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View Full Version : "...renegade pilots on his own side"


Kano_Magnus
01-24-2011, 04:34 PM
"The campaign thrusts the player into the middle of the Battle of Britain, where he will join the Royal Air Force to fight the Messerschmitt and renegade pilots on his own side."

(from http://shop.ubi.com/store/ubiemea/en_GB/buy/productID.221859200)

Seriously, is this a joke?

Trumper
01-24-2011, 05:44 PM
I hoped it was something lost in translation but the rest of the document seems ok in English so hopefully an explanation will be posted.

Mr_Zooly
01-24-2011, 05:54 PM
I would guess they mean pilots that will go their own way and do their own thing in a battle (like ignoring orders).

ckolonko
01-24-2011, 06:00 PM
I asked about this and the general consensus was that it referred to online play. However, im not too sure. I'll not be too pleased if it means half way through a mission your wingman decides the master race are right and decides to riddle you with .303, then defects to the Axis powers..

Avimimus
01-24-2011, 06:03 PM
Whether or not I'm fine with this 'feature' is entirely dependent on the presence or absence of an eye-patch on the renegade leader. Odd isn't it?

ckolonko
01-24-2011, 06:08 PM
lol. Or a goatee beard.

Sven
01-24-2011, 06:33 PM
each one has it's own taste, let it be an option and I have no trouble with it.

ckolonko
01-24-2011, 06:58 PM
Same here really. I just hope I get as much enjoyment out of the new sim as I have Il2.

Kano_Magnus
01-25-2011, 05:37 PM
It does quite explicitly say this in the single-player section. I would actually like an answer to this question, as a scripted campaign with a bollocks story would prevent me from buying this game.

rollnloop
01-25-2011, 05:41 PM
renegade=defeated polish,french,czechs still fighting alongside the british. They were considered as renegades in their own army and condemned to death (at least the former french air force pilots).

JG53Frankyboy
01-25-2011, 05:42 PM
perhas there are some 'special' missions........................ who knows.
just remember the woman in the Spitfire cockpit screenshots, most propably also a special singleplayermission.


form a historical viewpoint its nonsense IMHO !
but its still a game ;)

brando
01-25-2011, 06:27 PM
renegade=defeated polish,french,czechs still fighting alongside the british. They were considered as renegades in their own army and condemned to death (at least the former french air force pilots).

Rollnloop has it right. Servicemen who fought on after their country had surrendered were classified as renegades by the new government of the country concerned. It's an unfortunate translation that has probably been seized upon by some advertising oik and used because it seems to add some spice, that's all.

Lensman_1
01-25-2011, 06:28 PM
perhas there are some 'special' missions........................ who knows.
just remember the woman in the Spitfire cockpit screenshots, most propably also a special singleplayermission.


form a historical viewpoint its nonsense IMHO !
but its still a game ;)

Women flew Spitfires every day of WWII, just not in combat.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article3403685.ece

The Kraken
01-25-2011, 07:07 PM
Women flew Spitfires every day of WWII, just not in combat.

True enough, but rarely on the pilot's lap...

Somehow I think the description "The player will join the British Air Force to fight [...] renegade pilots on his own side" doesn't leave much room for interpretation. Also remember Luthier's thread about "wow" moments some months ago, so for me all signs point to a linear campaign with some drama moments and scripted events. Which doesn't have to be a bad idea for the general public (which we all need to have a commercially successful launch, so at least the local marketing experts should be cheering for that idea :-P).

Doesn't rule out a simple FB-style dynamic campaign is also included, but at any rate the best campaigns will come from 3rd party devs. So it's not really an issue for me.

ckolonko
01-25-2011, 07:57 PM
As as been stated it looks like they meant fly with not fight against (unless flying the German campaign) Renegade pilots eg the poles, Americans, Australians and the single Jamican Pilot who flew in the battle.

Trumper
01-25-2011, 08:46 PM
renegade=defeated polish,french,czechs still fighting alongside the british. They were considered as renegades in their own army and condemned to death (at least the former french air force pilots).
I don't think they would've been called that from over here in the UK.Maybe free as in Free French.Technically it's not wrong in meaning but in the use of the term possibly not right.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/renegade
"renegade [ˈrɛnɪˌgeɪd]
n
1.
a. a person who deserts his cause or faith for another; apostate; traitor
b. (as modifier) a renegade priest
2. any outlaw or rebel
If the countries i e Poland etc were invaded and forced to side with the Axis then i don't think they were renegades as they were still fighting for their home country against the invaders.

Triggaaar
01-25-2011, 11:32 PM
"he will join the Royal Air Force to fight the ..... renegade pilots on his own side."

renegade=defeated polish,french,czechs still fighting alongside the british. They were considered as renegades in their own army and condemned to death (at least the former french air force pilots).

