The Blue Sun Mod [Archive] - Official Fulqrum Publishing forum

R@S

05-15-2010, 05:40 PM

The Blue Sun Mod has gotten a facelift thanks to the hard work of Thrillseeker and SilverGirl. The new portraits joefoxx made for Lambert, Alena, Gorres, Kelly, Miguel, Mindow, Paco and Paquito has been added so far, hopefully he'll have time to complete the rest in the future. D_F_N has sorted the JA2 mercs giving them much needed attention, they are now much closer to their JA2 counterparts in terms of stats.

A special thanks to all the testers for helping out, it really speeds up development time and produces a better end product. And a big thanks to Sprut for once again making the installer.

This will most likely be the last version of the Blue Sun Mod, the coming year wont leave me much time to continue developing it. But do not despair, there are already very talented people working on other mods for 7.62. Hopefully we'll be able to play an English version of the HardLife Addon in a near future as well, I'll try to help with the translation effort once it starts.

And remember, I will always have time to help anyone interested in modding 7.62, so my knowledge of the game structure and quirks will never be lost. Just PM me your questions and I'll do my best to help.

How to install:

1: Install 7.62 in a new folder, like C:\games\7.62\. Do not install the game in the default folder like "Program Files" or "User".

2: Mount or burn the bsm_2.1.iso image.

3: Run the setup.exe and choose your installation options.
(The installer includes the Unofficial Patch 1.06, media.pack files and everything else needed to make the game work, but remember to check the right options. It also has an option for our German players who can select the German Unofficial Patch and GCP files, and the Russian Compatibility Patch(RCP) for owners of the Russian version of the game.)

4: Run the BlueSunMod.exe to start the game.

Download from Yandex.Disk (https://disk.yandex.com/public/?hash=bfbo9S1iRcUUrMilHifUg3kBqy1x9Y33pGF0a0CXPns% 3D)

Download from Mega (https://mega.co.nz/#!qdQHkKha!lvKngXO0eDU4ZNIEAC-jfn3iqIDIvoaZ7clH8TWv2hY)

Download Torrent (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/17796446/BlueSunMod21.torrent)

Size: 840MB

MD5: 2D5265507F54A8DDB5B4F4C24559FCC2

Keep in mind that the launcher uses code injection, which is considered bad behavior by most antivirus programs. It is a false positive, there are no viruses in this mod, but you need to add the BlueSunMod.exe to your program's Trusted Files/Exception List. I recommend turning off your antivirus program and disconnect your Internet before you start installing the mod, and adding BlueSunMod.exe to the Trusted Files when you start up your antivirus program again. Don't start the game before this is done, or it will remove the file it considers a threat.

Have fun and don't forget to save often

R@S

MoreDread

05-18-2010, 08:04 AM

argh i'm so torn about this...

what are the changes? i kinda don't wanna restart yet...
but sooner or later i will have to do so anyway to get my new items.

i'd really love to get that ski mask done beforehand tho.

R@S

05-18-2010, 08:36 AM

There are only some minor changes, mostly fixes but a few new things as well. For those who has the final beta there's some new weapons and a new car. But I recommend you finish your current game before you start a new one with the latest version.

MoreDread

05-18-2010, 10:17 AM

I went ahead and did it anyway.. just so i can update the next thing i want to release in a few minutes.
bye bye old savegame....

0a.Archangel.a0

05-18-2010, 10:46 AM

I think there are already enough items of normal specs. The game simply calls for stats improving items and some new mods or techs to guns. You know e.g.:
ski mas(+10stealth), night_ops_outfit (+80 stealth and silent movement at night),
Targeting system built in helm (+20 to accuracy when shooting w/o scopes),
surgery kit (req: medic 75+, heals lost/blacked out health),
statis injector(req.:medic 60+, 50% chance of revival of recently fallen member-% dependant on med skill, aplicable only within 3 minutes since the merc was shot down),
camo blanket (when used the merc hides under the camo blanket, +200stealth/near invisibility, is droped off if the merc moves),
flask of water with pipes (cant figure out a world for it, simply a flask with pipes which would go from the flask to mouth and make the flask useable at any time directly from belt menu 'drink' endurance gain would be like 75%, cuz it would require more time to drink enough water to fully refresh the soldier but u dont need to put away ur gun),
Radio backpack (call for heli backup-start video heli flying in and shotting its eggs down-end of video, 15%chance per enemy unit to drop dead=hit by the gun from the heli) call for ur guys at your base to come and get all eq. looted-items will be amde accesible at your crates at your base), call for available reinforcement(opens the possibility for real wide warfare battles) from the area, both your own or your alies, %30 percent chance that someone will come for assist depending on your status in the world, during battle it is useable only once, else it is useable every hour - i would like this to also work for enemy patrols-simply it would be important to shot down the radio guy, before he calls reinforcements/for balance he will call them only if the battle seems to be lost and not directly from the start).
Treasure map fragments (sometimes to eb found on dead bodies, getting a set would open a new location on map, where something good can be found).
gas masks and gas grenades /upon arming a really wide area will cuz all units within to lose heatlh depending on the agression of the gas).
medics vest (+15 to med, skill), gunners vest(overall weight caried is reduced by 40%, allowing to cary more ammo without endurance and speed losses-restricts vest and backpack only to ammo,everything else is droped off and cant be put in/against spoilers).
medic uniform(req.: no gun equiped, -35% to acuracy and lesser threat of atackers of the merc with this uniform, not aplicable on bandits as they dont give a f, about red cross ideology),
flares/flare guns(req.: ownage of base with heliport and pilot, or nearby ally army base, creates a sector leaving zone, with 30sec cool down for alowance of evac, call for emergency evac can be also an option of the radio backpack)
thermo gogles: see all enemies in front of you (e.g. 50yds range) ignoring walls and heavy cover or stealth outfits.
outfit with leg support (like an unifrom, decreases energy drain from running and moving)
outfit with arms support(decreases energy drain from having ur gun in ready-to-fire stance)
outfit with body support (additional protection from explosions pulses also can help merc to withstand a hit which would normaly cuz him to drop down)
headset (special inventory item, req.:activation and assignement to soldier from the special items pack in inventory-all units with acivated headsets share enemy intel=one spots an enemy, everyone is aware of it and can shoot on it even if its not in visual contact-good for hitting enemies behind covers or doors=one unit spots-other blind shoots on its reported position-no more enemy-out-of-sight notifications when the f....s move behind trees and so on.
heart beat sensor-inventory activated, shows location of enemy units on mini-map (good for the last units search).
satelite scan(req.:backpack radio or something similar, scan area for hostiles - needs to be payed for afterwards at some guy in town(cia representative or something similar otherwise problems will ocure), scaning takes like 40secs and afterwards shows all units on map for 1-2 minutes depending on reputation of main char. by the provider :-D

I guess some are easy to implement and soem are harder, ut still doable, but quite time consuming. Maybe at least i inpired someone. got more ideas but that would made this too long to read.

BTW.: R@S i gaved up on the tank programing, spent a lot of time texturing it but i simpy cant make it to fire correctly. Controls were arrow based so u had to mvoe it manualy, but it simply stucks in terain too much, mainly cuz the trees are indestructible. OMG. Also i got my nerves off when trying to animate characters to enter , leave it-omg had a friend working on it, but looks like we took more than we could handle. Items simply miss to much useable parameters to make it all work so we gived-up with this. started our own project, from the scrap :-D. I am digging in python and he in blender :-D to make it cooperative enough :-D

MoreDread

05-18-2010, 11:46 AM

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/3369/mdsnightopsuniform01.jpg

Download v0.2 Here (http://www.sendspace.com/file/e009j3) (adds a female version)

it has the camouflage effect of the sniper camo suit.

it also contains the ski mask head and instructions on how to use it.

additionally it upgrades the vendors in puerto viejo and all barmen around the country to sell the new uniform and nightvision goggles right from the start of the game. rico reyes in cali cantinos now randomly sells all uniforms that are in the game.

this is an addon to the Blue Sun Mod 1.01

any attempt to use it without BSM or the wrong version of it might severely damage your game so be warned!

Shapecharge

05-19-2010, 04:59 PM

DO NOT DOWNLOAD THE UNOFFICIAL PATCH 1.06!!

When i extracted the patch from the .rar file, my anti-spyware/adware program (Spybot-S&D) detected malicious content within the patch files!
The file is infected with a malware called "Fraud.DesktopSecurity2010", instructions on how to remove it can be found at the official Spybot-S&D forum:
http://forums.spybot.info/showthread.php?t=55102

Edit:
False alarm, folks.

R@S

05-19-2010, 07:18 PM

aww shucks, my evil plan to infect my good friends with a bad thing has been foiled. Just kidding:-P

'Tis a very weird thing. Even if spybot reports that issue, there's no "Fraud.DesktopSecurity2010" anywhere to be found. My best guess is that it's a false positive, it's likely since the new archive includes a bat file and those are notorious for causing false positives.

But I could be wrong, a confirmation from others would help. Like, has anyone found the "Fraud.DesktopSecurity2010" on their computers after installing the patch?

Shapecharge

05-19-2010, 08:54 PM

Harry Renquist

05-19-2010, 09:29 PM

I just downloaded the unofficial patch and scanned it with Avast which is much superior antivirus program and found nothing. It probably is a false-positive result from Spybot.

R@S

05-19-2010, 09:54 PM

Thanks Harry, you made it so that I can sleep better tonight:)

I also checked the "Date Modified" on the AZP.EXE and it was like 2007 or something, another little clue that it might be a false positive. I also checked it with AVAST, and AVG on my laptop, no virus/spyware found. And I must have installed the patch more than 5 times and I checked the regestry, program Files folder and such, no spyware.

Shapecharge

05-19-2010, 10:53 PM

Hey, thanks for confirming the positive negative thing for me, almost crapped myself when the AV app lit up :grin:

Harry Renquist

05-20-2010, 02:02 AM

RE: Shapecharge

You should install the Free version of Avast; I used to use Spybot years ago and it would report alot of false positives.

http://www.avast.com/en-ca/free-antivirus-download

0a.Archangel.a0

05-20-2010, 08:41 AM

Well you ahve to think this thign over at this point.

If returning false positives is better than silent protector?

I had installed nod, avast, eset, kaspersky, avg and other things and simply every one ahd its backdoors. I have an eye on the recent NOD comercials and maybe I will try it out buit at this moment I have isntalled comodo. This dick showed a lot of activity and popped up almost every second after isntalation but that was the thign I wanted, Continual in depth control of system, I checked the first things it popped up, some i check to be trusted, few I blocked and voala, no more popups after the initial setups.

The program also has instalation routine - this means that you can set it to isntall mode when you are trying to install something and it will ignore few things which would otherwise be considered as threat, this means .exe and other executables and autotriggers, mostly .tmp bastards from comercials.

Has a number of different scan setups and system core checks, also tracks all net activity, inbound and outbout connections, which makes it easier for me to find intrusions.

Also keeps nonstop eye on root directories and registry, all changes are reported immediately and asked to either allow or block them :-D boy i like this thing, mostly because of no more troubles with auto update hooks and comercial sites autostarters :-D. So far the thing that finaly satisfied me.

Looks very good but maybe the bad is yet to come as it was by all pc defenders i had :-(.

Harry Renquist

05-20-2010, 01:00 PM

I use the Free Comodo Firewall program. I havn't tried their newer Antivirus though I see on their website that they have one now. I've tried about 20 antivirus programs so far. I think Avast is one of the best I've seen for finding viruses and spyware. Although from the ratings Kapersky is supposed to be the best.

NOD crashed my system and I had to do a repair install of my operating system, so I personally won't recommend it.

0a.Archangel.a0

05-20-2010, 11:47 PM

yep, i also seen that kaspersky was supposed to be the best, yet experience aproved it of being ram-eater. Mix its eating style with this game and man what would come out then? :-D

avast has free licence for noncomercial use and so has a lot of users, and from this amount you simply must find a few guys who say that its the best but frankly, not. I found my registry regularly infected with viruses and/or damaged also, its weak against key loggers, and backdoor spies. I even had experience when after update avast set all exe files to be viruses, omg :-D :-D , thats about the last experience from avast, afterwards i uninstalled it. I still recomend it to neighbours as even a dumbass can work with it and update his licence and so I dont ahve to come over and over to them and fix their fucked up pc, simply because I f.... on them and dont give a d... about their pc infections as long as they dont want anything from me.

Another thing, although you update, avast is allways behind and out-of-date when compared to the updated libraries of nod and etc. Its simply a trick for dumbs. Thats my opinion over it, based on 3 year experience.

Harry Renquist

05-21-2010, 02:33 AM

Well I'm sorry to hear of you negative experience with Avast.
Me and hundreds of other people I know have never had a problem with it, you seem to be the exception.

Avast was rated number #1 and
"having excellent virus and spyware detection rates according to antivirus test results from AV-Test.org."

http://freebies.about.com/od/securityfreebies/tp/best-antivirus.htm

AV-Test.org is an independant virus testing lab.
http://www.av-test.org/index.php

The two worst antivirus programs I ever had were; NOD and Norton. They both infected and corrupted my system.
They also chew up ram like crazy. Avast is easy on resources and it updates atleast once a day its virus database.

0a.Archangel.a0

05-21-2010, 06:21 AM

bad experience, sadly but true. Hundreds of users? TO me numbers dont matter I prefer opinion of one advanced user then thousands of 'users'.

over 80% users are beginners, hacking them is automatic and doesnt even require a man but just a tricky worm, so yes I dont care about the opinions of hundreds ;-).

secondly, free softs can not and will not have comparable quality to paid soft, oterwise all the tech. labs would go bankrupt as they are needless.

for sample. Go on avast for three months. Then use NOD free scan, check registry and all disks on advanced level and wait for surprise :-D

Believing that u are safe is also hackers wish :-D.

R@S

05-21-2010, 08:21 AM

In my experience, a good firewall is much more important than a good anti-virus prog. I started using Sunbelt Kerio a while back and am very pleased with it. I use Comodo on my laptop and that's a good one as well.

But this is supposed to be a thread about a mod called Blue Sun, could we get back on topic?:grin:

0a.Archangel.a0

05-21-2010, 10:47 AM

OK, sorry for the off topic R@S :-(

and thx for the firewall tip, I will try it out :-).

Shapecharge

05-28-2010, 03:14 PM

I've been playing this mod for some while now and enjoying it so far.
But I ran into a problem with the "backstabbing" mission:
After the car bomb situation and the ambush, I encountered a border guard whom I managed to bribe, but afterwards when I try to leave the area, the arrow representing the truck on the world map screen seem to disappear instead of following it's designated route.
Is this a bug or am I doing something wrong?

Edit:
I solved it by waiting a few hours on the mapscreen :P

deekin

05-29-2010, 10:01 AM

Hi just started playing this mod. love that you let us get the base mission off the jump.. my question is that since the SR25 was remove from the box in the base, will I be able to buy it later in the game? cos I never saw the rifle in the shop when I play the normal game. It would really sock if I cant get that rifle any more since it my fav weapon in the game.

Gnomy

05-31-2010, 06:01 AM

Legionnaire=M=

06-01-2010, 08:55 AM

causing problem with secuROM

How about rename modified E6.exe(3.38Mbytes) to another name & run it directly?
Also, keep E6.exe secuROM ver.(6.77Mbytes) on your 7.62 directory.

I'm not sure this works as a solution. But I recommend to try this way.

Gnomy

06-02-2010, 03:53 AM

^ Thank you for suggestions. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to help...

Kyle

06-09-2010, 05:47 AM

I'm thoroughly enjoying 7.62 with this mod installed. That said, I have a few questions...

I've noticed that there are super-specialized backpacks for sale at the bar in the first town the player spawns at at the very beginning of the game. These packs are nicknamed "Drugs, Collimeters," etc., etc. In spite of their different names and icons, the item layout in the packs are the same.

I'm at level 3 and so far, in spite of their price differences, they're all empty upon purchase. Is this correct? What special purpose (if any) do these backpacks serve?

The merc-agent charges me a lot more than "just" $1,000 to bring in a merc for me. Also, the merc doesn't always appear even though I coughed up the money. Is this because my funds are too low to actually hire them, or are they spawning someplace else, or...?

In spite of being at Level 3, I still haven't been able to hire anyone due to how low my funds are...Is this a normal progression? I seem to recall being able to hire a partner fairly early in Brigade E5.

Thanks in advance!

FoxHound

06-09-2010, 01:38 PM

I have beaten the Blue Sun Mod. I believed I haven't found out almost everything in the mod and I am happy to help people out. If anyone has any questions and using Steam ( I don't like using MSN or whatever), feel free to add me robinlovesshare on Steam. I will be able to answer most if not all your questions. :)

Kyle

06-09-2010, 03:03 PM

Oh, and I forgot to mention that the item-specialty-backpacks are invisible while they're WORN, but become visible when they're placed on the ground. Is this a bug, or...?

:confused:

Dr.Q

06-10-2010, 05:46 PM

The labelled backpacks are meant for reducing clutter in the car, no further secrets behind those.

I haven't had any problems with the merc agent, they spawn at one of the entry points and then walk to the hotel. The agent then takes some time off, depending on how expensive that merc was.

