Video card quandary

[Biggs]

I know there are alot of us asking about what new PC parts to buy in preperation of CoDs launch, and I now find myself in a similar position.

Im looking to upgrade my 4850HD and I think i've narrowed it down to two Nvidia cards, the GTX470 and the GTX560ti... but i dont know which one is better.

The 560ti has a faster coreclock speed 850 vs 470's 607MHz and has a faster memoryclock speed, 4104 vs 3348. But the 470 has 1.28Gigs and the 560ti is only 1Gig.

the 560ti's $250, the 470 is 10 bucks more.

I have an aging Rig:
ASUS P5K Deluxe motherboard
Intel Core2 Quad OCed to 3.2Ghz
4gigs DDR2 Ram

I dont really want to go oer 300 USD for this upgrade. so let me know what you think.

[camel24hrs]

I know there are alot of us asking about what new PC parts to buy in preperation of CoDs launch, and I now find myself in a similar position.

Im looking to upgrade my 4850HD and I think i've narrowed it down to two Nvidia cards, the GTX470 and the GTX560ti... but i dont know which one is better.

The 560ti has a faster coreclock speed 850 vs 470's 607MHz and has a faster memoryclock speed, 4104 vs 3348. But the 470 has 1.28Gigs and the 560ti is only 1Gig.

the 560ti's $250, the 470 is 10 bucks more.

I have an aging Rig:
ASUS P5K Deluxe motherboard
Intel Core2 Quad OCed to 3.2Ghz
4gigs DDR2 Ram

I dont really want to go oer 300 USD for this upgrade. so let me know what you think.

I have a Asus P5k Deluxe with Q9550 oc to 3.7Ghz and I had a 9800gt and have been looking at cards too. I was looking at either a GTX570 or the GTX560ti. I found a GTX560ti with 2 gigs of ram at NewEgg for 279. And that is what I ordered. From what little info I have read the the 560 cards are very overclockable. A plus is it uses less watts than a 570. You ought to check it out. PALit Geforce GTX560ti with 2gig ram.

I am thinking even with our aging pcs we should still be able to handle this flight sim with a decent video card.

[Codex]

The 5xx series use less power and are quieter than the 4xx series. But the extra ram on the 470 will definitely help with CoD.

[Biggs]

I have a Asus P5k Deluxe with Q9550 oc to 3.7Ghz and I had a 9800gt and have been looking at cards too. I was looking at either a GTX570 or the GTX560ti. I found a GTX560ti with 2 gigs of ram at NewEgg for 279. And that is what I ordered. From what little info I have read the the 560 cards are very overclockable. A plus is it uses less watts than a 570. You ought to check it out. PALit Geforce GTX560ti with 2gig ram.

I am thinking even with our aging pcs we should still be able to handle this flight sim with a decent video card.

hmm the 2gig sounds really promising... and with OCing up to 950mhz it should be all the card I need.

not sure how much I trust PALit tho.. I've never heard of them before.

[camel24hrs]

hmm the 2gig sounds really promising... and with OCing up to 950mhz it should be all the card I need.

not sure how much I trust PALit tho.. I've never heard of them before.


So far the reviews of PALit cards at New Egg were all 5 stars except one 4 star and he was holding back on the fifth star till he has had it for awhile. They basicly have 3 PALit 560 cards. The 2 gig model, a 1gig and a 1gig that comes overclocked out the box. Also EVGA has several cards that look good too. I did a Google and found some reviews....The PALit 1 gig overclocked out to 975core and 1950shader and was stable. MSI has one that is 1000mhz out of the box.

I really liked the GTX570, but with my old Asus P5K system, I dont think I will see a noticible benifit from it over the 560. Really looking forward to getting the 560 tomorrow and trying it out. :mrgreen:

[Biggs]

Nice, lemmie know what you think.

[swiss]

Nice, lemmie know what you think.

Wait for the results ppl get with different cards. :grin:

[camel24hrs]

Wait for the results ppl get with different cards. :grin:

Yeah Briggs, if you wait I will let you know how the setup works with COD since we basicly have the same system. I run Vista 32 bit, what are you running?

