know these facts or do you just read the forums like the rest of us and make an educated guess, you seem to imply in your posts that you are somehow 'in the know' but I doubt you know anymore than the rest of us.

[Tree_UK]

Do you have proof that these are the facts, or of anything you are saying, how do you know what Luthier said isn't the truth ie that this was dumped on them late in development, do you have someone on the inside letting you know these facts or do you just read the forums like the rest of us and make an educated guess, you seem to imply in your posts that you are somehow 'in the know' but I doubt you know anymore than the rest of us.

Fact - We never saw any 'in game footage' despite numerous requests.
Fact - Ubisoft have had the Epilepsy rule for over 3 years
Fact - 1c failed to meet the requirements of the rule, hence luthier having to apply the filter, this as caused FPS drop and effectively disabled SLI.

proof here from 2008, please read the forums Tiger, its all there.

http://spong.com/article/15691/Ubisoft-is-Screening-Video-Games-for-Epilepsy

[Meek]

Does epilepsy filter also create CRAP sound?

Nah, it's just Ubisoft worried about certain frequencies making people's ears explode, so they force 1C to use known "safe frequencies" for audio.

That, or they are just poorly made, but given recent events, which do you think is more likely?

[mazex]

Fact - We never saw any 'in game footage' despite numerous requests.
Fact - Ubisoft have had the Epilepsy rule for over 3 years
Fact - 1c failed to meet the requirements of the rule, hence luthier having to apply the filter, this as caused FPS drop and effectively disabled SLI.

proof here from 2008, please read the forums Tiger, its all there.

http://spong.com/article/15691/Ubisoft-is-Screening-Video-Games-for-Epilepsy

Well Tree, never though I would be holding hands with you in the middle of a flame storm :) I guess you may have some extra flame suit in the wardrobe? Maybe some worn out that I can borrow?

[JG52Krupi]

Fact - We never saw any 'in game footage' despite numerous requests.
Fact - Ubisoft have had the Epilepsy rule for over 3 years
Fact - 1c failed to meet the requirements of the rule, hence luthier having to apply the filter, this as caused FPS drop and effectively disabled SLI.

proof here from 2008, please read the forums Tiger, its all there.

http://spong.com/article/15691/Ubisoft-is-Screening-Video-Games-for-Epilepsy

No, No and No

I have read elsewhere that they dropped the epilepsy rule a year ago.

You have no idea, about the meetings between Ubi and 1c so STFU your full of assumptions that you have no means of verifying!!!

[|ZUTI|]

I just hope that:
- they manage to remove this epilepsy protection from RUS game version (if it will not be toggable for western region)
- there will be an option to have english language in RUS game version.

OR
- image quality will be the same with that protection or without it (can't imagine this one though).

We shall see.

[Kankkis]

next week i see how it run on my gig

Specs:
Gigabyte GA-58 Extreme
i920 -> 3,4GHz
6 gig ram
Ati 5970 crossfire, just bought some time ago because IL2 CODcoming :(
Win 7 64bit

if not running smoothly enough then there is something really broken in code.

Those Vaal bughunting videos, in my opinion it's looks good with FPS, lots of detail and so on. Of course there is no other planes.
Of course Developers diary 1 was wonderful, but it's trailer, not actually raw gameplay :(

Next week i see the truth

We are not seen any good videos yet, only those couple of bad videos.

Kankkis

[David198502]

Gentlemen,

I urge all of you to cancel your pre-orders as soon as possible.

Money is all that UBI and 1C understand, so the only way to drive home our dissatisfaction is to cut off the money tap.

I have canceled both my pre orders.

Sorry Oleg, I truly am, but it's my money and I refuse to spend it on a broken product.

i will do so now!!i was afraid that i would not be able to play the game smoothly with my rig.now im confident.sorry to the devs, but get another publisher!!!!:evil:

[whatnot]

We are not seen any good videos yet, only those couple of bad videos.