A propos expensive, I'm not having any problems with the money in BSM. There's a free and pretty good merc you can get right away by going to Santa Maria. Solve his quest either way and there you go, won't need Benicia except for muling duties :)

Kyle

06-11-2010, 05:20 AM

Dr. Q.,

Thanks for your help. I'm guessing that by the "free" merc you mean the drunkard at the bar? I'm avoiding him like the plague! Still, I never thought of him acting as a pack mule, so the next time I'm there he's "hired."

I've come to the realization that I'm "stuck" mid-storyline. Near the beginning of the game, I went all the way North to acquire an illicit means to get into the Forbidden/Restricted Zone. I paid approximately $500 to play an "Easter Egg" game to get it, and although I succeeded at this, no new map location was generated Southward.

I then went and spoke with the Minister who wanted me to kill the Marauders. I'm spoke with the Marauders' leader and made a deal with him, got his dog tags as proof that he's dead, and returned them to the Minister in order to get the paperwork to get into the Restricted Zone. I had to start a new dialogue with this Minister in order for him to know that I was ready to go South, and...

Nothing happened, not even a new map listing.

What am I doing wrong? Am I missing something simple, is it a bug, or...?

Thanks again for the help!

MoreDread

06-11-2010, 11:37 PM

no you will just have to go exploring on your own =)

having done this mission means that you can now travel in the restricted zone
(marked by the borders around those 5 different cities you can see right from the start)

there are a few other cities and other sectors outside + theres a chance to get random encounters with bandits... those are a good way to hone your fighting skills and collect some loot.

for that it is very advisable NOT to miss that drunkard guy in the bar in santa maria.. because he will give you your first car.

beeing able to put loot in your trunk is essential if you wanna hunt bandits and not loose most of the loot after battles and it also greatly increases your traveling speed. (note that there are a few missions that don't work if you have a car... mainly escorting the german guy in puerto viejo and the assault on the convoy if you decide to work for tanya. if you want to do these missions, simply ask a bartender to look after your car for a while.)
the drunkard will also allow you to do quite a few missions for the corrupt policeman in sagrada. just give it a try, these missions are hilarious. you can fire him afterwards if you don't like paquito..

and Dr.Q was mentioning benicia, she is basically a free merc.
talk to the foreigner in the campecino hospital, he will ask you to save her from his overprotective father in santa maria. then instead of delivering her to her lover right away, you can just keep her in your team for free until you need that spot for hiring an 'actual' merc. (theres a non-violent way to solve this quest.. look around the forums if you can't discover it yourself, i explained it somewhere)

Kyle

06-12-2010, 04:30 AM

MoreDread,

Well, I can't tell you how good it is to know that I wasn't "wasting" my time going waaaaaaay down south, enter that cloud, and just to see what would happen. So, the fact that I can even enter that region demonstrates that the Easter Egg mission worked, although I didn't know it yet!

In a way, having to explore that region with no assists makes it feel more foreboding, almost like living "Heart of Darkness." Interesting!

Now I have to get those "free" mercs, because my first encounter in the canyons was quite a challenge with me and the one merc I did hire, Warlock. Help is definitely needed from this point onward.

One thing that I miss from Brigade E5 is that a majority of these maps seem more restrictive both in the absence of vertical tactical options and with depicting regions that certainly look accessible to humans, but are made off limits in the game. The "Jungle" map is a good example of this. Those mounds look approachable to me!

The canyons map is the first map I've fought on where the threat of the lower and upper elevations kept me nervous. I hope that there's more of this down the road.

Thanks for your tremendously detailed response. It's got my interest level piqued! :grin:

Dyhhan

06-15-2010, 07:21 PM

First, thank you for improving one of my favorite (if flawed) games!

Unfortunately, I am having problem running the newest version of Blue Sun Mod. I re-installed 7.62, and applied unofficial patch. At that point, the game ran fine. Then, I installed Blue Sun Mod on top of it, and now it crushes whenever the first map loads after the character creation. :confused:

I am using Win7 64bit, and Gamersgate version. I am suspecting that the modified e6.exe included in the mod is causing problem with secuROM (GG version needed to be activated first), but I am not very sure. Thank you for the help.

I'm having the same problem as Gnomy, and I did what Legionnaire=M= suggested, but this still happens. I installed everything perfectly. I'm also running the Gamersgate version but on a 32bit XP pro os.

There is another issue I have. When I run the PatchMe.bat I get an error message that looks like this:
This application has failed to start because MSVCR71.dll was not found. Re-installing the application may fix this problem.

Anyone have any ideas, and what is that .dll about?

Forgot to say; mine also crashes after character creation, and it worked fine before the BSM install

MoreDread

06-15-2010, 08:11 PM

microsoft visual c++ runtime components.. this is what you need, google vcredist or follow this link, then download, install and try again.
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=9b2da534-3e03-4391-8a4d-074b9f2bc1bf&displaylang=en

Dyhhan

06-15-2010, 10:19 PM

Thanks for the help. I was looking around, found some answers, my friend sent me the file, and everything works perfectly now.

Cel.Barbosa

06-19-2010, 12:49 AM

This mod is great but I think they are missing some weapons such as pistols SIG SAUER for example and have too many variations of Mosin Nagant and AK47, you can put a Mauser 98, a pt24/7, a MT40 and a RT410 from TAURUS, some modern variations of the 1911, some real guns. except for that everything is great, keep up the good work.:grin:

sorry for my bad English, I used the google translator.:mrgreen:

R@S

06-19-2010, 06:07 PM

I would like to see the DSR-50, and the new m14. And a few older SMG's would be nice too. Anyone feel up for some 3d modelling?

Cel.Barbosa

06-19-2010, 06:29 PM

a LUGER P08 and a MP40 would be nice.

I having a problem on paquito first mission. whem i press "give that key" the game crash back to windows. any sugestion?

R@S

06-19-2010, 07:16 PM

Do you have a car when you do that mission? And what does the log file say about the CTD?

Cel.Barbosa

06-19-2010, 08:44 PM

Do you have a car when you do that mission? And what does the log file say about the CTD?

I don't have a car and the CTD says nothing.

R@S

06-20-2010, 10:26 AM

The log file must say something, even if it's just a [Warning] it might give me a clue to what the problem is. But since noone else has reported such an issue it might be your installation.

To everyone
The more info you give me on the issues, the easier it is for me to find the problem. Please include your installation info, log entries and whatever you think might help solving the problem.

Cel.Barbosa

06-20-2010, 04:03 PM

I have reinstaled the game and the mod and nothing. with the version 0.9 it worked fine.

NOTE: i put the version 1.01 under the 0.9. if i put just the 1.01, the game doesn't start

like i said before, when i press "give me that key" the game close back to windows, with no explanation.

R@S

06-20-2010, 05:48 PM

Cel.Barbosa

06-20-2010, 09:50 PM

There you have it then, the 0.9 version is probably screwing things up for you.

Did you have any problems installing the Unofficial Patch? A failed installation of the patch might be the reason the 1.01 version wont work for you.

I think that windows is not allowing the patch to install the right way. My operating system is Windows 7 64 bit home premium edition. Could you help me with this?

website to save youtube videos (http://www.savetubevideo.com/ )

MoreDread

06-20-2010, 11:54 PM

its been said before.. do not install the game to you program files folder.. instead choose a different folder like c:/games/7.62 .

the program files folder can be a bit complicated if you don't have complete admin rights on your version of windows and lots of software that was written pre 7/vista doesn't run properly

then unpack the unofficial patch to a temporary folder.. move its contents to your game dir and run the batch file.
the latest BSM requires the unofficial patch and won't run without it.. the 0.9 had a previous version of the patch included which is why i think that it almost works if you have it pre installed... however it contains old files of BSM which are obsolete now and cause conflicts.

after that try installing the latest BSM again and it should work.

i hope that helps

it worked for me this way and so it should for you.

Cel.Barbosa

06-21-2010, 05:08 PM

I tried that but now that screen in the thumbnails apear.

It says that the program did something real bad and was killed.

R@S

06-22-2010, 09:11 AM

1: Install 7.62 in a new folder, like c:\games\7.62. DO NOT intstall the game in your Program Files or User folder, that will cause problems with vista/win7

2: Extract the Unofficial Patch to a temporary folder, then copy those files to your game directory. Make sure the PatchMe.bat and azp.exe are copied, sometimes they'll get stopped by anti-virus progs. If they do, add them to the exception list and copy them again.

3: Run the PatchMe.bat and watch as the command prompt packs the files. If you get any error messages, make a note of them. It might be useful if you need help problem solving later. If any files are marked as reaqd-only, they'll get added to the archive but not deleted afterward.

4: Extract the Blue Sun Mod files to a temporary folder, then copy them to your game directory. Make sure ALL files gets copied, the exe file might get caught in your anti-virus. If it does, add it to your exception list.

5: Run the game.

If you still have problems, check the log file located in your \7.62\Log\ folder. A log file will be created every time the game crashes and is very good at spotting missing resources and the like.

Cel.Barbosa

06-22-2010, 05:43 PM

Finally the games is working. The patch doesn't have extracted complete, some of the patch files were missing but now its ok:-P.

Just the "enter_dev_mode" => "shop" that stop working but the game is fine, Thank you for helping me.:grin:

Chortles

06-26-2010, 11:56 AM

Then again, the Patchme.bat failed to work, so I'm not surprised... also Windows 7 64-bit.

Installed the game to a "root drive:/Games/7.62 - High Calibre" folder, then unzipped the Unofficial Patch... albeit, straight to said directory. Here's the error message I got when trying to run Patchme.bat (mind you as admin):'azp.exe' is not recognized as an internal or external command, operable program or batch file.
The system cannot find the file directory.a.
Could Not Find C:\Windows\system32\directory.a
Could Not Find C:\Windows\system32\files.a
Could Not Find C:\Windows\system32\azp.exe
Compression Complete
Press any key to continue . . .Nevertheless, afterward I extracted the Blue Sun Mod 1.01 to a temporary folder and moved its contents to "root drive:/Games/7.62," then tried to run the game at 1024x768 full-screen. So far the game will run, but CTD when I start game, at least with Cameron.

FWIW, I'm able to use the Editor, but there's almost nothing in the "Armor" category except for a Tripwire, and I find that I cannot remove any of the vertical Foregrips or collapse/"fold" the Modified M4A1 stocks... is this intentional, or a bug?

R@S

06-26-2010, 01:08 PM

It seems you missed the second(2) step in the install instructions in the above post where I mention the need to make sure the azp.exe actually gets copied to the game directory. I think it gets blocked by your system and you need to add it to the exception list. The same goes for the Files.a and Directory.a files, make sure they're in the game fiolder before you run the PatchMe.bat file.

The shop issue is known, but I haven't gotten any confirmation if my fix for it works. This bug only happens to some people, I don't have that problem, so it's very hard for me to see if I fixed it. My latest attempt can be found here, just copy the files to your game directory and make sure the RenderedItems folder is empty to make sure you re-render the old screwed up images.
http://rapidshare.com/files/399965405/BSM_1.01_Fix1.rar

The foregrips in not meant to be taken off, it's due to some engine limitation so you have to live with it. It's also the reason they can't be bought in shops, only ordered though Uribe.

The stock issue must be on your end, it works fine for me. Which version of the WEAPONINFO are you using? Could be that I messed up the alterative one, if that's the one you're using.

Ninja2dan

06-26-2010, 09:31 PM

Hey R@S, good to see you're still modding for the game. I had a few quick questions for you, if you have the time.

I haven't played 7.62 since last November or so, which at the time your mod was still going by the name "BFX". My personal computer was damaged about 5 months ago, and I've been too busy to get it fixed. But I'll finally be ordering replacement parts next week, so pretty soon I'll be able to play the game again.

I noticed that your newest mod version is being called "BSM" now. I read up on the BFX topic and did notice a few changes being made to that mod, and I've also read this topic. Unfortunately, I'm still not understanding the differences between BFX and BSM versions.

My question is, can you provide me with a summary list of features/changes between the BFX mod (circa 11-2009) and your new BSM mod? For example, I see that you mentioned you found a way to boost the max weapon count from 256 to 4k+, a major improvement.

One thing that I did notice is that both in the original game and also with the mods, many of the items found throughout the game have uses/functions/etc that are never clearly explained. A perfect example being the field manuals. If one didn't spend hours reading the forums, you'd have no clue in hell what those damned things even did for the game. There are also some items where their general use/function might be guessed, but their in-game descriptions leave the player guessing how/where/when to actually use those items.

Has anyone considered creating some sort of "database" or Wiki for the game and/or BFX/BSM mod to include the weapons, items, characters, etc available? Something that might be capable of explaining what the various items are used for, how they are used, or even what items have no use at all. This would benefit the game quite a bit, and lower the learning curve and aggrevation level that many players might experience. In many cases the steep learning curve and complications figuring things out might be forcing many prospective players into simply giving up.

R@S

06-27-2010, 08:52 AM

Chortles

06-27-2010, 03:52 PM

It seems you missed the second(2) step in the install instructions in the above post where I mention the need to make sure the azp.exe actually gets copied to the game directory. I think it gets blocked by your system and you need to add it to the exception list. The same goes for the Files.a and Directory.a files, make sure they're in the game fiolder before you run the PatchMe.bat file.Unfortunately I got the same error when I manually copied the files to the game root directory. In all cases I'm merging the folders and "move/replace" (overwriting), and the three files ARE in the game's root directory "root drive:/Games/7.62," PatchMe.bat is in that directory, and I'm running it through "run as administrator," not relogging.

Would try out your fixes for the shop and the WEAPONINFO, but I have to get the Unofficial Patch to work first, much less BSM...

EDIT: That is to say, unfortunately your instructions did not resolve the issue successfully; the three files were successfully copied, but it did not work. :( Do I have to do this on an admin account?

Ninja2dan

06-28-2010, 08:22 AM

Welcome back

What's new since last time you played? The major thing is oc the new weapons, and some old one has been put back in as well. There's some new missions too, and the BSM quests has now been tied together so it's like a new faction to work for. It goes first the cops in Sagrada, then the Boblings at the harbor and finally the Blue sun guys at their base. If you finish those quests it'll lead you to your original target Fakirov/Bashirov. There's also a new weapon ordering system, but it's only one guy that has this ability. Then there's some other minor tweaks, like when the player base is available, the border check is removed and the first rebel encounter is also gone.

There was a database in Reloaded that did what you asked for, but it never got translated. I think there's also a "Travelling Guide" made by Toneone1 in German somewhere, but that deals with missions and how to complete them successfully.

Someone with knowledge of the game could edit the ITEMINFO file and write better descriptions of the items, but there's a limit on how many letters there can be in every item entry and one would have to be very succinct. I'm too lazy to do it myself:-P

Yeah, the last time I played was around November of 2009, I've been pretty busy since then. I never got to finish the game using the BFX mod, but I was already having a good time with the new weapons and items.

It'll be good to see some new quests. A few of the quests that I do remember were a little "stupid", they seemed to have bugs or issues that didn't make sense or would end up causing problems. I'm hoping that most of that has been cleaned up, if not then I can leave more detailed feedback when I get the game up and running again. Overall though, the new quests added something fun to do when the normal stuff got boring.

I wouldn't mind looking into the ITEMINFO file once I get things running again. As both a former US Army soldier and civilian law enforcement, I have plenty of experience with weapon systems and tactical equipment. I could take a look at the descriptions and see if any need revised, or if anything is missing.

My main concern was for the game overall. It would be great to have some sort of Wiki set up that explains the weapons, items, vehicles, etc so players know what to do with everything. While most weapons in general are obvious, there are a few accessories that might not be as obvious to casual gamers. And then of course you have those oddball items like the firearm manuals that nobody really knows WTF they are there for.

Maybe I can look into setting up some type of Wiki, but I'll need help when the time comes. I'm sure we have enough active players and forum users that would be willing to post some stuff there.

Thanks for the heads up, I look forward to checking the game out again soon. Should be about 2 weeks before my PC is repaired (I hope), and then I'm ready to rock.

By the way, does anyone know the contact information of the people responsible for producing/developing the game?

R@S

06-28-2010, 11:51 AM

@Chortles
Are you familiar with the Security Center(not sure if that's what it's called), in your control panel? There's a page there called Quarantine and I wan't you to see if the azp.exe got stuck in it. If it is add it to the exception list. If not, check your anti-virus and firewall as well. Since you're certain the patch files got copied to your game directory, there must be someting preventing them from beeing run in your installation directory, otherwise you wouldn't have any problems. Others have reported similar problems and have gotten it to work, maybe checking the old threads to see what they did to resolve th issue.

It seems that my attempt to fix the cheater chop inventories failed, but I've made a new fix that might work:
http://rapidshare.com/files/403495009/BSM_1.01_Fix_2.rar
Just copy the files to your game directory and delete all the files in the RenderedItems folder before starting the game.

@Ninja2dan
Apeiron seems to be offline, so contacting them is almost impossible. Here's a link to their forum, if they ever come up again:
http://apeiron-games.ru/forum/index.php

The guy who was most helpful, Snowie, has left the company and the other guys never answered any queries, so I'd say it's almost impossible to contact them. You could try asking over at the HLA site, they know much more about the game than anyone and might be able to help you.

