New inteview on BOB SOW from Oleg Dec 29,2010

[nearmiss]

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&langpair=ru%7Cen&u=http://www.spread-wings.ru/index.php&prev=/translate_s%3Fhl%3Den%26q%3Dhttp://spread-wings.ru/index.php%253Foption%253Dcom_content%2526task%253D view%2526id%253D156%2526Itemid%253D42%26sl%3Den%26 tl%3Dru

Look for Battle of Britain - Oleg Medox - it should be the first article

You can also just go to www.spread-wings.ru (http://www.spread-wings.ru) and translate as you will from Russian

[kestrel79]

Interesting read. A lot of it seemed sort of lost in translation. But there still were a few nice nuggets in there.

[baronWastelan]

"It's 90% complete. Unfortunately, the last 10% always takes 90% of the total development time."






J/K :)

[Feathered_IV]

Very good.

[furbs]

Cheers, did i read it right...SOW on steam?(its early and no coffee yet)

[Tree_UK]

Yes Furbs SOW on steam, which makes sense I suppose, regarding the percentage of the finished game Oleg was saying the same last year and the year before so its hard to gauge where we are at.

[Hecke]

SOW on steam

Valve's Steam platform or what are you talking about?

[Coen020]

steam is ok, i use it a lot. it auto patches which is really nice.
btw is there any change someone can save the images to some sort of library within this forum?

[Sven]

"As I said, the game will immediately support the steam. This condition of the publisher."

Not entirely sure thanks to google's translation here, but does this mean they already have a publisher?

[The Kraken]

Yes. 1C Softclub for the CIS countries. Rest of the world is still unconfirmed; fingers crossed that Ubi is out...

[Sven]

Yes. 1C Softclub for the CIS countries. Rest of the world is still unconfirmed; fingers crossed that Ubi is out...

Ah roger, thank you for the explanation:)

[352ndBushpilot]

Could some of our Russian fellow pilots do a proper translation of the interview?

Thanks in advance!

352ndBP

[Bolelas]

Sorry if this is a little out of context, but, has mr THE KRAKEN said, i hope to it will not be ubi! I live in Portugal, and there is only one store were i could find IL2 1946, (were i bouth mine), and i passed there few times after that, and no more 1946!! All big stores, supermarkets, etc...zero! But if you want a crappy simulation game, you will find them all there! Dont know if ubi is the responsable, but makes me wonder... Probably wen BOB SOW is out i will have to go to spain just to have it... hope not.

[David603]

Beta version which we are preparing to the exit, implies that all the functionality works remain mere improvements.
If I understand this right, the simulation is now complete features-wise and only bug fixing and detail changes remain.

[speculum jockey]

If I understand this right, the simulation is now complete features-wise and only bug fixing and detail changes remain.

YES!!! Can't wait for that Late 2011/Early 2012 release date! :-P

[Skoshi Tiger]

What is "WT"??????

[Katkatman]

"WT" = Storm of war, I believe.

[Feathered_IV]

"WT" = Storm of war, I believe.

Bing Translate expresses it as "BzB". Battle of Britain perhaps.

[Letum]

Yes. 1C Softclub for the CIS countries. Rest of the world is still unconfirmed; fingers crossed that Ubi is out...

Given that Ubi still own the SoW trademark, I doubt it.

[Avimimus]

That could help explain the name change...?

[nearmiss]

The part in the article about the AI should excite all Offline players.

AI performance is critical to offline play, and has been a very weak part of the IL2.

Oleg has been paying attention to his users.

[AKA_Tenn]

"As I said, the game will immediately support the steam. This condition of the publisher."

Not entirely sure thanks to google's translation here, but does this mean they already have a publisher?

not sure but i think he means it'll be available for digital download on steam, but if no publisher decides to make a box version then we don't get a box version.

[Wutz]

not sure but i think he means it'll be available for digital download on steam, but if no publisher decides to make a box version then we don't get a box version.
Ups no box version......no money from me.....been ripped off too often with download versions.

[Peffi]

If I can download it, burn it to a DVD and download the coverpicture, then it's ok. Making a boxed version will make the game more expensive or reduce profits.

[Hecke]

only 0815 games come without boxed versions.

[swiss]

Making a boxed version will make the game more expensive or reduce profits.

Two versions will have different prices, you want a boxed version - you'll have to pay more.
That's normal and was always like that.
I have no problem paying $30(or whatever they ask) more for for a hardcopy - I want to own the game physically on a DVD, everything else is not an option.

Oleg just said they will make it available on Steam too - otherwise they wouldn't really need a publisher to begin with. ;)

[addman]

Nothing said about there being no boxed version, re-read it and you will find that that it says that SoW will be on steam as a condition made by the publisher. Many games -if not a majority- are released on steam AND boxed nowadays. Keep cool, keep cool:cool:

[1.JaVA_Sharp]

that makes me wonder.. 1c also has a steam shop of their own.....

[He111]

good interview.

"Quality on PCs" is what it's all about. I'll pay big for quality but won't pay cheap for junk. i suspect most IL2 fanatics are similar. I'll even buy a new desktop for it! :grin:

My Pc plans for the next few years are a beastie Desktop soon and a powerful PC tablet within a few years. Hope that fits into your views of the future PC market? :grin:

Ps, I've had no problems with steam but prefer a CD as backup.