That's true, just 30 second clips from some naysayers. Would love to see a written report in english of what HW they're using, how does it run on different gfx settings on different situations (over the sea, cities, countryside, 10 planes, 100 planes etc).

Damn Ruskies just keep it to themselves and the only thing we get are small nuggets of poor framerates and slideshows without any context.

[PE_Tigar]

This is a joke post right? Mazex isn't a Ubisoft fanboy, your dealing with the facts here, Cliffs Of Dover did not meet the required Eplipesy standard that Ubisoft amongst others have imposed for the last 3 years, this is not Ubisofts fault, the dev's have screwed up, either that, or its an excuse for such a poor running game. Given the fact that they refused to show us any 'in game' footage despite repeated request from myself and others then it would appear that its a cover up for a poor running game. IMHO.

Frankly, and I mean no disrespect, I don't give a flying f*** about epileptics' video game problems. If you do have symptoms, don't play video games - you have many better things to do. If you don't have symptoms, but have epileptic cores in your brain - it's just a matter of time before you get it, video games or not.

So, to conclude:

1. The Ubisoft's insistence on this is pure "social responsibility" posturing, and making devs absorb the costs is evil. Epilepsy standards? Give me a break!

2. I'm cancelling my pre-order for now, and will get the game from Russia if and when they make the filter optional there.

3. I again emphasize that Oleg and Maddox Games would be much better off if they've published their product themselves online.

[whatnot]

2. I'm cancelling my pre-order for now, and will get the game from Russia if and when they make the filter optional there.

Has there been any reports of how it performs with this famous russion version without the protection?

Igomir and the leaked vids look quite ok to me given the HW that was used.

[Kankkis]

And secondly, we doesen't know even how much that epileptic system is lowered overall performance, it maybe be 2%, who knows.

Hold on horses friends, wait until it is released here in UK next week.


Kankkis

[Vevster]

You have no idea, about the meetings between Ubi and 1c so STFU your full of assumptions that you have no means of verifying!!!

There are many here who post about Ubi with only assumptions & no knowledge of the meetings either, do they have to STFU too? Why don't you tell them so? why is it that only those who question Luthier's explanation would have to STFU?

there.

3. I again emphasize that Oleg and Maddox Games would be much better off if they've published their product themselves online.


1C did publish it, they don't need the anti epileptic filter since it's evil Ubi who insisted on it if we have to believe what is said; but strangely, it is present in 1C version. Why?

[David198502]

i am canceling my order as well till this is solved

the only hopeful solution i see for this is that for the russian market they will make this filter optional (or remove it completely) and put a warning on the box etc ... we can then download it online from russia, or buy it from a russian amazone site etc..

one issue people havnt mentioned in this thread yet, those in danger of having epilepsy induced are most likely people who dont yet know they have the condition or that they are predisposed to it (since epileptics generally will be told to avoid anything that involves rapidly alternating bright lights etc..).secondly, even "normal" people who are not epileptic can have epilepsy (or migraine etc) induced in them if you just expose them long enough to severe enough of a visual irritation of the right type (be this from games or other flashing lights etc).

point being: with these pc games (and movies etc) it is not a bad thing to have the game creators and programmers being made aware of some of these issues so that they take account of it where possible (meaning we might have slightly uglier prop spin, rather then more realistic ones that have an increased risk to them). and in the same way games/movies are screened by national censors for content and age rating, games could be screened for "epilepsy inducing rating" so that the worst visual effects that might be a problem are toned down.

sadly this is not how the risk reduction is being implemented, ubi seems to have located some half baked idea and is blanket implementing on all its products, even if it kills the game itself. dont have any illusions, ubi will not do anything to solve this (given their previous total disregard of customer interests, even if it completely kills a game series). our only hope is for oleg's crew to find a work around for the russian market, and us somehow getting a hold of that product line

meanwhile cancel all your orders and hit ubi in the only place they care, the sales revenue. buying directly from oleg in russia probably also significantly increases oleg's profit margin on the sale, so its supporting him in trying to find a solution

is it possible to have an english menu in the russian version??