Ninja2dan

06-28-2010, 12:41 PM

So I take it they have no plans to produce another release or expansion? Such a shame, because with a little more work and updating they could have made a ton of money.

There are a lot of other soldiers that I know, as well as LEO and similar professionals, that find little interest in most of the games out there. But when we come across a game like 7.62 it just makes us say "Wow, awesome". It has all of the features that we enjoy, and we're more than happy to continue purchasing expansions and new releases.

It's nice that the game is capable of modding, but there is only so much that can offer. You have done a great job at creating some new and interesting features, adding in new weapons and items, and generally giving the game a second life. But in all honesty, there is only so far your mod can go. I love the new features, but part of the reason I stopped playing it half-way through was because so much of the game just seemed like the same old thing. Sure, the original game was enjoyable the first time through, but once you know the storyline, once you know the missions, the replayability is very limited.

And that's where expansions are supposed to come in. They add new locations, new items, new storyline, new characters, new features. They give the game a new life, and that's really what this game needs. But if the dev team has given up on it, that's not only disappointing but senseless.

R@S

06-29-2010, 08:56 AM

And that's where expansions are supposed to come in. They add new locations, new items, new storyline, new characters, new features. They give the game a new life, and that's really what this game needs. But if the dev team has given up on it, that's not only disappointing but senseless.The only thing we can't do is make new maps, all the other things, like new missions, weapons, characters and features are all possible. I just found out that the HLA guys has started making new functions in the code which opens up the possibilities even more. But expansions with new locations is what the game needs, it's the weakest point of the game, the limited number of maps and the lack of a map editor.

One can oc place the player and the enemies in varied position to create different tactical problems, but that's not enough. I would like to add as many maps as possible from 7.62 Reloaded, but I think that violates some copyrights and might put me in a bad situation. They should consider releasing it in Europe, even if it is in Russian, the fans would quickly make a translation and the resources from these 2 games would make it easier for modders.

And the dev team never gave up on their baby, they just ran out of money to continue developing awesome games. I would do anything to support those guys. They've created something new and brilliant, something a market based system that we have in the rest of the game development world never does, and they deserve a better fate.

Chortles

06-29-2010, 11:54 AM

Depending on the mod, sometimes there's enough content to keep trying out the little things... I believe that v1.13 has had the same issue for JA2, but even so I've returned to it every now and then, and hopefully Blue Sun Mod going forward extends the life of 7.62 for me beyond what it would have been.

R@S, the patch problem seems to have been solved by either giving the game directory an exception in Microsoft Security Essentials, running Patchme.bat from the Command Prompt instead of the Windows Explorer GUI, or both; that also solved the Modified M4A1 stock issue, which does extend/collapse normally. (I do admittedly find it redundant though for there being both "stock collapsed" and "stock extended" versions of the otherwise exact same weapon in the shops... it's a lot of screen clutter if you ask me, kinda like all of the ARMA2 weapon "variants.")

I do find it strange/unfortunate though that the "modified"-type stock, akin to the Magpul UBR, is not an option for the M4 unless I want to run some sort of rig with an underbarrel device (UGL or VFG) or in 6.8x43 or 7.62x39.

Oscuro1987

06-29-2010, 05:03 PM

RESOLVED :
Well it seems that, even though i deactivated spybot, my patch installation was still corrupted, I tried again and after 3rd attempt it worked lol.... xD My bad sry !

Hello there ;)
Well i tried to install BSM 1.01 exactly how it's written on the website, tho i can't make it work...
And yeah i have spybot but deactivated it when i installed patch otherwise he tells me the patch has a virus (which is fake i suppose)

I retrieved the error message out of the logs though :

[...]
00:02.805 INFO [0] .\ZApp.cpp (847) Entering main program loop...
00:15.093 ERROR [0] .\Items\items.cpp (697) Item not found by name: 'Unique Sniper Rifle SKS (7.62x39)'
00:15.093 FATAL [0] .\Shop\ShopEconomics.cpp (324) Invalid item in economy: 'Unique Sniper Rifle SKS (7.62x39)', shop: Emiliano Calderon_25048
>-----------------------------------------------------------
> Exception C0000005 at 0x004E5442
>-------------------- Call stack ---------------------------
[...]

How could I fix it please ? :p

Thanks for this mod btw it looks awesome (even tho i still need to try lol ! xD)

EDIT : i tried applying fix 1 & fix 2 and I still get the same error message :o

R@S

06-29-2010, 05:53 PM

@Chortles
I'm very glad you finally got it working and am sorry for your troubles.

If the latest fix doesn't resolve the cheater shop tab issue where items are missing, someone reported that if you run the game in winXP SP3 compatibility mode it should work again.

You'll notice that in the "real" shops there isn't as much clutter since it only shows the folded version if it's available, it never shows both versions unless you sell an unfolded one. And your gripe with the M4 stocks is just a matter of cosmetics, but if it annoys you that much I can easily add a normal M4 with the alternative stock. I'm always willing to improve the game to please the players:grin:

Ninja2dan

06-30-2010, 01:54 AM

The only thing we can't do is make new maps, all the other things, like new missions, weapons, characters and features are all possible. I just found out that the HLA guys has started making new functions in the code which opens up the possibilities even more. But expansions with new locations is what the game needs, it's the weakest point of the game, the limited number of maps and the lack of a map editor.

One can oc place the player and the enemies in varied position to create different tactical problems, but that's not enough. I would like to add as many maps as possible from 7.62 Reloaded, but I think that violates some copyrights and might put me in a bad situation. They should consider releasing it in Europe, even if it is in Russian, the fans would quickly make a translation and the resources from these 2 games would make it easier for modders.

And the dev team never gave up on their baby, they just ran out of money to continue developing awesome games. I would do anything to support those guys. They've created something new and brilliant, something a market based system that we have in the rest of the game development world never does, and they deserve a better fate.

That's part of the primary difference between game expansions or updates, the addition of new maps/locations. You can change the weapons, items, characters, etc all you want but if you keep dropping them into the exact same cities on the exact same map, there just isn't going to feel like much difference.

I'm not aware of what this "Reloaded" version of the game is, but it sounds like some sort of expansion that was released only for Russian market? What kind of changes does that version have in regards to maps and locations? And if it hasn't been released, has anyone tried to contact the publisher about it?

And if the development team didn't "give up", why is it that I can't find any contact information for them? Was 7.62 their first and only release? I just can't see a company going bankrupt and closing like that with a product of this quality.

R@S

06-30-2010, 07:45 AM

Wuinny

06-30-2010, 03:23 PM

As there are so numerous topics for the mod i post that here too.

Hello,

First thank you for the mod.

But i have a problem. Maybe a scripts.

So

-i have a fresh install of 7.62
-Installed 1.06 unofficial patch
-installed BSM 1.01

I started a new game, did the quest to have the border pass but when i pass the border nothing happen.
So i continue on the map until i'am attacked by bandits (not by the scripted soldiers of Tanya)
I already reached once the location of her camp on the map but there's nothing and i can't do anything.

Is there a fix ?
Thank you.

Oh, my rig:
-P8400 2.4Ghz
-4Go Ram
-9650M GT 1Go
-Seven x64 ultimate.

Ninja2dan

07-01-2010, 03:06 AM

As you suspected, Reloaded was ony released on the Russian market and it's a linear game, not a sandbox type like 7.62. It's actually a lot like Silent Storm, you have a base where you store your gear and get your missions. The best thing about it is that it adds around 10 new locations that are compatible with the 7.62 engine, and those maps are really nice, from a tactical stand-point. I dunno if anyone has contacted 1C about releasing it outside Russia, but the game is almost 2 years old, they might think that's not in their best interest.

The developers, Apeiron, has also made Brigade E5, published by Strategy Firts, and their latest SPM game Man of Prey, published by Buka(which has been bought by 1C).

They also started working on another title called Capitulum but never found a publisher for it. It's also a SPM game based on a famous book taking place in a post apocalyptic setting.

I'm not sure you're aware that 7.62 was plagued with bugs when it was first released, as was Brigade E5. And in both cases the devs and pubs seemed to be in a disagreement on long term product support, which resulted in an even bigger mess, no official patches. But one good thing came from that, it made the community a tight-nit group that helps one another and keeps improving the game on their own.

I actually just recently finished playing Silent Storm and the expansion Sentinels, it just happens to be one of the few games that works on my loaner laptop until my primary PC is fixed.

I found that game very disappointing overall, but it did have some interesting aspects such as destructible environments that allowed you realistic alternate movement methods throughout structures. The mission system kind of sucked though, as I thought there were far too few actual missions and the "encounters" were nearly identical.

I'm curious how the new locations in the Reloaded version work, and how they might actually be able to blend with the original 7.62 game. Are the locations of the same design quality? And how might they work with the current 7.62 map system?

As for 1C releasing the game outside of Russia, age of a game isn't really a primary factor for them. There are games that have been out for over a decade that are just now being released outside their original markets because the publishers feel there is enough demand to profit from. That's all the Reloaded version needs in order to make a US/UK release, enough interested customers to prove that the conversion would bring in a profit. If only a dozen people would buy it, that's hardly enough to justify the cost.

And in all honesty, I don't think too many gamers would buy the Reloaded version. The majority are probably just like those on the forums here, who would wait for the "enhancements" to make their way into the original game via a mod instead of just playing the new version itself.

I looked up the game Man of Prey, and it lead me to the Buka company site but the game was still listed as Q1 2009 release. Man of Prey appears to be based on a book "Marauder" about the post-apoc. There are a few screenshots of the WIP, but nothing else really detailing the game or its development progress.

And after looking up info on Capitulum, it also appears to be a post-apoc setting, but made it far enough to offer a downloadable demo. The storyline for that game is a bit outside of the scope that I generally look for in games, and it looks like too many others agreed (which is why nobody was interested in publishing).

Still, the overall system of that used in 7.62 could have really been made into some great software with a little more work around the edges. Seriously, as a developer and advisor myself I am fully aware of how many players out there would actually dump some cash on a new version. To have such a product somewhat available and to not produce it, it's retarded. It's like discovering the cure to cancer, and just locking it away for nobody to see.

I would love to come in contact with some of the developers to pass on some comments, suggestions, or just advice on their potential market. I'd even be willing to go so far as to helping fund the development of a new game based on much of the features found in 7.62, but I just don't know how to even contact any of them.

Such talent, such potential, it really sucks to see it all go to waste.

R@S

07-01-2010, 08:04 AM

Dr.Q

07-01-2010, 11:29 AM

Still, the overall system of that used in 7.62 could have really been made into some great software with a little more work around the edges. Seriously, as a developer and advisor myself I am fully aware of how many players out there would actually dump some cash on a new version. To have such a product somewhat available and to not produce it, it's retarded. It's like discovering the cure to cancer, and just locking it away for nobody to see.

Hear hear :!:

There are tons of strategy/tactical gamers who would love this next evolution of a turn-based system. Relaxing thoughtful gameplay without being hustled along by ticking clocks. One step further than the old boardgame-based Jagged Alliance clones.

Chortles

07-01-2010, 11:30 AM

Ninja2dan

07-01-2010, 01:12 PM

Man of Prey has been released in Russian under the name "Marauder", and an English localization was supposed to be released as well. But news has stopped coming about it and they might've put it in a bin.

Reloaded is basically the same as 7.62 in both quality and design, they just removed the Sandbox element that causes so many bugs. The maps and other resources are very much compatible.

I'll see if any of my Russian contacts know how to contact them, if they do I'll forward the info to you in an PM.

I just don't see why a game company would go about spending so much money on developing a title, only to release it to such a limited market. All they need is a few hours/days of work in translation to market it to other countries and make some serious extra income, but by not doing so they have lost out in a big way. Same thing with the Reloaded version. Are their execs a bunch of morons?

If you were given permission from the dev team, do you think it's actually possible to use the Reloaded maps/towns with the BSM mod, or maybe a Version 2 of it? If so, it might be worth pushing a little harder to get in contact with them. If they aren't willing to get it done themselves, maybe giving approval for the community to do it would promote even a minor increase in sales to make it worth their wild.

I would really appreciate if you can find someone, somewhere, that is part of their dev team (and speaks English) that I could contact about possible future expansions or products. I know more than enough gamers interested in such a product that might be willing to support funding or other means to get something done.

Hear hear :!:

There are tons of strategy/tactical gamers who would love this next evolution of a turn-based system. Relaxing thoughtful gameplay without being hustled along by ticking clocks. One step further than the old boardgame-based Jagged Alliance clones.

Just look at what the game offers compared to other similar games out there. The character models aren't bad at all, even if limited in quantity they do not lack in quality. The item and weapon system is outstanding, one of the things I found most exciting about the game was the fact you could heavily customize your weapons and actually see every little change in game on the weapon models. You add a scope, and you can see it on the weapon in game. You modify this, swap out that, and it shows exactly as it should.

Then look at some of the other features. Grenades for example are done super badass in my opinion. There is no magic sphere of death, grenades function in a realistic manner. Outside of the immediate blast radius you have actual fragments of shrapnel that project outwards. Get hit by some frag, you're fried. Hide behind something, or just get lucky, and you live another day. I found myself constantly stopping in the middle of a firefight just to look around and see where all of the shrapnel hit, sometimes laughing my ass off when someone was just barely missed (like some idiot civilian running into the fire zone).

There are just so many features present in the game that really attract people like myself that really thirst for realism and tactical options. The market for games like this is very high, but in order to actually attract those buyers you need to know how to pull them in, how to advertise. If I had the resources of a team like theirs, I could easily pull in some serious sales. Hell, over 50% of the military personnel I know would snatch a game up faster than a bullet if they knew it existed. That's thousands of prospective buyers in just one little ring, not even taking any advertising into account. Imagine the possibilities.

They are sitting on a gold mine, but from my eyes it looks like they are too lazy or just uninformed, and it's costing them a lot of money. Sooner or later, someone else is going to beat them to it.

R@S

07-01-2010, 06:55 PM

Well, actually... hmm. I ended up using the shop tab fix, which worked in correcting the "Armor" tab so that the accessories (i.e. optics) are displayed and available for equipping. Problem is, in the editor the weapons' non-rendered portraits disappeared! :D Well, a lot of them...I'm glad that the fix did the job, and for the non-rendered weapons I think a simple "delete all files in the RenderedItems folder" should fix that. That is if you dint already do that, and I just moved the problem with my "fix"

Was the BMP folder supposed to disappear when I used "Patchme.bat" successfully? Yup, it should've been moved into the AZP archive when the patch was run. And i made it as simple as I could with the fix, that's why those files are outside. But for the next release they'll be packed in the BSM.AZP archive.

I would really appreciate if you can find someone, somewhere, that is part of their dev team (and speaks English) that I could contact about possible future expansions or products. I know more than enough gamers interested in such a product that might be willing to support funding or other means to get something done.Still haven't heard back, but will prolly know by tomorrow

About Reloaded, I think it's 1C that owns the publishing right, so you could try contacting them. I recommend sending a PM to Nike-it, a very helpful character that can point you in the right direction and should know who would be the best person to ask.

I've been playing this game for more than 2 years, and modding it for 1, and I still find new thing that blows my mind. The latest was discovered when I was playing around with the player skills. Even if the whole system is still a secret, from what I can tell it's a very complex and dynamic one. As I always say, the more you play this game, the more you realize what a great game it is:)

Once the new skill system has been tested and approved, I'll release a new version of the mod, including all the fixes as well. I've had some time to play it and found that some of the weapon attachments should appear earlier in the game, and I seem to have forgotten to add the new EOTech to the shops.

Ninja2dan

07-02-2010, 07:03 AM

Still haven't heard back, but will prolly know by tomorrow

About Reloaded, I think it's 1C that owns the publishing right, so you could try contacting them. I recommend sending a PM to Nike-it, a very helpful character that can point you in the right direction and should know who would be the best person to ask.

I've been playing this game for more than 2 years, and modding it for 1, and I still find new thing that blows my mind. The latest was discovered when I was playing around with the player skills. Even if the whole system is still a secret, from what I can tell it's a very complex and dynamic one. As I always say, the more you play this game, the more you realize what a great game it is:)

Once the new skill system has been tested and approved, I'll release a new version of the mod, including all the fixes as well. I've had some time to play it and found that some of the weapon attachments should appear earlier in the game, and I seem to have forgotten to add the new EOTech to the shops.

As you suggested, I sent a PM to Nike-it from 1C. His reply is below:

Hi Jason,
1C is currently not working with the developer of 7,62 - Aperion Games. So from our side we can't give you the permission ot use content form 7,62 Reload. The right for the game belongs to Buka if not mistaken. Try to reach them: http://buka.ru/cgi-bin/show_more.pl?...=Show_contacts
Most likely you will need this mail: cooperation@buka.ru
Good luck and Best Regards.
Nike-it

So it appears that 1C is no longer in direct business with Aperion anymore, and the Aperion web site links all come up with a dead site. So at this time, I have no clue on how to contact Aperion or any of the active staff associated with 7.62 now.

And as for 7.62 Reloaded, he stated that Buka owns the rights and not 1C, which is odd because the Buka site news post dated July 2008 stated that 1C had acquired ownership of Buka. I'll ask Nike-it in another PM specifically about that, hoping that I'm not just chasing ghosts.