[addman]

I like Steam, I really do. Like right now they have some great sales going, bought Alien vs Predator for 4,99€ for example. One thing that ticks me off though is the missconception that Steam is cheaper then retail games. That might be true on many smaller budget games/indie games but take a look at CoD: Black Ops for example, 59,99€!!!! that's nuts since I can walk down to a local retailer or order it from an online retailer and get the boxed version for almost 10€ less so no, downloadable games are not always cheaper and many times it's the other way around.

[philip.ed]

Surely Steam only-sales would only be marketed towards people that know about the game? If new customers are wanted, then it's best to hit the shops so that they can see it and buy it.

[swiss]

I like Steam, I really do. Like right now they have ome great sales going, bought Alien vs Predator for 4,99€ for example. One thing that ticks me off though is the missconception that Steam is cheaper then retail games. That might be true on many smaller budget games/indie games but take a look at CoD: Black Ops for example, 59,99€!!!! that's nuts since I can walk down to a local retailer or order it from an online retailer and get the boxed version for almost 10€ less so no, downloadable games are not always cheaper and many times it's the other way around.

That only shows something in their distribution is wrong - getting such a high discount should be impossible.

[6S.Manu]

I've never bought anything by steam if not as a special offer.

But in this period I've spent 120€ in 10€ and 5€ games... most of those are simply fantastic.

I will never have the time to play them all...

[pupo162]

Sorry if this is a little out of context, but, has mr THE KRAKEN said, i hope to it will not be ubi! I live in Portugal, and there is only one store were i could find IL2 1946, (were i bouth mine), and i passed there few times after that, and no more 1946!! All big stores, supermarkets, etc...zero! But if you want a crappy simulation game, you will find them all there! Dont know if ubi is the responsable, but makes me wonder... Probably wen BOB SOW is out i will have to go to spain just to have it... hope not.

+1, live in portugal myself to, and im afraid spain will not be enough, since its hard to find it in spain to, or so i've read.

off we fo to france mate, split the gass i say

[swiss]

Have you guys ever heard of ebay?

And there online retailers, I mean, wtf? What is the problem?

[The Kraken]

Surely Steam only-sales would only be marketed towards people that know about the game? If new customers are wanted, then it's best to hit the shops so that they can see it and buy it.

Steam is a very good marketing tool; the likelihood that PC gamers who never heard about SoW will notice it there is probably higher than in a shop where it's hidden behind the console section amongst World of Warcraft, The Sims and a few console ports. Even more so in the US where few shops still sell any PC games at all, and where retails space often has to be rented by the publishers.

Bit of an academic discussion though as boxed versions will of course be available.

[Krt_Bong]

Steam is great, most of the games I have came through Steam however, they are usually about a day or two behind on patching and sometimes the games you download from them versus a hard copy differ slightly in some of the files (il-2 for instance) and not that it has anything to do with SoW but they also sell games that for one reason or other have no support or are missing online features at full price. If you download a game from there it likely wont be something you can simply "burn to disc" and reinstall it from there.

[MikkOwl]

I like Steam a lot. I prefer it over any other distribution method. UBI is probably the publisher; I hope they won't force the 'must be online for single player' stuff and just settle for the Steam DRM, which is OK by me.

[Bolelas]

+1, live in portugal myself to, and im afraid spain will not be enough, since its hard to find it in spain to, or so i've read.

off we fo to france mate, split the gass i say
I once find the game 1946 in a store a few kilometers from Madrid, in Media Markt. but i bought mine in Lisbon, GAME store in colombo, payd 49,99€, still have the receipt in the game box. I prefere the phisical game, would consider a tripp to spain, but france is a little of my limit$$$ :)
Ya, we split the gas, he he!

[Heliocon]

Surely Steam only-sales would only be marketed towards people that know about the game? If new customers are wanted, then it's best to hit the shops so that they can see it and buy it.

A quick reply to this and about steam: No one buys computer games in shops anymore (no one being the majority of gamers by far). Not only is it hard to find pc games in shops, none of them stock news games either and most of the stuff on the shelf is old software that hasnt sold yet. PC retailing is dead.

Steam on the other hand just passed the 30million member mark, I have atleast $1500 worth or more of games on steam based on standard price, but most bought during steam sales where $40 games go for $4, I havent spent more then a couple of hundred on software max, never going to get around to playing it all either.
The reason COD:BO is priced high on steam is because if they sell it cheaper on steam, retailers like gamestop feel undermined by them and will not stock their games. Therefor the publishers/devs especially for console games (not much for pc anymore) have to sell them at standard prices (yet still give occasional awesome discounts).

Also bear in mind: Steam brings online security and reduces piracy to an extent while it is much simpler, versatile and useful then other DRM (which it is) but it is also a shop, patcher and community hub etc.
Steam also opens up a massive audience for devs, they dont have to pay for packaging and shipping of physical game copies which is alot of overhead especially from Russia. So for much less capital they can access a huge audience worldwide. Steam and other online providers are PC gamings future. Edit: Also bear in mind steams integration provides: Forums, steam and 1C, auto patching and hot fixes, integrated ingame browser and news updates, MP support, advertising (of course), impulse buying potential (ooo this lookes interesting! Click, cart, confirm = download!) as well as the games page with screenshots, trailers etc.