Rollnloop has it right. Servicemen who fought on after their country had surrendered were classified as renegades by the new government of the country concerned. It's an unfortunate translation that has probably been seized upon by some advertising oik and used because it seems to add some spice, that's all.It's not so much a question of who the renegades were, it's the fact that you are to fight against them. I've seen so many so called explanations of this nonsense. There are only two possible explanations:
1) They've typed it incorrectly - without doubt the most likely explanation
2) The development team have taken leave of their senses and turned the game into a farse - I doubt it.

Robotic Pope
01-26-2011, 12:59 AM
"he will join the Royal Air Force to fight the ..... renegade pilots on his own side."



It's not so much a question of who the renegades were, it's the fact that you are to fight against them. I've seen so many so called explanations of this nonsense. There are only two possible explanations:
1) They've typed it incorrectly - without doubt the most likely explanation
2) The development team have taken leave of their senses and turned the game into a farse - I doubt it.

In situation 2, Ive got the story all sorted lol.
The Germans have created a new secret bio weapon, A mind control virus that becomes known as the Defection Infection. This virus can infect any of your squadron at any time. Who can you trust as your wingman? Will your best friend suddenly start shooting at you? To have any hope of winning this war, You must hold out against an enemy on two sides long enough for the British scientists to come up with a cure. ;)

Skoshi Tiger
01-26-2011, 01:01 AM
I wouldn't consider the Polish and french pilots based in the UK as renagades as they were still fighting to protect their people from the last freely elected governments of their respective countries.

You need to remember that the govenments elected during the time of occupations didn't represent the wishes of peoples of those countries. They were infact puppet goverments intended to legitimise the occupation of the Nazi forces, and in most cases recieved their just deserts after the war.

I think the term renagade was put in there to represent the LW pilots who think they know beeter than their own high command and will disregard orders about sticking with the bombers and run off to the closest furball.

This will make the RAF Job easier as stopping the bombers are the main objective of the RAF.

How many RAF pilots are going to become renagades by finishing a mission with a quick flyby to see the 109's with empty fuel tanks floating in the Channel! ;)

Cheers!

Avimimus
01-26-2011, 03:01 PM
It does quite explicitly say this in the single-player section. I would actually like an answer to this question, as a scripted campaign with a bollocks story would prevent me from buying this game.

First, it is not a game.

Second, it will have a full mission builder and support for 3rd party campaign system (more than RoF provides). So, you will eventually have loads of historically detailed linear campaigns, one or more dynamic campaign engines and possibly even have a strategic campaign (as past BoB sims had).

Novotny
01-26-2011, 03:16 PM
It's not a game?

I'm going to be very disappointed if this turns out to be some sort of film or book. Not that there's anything wrong with either of these, it's just that after playing IL2 for so many years I was really looking forward to playing what I had up until now thought was its sequel.

Can anyone else confirm this?

Kano_Magnus
01-26-2011, 03:19 PM
First, it is not a game.

Second, it will have a full mission builder and support for 3rd party campaign system (more than RoF provides). So, you will eventually have loads of historically detailed linear campaigns, one or more dynamic campaign engines and possibly even have a strategic campaign (as past BoB sims had).

First, yes it is a game you clot. Will I see it reviewed in PC Format or the Times Literary Supplement?

Second, I don't care what the game will be like in 18 months when the modders have been at it. I want a decent game out of the box, preferably one that's more advanced (in terms of gameplay) than 1989's 'Their Finest Hour' (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Their_Finest_Hour_(video_game)).

Flying Pencil
01-26-2011, 03:54 PM
"The campaign thrusts the player into the middle of the Battle of Britain, where he will join the Royal Air Force to fight the Messerschmitt and renegade pilots on his own side."

(from http://shop.ubi.com/store/ubiemea/en_GB/buy/productID.221859200)

Seriously, is this a joke?

Friendly Fire?

Qpassa
01-26-2011, 04:16 PM
To OP: It is bit creepy

Il2Pongo
01-26-2011, 04:52 PM
http://www.cee-gee.net/Gallery/Images/CG_NaziMachine.jpg

ckolonko
01-26-2011, 05:43 PM
Nice!

Avimimus
01-26-2011, 06:07 PM
It's not a game?

I'm going to be very disappointed if this turns out to be some sort of film or book. Not that there's anything wrong with either of these, it's just that after playing IL2 for so many years I was really looking forward to playing what I had up until now thought was its sequel.

Can anyone else confirm this?

It is a detailed historical simulation. A document. A cathedral to memory.

A game is something you pick up, learn to use in five minutes and throw out after playing it twice. Simmers may play games, but we aren't really Gamers in the modern console-player sense, are we?