[Tacoma74]

The stuttering and laggy framerates are sure to induce an epileptic seizure more-so than a smooth running game. Watching some of the videos coming out is making me weezy. Hopefully this is fixed. I shouldn't have to invest in a crazy system just to get past what this filter ultimately does to inhibit smooth performance. ARGH!! Damn your legal policies!!

[professor]

I am epileptic and I applaud of decision form UBI :rolleyes:

[Davy TASB]

The stuttering and laggy framerates are sure to induce an epileptic seizure more-so than a smooth running game.

A very valid point that the money grabbing execs at UBI are too dim to understand.

[Tvrdi]

I hope I will not get epilepsy because of UBI decision haha

and I agree, If we ever get epilepsy that would be from bad framerates before anything else...

[JG52Krupi]

I hope I will not get epilepsy because of UBI decision haha

and I agree, If we ever get epilepsy that would be from bad framerates before anything else...

Lol yes instead of a reduction in Color between frames we now have huge changes, this game is torture for people that suffer from epilepsy...

[Mysticpuma]

I'm keenly waiting for news on this as it seems, once-more, UBISOFT have gone out of there way to cripple another of their game releases and the Developer suffers!

I don't get why, after all the years of development, that 1C chose a Developer that most in the community saw as one that would or could make or break this product, with most thinking the 'break' would be more possible!

So-far I have not seen anything in the videos and release information that makes me think this has now been rush-released by Ubi and Russia (fortunately for us in the West) is getting to Beta test all the bugs before the 31st in Europe and by the time it reaches the US it should be running smoothly only if the statement by Oleg regarding patches depending on the success of the initial release isn't a forewarning that there may be little done after?

I hope that CoD gets it's success, those who are IL2 fans will, I am sure, be there for it, but it's like everything.....you need new blood to come into the market to make the sales figures work, and if the game is buggy, glitchy and problematic from the start, new buyers will be the ones writing poor reviews and killing future sales!

I applaud the epilepsy implementation, but to make it non-optional is ridiculous. It should be the users choice, but then again what can you say when an Historical Simulation has marketing decisions forced on it like the removal of the Historically accurate hakenkreuz!

I'm now cancelling my Steam order and waiting to see what it's like when it's released in the US, hopefully with a couple of patches in the Steam version implemented?

Cheers, MP

[mazex]

This thread truly is depressing...

How come I'm not amazed that this descended into making jokes about the 0.5-1% of the population that suffer from a very serious disease? What's next? How low can you go?

And no, I'm not cancelling any pre-order unless the devs continue blaming not passing the tests that most other games pass without resulting in a slide show - to cover up a non optimized release. I can take that the game is released in a non finished state and gets patched to work later (like the RoF release). But blaming the anti epilepsy screening tests and Ubisoft for that is not the way to sell games. I hope you understand that making statements like that hurts your sales - or what? Just look at this mess. Get some sleep and think twice before posting comments like that?

[Tree_UK]

This thread truly is depressing...

How come I'm not amazed that this descended into making jokes about the 0.5-1% of the population that suffer from a very serious disease? What's next? How low can you go?

+1, 100% agree. This is not a joke, the epilepsy rule/law is there to protect people who have the misfortune to suffer from this terrible condition, Ubi should be praised for taking action in 2008 not rubbished. Its sad that it has blighted Cliffs of Dover, but it is an oversight from the Dev's not from Ubisoft. It hasn't affected any other game or developers that adhere to the same restrictions.

[kendo65]

Fact - We never saw any 'in game footage' despite numerous requests.
Fact - Ubisoft have had the Epilepsy rule for over 3 years
Fact - 1c failed to meet the requirements of the rule, hence luthier having to apply the filter, this as caused FPS drop and effectively disabled SLI.

proof here from 2008, please read the forums Tiger, its all there.

http://spong.com/article/15691/Ubisoft-is-Screening-Video-Games-for-Epilepsy

The only thing that doesn't fit this is that Ubi only got involved again late last year. (I know Tree has said otherwise but i want to see facts to back that up before buying another grand conspiracy theory)

[Vevster]

So-far I have not seen anything in the videos and release information that makes me think this has now been rush-released by Ubi


Rush released by 1C, not by Ubi.