[KG26_Alpha]

I only hope the release will be world wide and comprehensive across media platform types, be it downloaded or hard copy etc.

In the past delayed intercontinental releases left IL2 1946 open to piracy as many users were left behind over a month in some cases and unable to fly with team mates etc.

I will have the boxed copy with the map and any other extras that come with it.

:grin:

[krz9000]

steam is great...you have a global publishing base. and the shopping process is so smooth! also the update process is so convenient that i have always choosen the steam version if there was a choice. i see no reason anymore to buy a boxed copy since i live with a stable interconnection. i think today its a must if you want to sell your product. also i think the same price for steam vs boxd copy is ok since its so convenient.

[ATAG_Doc]

"It's 90% complete. Unfortunately, the last 10% always takes 90% of the total development time."






J/K :)

Sounds good to me. Give me more time to complete my PC.

[AKA_Tenn]

the only issue i have with steam is that you don't actually own anything you have on it... if the people that run steam want, they can cancel every single account on steam, and all the games everyone has are now gone, and because you accepted the agreement when you made your steam account, you can't do a thing about it...

where as if you have a physical copy of the game, one you can play without connecting to the internet at all, nobody can take it away from you without knocking on ur door, coming in, and taking it/smashing it, and then it would be illegal...

so personally, i'd only get a boxed version if i had the choice.

[nearmiss]

Steam?

Oleg will release a copy for standalone use. It just wouldn't make sense to release only through steam or direct download.

There are too many people in too many places of the world that don't have adequate internet connections.

Many persons will have high capacity computer systems, and there will be those that don't.

I wouldn't get myself worked up over the reference to steam. (suggestion)

[Heliocon]

the only issue i have with steam is that you don't actually own anything you have on it... if the people that run steam want, they can cancel every single account on steam, and all the games everyone has are now gone, and because you accepted the agreement when you made your steam account, you can't do a thing about it...

where as if you have a physical copy of the game, one you can play without connecting to the internet at all, nobody can take it away from you without knocking on ur door, coming in, and taking it/smashing it, and then it would be illegal...

so personally, i'd only get a boxed version if i had the choice.

I would say used to be true - very few games now give you ownership, even physical copies. You pay for the right to access the information on the disk, and tbh there is alot worse and some very nasty DRM out there that comes on disks with games...

*But yeas I agree with you on ownership, luckily I have not heard of this happening on steam before although I may just not be aware.

[K_Freddie]

I've had steam problems, and believe me you do not want this "You're guilty until proven innocent" business attitude.
Offline play should be a simply 'key' enabled, whereas online play can have a semi-drm type authentification, no steam, as it tosses offline play as well.
It makes more sense for oleg to have his own steam type shop.

No steam for me.. I would like the box, thank you !! ;)

[wizardd]

Steam is fine. Too much tinfoilhat people.

[Robert]

Box for me. I won't buy any game without a disc and box. A manual would be a necessity, but since they seem to be going the way of the Dodo bird I'll not hold it against 1C should they not make one as long as there is a good PDF.

[kestrel79]

I want Oleg and his team to make killer bank off this sim. I'm hoping the boxed version will be some sort of special edition that is priced pretty high that includes a lot of extra goodies.

[JAMF]

If it's available on Steam and there is not another DRM attached to the game, I'll buy it from Steam. 1C:Maddox will earn much more money that way. (~200% more?) I might buy the DVD version (years) later, when it's in the bargain bin, so I have that real thing after all.

If the Steam version has another DRM, like GfWL, which demands attention too, I'll get the DVD version.

If SoW comes with Starforce or Yuplay, I'll not buy it.

[Warhound]

I am praying it get's released(on day 1) in the 1C-shop , http://1c.yuplay.com/ , so maddox games get's a bigger cut than even with steam. But it's unlikely a publisher would allow them to put it up there for the first few years at the least.
Still if they find a way to do their own digital distribution i will be sure to buy it there or otherwise whereever Oleg states he get's the biggest % per sale from.

[Tree_UK]

From what Oleg is saying at the simhq interview I doubt very much we will see a boxed version, he is very firmly in the digital camp.

[Foo'bar]

I think they will mainly concentrate on publishing the sim digitally, though I believe that we will see a "Collectors Edition" later. Remember luthier's questions after a proper authentic map material and design ;)

[SlipBall]

From what Oleg is saying at the simhq interview I doubt very much we will see a boxed version, he is very firmly in the digital camp.


Maybe, but then there is a contradiction with luthier's cloth map info request thread...anyway I hope that you are wrong, even though you usually are right:grin:

[Tree_UK]

Maybe, but then there is a contradiction with luthier's cloth map info request thread...anyway I hope that you are wrong, even though you usually are right:grin:

Oleg says that he see's the way camera manufacturers make thier manuals online in PDF format as the way forward, he later went on to say that he considers multiplay to be the future rather than stand alone.

You can read the whole 'future of simulations interview' here http://www.simhq.com/_commentary/all_106a.html

[Foo'bar]

Personally I don't mind wich form SoW will reach me. I'm interested in playing the sim, not gazing a box here on my shelf.

[Trumper]

No steam for me.. I would like the box, thank you !! ;)
+1 here.I want to see a hardcopy on my shelf.