[Biggs]

Win7 64 bit

and my processors a bit older , its the Q6600 core2 Quad

[ghodan]

Here you go:
GTX560ti vs GTX570
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/330?vs=306&i=187.188.190.191.192.193.194.195.196.197.199.200. 201.202.203.204.205.206.207.208.209.210.211.212.21 3.214.215.216.217.218.219.220.221.222.228.229.230. 231.232.233.234.235.238


Update:
Oops i read it wrong.
You want a 470 vs gtx560i
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/311?vs=330&i=188.187.192.191.190.193.194.195.196.238.197.199. 200.201.202.203.204.205.206.207.208.209.210.211.21 2.213.214.215.216.217.218.219.220.221.222.228.232. 233.231.229.230.234.235

[Biggs]

Here you go:
GTX560ti vs GTX570
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/330?vs=306&i=187.188.190.191.192.193.194.195.196.197.199.200. 201.202.203.204.205.206.207.208.209.210.211.212.21 3.214.215.216.217.218.219.220.221.222.228.229.230. 231.232.233.234.235.238


Update:
Oops i read it wrong.
You want a 470 vs gtx560i
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/311?vs=330&i=188.187.192.191.190.193.194.195.196.238.197.199. 200.201.202.203.204.205.206.207.208.209.210.211.21 2.213.214.215.216.217.218.219.220.221.222.228.232. 233.231.229.230.234.235

Cool...

http://www.legionhardware.com/articles_pages/nvidia_geforce_gtx_560_ti_overclocking_guide,4.htm l
check out the benchmark pages... with the aggressive OC 1000/2290MHZ the 560ti (1Gig) is on par and in some cases BETTER than the 570. and with the more reliable 950mhz OC its pretty much on par with the 570.

That's pretty awesome for a card that's 100 bucks cheaper than the 570.

[camel24hrs]

Cool...

http://www.legionhardware.com/articles_pages/nvidia_geforce_gtx_560_ti_overclocking_guide,4.htm l
check out the benchmark pages... with the aggressive OC 1000/2290MHZ the 560ti (1Gig) is on par and in some cases BETTER than the 570. and with the more reliable 950mhz OC its pretty much on par with the 570.

That's pretty awesome for a card that's 100 bucks cheaper than the 570.

Yes on a overclock to 1000 you can basicly match the 570 at stock speeds. The 570 on overclock however leaves the 560 in the dust and most everything else as well. But like you I am on a budget this time of the year, ( got to pay Uncle Sam greenbacks ) so the 560 appealed to me. Not sure how much of a bottle neck the Q9550 on a Asus P5K will be. But I am sure the 560 will smoke my old 9800gt. I am so looking forward to dropping it in tomorrow afternoon and trying a little over clocking to see what I can get it up to. When I get COD loaded I want to be setup and ready. Next year I will do a new build. And then I will go all out, who knows what will be out there this time next year?

[camel24hrs]

Briggs this one is for you.

I got the PALit 2 gig GTX650Ti in today and did some playing. First off if you do any playing aorund with it go to your Asus bios and write down your settings. I did not and at one point crashed my system. I was running 3.7 but could not remember the settings so setup to 3.2 and the good news is that is how you have yours setup so this should give you some kind of idea how it will play out on yours.

First off I got the latest drivers from Nvadia and installed them. PALit gives a little program that will let you adjust speeds but not voltage. MSI Afterburner 2.0 will not allow you to change it either. You will need Afterburner 2.1 Beta. It covers the 560 boards. I also used MSI Kombuster to see how my clocks held up. I set it on 1920x1080 AAx4.

On stock voltage I was able to hit 900/1800 no sweat. I then bumped from 1.025v(stock) to 1.075v and hit 940/1880 and then 950/1900. I then had to go to 1.100v to hit 960/1920. I ended up at 1.125v and had 975/1950. I never touched the memory clock. The most voltage I can go up to is 1.150v. But I think I will stop there. I did not try to go above 975/1950 at 1.125v. I let it run in Kombuster on stress test for 30 minutes and it held up. I hit a max of 73 degrees and the fan never went over 51%. And I cannot hear the fan at that speed.

The only real game I tried it on was IL 2 1946 and it took out my shudder problem and maintained my frame rate. So the real test will come when COD comes.

BTW, what Vcore voltage are you running on your overclock?

[speculum jockey]

I'm sure everyone knows this, but a little reminder.

Increasing the voltage to your GPU or your CPU can have negative consequences. Such consequences may include. . .

-increased power consumption
-instability
-reduction in processor life
-increases in heat output
-voiding your warranty
-stability in benchmarking, but instability in other applications
-stomach pains
-causing damage to your mainboard (rare)

If you're overclocking make sure you keep a close eye on temperatures and if possible use aftermarket cooling methods (typically a better heatsink/fan or combination of both).