It takes a completely different attitude to recreation.

Blackdog_kt
01-26-2011, 06:40 PM
Oh come on....it's this exact attitude of riding our high horse that we all display at times that turns away newcomers from the genre and i'm not singling anyone out in particular here...i've been guilty of the same thing in the past until i realized we're shutting ourselves out from possibly bringing "new blood" into the hobby, even the limited number of people who would actually be interested in trying their hand at it.

It's no shame to call it game. Saying it's a game doesn't mean it can't be intellectually challenging or teach you stuff, don't you think?
For example rolling dice is a game, then chess is a game too...one is pure luck, the other involves some thinking to actually be good at to be the point it can be considered a sport.

In fact, even games that are based on luck can be made challenging and be considered mental sports if the rules are complex enough, for example the difference between simple games of cards and complicated ones like poker, where you can win by other means despite being unlucky and drawing the worst hand. Or in another case, pen and paper role playing games...they too use dice (albeit up to 20-sided ones) but the rules make sure it's not all about luck.

However, people still say "let's play a round of chess" just like they say "let's play a round of cards" and nobody takes offence, you hardly see anyone saying "let's stimulate our analytical mental faculties and intellect with a round of simulated, turn-based, movement restricted warfare with wooden soldier pieces" :-P

Robotic Pope
01-26-2011, 07:06 PM
It is a detailed historical simulation. A document. A cathedral to memory.

A game is something you pick up, learn to use in five minutes and throw out after playing it twice. Simmers may play games, but we aren't really Gamers in the modern console-player sense, are we?

It takes a completely different attitude to recreation.

Yes it is those things, but above that of course it is a computer game and is classed as one. We still PLAY the game.

The word game covers far more than what you described. Chess is a game for example and people who play that live their whole lives continueing to learn new tactics and stratagies.

Nobody said anything about being a "gamer" a word that has come to mean a person who plays video games.

Edit: I agree with Blackdog. Sorry I didn't read your post before I replied.

Skoshi Tiger
01-27-2011, 12:51 AM
http://www.cee-gee.net/Gallery/Images/CG_NaziMachine.jpg

Our .303's will have absolutly no effect on this at all. I think we will need cannons!

Cheers!

F19_lacrits
01-27-2011, 01:24 AM
Our .303's will have absolutly no effect on this at all. I think we will need cannons!

Cheers!

Do you see the 120mm mortars on the right shoulder and the 105mm howitzer sticking out on the left chest? We need nukes to neutralize this monster.. Robocop is nothing, look out for Robofritz! :D

Avimimus
01-27-2011, 03:40 AM
Oh come on....it's this exact attitude of riding our high horse that we all display at times that turns away newcomers from the genre and i'm not singling anyone out in particular here...i've been guilty of the same thing in the past until i realized we're shutting ourselves out from possibly bringing "new blood" into the hobby, even the limited number of people who would actually be interested in trying their hand at it.

It's no shame to call it game. Saying it's a game doesn't mean it can't be intellectually challenging or teach you stuff, don't you think?
For example rolling dice is a game, then chess is a game too...one is pure luck, the other involves some thinking to actually be good at to be the point it can be considered a sport.

In fact, even games that are based on luck can be made challenging and be considered mental sports if the rules are complex enough, for example the difference between simple games of cards and complicated ones like poker, where you can win by other means despite being unlucky and drawing the worst hand. Or in another case, pen and paper role playing games...they too use dice (albeit up to 20-sided ones) but the rules make sure it's not all about luck.

However, people still say "let's play a round of chess" just like they say "let's play a round of cards" and nobody takes offence, you hardly see anyone saying "let's stimulate our analytical mental faculties and intellect with a round of simulated, turn-based, movement restricted warfare with wooden soldier pieces" :-P

+1 I'm just annoyed that the local computer stores no longer sell second hand PC games (thanks to DRM & serial codes), have reduced their PC collection to two small shelves and that 10 out of the 12 titles they have are console ports.

It is the end my friends the end (something or other).

Yes it is those things, but above that of course it is a computer game and is classed as one. We still PLAY the game.

The word game covers far more than what you described. Chess is a game for example and people who play that live their whole lives continueing to learn new tactics and stratagies.

Nobody said anything about being a "gamer" a word that has come to mean a person who plays video games.

Edit: I agree with Blackdog. Sorry I didn't read your post before I replied.

Yes, I guess - not a gamer. I agree with all you've said.

Er... I ah, don't really play Il-2 btw. I load it up. Look at it. Crash things into each other. Admire the accuracy. Declare it a wonderful thing and then exit.

I can never seem to find time for proper campaign missions...