[The Kraken]

There are boxed versions available for Rise of Flight, for DCS Black Shark and even Flaming Cliffs 2 which is an addon to a sim from 2003. Other 1C titles like Theatre of War are also available as boxed versions. Just because Oleg says (IMHO correctly) that sooner or later niche titles like flight sims will be available through download only (as is already the case with most indie games) doesn't mean we're there yet.

Then again this forum and some special members in particular have always been eager to draw premature conclusions ;)

[Chivas]

You will probably see SOW available as a download as well as a boxed versison. I'd like to see the boxed version with extras go for atleast a hundred dollars. We pay way to little for good combat flight sims, its not worth the time and effort for new developers to get into this genre.

[kestrel79]

You will probably see SOW available as a download as well as a boxed versison. I'd like to see the boxed version with extras go for atleast a hundred dollars. We pay way to little for good combat flight sims, its not worth the time and effort for new developers to get into this genre.

Great idea Chivas. You seem to be the person on these forums I agree with the most. :)

100 dollar special edition, with the cloth map, printed manual, extra skins, maybe even a few extra maps or planes?

Then a regular boxed version for 40 or 50 bucks, and a digital download version for 40 bucks and I think we're looking at a winner.

All the hardcore guys like us who are forum/flight sim junkies will support Oleg and get the special edition and the more casual players can pick up the cheaper copy. Everyone wins.

[nearmiss]

You will probably see SOW available as a download as well as a boxed versison. I'd like to see the boxed version with extras go for atleast a hundred dollars. We pay way to little for good combat flight sims, its not worth the time and effort for new developers to get into this genre.

I get where you are coming from, but economic situations around the world are varied. The economies and standard of living are very different around the world. Just think on all the places people are posting from on this forums.

The distributor will probably have the most to say on the price of BOB SOW. If Oleg distributes SOW directly like others, i.e., LockOn series ,then we could very well see prices exceeding $80 USD.

IMO, it really doesn't matter the price of BOB SOW. IL2 is all I do now, and the basic consideration for every computer upgrade I have made in the past 10 years has been targeted to accomodate as competent an IL2 as possible. By targeting this kind of spec system I always have adequate capacity for anything else I want to do with my computer system.

[SlipBall]

You will probably see SOW available as a download as well as a boxed versison. I'd like to see the boxed version with extras go for atleast a hundred dollars. We pay way to little for good combat flight sims, its not worth the time and effort for new developers to get into this genre.



I agree that it is worth that much to me, but they have to have the price much lower. The only way they will make money is by a high volume of sales. At a hundred bucks, they would miss many potential sales. Especially these days, with high unemployment, and a terrible world wide economy.:grin:

[SQB]

I reckon the key to a good price would be differentiated sales. I hear many people on the forum say "i would gladly pay 2x over for this" and this is a way to get those people (one of which being me :grin:) to pay a little extra.

How is this done? Different release formats, the cheapest being downloadable, for the bargain hunter, then store bought boxes, for the old fashioned and those who want a physical copy of their purchase, and then a "collectors edition" which has many extra things included (somebody has already mentioned the idea of a map) for 20-40 dollars more. Those of us who have being hanging on since that little bonus cd in 1946 can show their dedication in this way and help the company along.

[hiro]

I like how they touched on the degrading quality of the games, how publishers want quick money rather than quality development you see.

Lots of advice for the video game industry, heck any industry (like movie and music LOL). Look how long Il-2 is going, but games like blazing angels series are long forgotten.

Nice to know Oleg n crew are doing their best to stem the dark tide!

People want quality, not fluff used to turn a quick buck.

[Peffi]

Oleg will know what price is right, but two versions seems sensible. One "expensive" version for the hardcore community and one "cheap" version for the rest, upgradable to hardcore when wanted. "hardcore" contains more airplanes, free upgrades, added stuff,(free patches for everyone of course) and a discount on "SOW KOREA" :-D

[Igo kyu]

Oleg will know what price is right, but two versions seems sensible. One "expensive" version for the hardcore community and one "cheap" version for the rest, upgradable to hardcore when wanted. "hardcore" contains more airplanes, free upgrades, added stuff,(free patches for everyone of course) and a discount on "SOW KOREA" :-D
I'm a cheapskate, I don't pay more than I need to for games, the last time I didn't wait for the bargain bin was Oblivion, which was thankfully worth full price to me. I think I expect to pay the full price for SoW BoB, but I certainly won't be paying for a collector's edition.

I really don't see a point to having a discount in with an expensive version, the whole point of the expensive version is that those people will willingly pay extra. Maybe a discount in with an expensive version of SoW BOB on the expensive edition of SoW Korea would make sense, but on the ordinary version it really wouldn't in my opinion.

[Heliocon]

I've had steam problems, and believe me you do not want this "You're guilty until proven innocent" business attitude.
Offline play should be a simply 'key' enabled, whereas online play can have a semi-drm type authentification, no steam, as it tosses offline play as well.
It makes more sense for oleg to have his own steam type shop.

No steam for me.. I would like the box, thank you !! ;)

You obviously dont know about steam. You can play offline, you just need to authenticate the game then start steam in offline mode from then on...