We cannot accuse Ubi of delaying the release to the 31st in Europe & April in the US, and accuse them of releasing it too early.

Information about how finished the game is/was lies in the studio in Russia & at 1C. 1C decided on the global release date (March 2011) as much as Ubi, if not more.

[Tvrdi]

+1, 100% agree. This is not a joke, the epilepsy rule/law is there to protect people who have the misfortune to suffer from this terrible condition, Ubi should be praised for taking action in 2008 not rubbished. Its sad that it has blighted Cliffs of Dover, but it is an oversight from the Dev's not from Ubisoft. It hasn't affected any other game or developers that adhere to the same restrictions.

I have a friend who has epilepsy and hes playing IL2 and other sims no probs...

[Tree_UK]

I have a friend who has epilepsy and hes playing IL2 and other sims no probs...

Well that is most probably true, unfortunatley Cliffs Of Dover failed to meet the required standards by Ubisoft.

[Tvrdi]

Well that is most probably true, unfortunatley Cliffs Of Dover failed to meet the required standards by Ubisoft.

cool then make it as an option so ppl who dont have epilepsy can turn it OFF.....is that fair enough?

[swiss]

shame on you!

I'm blind and i'm pleased that ubisoft requested the implementation of that enjoyable voice who can help me flying over the cliffs of dover.

God bless ubi.

roflmaostc!

[Tree_UK]

cool then make it as an option so ppl who dont have epilepsy can turn it OFF.....is that fair enough?

well i agree with you whole heartedly, however we are assuming that this was required by Ubisoft, all other Ubisoft games have a warning on the box. So the dev's blaming Ubisoft makes it very suspicious and looks more and more like a smoke screen for a very badly running unfinished game.

[mazex]

I have a friend who has epilepsy and hes playing IL2 and other sims no probs...

So then all is fine? Should I let my five year old play computer games as he has not had a seizure in four years play this game then? The other solution here seems to be that I should tell him that no, you can't play computer games ever in your life even if all your friends do it all the time. That is not for you, go can go play on the yard outside instead...

[Tacoma74]

+1, 100% agree. This is not a joke, the epilepsy rule/law is there to protect people who have the misfortune to suffer from this terrible condition, Ubi should be praised for taking action in 2008 not rubbished. Its sad that it has blighted Cliffs of Dover, but it is an oversight from the Dev's not from Ubisoft. It hasn't affected any other game or developers that adhere to the same restrictions.

None of this defeats the fact that this should be made optional. That is the main issue we're having right now. Yes epilepsy is serious, but why bring all of us down. Unless it is made optional or fixed to work like it should soon then the game will be off to a very bad start. Question is, will it be authorized to legally be made optional, or must we all suffer with this crap forever, or until it is effectively fixed? I shouldn't have to drop an extra lump sum of cash to be able to play this smoothly. Period.

[mazex]

roflmaostc!

Yeah - this is so much fun making jokes about people with diseases and handicaps... I'm also rolling on the floor. How could I ever stop laughing after humor like that?

[Cowboy10uk]

Ummm well no, as its a 16+ game, Hes too young for it anyway. Im sorry your son has epilepsy, But to expect everyone else to have to put up with some draconian filter is out of order. If epilepsy affects him that badly then sadly He wont be able to play video games, The fact his brother and mates do is hard luck, but thats life.

Yes I agree Epilepsy is a bad condition and I know people do suffer greatly for it, BUT they are aware of the condition and its UP to THEM to take measures to stop themselves having an attack. OR if they are young like your son, then its upto the the Parents to take the action.