If somewhere along the line I can acquire permission from the rightful owners of the Reloaded version to use some of the content with community mods created for the original version, then we'll see what happens. It won't be a permanent solution but at least it might provide a little more playability from the game while we wait for the next release.

R@S

07-02-2010, 08:11 AM

OK, I talked with my Russian friends and they'll try to find some contact info for you. I'll send you a PM once I get it. However, while talking to them they gave me some pretty good arguments why I should include the maps from Reloaded in my mod, and I'll dot it! Yes, you read it right, I'm going to include most of the maps from Reloaded in the next version of BSM:grin: After all, I'm not making any money off their product and it might even increase their sales if there's an active modding community.

But I still recommend contacting Buka, they're the ones that published Apeiron's latest SPM game and might be convinced that the concept is worth saving and keep developing.

Ninja2dan

07-02-2010, 08:33 AM

I went ahead and sent a message via email to Buka, using the address provided by Nike-it. If I'm lucky, I'll get some kind of contact information for the dev team from Aperion. If not, at least I might be able to convince someone to look into releasing the Reloaded expansion outside of the Russian Federation.

And yes, you are correct. In theory, I don't see any problem "borrowing" certain features from the Reloaded expansion to be used in a public community mod for the original 7.62 game. Some might argue about ownership rights issues, but as a developer myself I would have to disagree.

If the Reloaded expansion had been released to additional markets, then it could be considered a problem because using features from that expansion in a mod for the original game might mean people purchase less copies of the expansion in order to use the mods. But in this case, where the expansion is not available to most of the gaming market, using features from that expansion will have zero negative effects on sales.

In fact, once gamers try out some of the features in such a mod, their interest in the expansion might be increased even further. This means that if/when the expansion is finally released to the US/UK market, the number of prospective buyers will have increased therefore increasing their profit potential. It's a Win-Win for everyone.

I had read a post somewhere else on the internet that some of the community over at the Strategy First forums were already doing a public community translation of the Reloaded expansion, and were 2/3 done with it at the time of that post. But I can't seem to access the Strategy First forums, so it's impossible to find any further information out on that subject.

If you follow through with adding the maps from the Reloaded expansion into your mod, it could go one of two ways. Either nobody will say anything about it and you'll be free to continue using those features until someone says otherwise, or you'll be contacted by someone with ownership rights asking you to cease using their content.

If the second option does happen, at least you'll then have direct contact with someone immediately associated with the ownership rights and will therefore be able to request direct permission to use the content.

The only reason I can see anyone denying permission is if they do in fact plan to release a US/UK version of the expansion.

Good luck, hopefully my computer will be up and running again in time to see the additions myself. I'm looking forward to it, keep up the great work.

R@S

07-02-2010, 08:55 AM

Yeah, your computer should be up and running by the time the next version is realeased. I think it'll take a month or two before it's ready. I only have one vacation week this month, but if I use my time wisely I'll get a lot done that week.

I already have 5 maps from Reloaded ready to be implemented, I was playing around with them a while back and now I only have to add them to the global map, create some character places and script the missions to go along. I think that Tang and the Blue Sun faction will be the quest giver for most of those mission. I might also re-arrange some of the Bobling missions, the book of Koans and the 12 pages will prolly moved to another character and will not be campaign sensetive. Those were my first ones and not very fun, if moved they won't be important and it'll make it less boring.

Chortles

07-02-2010, 12:27 PM

I'm glad that the fix did the job, and for the non-rendered weapons I think a simple "delete all files in the RenderedItems folder" should fix that. That is if you dint already do that, and I just moved the problem with my "fix"Yeah, seems that deleting all files in the RenderedItems got the weapons to show up in the editor now, thanks for that. :) Yup, it should've been moved into the AZP archive when the patch was run. And i made it as simple as I could with the fix, that's why those files are outside. But for the next release they'll be packed in the BSM.AZP archive.Sounds good to me, I was just wondering considering that now I have a BMP folder that only holds the fixes.Once the new skill system has been tested and approved, I'll release a new version of the mod, including all the fixes as well. I've had some time to play it and found that some of the weapon attachments should appear earlier in the game, and I seem to have forgotten to add the new EOTech to the shops.I have several questions about items thusfar...

Is "the new EOTech" something besides the EOTech Holosight 552? I noticed that it does not have the bright red reticle in its 3D model, while the "EOTech Collimator" does... either way though, the Aimpoint Collimator Desert at this time rules them all and I wouldn't use any other atop my "WR" gun. :P

Possible balance issue -- why is the UMP40 higher damage (45-76) and higher accuracy (38) than the UMP45 (13-68, Acc 36)? Also wondering where you're getting your damage numbers on some of the Short-Barreled Rifles (SBR), i.e. the SCAR-L CQB having higher damage than the HK416 10.5-inch despite them having almost identical barrel length.

Also, Is the HK416 10-inch w/ Foregrip supposed to be a fixed-stock weapon? *Also finds it amusing... though odd... that by default it comes with a C-Mag* Mainly wondering since it seems to be one of the only shortie-M4s in 5.56x45, and some of the claimed damage numbers are confusing-seeming. (Can you tell I have a thing for SBRs yet? ;) )

From what the "Diagram" explanation of weapon ballistics shows me, there's no benefit to sticking magnifying optics (i.e. the ACOG) onto short-barreled weapons? I see that the apparent accuracy for hipfire and snapshots goes down, while the "using optic" accuracy is always just below the "standard" line (I assume meaning 'maximum theoretical accuracy'). In contrast, the laser increases hipfire accuracy -- though why not snapshot? -- and a "reflex"/"red dot"/"collimator" sight increases snapshot accuracy, though I don't see anything that affects 'aimed' accuracy...

R@S

07-02-2010, 04:25 PM

Yeah, seems that deleting all files in the RenderedItems got the weapons to show up in the editor now, thanks for that. :)Sounds good to me, I was just wondering considering that now I have a BMP folder that only holds the fixes.I have several questions about items thusfar...Phew, that's a load off my chest, very glad the fix seems to do its jod:)

Is "the new EOTech" something besides the EOTech Holosight 552? I noticed that it does not have the bright red reticle in its 3D model, while the "EOTech Collimator" does... either way though, the Aimpoint Collimator Desert at this time rules them all and I wouldn't use any other atop my "WR" gun. :PThe EOTech Holosight 552 is the new one, the other one if from the BE5 mod Immortal Bada$$

Possible balance issue -- why is the UMP40 higher damage (45-76) and higher accuracy (38) than the UMP45 (13-68, Acc 36)? Also wondering where you're getting your damage numbers on some of the Short-Barreled Rifles (SBR), i.e. the SCAR-L CQB having higher damage than the HK416 10.5-inch despite them having almost identical barrel length.Damage is based on what ammo you're using, but one has to consider penetration ability and a lot of other factors. But since I'm no expert on the subject there must be a lot of those weird inconsistencies in the mod.

Also, Is the HK416 10-inch w/ Foregrip supposed to be a fixed-stock weapon? *Also finds it amusing... though odd... that by default it comes with a C-Mag* Mainly wondering since it seems to be one of the only shortie-M4s in 5.56x45, and some of the claimed damage numbers are confusing-seeming. (Can you tell I have a thing for SBRs yet? ;) )HK416/HK417 also comes from Immortal Bada$$, and they come with no folding stock. I guess it was the weapon limit that made it that way.

From what the "Diagram" explanation of weapon ballistics shows me, there's no benefit to sticking magnifying optics (i.e. the ACOG) onto short-barreled weapons? I see that the apparent accuracy for hipfire and snapshots goes down, while the "using optic" accuracy is always just below the "standard" line (I assume meaning 'maximum theoretical accuracy'). In contrast, the laser increases hipfire accuracy -- though why not snapshot? -- and a "reflex"/"red dot"/"collimator" sight increases snapshot accuracy, though I don't see anything that affects 'aimed' accuracy...It's a very complex system, and the diagram doesn't always show you the true values. I'm not sure I can answer this question so I better shut up:)

Chortles

07-02-2010, 09:52 PM

Damage is based on what ammo you're using, but one has to consider penetration ability and a lot of other factors. But since I'm no expert on the subject there must be a lot of those weird inconsistencies in the mod.From what I read and seen, there's quite a few inconsistencies in the displayed damage ranges given when mousing over an unloaded weapon.HK416/HK417 also comes from Immortal Bada$$, and they come with no folding stock. I guess it was the weapon limit that made it that way.Strange, but okay. Wonder if that can be fixed? Because here (http://cdn1.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/hk416_new_mag_01-tfb.jpg)'s its new look lately, with a 'new' H&K polymer magazine for the AR-15 magazine well (http://cdn1.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/hk416_new_mag_04-tfb.jpg).

Incidentally, here (http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/09/21/dsei-09-new-design-hk416-sub-carbine/)'s the only known photos of a special HK416 variant with G3/MP5-style collapsible stock (as opposed to the M4-type stock), a longer flash hider and a 9.3 inch barrel; no word on what's become of it, as H&K has never acknowledged its existence.

Last SBR linking... for now: Colt (http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2010/01/19/colt-scw-carbine-coming-to-civilians/) Sub-Compact Weapon (http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/01/16/colt-sub-compact-weapon-scw-photos/) with 10.3 inch barrel. (The buttplate folds upward into the rest of the stock.) :-P
It's a very complex system, and the diagram doesn't always show you the true values. I'm not sure I can answer this question so I better shut up:)Nevertheless, it's curious to see that none of the aiming devices seem to affect aimed fire, only hipfire (lasers), snapshot (red dot/collimator/reflex), or adding "using optic" (magnifying riflescopes).

R@S

07-03-2010, 09:11 AM

I can't do anything about the stocks for the HK416/417, their models are mode with the stocks as is and can't be replaced.

I would take the stats of the weapons with a grain of salt, you need to use them in battle to get a sense of their true potential. The stats and diagrams are based on a few ini settings, while in battle there are more than those ini settings used. For instance, the Optics doesn't really show you the increased range and accuracy of the weapon, and it doesn't really check what ammo is used in that combination. So use the weapon in battle and you'll get a better sense of how good it actually is. And then there's the whole "Familiarity" thingy you get once you have used a weapon a bit. That is also not shown in the weapon stats but shows in the little things, like how quick you raise, aim and reload it. It's a very complex system and the more you play the better you'll get at finding weapons that suits your gaming style.

Chortles

07-03-2010, 11:47 AM

I can't do anything about the stocks for the HK416/417, their models are mode with the stocks as is and can't be replaced.Fair enough, regarding their stocks... for now. :grin:I would take the stats of the weapons with a grain of salt, you need to use them in battle to get a sense of their true potential. The stats and diagrams are based on a few ini settings, while in battle there are more than those ini settings used. For instance, the Optics doesn't really show you the increased range and accuracy of the weapon, and it doesn't really check what ammo is used in that combination. So use the weapon in battle and you'll get a better sense of how good it actually is. And then there's the whole "Familiarity" thingy you get once you have used a weapon a bit. That is also not shown in the weapon stats but shows in the little things, like how quick you raise, aim and reload it. It's a very complex system and the more you play the better you'll get at finding weapons that suits your gaming style.I actually was not aware of the Familiarity thing, thank you for explaining that! I still feel that the stated numbers are inconsistent, but hopefully I'll find the in-game weapons more consistent in practice. As it is, I'm still trying to figure out the difference between "Shooting" and "Gunfighting"... (The optics discussion also tied into my internal debate over where to allocate points under the current system, instead of your planned class system.)

The last time I played a game like this was JA2 v1.13, where unfortunately it eventually became the case that "7.62x51mm battle rifles on semiauto with 7x scopes are king." :P Well, okay, from what I've heard about Afghanistan that may be realistic... but still. :-P Much commendation to you over this mod still.

beepbeep

07-03-2010, 02:48 PM

After getting fed-up with vanilla because of the Mafioso brother shoot-out I decided to install the BFX mod. Great, right?

Sadly, wrong.

I do a clean install of the game and then try to install the 1.06 patch. Instead I immediately get a message that the MSVCR71.dll is missing. But I HAVE the latest vcredist installed...

Ignoring that problem I then install the mod and run the game.

After I set-up my character the game then crashes after a few seconds of showing the splash screen, with the usual "the game did something bad..." window, but with no explanation for the crash.

And if I try to mark the entire folder as not read only the game CTDs even before going into main menu...

HELP!!!!

EDIT: I have the newest vcredist (2010) and the newest .NET (3.5 SP1) installed. I'm THIS close to deleting the Blue Suns rar file permanently off my computer and just playing the vanilla version.

EDIT EDIT: my vanilla game's version is 1.11 build 286

beepbeep

07-03-2010, 04:01 PM

Okay, fixed it! :)

All I had to do was google MSVCR71.dll, download it off the first site I found and then install it into C:/Windows/System32.

Then I just ran patchme.bat, installed the mod and the game runs! :)

Thanks R@S for amazing work on this mod!

R@S

07-03-2010, 06:42 PM

The last time I played a game like this was JA2 v1.13, where unfortunately it eventually became the case that "7.62x51mm battle rifles on semiauto with 7x scopes are king." :P Well, okay, from what I've heard about Afghanistan that may be realistic... but still. :-P Much commendation to you over this mod still.There are some very powerful weapons in the mod using the .50 BMG and .338 Lapua, but I've tried to level them out a bit by giving them long prepare and aiming times. I haven't tested them that much and they still might be too powerful, will check that next time I'm on high CGL's and the enemies are well equipped.

There are some tactics that makes the game too easy sometimes and I find myself constantly trying different tactics to make the game a little more challenging. I get an adrenalin rush when I succeed with a daring rush up to an enemy and hip-shooting him to death:D In those situations the AI is stupid, they usually start making some movement that costs them too much time, like crouching or standing up.

When fighting in cites the AI uses a tactic where they bunch up around a corner, then 2 of them rush out a few yards. When they do that another enemy usually quick turns out from behind the same corner and shoots at you. That's the one you should kill first, preferably by aim-at-point before he appears(then your shot will only take 0.05 sec), then throw a quick aimed burst at the other ones. I've had situations where I've killed 4 enemies with my one guy when they tried that tactic, but it's a sweet feeling when they fail:)

Ninja2dan

07-04-2010, 03:35 PM

Regarding the weapons, it's nice to see a good assortment of firearms and accessories, but you want to be careful of what you add. I prefer to see weapons that are actually in use, not rare or prototype weapons (like the gyrojet). That also means taking precaution on the use of uncommon or experimental calibers.

From how I remember the game based on the original version and earlier BFX mod, there weren't many locations where the high-powered marksman rifles would come into serious use. The cityscape locations only have a few long-ranged open lanes, and as you mentioned elsewhere the enemy has a tendency to jump behind walls or around corners, making precision shots with those weapons very difficult. And on the random-encounter maps, few had long open lanes due to the foliage or terrain. Even my M24 was not used too often, mostly just for initiating contact or picking off guards along the top walls of a prison.

But I haven't seen any of the Reloaded maps, maybe some of them include more open and distant lanes that would allow clean shots with the Barret and similar rifles. But it's still not a bad idea to include them, just in case. If the player feels he can't position himself in good firing positions, he can opt for a "smaller" rifle such as the M24 or a tricked out G3/PSG-1/MSG-90.

And I know what you mean about tactics needing to be shuffled at times. When I played the original game through I used the same tactic in the towns nearly every time. I would spawn in at the location closest to the hospital, and make a mad rush for the rooftops. Half of my team would take one side, the other half of the team the other side. Each team would have a marksman for those long-range shots, an assaulter to watch the ladder, and a grenadier packed with frags to toss over.

I would put everyone in the prone, one watching the stairs while the other two were near the edge closest to the streets. Then I'd kneel with one of the marksmen, pick off the best enemy I could, and then prone again. If they tried coming up the ladder, BANG! And when I heard them all rushing around underneath me I'd just start lobbing frags at the contact spots.

When the majority were dead from grenades, I'd start peeking over the edge and picking off the survivors. Near the end, I'd usually get a few that refused to climb the ladders or come out from behind corners/walls. If necessary, I'd send a man or two down to clean up, then it was loot time.

After a while this routine got boring, so I tried other methods. I would sometimes rush everyone into a one-door room, place everyone in line like a firing squad, and open up on the enemy as they tried to make entry. Various tactics worked, others didn't. But the maps themselves were what ruined it for me, there's only so many tactics you can use on the same maps before your brain starts to rot.

So what's the deal with the Reloaded maps. What kind of locations are they? Are they new towns, random encounters, etc? How are they added to the master map already in place? Any chance of throwing up some screenshots of a few new locations?

I'm also curious how the new weapon limit is working out. What is the new "max" for weapons/items? Is there anyone still actively making new weapons or capable of doing so if requested? Have you thought of adding new items yet?

If you need any assistance with weapons, equipment, etc then I'd be happy to help. I'm a weapons expert, and I'm currently a military advisor for another PC game. I could assist in item descriptions, realistic data for weapon systems, reference materials, and other aspects that could be useful. If you need any help, feel free to ask.

beepbeep

07-04-2010, 05:06 PM

What's this 7.62 Reloaded that's been mentioned a few times, but never properly explained? An official expansion perhaps?