If such issues crop up discontinue your voltage increases. If the issues persist after returning to default settings, consult a nerd.

[camel24hrs]

I'm sure everyone knows this, but a little reminder.

Increasing the voltage to your GPU or your CPU can have negative consequences. Such consequences may include. . .

-increased power consumption
-instability
-reduction in processor life
-increases in heat output
-voiding your warranty
-stability in benchmarking, but instability in other applications
-stomach pains
-causing damage to your mainboard (rare)

If you're overclocking make sure you keep a close eye on temperatures and if possible use aftermarket cooling methods (typically a better heatsink/fan or combination of both).

If such issues crop up discontinue your voltage increases. If the issues persist after returning to default settings, consult a nerd.

Monitor everything. Always have. Been running a q9550 cpu 2.86 at 3.7 for 3 years. From what I have read the 560ti is good for a lot more than 1.150v. It is just they set that as the limiter on the card. Temps look excellent so far and most likely will back down to 950/1900 @1.075v. Just like to push it to see how far it would go. So far from the review sites I have seen, 975/1900 @ 1.125v is not uncommon with this board.

But your point is well taken. Everything you have said is true. So everyone overclock at your own risk.

[Biggs]

Thats great news! Im gonna hold off on getting the card till the release of CoD. Im interested in seeing what my oc'd 4850 can muster before I spend anymore money... This card upgrade will be the last bit of hardware i'll put into this rig from now on... After that, its time for a whole new setup
If I get it I'm hoping to do what they did on that website i posted earlier, and try to make ~940-50 on stock voltage. Ill probably just use nvidias oc tool too.

As for my CPU 3.2 OC. The vcore is at 1.35, tho i set it to 1.36 in the bios... The cpuid is telling me its only using 1.35. Temps are great, havent seen anything higher than 58C when stressed. The bios is set at a 9 mulitiplier and 355 for he frequency.

[Biggs [CV]]

Here is another site where you can compare vid cards :
http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=628&card2=641

I have a ATI ASUS 6870 that I am very happy with. I never had an ATI card before, I was strictly Nvidia. I upgraded a month ago. Vid card was my last and toughest decision and I finally got the 6870 for a good price at Tigerdirect.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6816351&CatId=2306

Go to the first link I gave you and put in the 6870, it compares rather well with both the Nvidia cards you listed and its $244 at Tigerdirect. It also uses less power than either the Nvidia cards which means it should run cooler.
Not trying to change you mind, just giving you some food for thought.

[Biggs]

hmm that does sound pretty good too... though i really like the 2gig option with the 560ti. But it seems that with an overclock the 6870 should be on par with it.

food for thought indeed.

[JAMF]

Maybe compare the 6950 to the 560Ti. It has 2GB and performance 'n' pricewise it's close too.

[NLS61]

Maybe compare the 6950 to the 560Ti. It has 2GB and performance 'n' pricewise it's close too.

I had a look at that but here in the Netherlands I can have A MSI 560Ti for 219 euro and that is way cheaper than a 6950.

So i'm think to go nvidia on an ASUS p8h67 mount an i5 2500k on it with 4 gb 1333 kingston and see where it ill get me.
Both the i5 and the 560 seam ocable enough.
any sugestions?

[camel24hrs]

PALit 560 2gig now running at stock voltage:
920 core
1840 shader
2450 memory (4900)

Breezes through Farcry2 with max setting. Min fps 69 max 96 avg 88. This with a Q9950@3600 on a Asus P5K. idle 29c full load 76c. max fan speed was 53%. I think this just might run COD with all the bells and whistles. Stock voltage is 1.025 and I can go up to 1.150. So there is room for more, but I will leave it where it is at and leave the voltage alone as I dont need more right now.

Overall a good card. Overclocks well and I like the 2gig if I ever need it.

[JAMF]

I had a look at that but here in the Netherlands I can have A MSI 560Ti for 219 euro and that is way cheaper than a 6950.
In the Dutch Pricewatch @ Tweakers.net :
- 2GB versions: 6950 = 247€ delivered , 560Ti = 303€ delivered
- 1GB versions: 6950 = 229€ delivered , 560Ti = 219€ delivered

2GB: price advantage AMD by 56€
1GB: price advantage nVidia by 10€

Better to compare similar spec'd items. Since Mr. Maddox said more graphic memory is better...