Also in response to another persons comment - the youplay was the MAJOR killer for WOP on steam because it was additional DRM, and it barely functioned.

[K_Freddie]

You obviously dont know about steam. You can play offline, you just need to authenticate the game then start steam in offline mode from then on...

You obviously haven't experienced steam problems ;)

[Dano]

You obviously dont know about steam. You can play offline, you just need to authenticate the game then start steam in offline mode from then on...


Try doing that when your net connection has already gone down...

[Tree_UK]

Try doing that when your net connection has already gone down...

Its bloody frustrating that is Dano, your internet goes down and you cant play the games that you purchased.

[SlipBall]

Its bloody frustrating that is Dano, your internet goes down and you cant play the games that you purchased.

That's why I didn't buy ROF at the time of release...and still to this day:grin:

[major_setback]

Buying downloads isn't the only area where problems can occur.

During one period several years ago I bought a large amount of FS add-ons from Just Flight. they were CD/DVDs shipped to my home address. I got bonus points (that gave discounts on future purchases) for every game I bought. I saved a lot of these bonuses: enough to buy several new games.

When I tried to cash-in the bonus points in they couldn't find my account details - I had changed computer and internet address, internet provider etc. since my purchases. I got nothing.

I can only imagine how much more troubling it would have been if I didn't even have the discs in my possession. At least I only lost my bonus points, and not games I'd already paid for!

I will never buy any game that I can't hold in my hand.

[zauii]

Maybes its time for you old schoolers to actually upgrade to a 24/7 hour >working< broadband...
Its 2011 and developers couldn't care less, the future is digital distribution, deal with it.

And if it goes down its not the end of the world, why cry so much because you can't play your precious game for a
short while when the Internet is getting repaired or whatever it might be, just makes me sick the whole lack of patience.

RoF was and still is a great title, imo feel sorry for people boycotting it for such reasons(DRM etc).

[Skoshi Tiger]

I live on the West Coast of Australia, Unless you want to pay for an overnight courier, packages take about 5 working days (Sat and Sunday not included) to get to me IF they're posted from the Eastern States the day their paid for, Plus the extra time it takes them to get to Oz in the first place!

My DCS:A10 became corrupted yesterday and I had to download the beta 4 again. It only took me 2 hours using bittorrent. Hmmm!

Given the option of buying a download or reading you guys on these forums talking about how fantastic SOW is, for up to a month before it hits the shelves near me, I know which option I'ld take!!!!


It would be fantastic if I could buy the licence online, and the Boxed set turned up sometime later, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Cheers!

[Dano]

Maybes its time for you old schoolers to actually upgrade to a 24/7 hour >working< broadband...
Its 2011 and developers couldn't care less, the future is digital distribution, deal with it.

And if it goes down its not the end of the world, why cry so much because you can't play your precious game for a
short while when the Internet is getting repaired or whatever it might be, just makes me sick the whole lack of patience.

RoF was and still is a great title, imo feel sorry for people boycotting it for such reasons(DRM etc).

You show me one Broadband provider who has had a 100% uptime record... other than that get a grip, nobody is crying, just pointing out the bad side of the whole online only method which when people have limited time to play their games becomes a ball ache if it happens to coincide with an outage.

[Wutz]

Maybes its time for you old schoolers to actually upgrade to a 24/7 hour >working< broadband...
Its 2011 and developers couldn't care less, the future is digital distribution, deal with it.

And if it goes down its not the end of the world, why cry so much because you can't play your precious game for a
short while when the Internet is getting repaired or whatever it might be, just makes me sick the whole lack of patience.

RoF was and still is a great title, imo feel sorry for people boycotting it for such reasons(DRM etc).
If you enjoy only "renting" a game good for you! As long as defect keys and other trash foul up downloaded games, or being forced to be online even when you wish to be offline, is a no go for me. That has nothing to do with old school at all but common sence, do you know what might be going on while you are playing your game? I have a feeling you are a bit old school yourself and are not up to date on some of the nasties people can pull off with out you even noticing it.

[speculum jockey]

Maybes its time for you old schoolers to actually upgrade to a 24/7 hour >working< broadband...
Its 2011 and developers couldn't care less, the future is digital distribution, deal with it.

And if it goes down its not the end of the world, why cry so much because you can't play your precious game for a
short while when the Internet is getting repaired or whatever it might be, just makes me sick the whole lack of patience.

RoF was and still is a great title, imo feel sorry for people boycotting it for such reasons(DRM etc).

Some people like to play games at the cottage, on the train, while crossing the Pacific on a 12 hour flight to Incheon, etc. There are reasons why people don't like having to constantly be online. Ubisoft had the big debacle with their servers going down, saves being lost, and other such things. Flight sims can sometimes take hours without time acceleration, and inflight-saves are not that common. I don't want to spend an hour or two flying to a destination, shooting down a personal best, and having my game crash to the menu and lose all my progress a minute before landing because my wireless router hiccupped or the net connection blinked.

I'm not saying that companies shouldn't try and protect their product, but if they went with a "have to be connected to play" DRM scheme then what's to stop players from getting screwed over if the company's decides they don't want to pay for the authentication server after a year because sales have slowed? People are still playing the game, but they're not giving the company any more money. Maybe the company might not even release a patch to allow offline play before they can the servers? Maybe they don't have a choice because they went out of business or got bought out and it's out of their hands.