R@S

07-04-2010, 05:06 PM

beepbeep

07-04-2010, 05:15 PM

This looks great!

Btw., what 7.62 Reloaded? An official expansion pack?

Also, is it just my imagination or did you really remove the only Zastava weapon that was in the game?

If you manage I'd be really grateful if you would at one point include some Yugoslavian weapons, like the M76, M70B1 and the M70AB2 (it was the gun I was assigned when serving my tour in our country's military and it's also supposed to be much better than the Kalašnikov),...

R@S

07-04-2010, 05:29 PM

7.62 Reloaded is a stand-alone sequel to 7.62. There are some differences though, it's linnear and only have a handful of new items.

It's your imagination, the Zastava is still in the game;) Try the cop trader, Campesino special trader, or the trader in Ciudad-de-Oro. They should carry it as will the rebel depot traders.

If I had the models for any of those Yugo weapons I would add them, that's how it is:)

beepbeep

07-04-2010, 06:04 PM

7.62 Reloaded is a stand-alone sequel to 7.62. There are some differences though, it's linnear and only have a handful of new items.

Thanks for the explanation.

It's your imagination, the Zastava is still in the game;) Try the cop trader, Campesino special trader, or the trader in Ciudad-de-Oro. They should carry it as will the rebel depot traders.

That's great news. Even though I didn't enjoy myself back, nowaday I tend to look back at them with fondness. Maybe I'm just weird...

If I had the models for any of those Yugo weapons I would add them, that's how it is:)

Models? Like what (I've never done any modeling for games before)? You mean photos on which to base that weapon and data for it?

That's easily fixed:

------------------------

Zastava M70AB2 (with a light metal folding stock, the ones with fixed wooded stock are M70B1):

Calibre: 7,62 x 39 mm
Fully loaded and ready weight: 4110 g
Capacity: 30 bullets per cartridge
Length: 960 mm
Length of barrel: 415 mm
Muzzle velocity: 725 m/s
Maximum range: 6000 m
Effective range: 400 m
Speed of fire: 650 bullets/min.

Among other differences from the AK it's that with an adapter that comes with every rifle you can fire off Tromblons (Tromblon mines).

Tromblon:
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y88/nothernug/02grenadelauncherM60M59-66andM70.jpg

M70AB2:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d7/Zastava_M70AB2_with_folded_stock_Hunter_la5.JPG/800px-Zastava_M70AB2_with_folded_stock_Hunter_la5.JPG

http://hr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datoteka:Zastava_M-70_.jpg

Some info
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zastava_M70B
http://www.oocities.com/dswahilly/AP_M70.htm

------------------------

RT-20 (Rucni top 20 mm - Hand Cannon 20mm) Anti-material sniper rifle
-

Caliber: 20x110mm Hispano
Operation: manual operated, bolt action
Barrel: 920 mm
Weight: 19.2 kg with scope and bipod
Length: 1330 mm
Feed Mechanism: single shot, manual loading
Maximum effective range: about 1800 meters
http://world.guns.ru/sniper/sn56-e.htm

http://world.guns.ru/sniper/rt-20.jpg

http://world.guns.ru/sniper/rt20_1.jpg

cartridge size comparision: .50 BMG (top) and the 20x110mm Hispano (below)

http://world.guns.ru/sniper/20hs404.jpg

------------------------

ZASTAVA M-76 sniper rifle:
http://world.guns.ru/sniper/sn65-e.htm

Calibers: 7.92x57 Mauser; also 7.62x51mm NATO and 7.62x54R
Operation: semiautomatic, gas operated, rotating bolt
Barrel: 550 mm
Weight - rifle with scope: 4.2 kg
Weight - empty cartridge: 0.23 kg
Length of rifle: 1135 mm
Length of barrel: 550 mm
Muzzle velocity of bullet: 730 m/s
Feed Mechanism: 10 rounds detachable box magazine
Max pressure of gunpowder gases: 3200 bar

http://world.guns.ru/sniper/m76-1.jpg

-----------------------------

ANOTHER INTERESTING YUGOSLAVIAN SNIPER RIFLE

Zastava M93 Crna strela (Black arrow) .50 calibre sniper rifle

Caliber: .50BMG (12.7x99mm); also available in 12.7x108mm
Operation: manual bolt action, rotating bolt
Barrel: 1000 mm
Weight: 16 kg
Length: 1670 mm
Feed Mechanism: 5 rounds detachable box magazine
http://world.guns.ru/sniper/sn59-e.htm

http://world.guns.ru/sniper/black-arrow1.jpg

http://world.guns.ru/sniper/black-arrow2.jpg

Ninja2dan

07-04-2010, 06:30 PM

The realism vs game balance is a tricky one, and I tend to lean towards balance. Since I'm modding this game to increase the fun, not add a lot of micro-management that hinders the flow of the game, I almost always sides with balance. I could've added stuff like not being allowed to carry guns in cities, but that would mean that you'd have to leave your weapon in the car or on the ground everytime you enter a city. Or not being allowed to talk to character while you have a weapon in hand, being forced to shoulder it. A lot of time spent on pointless actions that disrupts the fun, just for the sake of realism. If I learn how to make those settings controlled by an INI file, then I'll consider adding them. But for now I'm not good enough and have so many other things to do, it'll have to wait.

I think that having to sling arms or conceal weapons would be going a little too far even it that option was possible. There are holsters in the game already that accept a pistol and keep it "concealed", which would be more than sufficient for that purpose. But if your character is on a mission where he is packing an M249 or SVD, he's going to be using that weapon shortly after entering the town. So needing to conceal the weapons like that would be pointless really, since you're about to start slinging lead all over the place.

And having to shoulder a long arm while talking to someone is also not needed. Just because someone has a rifle in their hands doesn't mean they are holding it in an "aggressive" manner that might upset or intimidate the person they are speaking with. So don't worry about that kind of detail, you're fine without adjusting it.

I've heard the argument that some weapons are only prototypes and has no place in Algeira countless times, and IMHO that argument is flawed. Where does it say that this game takes place now and not a couple of years in the future when prototypes might have been produced in larger numbers? Having said that, I do agree that the gyrojets has no place in the game, but my argument is that they are so bad and no fun, they're a waste of space. That's why they've been removed from this mod. But other prototypes, like the Jackhammer and such, are fun to use and I'll leave them in the mod no matter what. You'd have to pry them from my cold dead hands;)

I haven't really seen too many weapons in the earlier versions that I did play that would have been considered "prototypes", but the Gyrojet was a perfect example. What I mean is firearms or equipment that never was, is, or ever will be used as an actual production weapon system (or at least outside of the special-order market). The Pancor/Anderson "Jackhammer" is questionable, because I am pretty sure the USAS-12 was also in game already. The Jackhammer was a cool design, but never made it into production and never will. The benefits it offers is a 10-round drum, fully-automatic capability, and bullpup design for "compact" size over other shotguns. But the USAS-12 is also select-fire capable, and has both 10-round magazines and even 20-round drums. I've fired the USAS-12 many times in real life, and it's one hell of a nice weapon. Still, my point is that the Jackhammer is not really something that I would consider worth removing, but I would hope that nothing is used that is way off the realism scale.

That isn't just regarding "prototype" designs, but also the use of regular-looking firearms using oddball calibers. For example, there shouldn't be any .454 Casull firearms in game because it's a very uncommon caliber. You sure as hell won't be seeing ammunition in some 3rd-world country, and even in places like the US those rounds are quite rare.

Not that one has been added yet, but stuff like a 9mm AK-47 is another example of something that should never be added, no matter how "cool" it looks.

The new weapon limit is 4096, the mod has 400 variation of weapons, both modifed and folded ones included in that number. For the time being I have no 3d guy, but hopefully another capable guy will came along and help out. And I can always ast the HLA team if I can borrow their new additions, they've never turned down any of my requests. What a great bunch, eh:D

The game that I'm a DEV for is a mod for BF2 called "Project Reality". We have a whole team of model and texture artists, coders, etc and have already been using a lot of custom-made items. I wonder if any of our models could be ported over to the 7.62 system easily, in case we have something on our end that isn't already in game yet. If it's possible, I'm sure I could get permissions from the rest of the team.

Off-hand there aren't really many weapons that I can think of suggesting for future addition. Although I wouldn't mind hearing what else the HLA team has made lately. Mostly I was thinking about weapon accessories, uniform (character model) changes, and personal equipment. Those new maps bring a lot of new ideas to mind.

I had a guy working on realistic weapon characteristics, but he's been working on that for more than 6 months and never seemed to get anywhere. So I got tired of waiting and made a few adjustments myself, and I'm by no means an expert, or interested in it. So if you have time I'd be grateful for anything you could offer in that department. It's the WEAPONINFO file that needs to be altered, and if you need help I'll gladly explain what all the entries are for and what they do when altered.

Trying to get the weapon data in game accurate shouldn't take that much effort. If it is that difficult, then you really don't need to make everything 100% accurate to their real-life counterparts. The overall idea is to just make them "as realistic as possible within reason". You don't need muzzle velocities to match precisely, but you obviously want an M16A2 to be shooting hotter than a M1911A1.

Since I'm not a coding guru myself, I don't think I'd have much help to offer in that aspect. And it sounds like it takes a bit of coding and some serious testing to get things working right. I'd probably mess things up more than fix it, especially if your other guy was working on it for 6 months and still made no progress.

Then there's the ITEMINFO debacle, I was in such a hurry and had so little spare time, some of them are incomplete. Some better explanations and descriptions would be great, but I think that's too much work for just one guy.

Now that does sound like something I could manage. It'll be a bit before I could actually get to work on it, I'd need my PC repaired and the game running again so I can preview an item in-game while writing the description to make sure it all looks acceptable.

I'd just need to know if there are any character limitations, restrictions on certain character types (no symbols, etc), and how "detailed" you want the descriptions to be. Noob terms or Soldier terms basically.

Here's 6 maps from Reloaded that I've added, they're mostly walled off bases, some have a bit of forrested surroundings . Then there's 4 new Random Encounter maps, 2 of which is open space ones and the other 2 is winding passages. I dint bother making screenshots of them, gotta leave some things to your imagination.

All I can say is "Wow". Seeing those images, it looks like they are of the exact same quality, matching the maps from the original game. That's great because they will blend in perfectly without looking like some modified content.

The military-style design to several of those new maps is cool, and can lead to a lot of new scripting/quest ideas. The terrain is nicely mixed, and looks to be well laid out and designed to look like a real location. The Aerodrome looks beautiful!

About the map you have labeled as "Tutorial", I'm assuming that it was used as part of the tutorial in Reloaded. I'm curious, are any of those targets reactive, or are they just stationary objects? Most likely just stationary, but I can dream.

This looks great!

Btw., what 7.62 Reloaded? An official expansion pack?

Also, is it just my imagination or did you really remove the only Zastava weapon that was in the game?

If you manage I'd be really grateful if you would at one point include some Yugoslavian weapons, like the M76, M70B1 and the M70AB2 (it was the gun I was assigned when serving my tour in our country's military and it's also supposed to be much better than the Kalašnikov),...

Yes, 7.62 Reloaded is an "official" expansion pack, but unfortunately it was only released in the Russian Federation and is only available in Russian language. There were a few people working on translating it, but the location that those posts were (SF forums) is currently dead/closed.

And which "Zastava" weapons are you talking about? I can't really remember there being any in the game. All of their weapons were just clones of other weapon systems. The M76 was a modified clone of the SVD. The M70 series were just AK-47 clones. The M84 was cloned after the PK series. Why have the original weapon systems and then add duplicate copies with the only difference in game being the item name?

I have personally fired nearly every Zastava firearm in production as well as their "parent" firearm that they were cloned after. And from personal experience, they performed no better or worse. That was just a false rumor started by people from Yugoslavia, simply because it was "their firearm". Just like Americans claim that American cars are best, or Japanese claim that their electronics are best. People will almost always prefer a product made in their home country, and claim it as being better out of pride. Nothing against anyone from those countries, Yugoslavian firearms were not of poor quality. But I just never saw anything that would say they were better either.

R@S

07-04-2010, 07:48 PM

@beepbeep
Sorry, I should have said 3d models for the game. I saw 2 weapons there that already has similar models in the game, and by copying their models and adding their ini entries, they could be added. But I'm not in the right place to add new weapons right now, too busy with scripting.

@Ninja2dan
I think your 3d models can be ported over to 7.62, but one needs to use 3dsm 5, it's the only version the act exporter works with. Since I only have 3dsm 9 I couldn't do it myself, but I'm sure I know someone that has version 5 that could help with the exporting. I know for a fact that one can do a similar thing with weapons from STALKER, and those weapon models are of a very high quality.

To alter the weapon characteristics isn't that hard, it's just a matter of ini editing a few values. If you know what those values do, it wont take that long to complete. The difficult thing is find a balance between the weapons, and since the maps isn't that large one needs to respect the range limits to keep the different types weapons apart, from pistols all the way up to anti-material guns. And testing that is what takes much time.

The tutorial map, not sure what you mean there. The shots will show on it, the decals are there. But if you mean they fall when shot, I think not. The map meshes for the maps are a bit rigid in that respect, something the devs changed in Capitulum and Man of Prey.

I've gotten some help lately with creating new uniforms, there might be a new line of them in the upcoming release. I think I'll leave them faction neutral, but if work progresses with the Blue Sun Quests I might consider adding them to that faction.

There are 2 new weapons in the latest HLA I'd like to add, the Magpul Masada and the old German MP40 Submachine-gun. I think I'll ask them about it tomorrow.

Ninja2dan

07-04-2010, 08:49 PM

I'm not sure what weapons, if any, you'd find of use from the game I work with. The majority of the weapons are all custom made by our staff, replacing the original weapons from the "vanilla" game. They are of pretty high quality in their core file, being "down-graded" during export to meet the poly requirements of the game.

All of the weapons are current military issue, with the exception of a few weapons used by the Insurgent faction. We have quite a few factions in game as well, so the weapon list is pretty large. But a lot of those weapons might not even be desired in a game such as 7.62, such as the RPG or AT-4. But if you're looking for military weapon systems, and it's not in BSM already, just let me know and I'll see if I can get the models for you. You mentioned you're a bit busy now, so there's no hurry on it.

As for the weapon data, that was actually part of my concern. The ranges used in the game are not extended enough to make full use of the larger-caliber weapon systems such as the Barret. I'd have to find a large open area to do the ballistics testing to try and get everything matched up properly, and I'd need some instructions on how to actually create a "copy" installation that will allow easy and rapid access to the testing location. Something to think about in the future, but I think I'll look at the other areas first.

And yeah, that was what I meant in regards to my question about the Tutorial map. I was wondering if they had somehow added the ability for the targets to be reactive, meaning the "fell down" when hit. I had strong doubts that it was possible, but figured I'd ask just in case. Oh well.

I'm curious, how "easy" is it to actually create new missions/quests? How well do they tie together, such as having multiple-outcome scenarios that string along like a tree? Is it basically just creating a storyboard, writing out each mission, and then creating some sort of script that ties them together?

Is there a limit to the number of overall missions used in the mod? Are there any other limitations or complex problems that interfere with creating new missions? Things such as max enemy/civilian characters per mission/map. I know there isn't a map editor, but is there any way to add objects to a map, such as a backpack that must be located and picked up? Or can this only be done by looting from bodies?

I'm asking a lot of questions because I'm hoping to help come up with some new ideas that will expand the mod further while we wait for a new version to be released (if ever). I really like this game, probably my #1 on the list, so I'd like to help keep it alive if at all possible. I've done a lot of game development in the past, so I'm sure I can come up with some useful stuff. I just need to have a better understanding of the game engine and its limitations/capabilities. You're kickin ass, but this is too much work for one or two people to handle alone.

Edit: I also forgot to ask, do various objects/materials have different damage/penetration values? Such as doors being made of wood having different penetration values than doors made of steel? And do the various projectiles per caliber have different penetration values? If so, I'd have to conduct additional testing during the ballistics modification to ensure their penetration values were in line as well.

R@S

07-04-2010, 09:24 PM

As for the weapon data, that was actually part of my concern. The ranges used in the game are not extended enough to make full use of the larger-caliber weapon systems such as the Barret. I'd have to find a large open area to do the ballistics testing to try and get everything matched up properly, and I'd need some instructions on how to actually create a "copy" installation that will allow easy and rapid access to the testing location. Something to think about in the future, but I think I'll look at the other areas first.I've made this clever little character called a map guide, when talking to him he'll transport me to any map I like. I could easily add a few enemies on any map to easy your testing. It would be a matter of starting a new game, talk to himand he'll get you directly to the action. In combination with the shop cheat this would make it all too easy:D

Once I've found a suitable file host, and some spare bandwidth, I'll upload the Reloaded maps, fix the guide map encounters and send you the link. Just let me know when your computer is up and running.