Stop expecting the rest of the world to have to make sacrifices on the off chance some person near us suffers from a medical condition. Im sick and tired of this damn nanny state that has grown up because of the bloody PC brigade.

This may sound harse, if it does Im sorry, and yes before you ask I have seen many many people suffer from epilepsy including some very close friends.

[Health_Angel]

Yeah - this is so much fun making jokes about people with diseases and handicaps... I'm also rolling on the floor. How could I ever stop laughing after humor like that?

So the solution is to make a game unplayable for all customers because your 5 year old son couldn't play it? There are plenty of games he could (actually should) play instead of IL2 CoD i guess.

[mazex]

None of this defeats the fact that this should be made optional. That is the main issue we're having right now. Yes epilepsy is serious, but why bring all of us down. Unless it is made optional or fixed to work like it should soon then the game will be off to a very bad start. Question is, will it be authorized to legally be made optional, or must we all suffer with this crap forever, or until it is effectively fixed? I shouldn't have to drop an extra lump sum of cash to be able to play this smoothly. Period.

I have no problem at all with making it optional, and I think that is how it should be done too. But as this is to comply with laws and government recommendations there may be some problem there unfortunately. Somehow all other Ubisoft titles have managed to do it without losing FPS... How about Assasins Creed : Brotherhood - that game has passed the same tests and has an average user score of 9.1 over at Gamespot now (released March 2011). They sure had to do some compromises to make it pass as there are a lot of gameplay involving going from dark rooms to sun bathing desert there... Hear a lot of people whining about how bad it looks and how it stutters all the time? Do you hear the devs blaming Ubisoft for making the implement the features that will make the game more friendly to people with these serious problems?

[Tiger27]

Fact - We never saw any 'in game footage' despite numerous requests.
Fact - Ubisoft have had the Epilepsy rule for over 3 years
Fact - 1c failed to meet the requirements of the rule, hence luthier having to apply the filter, this as caused FPS drop and effectively disabled SLI.

proof here from 2008, please read the forums Tiger, its all there.

http://spong.com/article/15691/Ubisoft-is-Screening-Video-Games-for-Epilepsy

What you have proved is that Ubi has been screening games for epilepsy since 2008 (google is your friend, well done), what you haven't proven is your following comments,
"this is not Ubisofts fault, the dev's have screwed up, either that, or its an excuse for such a poor running game. Given the fact that they refused to show us any 'in game' footage despite repeated request from myself and others then it would appear that its a cover up for a poor running game. IMHO."
As I said you have no more idea than any of us whether this is a cover up as you put it, or if UBI dumped this on Maddox Games at the last moment, it's fine to have an opinion but you are turning people away from the game on assumptions.

Why don't we wait until it's released in the West and see how it is instead of digging for faults and problems, you say you want this game to succeed while doing everything in your power to see that it doesn't...IMHO

[mazex]

So the solution is to make a game unplayable for all customers because your 5 year old son couldn't play it? There are plenty of games he could (actually should) play instead of IL2 CoD i guess.

See my answer above.

[carguy_]

A NOTE ABOUT EPILEPSY

Well that is it then, this is a deal breaker for me. I'm not directing this at Oleg and his team personally, but I don't spend $$$$ (yes $thousands$) on having a high end gaming system with multi-gpu's to have my gaming experience nerfed by some legal - suit wearing - OMG we'll be sued - dickless yupi. This has just taken things too far, it is sufficient (in my eyes) to simply place a warning message on the manual and even a pop-up message on screen before the game starts. Personally I'd advise Oleg and Team to seek their own legal advise AND DITCH UBI ONCE AND FOR ALL!!!!!

It pains me to say this but I've cancelled my order. I'll stick with IL-2

P.S.

You make it sound like its a bad thing Luthier ;). Seriously, I understand and I feel sorry for you guys having to deal with this situation.