Lots of stuff can happen, and sometimes being a physical copy Luddite pays off.

[Igo kyu]

Its 2011
It's 1911 and those wax cylinders are dead, these flat acetate records with grooves in are the future of music.
That bringing the date into a conversation as a point about tech always amuses me, it's so old, and the tech always changes again.

There's a black and white film, with speech, where some character says something like that (but not about records, I made that up).

[Flying Pencil]

A quick reply to this and about steam: No one buys computer games in shops anymore (no one being the majority of gamers by far). Not only is it hard to find pc games in shops, none of them stock news games either and most of the stuff on the shelf is old software that hasnt sold yet. PC retailing is dead.


I would prefer a box, provided it includes fold out keyboard maps (to use until I remember all the keys), large map, unit data sheet, and a poster to decorate my room. :)

And I will order online said box package. :)

Gone from store, not from mind.

PS! (predictive sensor)
51% it will be here BEFORE April 1's

[Furio]

I would prefer a box, provided it includes fold out keyboard maps (to use until I remember all the keys), large map, unit data sheet, and a poster to decorate my room. :)

And I will order online said box package. :)

Gone from store, not from mind.



+1;)

[nearmiss]

I like better to have immediate download when I buy, then have DVD sent to me immediately thereafter.

Best of both worlds

User having to be Online as a requirement for play at "any" level is not acceptable, unless it's Online play. (Confusing)

[Trumper]

Maybes its time for you old schoolers to actually upgrade to a 24/7 hour >working< broadband...
Its 2011 and developers couldn't care less, the future is digital distribution, deal with it.

And if it goes down its not the end of the world, why cry so much because you can't play your precious game for a
short while when the Internet is getting repaired or whatever it might be, just makes me sick the whole lack of patience.

RoF was and still is a great title, imo feel sorry for people boycotting it for such reasons(DRM etc).

Maybe you have more faith in computers,the internet and technology than others.Some people can't get internet access .
Sorry,- if i pay for something i want to have it ,not rely on something not going wrong.
You state you feel sorry for people boycotting ROF,surely you have got that the wrong way round ,you should feel sorry for the developers of ROF and SOW for losing people who won't spend their money on these products because as you put it
"Its 2011 and developers couldn't care less, the future is digital distribution, deal with it."
We do deal with it,we don't purchase it and the developers lose money.

[Stab/ZG26-Sashke]

At first sorry for my bad english

Does enybody know something abot the radiator Management ?
Will the engibe become damage if it becomes to colt in a fast dive with opend Radiator ?

[swiss]

Given the option of buying a download or reading you guys on these forums talking about how fantastic SOW is, for up to a month before it hits the shelves near me, I know which option I'ld take!!!!


If the publisher is not complete amateur, he won't open one channel before the other one.
(unless he wants to p.o. the retailers)

[JG52Uther]

If the publisher is UBIfail,expect to see SoW released in Russia a month before France,in America a month after France,and a month after America for the rest of the world...

[RCAF_FB_Orville]

Sadly I think because of a culture of piracy PC gamers have brought this situation upon themselves. DRM is now a necessary evil I'm afraid, with some forms being more acceptable than others.

Any single person on here who has ever downloaded a game illegally has no cause whatsoever for complaint. While obviously everyone will protest 'I didn't do it!' and that may well be so, fact remains that someone (and that 'someone' is Legion) is doing it. Honest people are now being inconvenienced for this now, so hope you are pleased with yourselves.

Its the smaller Devs like 777 Studios and Olegs lot I feel most sympathy for.....and they are now being forced to measures which they would no doubt rather not pursue in an ideal world.

People have a right to protect their Intellectual property, as much as they have a right to defend their home; its that simple. Heres a quick analogy; You have just spent 6 years of your life restoring a 1911 Rolls Royce Silver Ghost to its former glory, everything as it should be, a labour of love. Maybe you'll sell it on to a third party later, maybe not. Then some little b*stard sneaks into your garage in the dead of night and wheels away with it Scot free down the road.

All that hard work for nothing. How would you feel? I'm guessing you wouldn't be too amused. I don't like DRM, and I definitely feel sympathy for those who have problems with it for no fault of their own. :( Because of people who think they are somehow entitled to something for nothing however, it is here to stay. That's the way it is now unfortunately, deal with it.

[swiss]

If the publisher is UBIfail,expect to see SoW released in Russia a month before France,in America a month after France,and a month after America for the rest of the world...

Russia is 1C bro. ;)

[Wolf_Rider]

@ Orville

Here, Here

[Skoshi Tiger]

If the publisher is not complete amateur, he won't open one channel before the other one.
(unless he wants to p.o. the retailers)

I'm only going by past experiences. The software would normally enter Australia via the East coast (Sydney) , then get trucked or shipped by rail over to where I live 4352Km (by rail - longer by road) to the West in Perth.

It would be delivered to the shops at least a week after it's in the stores on the east coast.

Normally the software can take a month or more to get to Australia after more civilized places.

I cannot see the distributor holding up a European or American release just so it can hit the shelves in Australia at the same time.

Once it goes gold and into production they'll want it being sold as quickly as possible.

So even if I prefer a boxed copy (Which I do) I'll buy the download if it means me getting the sim when it's released.