Here's a head-2-head comparison of the 1GB versions of the 560 and 6950:
http://www.guru3d.com/article/radeon-hd-6950-1gb-vs-geforce-gtx-560-ti-review/10

[Tiger27]

I'm looking at getting 560ti, but I have an I7 920, I would be concerned about some of the processors you guys are hoping to use, I can run all games smoothly at mid to high setting with my current setup of the I7 920 and an 8800gt, with flight sims the CPU is very important, as many that play ROF have found out.

[addman]

Wow guys! I just sold my old card and I'm looking around for a good mid-range card. The things is though, reviews don't help all that much you see. I've been reading TONS of reviews the last week and one thing I noticed is that it's so dependent on the game how a video card performs. Example, card A beat card B in game z but in game x card B beats card A!

It's very hard to know which card is going to be the best for CoD until the game is actually released and tested. Even though I'm sitting on a crappy IGP at the moment I'm actually inclined for the game to be released FIRST before I make my judgement. Hopefully some cards will also fall a bit in price by then. Good luck on your findings and plz share your performance info after you've tested the game. ;)

[adonys]

I think I'll go for an nvidia.. 3D glasses might be a blast with CoD :D

[speculum jockey]

I think I'll go for an nvidia.. 3D glasses might be a blast with CoD :D

Do you have an Nvidia 3D certified screen or projector?

[adonys]

I have the Samsung 3D Gaming LCD 2233RZ, 120 Hz, 1680x1050 native resolution LCD on a BFG Nvidia 280 GTX OC2 videocard, yet I think I'll upgrade it to a 570 or 580 GTX. The AMD 6970 sounds good, but the fact it doesn't have Physx and 3D vision hangs heavier in balance in favor of Nvidia.

[NLS61]

In the Dutch Pricewatch @ Tweakers.net :
- 2GB versions: 6950 = 247€ delivered , 560Ti = 303€ delivered
- 1GB versions: 6950 = 229€ delivered , 560Ti = 219€ delivered

2GB: price advantage AMD by 56€
1GB: price advantage nVidia by 10€

Better to compare similar spec'd items. Since Mr. Maddox said more graphic memory is better...

Here's a head-2-head comparison of the 1GB versions of the 560 and 6950:
http://www.guru3d.com/article/radeon-hd-6950-1gb-vs-geforce-gtx-560-ti-review/10

Hi thanks for the heads up.

Ive decided to go for he 560 ti now mainly because its easily oc,ed
I found some bench mark results that placed it on par with the 570 when oced.
The 6950 dint show as good oc properties as the 560ti.
So when the next series is introduced the 600? prices wil drop and Ill buy a second one to run SLI.
This wil give a situation wich will be faster then a single 580.
Maybe even not much slower then the top card of that time but surly much cheaper.

cheers,

[camel24hrs]

Dont know how much the 2 gig is going to help out in COD. Running IL 2 1946 and monitoriing with MSI afterburner I never use more than 600 meg of memory. So there is plenty to spare on a one gig card with IL 2. I guess we will have to just wait and see how demanding COD will be.

[camel24hrs]

While waiting on COD to come out I went out and got the Rise OF Flight:Iron Cross Edition. I do not know how simular COD will be to it but they both seem to have alot of eye candy and complex fm.

As video cards go with my Paliet 560ti 2 gig I am able to run 1920x1080 with all the eye candy turned up and it runs smoothly. FPS avg high 50s. From the forum post at their site and from my own experince, the amount of ram seems to make a big difference on how much you can turn up the eye candy.

As you load up the eye candy it tells you how much memory you are using up. And it gives you a warning when you get over 90% of video memory. With my 2 gig I use 53% with all the eye candy turned on. And I check MSI Afterburner after flying a mission and I actually use 1.380 gig of ram. So having just 1 gig of ram would be a hinderince in that flight sim.

Like I said I dont know how simular the two sims will be but all I am saying is if you are in the market for a new GPU my suggestion is to wait till COD comes out and see what we got.

Also RIse of flight seems more geared to using trackir. And while that is not a bad thing it makes it tough on an old school guy like me that uses cockpit views and padlock. I just hope that COD is more padlock view freindly.

Plus it is quite a steep adjustment from flying IL-2 to rise of flight. I hope it is not as tough going to COD.