I'm curious, how "easy" is it to actually create new missions/quests? How well do they tie together, such as having multiple-outcome scenarios that string along like a tree? Is it basically just creating a storyboard, writing out each mission, and then creating some sort of script that ties them together?Sure, if you have a little knowledge of programming C/C++ it isn't very difficult. I had most problems with the Object relations, but once I figured out how that worked it all became very easy. I just check the vanilla missions to see what functions are available and the copy them to fit my story. But I had a lot of help from Deadhead when I first started, and I really tested his patience I think:grin:

Is there a limit to the number of overall missions used in the mod? Are there any other limitations or complex problems that interfere with creating new missions? Things such as max enemy/civilian characters per mission/map. I know there isn't a map editor, but is there any way to add objects to a map, such as a backpack that must be located and picked up? Or can this only be done by looting from bodiesThere isn't any limit to how many missions the game can handle, at least not that I know of. And having a lot of civies or enemies on one map just causes a lot of lagging, so I've never tested to see if there was an upper limit there either.

Adding items to a map is simple, I think the function is "call AddSectorItem" nnd then you specify which map, map place and item. Easy piecy:) The exact syntax can be found in one of the random missions, nr 7 if memory serves.

I'd be more than willing to help you get started on scripting, I know from experience that it's much easier when you have someone to rely on for tricky things.

I also have some good news, I just got the source code for the outsourced mod and am looking at it right now. It appears that externalizing stuff to inis is much easier than I thought and I'm going to incorporate it into the BSM source to make them compatible again. What a sweet thing. A million thanks to guineapig for his generosity.

EDIT: I forgot about the materials and penetration. There's a file in the ini folder(AZP archive) called PHYSMATERIALS where you can alter the material properties. In the AMMOINFO file there are several entries used to calculate the bullet properties, such as penetration, tumbling, probability of shattering on impact and several others.

Ninja2dan

07-05-2010, 07:52 AM

Sounds good. It might take another month or so before my computer is fixed, depending on what is actually wrong with it. I have done all of the testing I can do myself, but without secondary components I can't test anything else. I'll be taking it in for a diagnostic tomorrow and will know for sure what part is fried. I'm guessing it's the video card, and I can't remember if it's still under warranty or not. If it is, the RMA will take about a week. If not, it won't be until next month before I can afford a replacement.

Once my computer is running smoothly again and I have the latest mod version installed, I'll go ahead and start asking for guidance on learning the scripting system and which files need looked at. I haven't done game scripting in over 6 years, and even then I was a fill-in instead of a full-time coder. But I'll give it my best shot, learning the system will help get new features added quicker and easier.

It's good to hear that there are actually different data files to determine values of materials and ammunition. Without destructible environments, having some capability of shooting through walls does come in handy. But I'm guessing that the AI is not capable of such a tactic, shooting through walls at your mercs when they hear you moving around?

What is the "Outsourced Mod" that you mentioned? What does it do?

R@S

07-05-2010, 09:15 AM

The Oursourced Config mod is a little thing that externalizes some settings, like starting money, merc salaries and random encouter settings. It also adds the ability to change the random missions available at the bartenders and traders. These can be considered a cheat if used the wrong way, but it also has a few other functions, like the collateral damage setting and the convoy mission fix where the AI solders on your side wont go hostile if you throw a nade in their vicinity.

Check the \INI\outsourcedconfig.ini file for more info.

Chortles

07-06-2010, 09:22 AM

There are 2 new weapons in the latest HLA I'd like to add, the Magpul MasadaWhich version are you thinking of? The Magpul-exclusive prototype, the Remington/Bushmaster Adaptive Combat Rifle (ACR; Bushmaster for civvie, Remington for military version), or what The Firearm Blog (http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2010/06/30/bushmaster-enhanced-acr-now-shipping/) called "The-ACR-As-Magpul-Intended-It-To-Be"? :P

R@S

07-06-2010, 01:29 PM

I dunno, but here's what it looks like:
Magpul Masada
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/7606/magpul1.jpg (http://img441.imageshack.us/i/magpul1.jpg/)
http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/927/magpul2.jpg (http://img708.imageshack.us/i/magpul2.jpg/)

I've added a banker in Puerto Viejo. I started by using the one from ECOmod but ended up re-writing most of it. Let me tell you, I had some serious problems trying to figure out how to calculate the interest rate on the account. I left the loaning system pretty much intact, but I plan to alter it since it wasn't really complete in the ECOmod. Guinneapig said he was going to add some debt collectors but never got that far in his work. I think I'll do it, maybe add some Repo men to steal the player's car if the repayment is overdue, not just start fighting with the player. That'll be a great incentive for honoring your debts and paying your bills on time:)

For now the banker uses the same place as the ECOmod one, but I plan to make a mission for him. I haven't decided if I'll put him in Puerto Viejo or the player base, I want him to be accessible whatever faction the player works for.

Since the new class system is almost complete, it's time to start thinking about the global AI and the capturing of cities. Since I first must add the Reloaded maps so that I don't have to do that after it's complete, I'll wait a bit until they're uploaded and I have a few willing testers. In the meantime I'll be working on improving the outsourced mod and I hope people will share what they would like to see in this next project. How should it work? What should militia cost? Should there be several levels of militia, like in JA2?

Ninja2dan

07-06-2010, 02:40 PM

At what phase of the game, or CGL, does the player begin having militia available? If it's fairly early on, I think I'd like to see several "levels" of militia available. Something that allows you to pay a fee to upgrade them, with the max level depending on current CGL. The higher the militia level, the better equipment they are likely to have. And, if possible, the higher-level militia will also get a little better skill?

As for cost, I really don't know. It's been so long since I played the game last time, and I don't even really remember ever having used the militia for anything. They basically just sat at my base, which was never even attacked. Their fee should be equal to their quality and function though. If they make it a lot easier for the player to survive a battle, then they should be priced accordingly. Remember that the easier a battle, the less ammo is used, and the more loot can be picked up. So the easier the battle, the more profits.

With your suggestion about vehicle repo, what happens to any equipment in the trunk?

R@S

07-06-2010, 04:10 PM

The equipment will be lost. But since the HLA guys made a user function that can store the ecuipment, I might be able to provide it later, if the player pays his debt.

As the banking system works now, if the player defaults on his loan, the bank account and all the money the player has will be set to 0, even if the player actually has the money to pay it back.

The militia, recruit, regular and elite, will have different stats depending on their level, if that's the way we'll go. And they'll have better equipment to, and all this will reflect in their cost. Maybe also add the possiblity to send them to capture towns, it's how the current system works. But it's still only in my head, and I'm not sure where this'll lead, that's why I'm asking for input.

Ninja2dan

07-06-2010, 10:54 PM

In the vanilla game I did try capturing towns on my own, but nearly every time I would lose the town just minutes after I left it. And it didn't matter if I was working towards the Government side or the Rebels side, the towns would always revert back to someone else's ownership.

I'm wondering if you guys have been able to successfully capture and hold a town after leaving it, without having to place militia there. And what benefit does capturing a town actually have? This isn't Command & Conquer, towns don't provide additional income or resources, so I don't know what the purpose even is.

Knowing that about the banking system, I can't see myself ever using it. Knowing that even if I had $2m in cash, if I for some reason forgot to pay towards a loan for only $150k, I'd actually lose the full 2m instead. Not worth the risk. But what about people that owe $100k, and only have $25k in cash? If the loan defaults, they'll lose the $25k but their debt will be cleared back to $0?

The same goes for the auto repo. The player could have over $1m worth of items in the trunk, but if they are late on the payment they not only lose their car but also the entire stockpile of items inside it. Those just seem like overly-harsh punishments for being late on a payment for what ever reason.

I think I'd rather see something that is a form of punishment, but more along the lines of an annoyance and reminder to get their payment made. The idea of random encounters from "The Muscle" would work well for this. But instead of sending a group of well-armed thugs after the player's group, how about a larger force with low-tech weapons? This way the player can't exploit the encounters as a means to stockpile on weapons and ammo. Using more enemy will in theory overwhelm the player's group, and even if the player survives with minimal injuries the annoyance of these frequent battles might get them motivated to pay their bill. What do you think?

Chortles

07-07-2010, 06:48 AM

R@S, your "Magpul Masada" actually makes me think of the Remington ACR (supposed military/LE version of what was the Masada, while Bushmaster is responsible for the horrendously overpriced civilian ACR), but with "MOAR RAILZ." :D I see the collapsible/side-folding stock and the side/bottom rails, and it looks like you're using the 10.5" barrel; only critique is that the 12 o'clock rail isn't full-length. So long as it's not a "redundant" gun with only aesthetic difference (I've already slotted it into the "rails-accessorized close-quarters carbine" role in my head), cool by me.

Please note that "levels of gear" are already accounted for with existing generic NPCs; just take a look at "BS_Soldier.inv" for example in the editor, where you have several different equipment sets across and within CGLs.

I should note though as a JA2 player, one rather "unbalancing" thing about v1.13 is that because your local support (and thus mine income) doesn't drop when you stall, there's no impetus or urgency in going aggressive against the Queen's holdings. Once I take Drassen's airport sector and the mine sector, I then proceed to hunker down for weeks on end to train militia and my mercs, the latter usually by importing mercs to act as trainers for high-LDR/high-WIS mercs who can then act as training cadres (both for other mercs and for militia). Eventually the outcome will outstrip my expenses, especially if I can get away with letting contracts expire on the higher-priced mercs; then take Alma (whose "gun range" sector gives a bonus to Marksmanship training to mercs training the skill there), and eventually it just grows to the point where I can afford the "luxury" of using Skyrider's $100-per-sector helicopter service as a regular ferry.

R@S, I'd still like to be able to do this in BSM, but just keep this anecdote in mind when designing the militia. (I should note that even with high LDR and the Extended Ear headset, the JA2 v1.13 militia AI was extremely inconsistent with following orders.)

I have to admit that I'm not a fan of the class system simply because of "forced specializing" but I'd be willing to try out whatever version you've got at the moment. At one point I had my Cameron carrying a suppressed SR-25, a M4 Super 90 (M1014), an M1A (or M14 "proper" variant), and a full-auto AR, mainly using "Aimed" mode, which should tell you something about where I'm coming from on this and what my preference is. (Though I recognize that the vanilla game does "force specialization" by its point allocation method of customizing each merc, on top of their basic traits.)

R@S

07-07-2010, 08:56 AM

If you don't wanna play with the class system, I've added a turn on/off function in the outsourcedconfig.ini file. I'll do this for anything new I add that might be in conflict with realism.

I know that there are many people that dislikes anything that isn't based on realism, but most of the criticism I've gotten is from people that has never actually tried it, only read about the changes on a forum. A long time ago I made some changes on grenade damage and got a lot of flak for it, but once people had actually played a little with the new setting the criticism ceased. The lesson here is, never complain about something without having at least given it a shot:D (this isn't aimed at you Chortles, you just left the door open for me to get this off my chest:))

When talking about the 3 levels of player guards, I was mostly meaning their attributes. But I will give them different gear, the recruits will have cheap stuff while the elites will have the expensive imported stuff.

The economy will be a big task to delve into, and I agree with you regarding JA2, I tend to do the same as you there. Luckily there are a lot of factors that will be part of it, and with a lot of work we might get it to work. There is of course always possible to trick any system, and since there's an "Easy Money" option in the game, one could easily bypass any system we make.

I had an idea last night before I fell asleep, that always happens to me.

As you might know, if one hires a merc you can tell him to wait for you, and if that place is a "Standard" sector he'll wait until his contract ends. It might be possible to add some dialog options to a waiting merc, like train militia. So if the player wants to train the existing militia, he'll have to recruit a merc for it and leave him in that town. We could then play with the merc salaries to tweak the economic system. I think this will be worth investigating.

QuickDagger

07-08-2010, 01:42 AM

Hey R@S, how are you?!

I´ve been out for a while but, after noticing the down of Strategy First Forums I´ve found this 1C forum. And, it makes me feel happy to know you are still active.

Congratulations for the BSM mod, I´m already playing it and it´s great!

Keep it up!

In 2009 or 2008 I´ve found Van-d-all on Mount & Blade Forums and that´s all from the old guys.

Any news from afp?

I´ll be around.

Cheers!

R@S

07-08-2010, 07:23 AM

Hey Quicky, glad you found this place and that you're enjoying our work. I remember you really investigated some aspects of 7.62 and made some interesting discoveries, do you have any new discoveries for us or are you just enjoying yourself playing?

I saw afp over at the ARMA2 forum, but that was half a year ago, and he was active over at sixthsense back then too, dunno his whereabouts now. But I guess he's up to his old tricks wherever he is:grin:

I still have sporadic contact with some of the old guys, and some of them have found their way here since SFI went down.

Laterz

beepbeep

07-08-2010, 03:08 PM

And which "Zastava" weapons are you talking about? I can't really remember there being any in the game. All of their weapons were just clones of other weapon systems. The M76 was a modified clone of the SVD. The M70 series were just AK-47 clones. The M84 was cloned after the PK series. Why have the original weapon systems and then add duplicate copies with the only difference in game being the item name?

So, in your words the game should have only one handgun, only one SMG, only one shotgun, only one assault rifle, only one sniper rifle and only one MG, because IN YOUR WORDS they're all copies of each other and they're so similar to each other that it's not worth having diversity, guns of different makers.

If you feel that way about variants of the AK-47 I am curious what you think about the variants of the M-16 that are in this game and about the fact that there ARE multiple variants of the AK already in the game... Do you find them superfluous also? After all, the M4 is only a shortened M16, not to mention the Colt AR-15.

Why then does the vanilla game already, not to mention this mod, have so many weapons that are practically a copy of each other with only small variants? Why the mini UZI and micro UZI when there's already the regular UZI? Why AN-94 when there's already AK-47 and AK-74? Why RPK when there's already RPD? Why all the SKS copies? Why all the handguns that are so similar to each other and yet very few people actually keep using them after they get their hands on rifles and SMGs?

I'm sorry, but your argument is null and void, defeated by the game and the mod themselves.

I have personally fired nearly every Zastava firearm in production as well as their "parent" firearm that they were cloned after. And from personal experience, they performed no better or worse. That was just a false rumor started by people from Yugoslavia, simply because it was "their firearm". Just like Americans claim that American cars are best, or Japanese claim that their electronics are best. People will almost always prefer a product made in their home country, and claim it as being better out of pride. Nothing against anyone from those countries, Yugoslavian firearms were not of poor quality. But I just never saw anything that would say they were better either.

PLEASE tell me you're just making a joke. Cause that would be the dumbest thing to EVER say.

I'm no weapons expert, BUT even I know that not only do weapons vary from one version to the next, but also individual weapons vary between each other. no weapon is exactly the same as the next...

Hell, even Jane's agree with that... a couple of decades ago they had a huge test, comparing the Kalashnikov to it's copies, variants, improved copies,... You know which were the two best? Zastava and the original AK-47.

Which means other AK copies were worse than these two, which means that AK copies not all are the same.

If you actually ever used all those AK copies you claim, you definitely wouldn't go around claiming all are the same, unless you're a total US patriot, with a flag pole in your front yard and your every second sentence would be "American stuff is the best and everything else is crap". Many US soldiers rather used the AKs they took from captured or dead enemies in Nam than use the M16, if they were allowed/able to.

My country's armament was a mix of Yugoslavian, Eastern European, Asian, Russian, etc. weapons (now we have that Belgian shit that breaks in the cold and the jams have to be fixed in an armory by a trained armorer; instead of easily in the field by the soldier himself as it was with Zastavas). In my own fireteam we had guns of different makers. I personally had a Zastava M70AB2 made in 1989, a couple of my mates had Romanian copies of AK, one's was newer than mine. We naturally compared our guns.

The difference between them was huge. Not only was the build quality of my gun better (like comparing a Mercedes to a Polski FIAT, everything was better from the metal to the furniture), it was more accurate, more powerful and more reliable.

To sum it up: no, AK and it's copies are not all the same and, YES, Yugoslavians DID have the right to claim our "AKs" were better than those of other countries.

Ninja2dan

07-08-2010, 04:05 PM

First, I never said all "variants" were the same, nor do they perform the same. Aspects of a firearm such as barrel length, weight, lining, muzzle brake style, fittings, method of attachment, rifling twist, and even age/use can cause variants of the same style to differ in performance. Stocks, grips, mode of fire, and every functional component can also cause variances in performance data. What I'm talking about is when a weapon is a nearly 100% identical copy of another other than the name. Where every little part is interchangeable with the other. Where upon inspection, with markings removed, one person could not tell the difference between the two, then I really don't see the point in having them.

You are trying to compare an M4 with an M16, or an AK-47 with an AK-74? Those are completely different weapon systems, with different calibers, barrel lengths, or other major functional differences. There are no simple cosmetic differences between them.

If someone were to lead me to a table covered in different AK-47's, all fresh from the factory with identical handling and identical number of rounds put through them, but just made by a different factory, then nearly 99% of them will fire the same. Sure, different factories will have different tolerances that lead them to produce items that are slightly better or worse than the other, but their overall performance difference is going to be so slight that the average shooter will not be able to tell. I'm talking very minimal MOA changes, doesn't matter if it was made in Russia, China, Yugoslavia, or wherever.