I just hope they sell an accessory pack (Pewter wings, Survival Manual, maps, German phrase book (English for German sales) and May West) so we can have the same things as the boxed version!

Cheers!

[mr71mb0]

I love digital distribution, who wants to wait for something to turn up in the post? Also I resent giving more money to shops etc when they did nothing to make the product, I'd much rather cut them out and have all (much larger slice) of the money go to the developer.

I hope SOW is released on Steam or even better would be direct.

I love the ROF method, no messing about with codes or DRM etc, just create an account, download the software, purchase a license and start playing.

If your PC ever blows up and you lose data or re-install OS, simply re-download / re-install from backup files, enter your credentials and you are back flying again. Easy.

The number of times I've wanted to dig an old sim or game out, and I can't find the disk....



Steam is great for keeping everything all under one account and keeping it updated, I just not sure about how much of a cut they take per sale. From what I hear, the ROF direct sale method, they take near enough 100%

[Hecke]

My only concerns about digital distribution are:

- DRM stuff with permanent or only at start up internet duty.
- Having to download a game with my broadband connection (DSL 786 kbit/s)

[mr71mb0]

My only concerns about digital distribution are:

- DRM stuff with permanent or only at start up internet duty.
- Having to download a game with my broadband connection (DSL 786 kbit/s)


Steam for example has an offline mode.

If you leave it overnight most stuff will be down by the time you wake up. Steam usually has a pre-load so it will download before release date and unlock when it's released.

[JG52Uther]

Russia is 1C bro. ;)
Exactly! And the Russian version will probably ship with less DRM than the rest of the world.
Note in the interview,Oleg did not answer any questions on DRM.

[Trumper]

How about you download the game as they wish BUT with it you also get a chance to buy the boxed edition at a reduced price if you have the receipt for downloaded version.

[WTE_Galway]

My gaming machine is offline.

It was over 12 months before I purchased IL2_1946 because I waited till it appeared in a shop.

I never bought RoF at all because of the online DRM.

I have FSX installed but never play it because it insists on re-activating and I am not online and phoning is too much bother.

I will purchase SoW if and when it appears in a local store providing it does not have an online DRM.

[mr71mb0]

My gaming machine is offline.

It was over 12 months before I purchased IL2_1946 because I waited till it appeared in a shop.

I never bought RoF at all because of the online DRM.

I have FSX installed but never play it because it insists on re-activating and I am not online and phoning is too much bother.

I will purchase SoW if and when it appears in a local store providing it does not have an online DRM.

Online DRM requirement for ROF is no longer required, so worth checking out now if that was your only objection. I'm quite new to it but am loving it.

[Foo'bar]

My gaming machine is offline.

It was over 12 months before I purchased IL2_1946 because I waited till it appeared in a shop.

I never bought RoF at all because of the online DRM.

I have FSX installed but never play it because it insists on re-activating and I am not online and phoning is too much bother.

I will purchase SoW if and when it appears in a local store providing it does not have an online DRM.

Then say good bye to all good titles upcoming in future. We won't see any games without DRM any more. No matter if it was a boxed version or a online purchased one.

[mr71mb0]

I don't understand what people have against online DRM? (expect for those unlucky enough to not be able to get online at all).

[Flanker35M]

S!

DRM is the ultimate way to infuriate the legit user of a software. I had 20fps lower FPS in IL-2 after stock 4.10m because of the damned DRM. So set in a "fixed" il2fb.exe and no more problems + the DVD can be safely in the box on the shelf. I do not support software piracy but there is possibly no software encryption out there that has not been cracked or circumvented and how much has this cost to the industry, just to try stop this from happening?

I will buy SoW when it comes in a box but please let me have it so that I do not need to keep the DVD in drive every time I play!

[Wutz]

I don't understand what people have against online DRM? (expect for those unlucky enough to not be able to get online at all).
So you don´t? Do you know the differance between buying and leasing?
When you buy something, no one tells you when you may or may not use your bought artical, leased is then a differant cup of tea as it is not really yours.
But when I buy something and give good money for a product I wish to choose when I use something or not. As you as a customer can not go to a store, and say well I will give you the money for now but I might object to you using it later on.
Sorry I do not rent software I buy it.

[Hecke]

DRM kills the true customers, not the pirates.
Bad luck for Oleg if he decides to cooperate with a publisher who uses DRM.

[mr71mb0]

That's why I'm in favour of online DRM (as long as it's not so strict that a blip in comms will interrupt your game mid session).

All this starforce crap that makes it so you can't even install / play a DVD you legitimately bought and then have to resort to getting a crack is not on. But that's as a result of the protection method being rubbish and should never have been used.

[Wutz]

That's why I'm in favour of online DRM (as long as it's not so strict that a blip in comms will interrupt your game mid session).

All this starforce crap that makes it so you can't even install / play a DVD you legitimately bought and then have to resort to getting a crack is not on. But that's as a result of the protection method being rubbish and should never have been used.
Yes opening the doors for any geek to tinker with your computer while you are playing. Are you maybe a representative of the software industrie?
Then watch this, even though it is not DRM it shows what companies do if they can lock on to your computer. Sorry I do not like being a glass clear costumer, opening myself for any kind of comercial bombardment.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aT322GiT5lw&feature=related

[Foo'bar]

Sorry I do not rent software I buy it.