I agree wholeheartedly. Currently it looks like the publisher put the producer at a situation in which the game might get crippled. If the release version is indeed like that, then we`re talking about crippling the sales aswell. The end-user cannot be blamed for not buying a broken game. 1C should really take legal means of cancelling the agreement with Ubi for the sake of the sales. I don`t know how others will react to this, but I`m not buying the game until I see an option to turn off the filter (a confi.ini line would be sufficent).

Saying that just from the info given by Luthier, I can only say that such a decision by Ubi is unacceptable.

[Vevster]

I have no problem at all with making it optional, and I think that is how it should be done too. But as this is to comply with laws and government recommendations there may be some problem there unfortunately. Somehow all other Ubisoft titles have managed to do it without losing FPS... How about Assasins Creed : Brotherhood - that game has passed the same tests and has an average user score of 9.1 over at Gamespot now (released March 2011). They sure had to do some compromises to make it pass as there are a lot of gameplay involving going from dark rooms to sun bathing desert there... Hear a lot of people whining about how bad it looks and how it stutters all the time? Do you hear the devs blaming Ubisoft for making the implement the features that will make the game more friendly to people with these serious problems?

Even it is has to be optional, it has to be implemented and the soft work with you, admitidly with an impact on perf, which should below; so it is still a question of implementation by the dev team.

[Tree_UK]

Guys, lets wait to see Luthiers response to my thread, it could all be good if we can see the game running before the filter was added.

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=19450

[mazex]

Ummm well no, as its a 16+ game, Hes too young for it anyway. Im sorry your son has epilepsy, But to expect everyone else to have to put up with some draconian filter is out of order.

There is no draconian filter. All other titles from Ubisoft and Sony pass these tests and have to make corrections to comply with them, and the thing is that my son does not have epilepsy now. He had those problems his first year and the doctors think that he is now fine and that i MAY have been low vitamine B12 causing it - but they do not know. So should I let him play computer games or not, for the rest of his life? A woman at work had never had any problems with epilepsy and then bang, one day after experiencing a lot of stress and strong light she got a seizure, and IF you push beyond the limit, the brain gets kind of a snowball effect. Now she is on medication, probably for the rest of her life. So this screening is presumably just as much for me and you, as we don't know if we could get a seizure tomorrow. I have been playing computer games since 1981, but tomorrow with a lot of other factors I cound get it...

Anyway, I am all for making it optional - but the drama here with "this is all Ubisofts fault" was naturally just expected...

[Codex]

Question is, will it be authorized to legally be made optional, or must we all suffer with this crap forever, or until it is effectively fixed? I shouldn't have to drop an extra lump sum of cash to be able to play this smoothly. Period.

According to the article referred to by Tree, there IS NO legal requirement to implement such a filter. The only legal requirement in all this is:

"On the statutory safeguards, the General Product Safety Regulations 2005 make it compulsory for producers to place warnings and instructions on all consumer products, including video games."

Now this is for the UK, not sure what it will be for other countries. But we've all seen the warning label in the manual's of games, legally that is enough. Also remember that UBI VOLUNTARILY decided to implement "photosensitive epilepsy" screening policy according to that article.

I smell a rat.

[Tree_UK]

According to the article referred to by Tree, there IS NO legal requirement to implement such a filter. The only legal requirement in all this is:

"On the statutory safeguards, the General Product Safety Regulations 2005 make it compulsory for producers to place warnings and instructions on all consumer products, including video games."

Now this is for the UK, not sure what it will be for other countries. But we've all seen the warning label in the manual's of games, legally that is enough. Also remember that UBI VOLUNTARILY decided to implement "photosensitive epilepsy" screening policy according to that article.

I smell a rat.

I smell one too.

[Tacoma74]

I have no problem at all with making it optional, and I think that is how it should be done too. But as this is to comply with laws and government recommendations there may be some problem there unfortunately. Somehow all other Ubisoft titles have managed to do it without losing FPS... How about Assasins Creed : Brotherhood - that game has passed the same tests and has an average user score of 9.1 over at Gamespot now (released March 2011). They sure had to do some compromises to make it pass as there are a lot of gameplay involving going from dark rooms to sun bathing desert there... Hear a lot of people whining about how bad it looks and how it stutters all the time? Do you hear the devs blaming Ubisoft for making the implement the features that will make the game more friendly to people with these serious problems?