You mention that Jane's made some comment, but you failed to note their conditions of the testing. How many rounds were fired from each weapon before their test? What type and level of maintenance had been performed on each weapon prior to the test? What type(s) of ammunition were they using in each weapon during the tests? All of those things can have performance differences on a firearm, and in order form a proper baseline you need to ensure that all weapons start with the exact same tolerances, and the test is done with the same ammunition from the same lot. Any variance in those standards will foul the results.

Yes, some weapons that I have used performed better than others of the same family. But never have I seen a weapon within the same tolerances that did so at a drastic level. Again, there might have been very minor differences in ballistics data, but soldiers aren't going to be picky about a weapon just because one of them is .5 MOA more accurate (excluding marksman weapons).

Having used AK's from all over the world, made by various manufacturers and with various levels of use/maintenance, I personally will stand by my point that the M70 series weapons I fired had no drastic performance differences over any of the others of equal tolerance. Note that I say "Equal Tolerance". I will not say that the Zastava rifles performed any more or less equal, because from my experience they performed at the same level as the other models.

I also never said that US-made weapons were any better than others. Personally, I tend to prefer H&K pistols over any other. Same with their SMG's. But different manufacturers produce different weapons with different features, and because of this I will often choose a weapon system based on the specific mission requirements. I might go with an M4, maybe I'll go with a G36, it all depends on the actual mission at hand. For me, country of origin means nothing. Specific features of a firearm and the reputation behind the manufacturer are my primary deciding factors.

I'm not going to turn this topic into an argument about which firearms are better, or which manufacturer is better, or which country is better. I know my level of experience and time handling the weapons, so I'm comfortable making statements based on my own opinions. If you want to shout out about how wonderful your country's rifles are, fine with me. I don't have to agree with you about it, you're free to make your own comments based on opinion. R@S is the one creating this mod, so he has final say in what goes and what stays. And since we are both "equals" in his eyes as players of the mod, he'll make his own decisions on which opinions to base his decisions on. If he adds copies, that's his choice.

beepbeep

07-08-2010, 04:27 PM

I'm definitely not trying to start an argument, I was just trying to explain why I believe your argument doesn't hold water, at times using the technique of over-exaggerating-to-bring-inconsistencies-to-light to help with the task.

The point of it was: if there are so many variants of one and the same weapon system in the game even though the differences are minimal (the perfect example being the G36), if the developers had THEMSELVES put the Zastava LK M59/66 carbine into the game even though the game already has it's "parent" rifle, the Simonov SKS; then putting the Zastava M70AB2 definitely has merit and would not be stupid nor superfluous, especially since the M70 is actually an IMPROVED AK-47... It's NOT a mindless, plain clone. Same goes for other models, the M-76 sniper rifle, the Black Arrow,...

Yet get what I'm trying to say?

Ninja2dan

07-08-2010, 05:49 PM

Personally, I see no functional difference between a Russian SKS and a Yugo M59/66, other than the grenade launching system. I personally owned a Yugo model while a friend owned a Chinese model. The two were nearly identical other than the above-mentioned launching system and a few cosmetic differences. I even used components from his rifle inside my own rifle out of curiosity, and it worked flawlessly.

So what point is there in having both a Russian SKS and Yugo SKS in a game? If the grenade launcher works, then that's your answer. If it doesn't work, then the answer is "None".

The developers were far from being firearms experts, and probably not even one of them was a prior-service military soldier. They probably wouldn't know the difference between an AK-47 and AK-74 without having to read spec sheets a dozen times over. So just because those guys decided to add in multiple "copies" of the same firearm doesn't mean that R@S or any mod maker should do the same. R@S has a chance to avoid the same mistakes the original developers made. Maybe the developers even used different ballistics data to distinguish the two weapons, when in reality that would have been false. Again, R@S and the others have been using more accurate ballistics data.

So in the example of the SKS, my opinion is to either add the Yugo M59/66 OR the Simonov SKS, not both. It doesn't matter which one you add, hell it could be Chinese, Romanian, Albanian, Yugoslavian, what ever. Just choose one and use it, dump the rest.

In note to the M70AB2, there is quite a bit of difference between those and the AK-47. It would more closely relate to the AKS-47/AKMS, which like the M70AB2 have an under-folding stock and stamped receiver. Of course the M70AB2 also has the grenade system, but other than that their functional differences are minimal.

I can see having various models of the AK family, with different barrel lengths, stock types, calibers, etc. But why have two weapons that look the same, feel the same, shoot the same, share the same parts, have 98% identical ballistics performance, and have the same functions/capabilities? So again, my opinion is to pick ONE model of each variant, I don't care what the origin, and lose the rest. If it gives you a chubby to see an M70AB2 in the game instead of an AKS-47/AKMS, then I have no problem with that. I just don't want to see both.

It's the same reason I don't want to see a Colt AR-15, DPMS AR-15, Bushmaster AR-15, Armalite AR-15, etc all in the game at the same time when they are all equipped with the exact same features. If they all have the same caliber, barrel length, stock type, furniture, etc then the name doesn't mean shit. Pick one, and only one, and leave the rest out. They're the same damn rifle, with their only difference being the name engraved on the side of the receiver.

You get what I'm trying to say?

beepbeep

07-08-2010, 08:05 PM

It would really bother you so badly if there was one extra gun in the inventory? :confused: It's not as if someone would be holding a gun to your head, forcing you to have to use it... :???:

Chortles

07-08-2010, 08:26 PM

If you don't wanna play with the class system, I've added a turn on/off function in the outsourcedconfig.ini file. I'll do this for anything new I add that might be in conflict with realism.Thanks for confirming that part of the mod is optional. :)When talking about the 3 levels of player guards, I was mostly meaning their attributes. But I will give them different gear, the recruits will have cheap stuff while the elites will have the expensive imported stuff.Will you be doing this through text-editing the INI files, or something more complex? For example, I've already been able to artificially increase Cameron's attributes (i.e. Hearing, Experience, Reaction), but not his adjustable skills' minimums (despite changing in the .ini file they're still a minimum of 30 in-game).

Also, is there any issue if I edit the character's starting inventory, but then it's full when I receive my luggage, or if there's not enough room for all of the luggage? I don't know if the result is randomized, but I did the "starting inventory quest chain," had my pockets, arms, and belt emptied before receiving the luggage, and I was given a UMP40 with loaded magazine, two empty magazines, a pair of 50-round boxes of .40 S&W, and a Hiking Backpack.The economy will be a big task to delve into, and I agree with you regarding JA2, I tend to do the same as you there. Luckily there are a lot of factors that will be part of it, and with a lot of work we might get it to work. There is of course always possible to trick any system, and since there's an "Easy Money" option in the game, one could easily bypass any system we make.I fully intend to do so. :D It's not to say that the JA2 system is bad, but rather that it does have much more leeway. In general I would create a high-LDR/WIS merc from I.M.P. (paying a flat $3000 fee), but who crucially will never need to be paid, and from there he and Ira (my first "indigenous merc" who doesn't need to be paid) can act as my training cadre... something that I'm not sure is viable in vanilla JA2. (I admit to 'tweaking' the config files to make Dynamo and Shank actually viable as anything...)

R@S

07-08-2010, 08:54 PM

Will you be doing this through text-editing the INI files, or something more complex? For example, I've already been able to artificially increase Cameron's attributes (i.e. Hearing, Experience, Reaction), but not his adjustable skills' minimums (despite changing in the .ini file they're still a minimum of 30 in-game).Yeah, when creating the new player guards I'll create new ini files for them and setting them accordingly. There is a random option to make some variations in those inis, so they likely have small differences even if they are the same type.

The skills for the presets(player) are hard coded and you can't change them through their ini files. The parameters on the other hand aren't and you can change them freely.

Also, is there any issue if I edit the character's starting inventory, but then it's full when I receive my luggage, or if there's not enough room for all of the luggage? I don't know if the result is randomized, but I did the "starting inventory quest chain," had my pockets, arms, and belt emptied before receiving the luggage, and I was given a UMP40 with loaded magazine, two empty magazines, a pair of 50-round boxes of .40 S&W, and a Hiking Backpack.The game engine will recognize a full inventory and will place the given objects on the ground if that happens, no need to worry about inventory space in those situations.

I've made some preset inventories that will be given depending on player class, there is no random element involved.

I fully intend to do so. :D It's not to say that the JA2 system is bad, but rather that it does have much more leeway. In general I would create a high-LDR/WIS merc from I.M.P. (paying a flat $3000 fee), but who crucially will never need to be paid, and from there he and Ira (my first "indigenous merc" who doesn't need to be paid) can act as my training cadre... something that I'm not sure is viable in vanilla JA2. (I admit to 'tweaking' the config files to make Dynamo and Shank actually viable as anything...)I have the ability to make a similar setting in this project, making mercs with high leadership and intelligence train the militia faster, and maybe also a little cheaper. I would have to adjust the merc salaries oc, and maybe some other stuff to make it balanced. But as I said before, this game offers a lot of variables to tweak the economics. It'll require a lot of testing, I hope you feel up for that:P

Chortles

07-08-2010, 11:10 PM

Yeah, when creating the new player guards I'll create new ini files for them and setting them accordingly. There is a random option to make some variations in those inis, so they likely have small differences even if they are the same type.You mean through the Variants option already in the Editor, or using the Probability option? (i.e. setting percentage chance that that item will appear when that variant is used.) That's cool, but I never did understand what Templates meant compared to the Variants.The skills for the presets(player) are hard coded and you can't change them through their ini files. The parameters on the other hand aren't and you can change them freely.The thing is, I don't understand why said skills would be listed (without any line break) then... seems a waste of space in the INI file. I'm guessing that this is not the case for the NPCs and recruitable mercs though?

Also, I'm looking at the ITEMINFO (where weapons' display names and Info are kept... but what's "a SUM rifle"?), WEAPONINFO and WEAPONINFO_ALT (can't tell which is entirely yours, though I see that they have different weapon stats), but how much of the weapon attributes are editable by text editor? For example, I'm guessing that I can change the HK416's default magazine to a standard "M16" magazine instead of a "C-Mag (M16)," as well as allow a MP5A5 RIS to accept "Weaver Rail" (should be called Picatinny) optics?...

Personally, I think a great solution to the "redundancy" or "incorrect stats!" dilemma would be if the INIs can be tweaked enough that we can excise or restat weapons. :DThe game engine will recognize a full inventory and will place the given objects on the ground if that happens, no need to worry about inventory space in those situations.Great, glad to hear.I've made some preset inventories that will be given depending on player class, there is no random element involved.Considering that you're not using the class system as default yet (though for that preset inventories makes sense), what's the case right now when not using classes?I have the ability to make a similar setting in this project, making mercs with high leadership and intelligence train the militia faster, and maybe also a little cheaper. I would have to adjust the merc salaries oc, and maybe some other stuff to make it balanced. But as I said before, this game offers a lot of variables to tweak the economics. It'll require a lot of testing, I hope you feel up for that:PHey, I'm already checking out and 'playtesting' your mod, though mainly the weapons. :P

**

I can sympathize with Ninjadan, as besides redundancy, "too many guns" results in screen clutter -- in JA2's "Bobby Ray's" (the in-game online store) using v1.13, last I played that mod, the first four pages of the Assault Rifles section were all Kalashnikov variants. :evil: On the other hand, I feel that R@S has already done at least a decent job of avoiding this in many cases while leaving plenty of visual variety for people that say, might want a MP7A1 over a TMP. There do seem to be limitations though, such as the vertical foregrips being treated as "separate weapons with non-removable bipods" due to the game engine, or the HK416 variants being fixed-stock weapons due to being imported from HLA.

I do feel though that at least according to the Editor stats, some of the weapon variants don't seem different enough... or rather, that you have stuff like "same inventory size, slightly faster Ready Time, but much worse Accuracy" for certain carbines... or situations like how the M4A1 becomes a "4-square" weapon when its stock is collapsed, yet it's a 5-square weapon when the stock is extended, even though the barrel is 5.5 inches shorter than the full-length M16's either way. (By the way, the "M16A1 late" is actually the M16A2 visually.) I noticed a similar issue with the shorter HK416 variants and the G36C/G36KE... except that the G36C and G36KE both become 3-square when folded.

I do have to find it oddly amusing though that if I fold the stock, I can fit a suppressed SMG or the HK53 into a guy's Ammo Pouch, but not a HK416 CQB... oddly amusing, considering that they're all collapsible-stock "subcompact" carbines, aka "subcarbines," or "short-barreled rifles" (SBRs); heck, I'm surprised that suppressors don't affect weapon size! (In JA2 you could suppress a MP7A1 while it was in the Machine Pistol Holster, but once removed it could no longer be put back in unless you removed the suppressor or had a larger container.)

safoolfool

07-09-2010, 01:09 AM

Also, I'm looking at the ITEMINFO (where weapons' display names and Info are kept... but what's "a SUM rifle"?), WEAPONINFO and WEAPONINFO_ALT (can't tell which is entirely yours, though I see that they have different weapon stats), but how much of the weapon attributes are editable by text editor? For example, I'm guessing that I can change the HK416's default magazine to a standard "M16" magazine instead of a "C-Mag (M16)," as well as allow a MP5A5 RIS to accept "Weaver Rail" (should be called Picatinny) optics?...

First of all, as far as I know, SUM stands for a Stephan Uribe modified (or something).

As for the iteminfo question, as far as I can see if you open up an entry (say G36) you'll find this:
ATT Laser 1 "Rifle Laser"
ATT Light 1 "Rifle Light"
ATT Scope 3 "G36 sight""G36E sight""HK G36 Scope"
ATT Bipod 1 "G36_bipod" blocks Bayonet and ILauncher
ATT Silencer 1 "Supressor - 5,56" blocks Bayonet
ATT ILauncher 2 "M203""M203PI" blocks Bayonet and Bipod
ATT Bayonet 1 "StdBayonet" blocks ILauncher and Silencer
ATT Magazine 1 "G36 mag"

Some things seem to be listed in groups (e.g. this lists only 1 type of magazine, but the g36 can take double mags and cmags, as well as (I think) reduced size ones (e.g. 20 instead of 30, but I'm not sure if there are g36 20s)). If you wanted it to take WR sights, I think you'd add "WR" in the scopes list. So the new scopes line would be:
ATT Scope 4 "G36 sight""G36E sight""HK G36 Scope""WR"
or, if you only wanted WR sights, it'd be
ATT Scope 1 "WR"
Additionally, it looks like you could delete the "blocks" part of those lines to allow you to have a bipod, suppressor, launcher, and bayonet all at once.
I don't see why you couldn't add in the m16 magazines to the ATT Magazine line, but I have no idea what would happen if you tried letting it use magazines of a different caliber (e.g. enable .458 socom magazines on the g36). It might work fine, and calculate damage as if it was a 5.56, but since I think damage is based on bullets, and not the gun firing them (not sure though, since different guns of the same caliber have different damage ranges on their in-game info pages).
I'm not sure what the number before the list of what you can attach means, but it seems to always be exactly the same as the number of things listed (e.g. g36 takes one magazine family, the number is 1; it takes 3 scopes, the number is 3; 2 launchers, the number is 2 etc.)
For changing the store default attachments and magazines, I think you go to the line
StdPlug "Rifle ammo clip (G36/30)"
and change the thing in quotes to whatever you want.

What I'd love to know about iteminfo, is how range is calculated. It seems to be based off of 3 numbers, max, effective, and curve. I think max is where the "standard" curve on the in-game info page touches 0, but effective I'm not sure. I'd assume it's the halfway mark (range where hit probability is 50%), but I don't think it always is. I know that the higher the range curvature, the faster range drops off. For example, the AS VAL has an 11 curvature, and its accuracy goes from something like 100% at 0m, 75% at 75m (so not much dropoff), then drops really fast, to the point where the hit probability is like 10% at 87.5 meters. On the other hand, guns with low curvatures, like 1, seem to drop linearly, or even experience (slow) exponential decay when less than 1. I'd guess it's using some function that varies by three parameters (max, effective, and curve) but I wish I knew what it actually was.

For now, I'm gonna go test letting a g36 use WR sights, and stop the blocking, and try a Beretta that accepts socom mags.

Edit: so I got the g36 to both use WR sights and take everything on it at once (despite the fact that the bayonet is shorter than the silencer, maybe you can use it as a polearm, instead of a spear? Putting socom magazines in the Beretta also worked fine (and looked hilarious, since it puts the magazine in the same place as a pistol mag, but its bigger than the grip, so it looked like a barrel and trigger sticking out of a box mag). I'm not sure if it was actually doing .458 damage though. Shooting an unarmored merc in the chest with both a .458 and a 9mm from the Beretta did the same damage (in HP and bleeding), but so did having a guy with an HK chambered naturally in .458 shooting at one of my guys. I did notice that everyone I shot with the .458 got their chest to show up red (as in a special injury, like when you're immobilized in the legs) and none of the 9mm guys got that injured. From that it makes me think that a Beretta loaded with a socom mag actually was doing socom damage, which is also pretty funny. I think the problem might be that I'm playing with critical hits on the player off. I just tried shooting an unarmored merc in the chest with the KS23's car-stopping round, which did the same damage (15 to health, ~45 bleeding). I guess "no criticals" just caps the amount of damage you can take from any one shot. I though criticals were like in other games, where you'd have a random variation in damage, so sometimes you do triple damage (to simulate hitting something important). Maybe in this game damage doesn't vary that randomly, and its just 0-5 damage = slightly hit, 5-10 = hit, 10-15 = heavily hit, 15+ = critically hit (or something). This really makes me rethink turning it off. I'm fine with not having criticals if they mean that luck becomes a huge factor (i.e. it's annoying to lose a merc because some asshole happened

As for effective range: I tried also editing the Beretta's effective range to 100m (from 41) while leaving curve at 6 and max at 150. The numbers I got for the "standard" hit curve in the info screen were: 87.5% @ 50m, 75% @ 85m, 50% @ 92m, 25% @ 100m. So effective range is definitely not the 50% mark.
When I then changed it by keeping effective at 100 and curve at 6, but made max 300, I got 87.5% @ 38m, 75% @ 60m, 50% @ 90m, 25% at 105m. So increasing max range actually made the guns less accurate at almost all ranges, up to about 100m, which doesn't really make any sense to me.