You'll NEVER buy software. You'll just pay for the right to use it. See the difference.

[Wutz]

You'll NEVER buy software. You'll just pay for the right to use it. See the difference.
Yes same goes for music CDs too but there no one forces you to be online or to register before being allowed to listen to your CD that too is a big differance!

[JG52Uther]

All online drm does is screw the legitimate customer.

[Wutz]

Well those who are so pro DRM seem to know little to nothing about data mining and simular stuff, I guess they just wonder why they get so much spam.
Some must really love virtual striptease for the sake of commercial interests

[mr71mb0]

man you must be really suggestible to be so frightened of a little advertising. I don't even see spam these days.

[mr71mb0]

and btw I'm not really pro DRM, but developers do have a right to try and protect the stuff they have invested time and money on.

most of these tiny companies are knife edge as it is.

[Wutz]

and btw I'm not really pro DRM, but developers do have a right to try and protect the stuff they have invested time and money on.

most of these tiny companies are knife edge as it is.
There is nothing against that, but for the right to use software, for which you pay, to allow anyone who wishes to snoop around and profil you, that is asking a bit much. Ever heard of identity theft? Is becoming more and more easier and a lot of people don´t seem to think what consequences something like that might have on them.
If you got no problems with that fine, but do not expect everyone else to share that attetude.
Software protection yes, but at the cost of lose of privacy no.

[mr71mb0]

such as?

[MegOhm]

Well when might the next OS come out?

Will SOW work with win 7 64 bit or will we have to do an install dance, if a another new OS is introduced before SOW is released I guess it might be another year or so delay to make it work.

Looks like it may be available around Dec 2013?

[K_Freddie]

I think essentially there are a core of honest paying customers like most of us here.
Maybe what Oleg/1C should do is allow us to register for SOW, which allows us to download the sim, and supply us with an enabling Key (via email or other means). This we can save onto a CD/DVD.

When playing online the server can do a quick authentication check - where it will recognise 'known' (good) customers via a PGP method.

Note that this is not the same as steam where you have to login to steam first before you play.

The pros and cons ar 50/50, but the objective should be for the ease of the good customer, as you are going to get pirates (even with steam) and it can be a community effort to 'disable' these pirates.

[Heliocon]

I understand what peoples points are on the DRM and net connection. Sorry if I was dismissive. In the end for internet it comes to this: If you want what you pay for, ie: a game, why not apply the same logic to your internet provider? I lived in Australia and rural NZ, now I am in the US. I could of understood the: internet suddenly stops working randomly: point if you are in a rural area and go back 5+ years. Now though there is really no reason you shouldnt have high speed 24/7 internet, and if you dont in Auz the new bill for internet passed will insure you have better net access then the US does!

For the: I like to play on the train comment. = Great, start steam at home, put it into offline mode. Turn on comp on train, select offline mode and play!
DRM ownership: Guys, just because you have a disk doesnt mean you OWN the software. Infact you dont, you OWN the RIGHT to ACCESS the software on the disk (this is how it has always been). Owning would mean you could copy, modify, resell and reproduce the disk and its contents.
I hate DRM, but if it keeps companies open who otherwise are hurt by it, I will take it over no games! Especially steam, which to me while DRM is very very accesable and efficient (I can re-download my games! Unlike Itunes where if your hard drive chokes on a furball from your desk = too bad for you, buy again!)


Seriously people, even in 1998, NZ countryside (rural) I had dialup. I hated competing for internet/phone with parents so we had a second line installed. I never remember it "dropping out" often. If thats an issue you need to contact your service provider. I am in a new house and the wiring for the tv/net was from when it was originaly built in the mid 80s. I was getting sometimes intermitent random drop outs, thats now all fixed.

(the only other time you might have problems is if your in Florida and theres lightning :P = buy battery backup for comp, Spam connect button! US utilities are horrible, only 12mb/s dl... In Singapore I had 100mb/s+ and no power outs...)

Also wante to add (yes another edit :P) that in reply to a reply from my reply to a reply a few pages ago...
For them to open there own shop/drm would take alot of rescources and programming. Then they have to provide server bandwidth/service for all the customers = $
Servers would have to be regional for any decent MP = $
Very limited install base and advertising vs Steam = -$
DRM doesnt work? Incompatible? Firewall problem? = tech support + programming (bug fixing) = -$ + Unhappy customers.
= Bad idea + Plenty more reasons if you want me to go on :P

[Gourmand]

DRM, ok, but the
"four activated before the game is Locked ", i can tolerate this ( is why i don't buy ROF )

I prefer a "net activation" with account mail and password ( and no-cd required )
or a simply steam connection

I hope the way to protect the game will be the most intelligent as possible

[Yvetette]

A lot of talk, talk,talk, but not a translation of the interview!!!!

[nearmiss]

What are you talking about?

[Yvetette]

What are you talking about?

In your first message that is not a translation, but bad English done by Google translator:-P

[nearmiss]

In your first message that is not a translation, but bad English done by Google translator:-P

Yes, you are correct that is what it is. :confused:

[Heliocon]

In your first message that is not a translation, but bad English done by Google translator:-P

Ok now please translate that into american.... ;)