We're not talking about Assassins Creed. The fact of the matter is that this game IS experiencing issues with this filter. While it has good purpose, it isn't meshing well with the games code that was already set in place before this was ever implemented. Newer games that are implementing this feature build their code around it making it much more stable. This game has been in development for around 5-6 years and hasn't had the opportunity to do so. The only solutions I can think of are to patch the XXXX out of it and make it less of a handicap, or to make it completely optional. That is all I have to say about it. Not going to waste another keystroke about this today.

[swiss]

The ignorance shown in this thread is really depressing.



Look, buddy - I'm sorry for your son but I can't change it.
It's you job to teach him what he can or what he can't do.
Our society does actually care about disabled people, and does the best to make their life as comfortable as possible.

What you can't expect it the society to adapt to them.


Options: Nice to have.

[Untamo]

This is like forcing me to ride my bike with training wheels on it because some people have inner ear infections.

Well said.

IL-2 CoD cannot be called a "combat flight simulator" anymore, it should be called "combat flight game" since they have now ripped the simulator part off, by ripping the realistic flashes etc. stuff that might cause epileptic shocks. Sorry epileptics, but guns make flashes, propellers whirl etc. Without them CoD isn't simulating reality, but a mystical world where these things don't exist.

Way to go Ubi. Let's put a knife in the eye of 99% of people to please the 1%. Some credit should also go to the crazy Ameerikan legal system for allowing ridiculous legal cases.

Will still buy the game, but NOT HAPPY about this. :evil:

-Untamo

[Tiger27]

Tree you do this stuff well, drop a few guesses disguised as legitimate info around and before you know it other people are quoting you as there source (sort of like wikki).

You all may be right about the conspiracy stuff but still, the game is not released yet in the West, wouldn't this be better if brought up when you know what you will get, all these comments are ensuring, is that a lot of people wont purchase this game, which will most likely see the end of any fixes we may have received, look at the state ROF was in when released, yet now it is a damn good flight sim, I just don't understand what anyone is hoping to achieve?

Obviously Tree, you would like someone from up high to tell you that you've been right all along, well that will be nice but at the end of the day all that will really be achieved is that we may never see another realistic WW2 FS again :mad:

[Upthair]

What boggles the mind (not in this case where Ubi is involved) is why it must not be optional. This just goes along with the well known phrase by A. Einstein:

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

... provided that the feature and above report is true. :)

EDIT: Can we have the link to the thread/post luthier made at Sukhoi.ru forum? Thnx.
Nice quote LOL

[Rodney]

If this epilepsy filter causes slower frame rates for me when I get CoD and that makes me angry, and I end up hurting myself (e.g. by punching a wall) or someone else then I am absolutely going to SUE YOU UBI, thats right I am going to SUE YOU and BANKRUPT you UBI because of the harm your over the top anti-epilepsy filter does to my state of mind:evil:!!!

[Tree_UK]

Tree you do this stuff well, drop a few guesses disguised as legitimate info around and before you know it other people are quoting you as there source (sort of like wikki).

You all may be right about the conspiracy stuff but still, the game is not released yet in the West, wouldn't this be better if brought up when you know what you will get, all these comments are ensuring, is that a lot of people wont purchase this game, which will most likely see the end of any fixes we may have received, look at the state ROF was in when released, yet now it is a damn good flight sim, I just don't understand what anyone is hoping to achieve?

Obviously Tree, you would like someone from up high to tell you that you've been right all along, well that will be nice but at the end of the day all that will really be achieved is that we may never see another realistic WW2 FS again :mad:

Actually I would much rather someone tell me Ive been wrong all along and have a great sim to fly. It would be no loss to me, im a man and can acceppt when i have got things wrong, i often do. Its not like i have to face you everyday is it?