[Tacoma74]

While waiting on COD to come out I went out and got the Rise OF Flight:Iron Cross Edition. I do not know how simular COD will be to it but they both seem to have alot of eye candy and complex fm.

As video cards go with my Paliet 560ti 2 gig I am able to run 1920x1080 with all the eye candy turned up and it runs smoothly. FPS avg high 50s. From the forum post at their site and from my own experince, the amount of ram seems to make a big difference on how much you can turn up the eye candy.

As you load up the eye candy it tells you how much memory you are using up. And it gives you a warning when you get over 90% of video memory. With my 2 gig I use 53% with all the eye candy turned on. And I check MSI Afterburner after flying a mission and I actually use 1.380 gig of ram. So having just 1 gig of ram would be a hinderince in that flight sim.

Like I said I dont know how simular the two sims will be but all I am saying is if you are in the market for a new GPU my suggestion is to wait till COD comes out and see what we got.

Also RIse of flight seems more geared to using trackir. And while that is not a bad thing it makes it tough on an old school guy like me that uses cockpit views and padlock. I just hope that COD is more padlock view freindly.

Plus it is quite a steep adjustment from flying IL-2 to rise of flight. I hope it is not as tough going to COD.

Good info! Thanks man :)

[Heliocon]

I would very strongly suggest if you get a nvidia card get EVGA. They are honestly their cards are the best. They have a lifetime warranty and OCing does not void your warranty. They also have a 90 day stepup. So when I bought my 480gtx and then 1 month later nvidia surprise announced the 580gtx all I had to do was pay shipping and $15. I now have a 580gtx.

Also they have good ocing tools and forums.

[Thee_oddball]

Wait for the results ppl get with different cards. :grin:

ditto, wait and see what results people get ,"a chain is as strong as its weakest link" I built a new system years ago and kept the old video card (fx5200) and the new backend doubled my FPS :)
I just built a new rig (to play bc2) and win7 is giving me a rating of 7.2/4 across the board with the exception of the HD (5.9) and it is a modest build
ASrock 870 extreme
Phenom X3 3.2ghz
kingston 1066 (4gb)
ATI 5750 (1gb)
Corsair 750 watt psu
win7 ultimate 64

I just reinstalled il2 (UP 2.01) And i am getting 225 avg fps at 1600x1200 rez with everything set to excellent :):):).. what does that translate to? i hoping i can play CoD at high settings and a modest rez :)

[Heliocon]

ditto, wait and see what results people get ,"a chain is as strong as its weakest link" I built a new system years ago and kept the old video card (fx5200) and the new backend doubled my FPS :)
I just built a new rig (to play bc2) and win7 is giving me a rating of 7.2/4 across the board with the exception of the HD (5.9) and it is a modest build
ASrock 870 extreme
Phenom X3 3.2ghz
kingston 1066 (4gb)
ATI 5750 (1gb)
Corsair 750 watt psu
win7 ultimate 64

I just reinstalled il2 (UP 2.01) And i am getting 225 avg fps at 1600x1200 rez with everything set to excellent :):):).. what does that translate to? i hoping i can play CoD at high settings and a modest rez :)

For the record I have a new pc as of a few months ago because my pc of 4 years got fried. Guess how? In the civ5 game menu which I forgot to quit and I fell asleep. Why? Because the devs never capped the max fps rate in the game menu...
Fail at probably 400fps in a menu (of civilization game...) fried my computer. It was embarrasing :P

[robtek]

If one has about 600 $ US to spare, this is the card to get!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/user/motherboardsorg#p/u/0/fjTB519cL9E

[JG52Uther]

If one has about 600 $ US to spare, this is the card to get!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/user/motherboardsorg#p/u/0/fjTB519cL9E

I would want a whole computer for that price!

[Heliocon]

If one has about 600 $ US to spare, this is the card to get!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/user/motherboardsorg#p/u/0/fjTB519cL9E

Why do you keep pushing this particular card? Its not even a good one.

[robtek]

Oh, i don't see me "pushing" this card, as afaik thats the first and only post about it.
And its not good because????
Share your wisdom, please.

[Heliocon]

Oh, i don't see me "pushing" this card, as afaik thats the first and only post about it.
And its not good because????
Share your wisdom, please.

My bad robtek - I thought you were someone else (either the OP or a commenter on this thread: http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=19104
Sorry for the mis-identification :(

The card is not so great as we see in the thread (its not bad or horrible per say, there just is "better" options imo).