R@S

07-09-2010, 07:23 AM

First off, the reason there are so many types of weapons that have very similar stats is to make the looting more fun. The more weapons you add to the game, the more variations in enemy load-outs there will be and you can create factions with a specific weapon suopplyer wihout them all carrying the same weapons. How would you like it if after an encounter all you would find was 18 AK-74's and 2 RPK's? It would make the game pretty boring after a while, at least I think so. One can of course set the percentage chance of a weapon turing up in a shop to prevent the cluttering of the screen, having some weapons only have a 10% chance. In my experience that woul mean running around trying to find a trader that sells the weapon I want. I made a compromise in the BSM and gave all the weapons a 50% chance, it reduces the clutter and there's still no need to run around too much.

I read somewhere that damage is calculated with a formula that also takes the distance to the target. This means that if you shoot someone at point blank range their damage would be bigger than if you shot them from a distance. Then there's the various settings in the AMMOINFO file that are added to the formula, like caliber, tumbling and whatnot. The more you play around whith these figures, the more you'll realize what a impressive and complex system it is.

Take the 5.56x45 and the.458 as an example. If you gave a weapon with the same stats the ability to fire both these rounds, you'd find that the range of the 5.56 round is far greater. This is becase the calculations for them includes their weight, and other attibutes. And since the .458 weighs more it also decreses the accuracy, range and several other things. Do as Safoolfool, play around with it a bit and you'll get a better idea of what I'm trying to say:)

And yes, SUM stands for Stefan Uribe Modified, him being the weapon smitty from BE5 that I added to 7.62 for sentimental reasons;)

Chortles

07-09-2010, 07:47 AM

I'd love it if you could somehow create a gun range "area"/"mission" to let us hop straight to the in-game "live fire" ballistics testing. :D

R@S

07-09-2010, 08:01 AM

I'll prolly add that when the testing of the new global AI and the new reloaded maps starts. If you help with that you'll be given a chance to do your testing. I'll add a map guide that will send you directly to selected map and as the testing progresses I'll add enemies as well. It's my usual progress, just ask the testers of the ARM project:)

Chortles

07-09-2010, 09:15 AM

What could I do on that front? (Yes, I consider this "hop in on the closed beta." ;) )

I don't know if you've ever heard of Op7, but that game (free-to-play+microtransactions online FPS) has a Preview function for weapons and (primary weapon) attachments you're checking out; when you click the Preview button, your character is sent to a basement shooting range with three stalls (differing in distance to the target), armed with the chosen weapons and attachments... something like that'd be great for playtesting the in-game ballistics. I've actually just made my own first "adjustment" -- made the M1911A1 able to support a suppressor (for simplicity's sake the .45 USP Tactical's) along with a laser or flashlight... unfortunately, those are appearing on the front of the pistol grip, instead of under the barrel.

R@S

07-09-2010, 09:40 AM

I've actually just made my own first "adjustment" -- made the M1911A1 able to support a suppressor (for simplicity's sake the .45 USP Tactical's) along with a laser or flashlight... unfortunately, those are appearing on the front of the pistol grip, instead of under the barrel.This is where the \GameDir\Actors\Items\*.ACT.INF files come into play. By adjusting the values for the attachments you'll be able to move them into their right place. It's the last 3 numbers you should alter, the control Front/Back, Up/Down and Left/right. But that might vary depending on how the model was created, the only ne that is always the same is the Up/down one, the 2 others might switch places but it's easy to figure that out with a little testing.

Never played any games online, I have too slow Internet connection speed. But I did think about adding such a feature as trying before buying, but since one can alway test all the weapons by cheating it would be too much work for something already easily done.

Now I'm off to work, laterz:)

Chortles

07-09-2010, 10:23 AM

So it has nothing to do with, say, the order in which I add the attachment slot to ITEMBONES? That should be nice, except for one problem... there isn't an Items subfolder in the Actors directory post-patch! All that's there is the "Monsters" subfolder... unless I botched the unofficial patch+BSM installation?? :confused:

Regarding my experimenting methodology thusfar: In general my "attachment/gear" tinkering mainly involves the inventory editor and Notepad, but if I need a "live fire" test, I tend to just start up a game and go straight towards the Weird Looking Hooker to take that quest -- since BSM's disabled the vanilla game's starting ambush (I guess because of your lack of starting gear), it's the quickest way I can get a relatively "open air" firefight going.

R@S

07-09-2010, 05:40 PM

Use the AZP.EXE in the mod kit to extract the ACT files. I'm sure i've posted the link to it here somewhere, but to make it easy, here it is again:
7.62 - Mod-kit and Source Code (http://rapidshare.com/files/244885999/Mod-kit_source.rar)

The files you're looking for should be in the Patch_1_12.azp archive.

If you wanna ease the testing, open up the console and write enter_dev_mode, hit enter then write shop then enter, and you'll get to the cheater shop. Once you've chosen your gear, exit the shop and shoot the nearest cop/guard and go nut:)

Kyle

07-10-2010, 01:49 AM

Ever since I started playtesting the Class System mod, my time's so tight that I stopped visiting this thread--a big mistake on my part!

The Reloaded maps look AMAZING. I got a pit in my gut every time I saw a new screenshot. Those look like some pretty intimidating regions to fight in.

In regards to having a million variants of a weapon system, all I'll state is this: when I playtested for the Super Mod Pack for the original STALKER, there were literally DOZENS of AK variants, most of which had very similar performance characteristics.

My play experience with them (and of MANY others, even those slavishly and rightfully devoted to the AK) was one of mainly annoyance. Don't get me wrong, I'm open to having like 7 variants of each of the different calibers in-game, but if it comes down to choice, let's pick the ones that are the MOST different from one another, otherwise, what's the point?

I LOVE the idea of repo men! A new faction to the game, so to speak and sensible. Very cool.

Chortles

07-10-2010, 04:31 AM

I saw no AZP.EXE in the modkit folder or "E1P" (whatever that is, I guess the to-date released source code)... I've also had "MFC71.DLL missing" pop up when I try to run the INI and Shop editors, but I've read on Yahoo! Answers that apparently the DLL is malware or at least a tracker...I use Total Commander for that search function since it's possible to add a plugin that allows browsing inside AZP archives. You can find it here:
Total Commander (http://www.ghisler.com/)Unfortunately, the use thereof... the only source I've found for how to successfully use it is here (http://forum.taktikzone.de/index.php?topic=1343.msg18128#msg18128), and the link to the preconfigured plugins there is down.

I've actually been trying out the "dev mode shop," but so far I've only been getting into fights with either the Hooligans or the Wino's Brothers... still, so far, it's given me the chance to playtest some gear, as well as some ideas... one good thing about this "dev mode" is that I can use it to clear out/move magazines, for example, to get rid of the empty magazine that all of the firearms come with (which adds on time), or to get rid of the stuff in my character's starting inventory so that I can right-away playtest starting particular items (i.e. a machine pistol and different-sized magazines for it, or time taken to add a suppressor); unfortunately, I eventually had a CTD when removing a body.

Unfortunately, even on Easy difficulty, I've had a few instances where the Hooligans or Wino's Brothers (particularly the latter) would stun/KO (by draining the purple bar) my character and then beat him to death.. heck, one time it was a mortally-wounded attacker. :rolleyes:

EDIT: Can the repo men be optional too? ;D

R@S

07-10-2010, 07:56 AM

I'll try to upload a mod kit that includes the azp.exe later and I think the mod-kit you already have included the Far plugin, which is the one used by Total commander. If you follow the instruction in the link you provided you should be able to set it up by yourself.

And it appears the the Yahoo! guys doesn't know much about programming or they would have said that it's part of a library for some code compilers that 3rd party developers use. And the file you're missing is located in one of the folders in the mod kit.

I could make the Repo men optional, but then you'd lose all your money instead, your account and what you carry with you. And I'm in no mood to add a cheat that makes it possible to avoid paying your debt and get away with it:D

EDIT:
I checked the mod kit again and I was wrong, it doesn't include the AZP viewer, only the e6 one. I'll include it in the mod kit I'll be uploading once I have collected all the files.

Chortles

07-10-2010, 10:59 AM

Hey, for that cheat I'd just be using the dev shop, or tampering with the outsourcedconfig.INI ;) Or, without modifying files, at least studiously avoid debt as much as possible... *chin rub* Choice is key in what I'm looking for out of BSM, though I so far am generally okay with your choices for defaults and recommendations.

*Hedges his bets anyway by setting aside a hypothetical round for each hypothetical repo man*

Thanks for clearing up the situation regarding the mod kit; I'd have tried the solution at the post I linked, but the link within that to the plugins archive was broken; or rather, whereas it should display an abbreviated URL the link itself was abbreviated. I saw the far plugin, wasn't sure how to use it, considering the post's instructions were for that plugins archive (using the modified files packaged together). I must disagree with you regarding "MFC71.DLL," while I'll take your word that it's safe, it's not in the existing mod kit release, I just looked. Nevertheless, I'm glad to hear that a future release is being worked on and thank you for your continued work on it.

R@S

07-10-2010, 11:19 AM

The mod kit you have must be an older one since I have the 7.62SaveEditor in mine and that includes the MFC71.DLL file.(The Save Editor only works with the Russian version of 7.62)

Here's a link to the latest Unofficial Mod-Kit, including the AZP archiver and instructions on how to set it up with Total Commender, enjoy:)

7.62_Unofficial_Mod_Kit (http://www.mediafire.com/?hwimrntdyiu)

Ninja2dan

07-10-2010, 02:48 PM

R@S, I had a question for you. How well in contact are you with the modding team that is/was creating the weapons that you've been adding to BSM? How active are they now, etc?

One thing that has always bothered me is that the game, even up through the end CGL's, is mostly focused just on small arms, not support weapons.

We have a few UGL's, but rarely did I recall them ever being available, and when you could find the launcher it was days before you found ammo for them. The mines sucked balls, seriously. The enemy was magically gifted at locating mines, making them totally useless. And there were few other heavy weapons such as rockets.

On top of that, my experience when using the UGL's was piss-poor. It didn't matter how much training I gave my soldiers, they never seemed to fire those weapons properly. The UGL's all seemed to fire at extreme velocities, giving them a very unrealistic ballistic trajectory. This means that those 'nades could rarely be "lobbed" onto the target, but were fired at almost a flat trajectory like a regular bullet. Shooting over walls/obstacles, or up onto higher ground was nearly impossible for me.

* Any chance of making the UGL's more common in the game, with ammunition more readily available?

* And do you think those weapon modders would be interested in creating a few "rockets"? As mentioned before, I've got great models of all kinds, would just need someone to convert them for use in BSM. M72, M136, RPG, etc are all available.

* Could someone take a look at the UGL's and do some testing with them, see if there is something wrong with their projectile velocities? You should really be capable of lobbing those things in a nice arc over a good distance, with weapon skill affecting accuracy, not range.

* Is there any way to improve the AP mine system, so mines are actually useful to the player? I don't know how mines are detected, what kind of dice rolls are made, or if certain terrain/objects help conceal them. But as they stand now, mines are 100% useless. The ONLY time I've ever been able to effectively use mines is when I placed those mines inside of an enemy spawn area prior to them spawning in, and getting lucky if one or two of those enemy happen to spawn in on top of one.

One last idea/suggestion, is it possible to create a new weapon like the Claymore AP mine using the same technology as the hand grenades? What I mean is having a small blast radius around the mine, but throwing projectiles (shrapnel/frag) in a dedicated arc in front of the mine. Also limiting the "clacker" use distance, so the operator must be within a certain range of the mine in order to detonate it.

I recall using other "radio-controlled" mines before, that allowed you to charge mines and lock up to 4 of them into one controller, and remote-det them. But it would be nice to see an actual Claymore-style variant, limited to only one mine per clacker.

R@S

07-10-2010, 05:08 PM

R@S, I had a question for you. How well in contact are you with the modding team that is/was creating the weapons that you've been adding to BSM? How active are they now, etc?I talk to them every week or so, they keep me up to date on their developments as I do them. After they release a new version of their addon and the bug fixes are done, they usually take a few weeks off from working on their project. They are still working on the new functions for the code, there are still some issues to iron out with it.

Their best 3d guy, Grey, is very busy with his real life and doesn't have much tome to work on new models. But they get by anyways.

We have a few UGL's, but rarely did I recall them ever being available, and when you could find the launcher it was days before you found ammo for them. I have already started working on making attachments available earlier, and that includes UGL's and nades. In BSM you need to do some missions before you get access to the best shops, the ones that has the awesome stuff before anyone else has it. I'm a firm believer of working for the good stuff, things shouldn't come without an effort.:-P

The mines sucked balls, seriously. The enemy was magically gifted at locating mines, making them totally useless. And there were few other heavy weapons such as rockets.Yeah, the mine issue is a bad one, and I've tried to correct it but think I've failed. I have some success with trip-wires and the random encounter bandits, but when it comes to guards and soldiers they seem to spot them very easily. But Legionnaire=M= did some work on the mine settings a while ago, I'm not sure that was after you stopped playing or not, and I haven't really tested the new settings that much to tell you if they are improved or not.

* Any chance of making the UGL's more common in the game, with ammunition more readily available?See above

* And do you think those weapon modders would be interested in creating a few "rockets"? As mentioned before, I've got great models of all kinds, would just need someone to convert them for use in BSM. M72, M136, RPG, etc are all available.They already have a M72 LAW, RPO-A and an RPG-7b with 11 different grenades to fire. So I'll say they're all set on that department;) I've already added the RPO-A from their game, not sure if asking for the others is worth it.

* Could someone take a look at the UGL's and do some testing with them, see if there is something wrong with their projectile velocities? You should really be capable of lobbing those things in a nice arc over a good distance, with weapon skill affecting accuracy, not range.Not me, I'm to busy, sorry. But I'm sure someone else has time for it.

* Is there any way to improve the AP mine system, so mines are actually useful to the player? I don't know how mines are detected, what kind of dice rolls are made, or if certain terrain/objects help conceal them. But as they stand now, mines are 100% useless. The ONLY time I've ever been able to effectively use mines is when I placed those mines inside of an enemy spawn area prior to them spawning in, and getting lucky if one or two of those enemy happen to spawn in on top of one.See above

One last idea/suggestion, is it possible to create a new weapon like the Claymore AP mine using the same technology as the hand grenades? What I mean is having a small blast radius around the mine, but throwing projectiles (shrapnel/frag) in a dedicated arc in front of the mine. Also limiting the "clacker" use distance, so the operator must be within a certain range of the mine in order to detonate it.

I recall using other "radio-controlled" mines before, that allowed you to charge mines and lock up to 4 of them into one controller, and remote-det them. But it would be nice to see an actual Claymore-style variant, limited to only one mine per clacker.I dunno for sure, the engine differentiates between nades and mines, and only mines has the Rem-det functions. The nades all use a timer and there's no way to change that. The problem with the mines is that they need to be primed and set before the rem-det works, and that means placing it on the ground. Maybe the Russians finds a way around this. If they do I'll add it for sure, I'm dying to have satchel charges in the mod:D

Ninja2dan

07-10-2010, 06:38 PM

I dunno for sure, the engine differentiates between nades and mines, and only mines has the Rem-det functions. The nades all use a timer and there's no way to change that. The problem with the mines is that they need to be primed and set before the rem-det works, and that means placing it on the ground. Maybe the Russians finds a way around this. If they do I'll add it for sure, I'm dying to have satchel charges in the mod:D

The Claymore would also need "primed" before placing it, just like any of the other mines/booby-traps. The difference though between the Claymore and other mines is that it would need to have a directional fragmentation, similar to how grenades currently spew shrapnel, but limited to within a specific arc.

I ask because I have never seen any other game in my lifetime come close to getting grenades to work as they do in 7.62. Most games simply have an invisible frag radius and anything within that radius is "hit" with the shrapnel. If they want a random effect, they simply add coding in to roll the dice. But in this game shrapnel is real, it's actual fragments that are thrown in random directions. The "randomness" is not a roll of the dice, but simply having the character get lucky and not being in the path of the fragments. Obstacles work as they should, no magic death if you were hiding behind a wall.

If someone could figure out how to get that same fragmentation effect to work in just a specific arc, you'd be able to turn that type of blast/frag into AP mines. Weapons like the Claymore would have many great uses in the game, and because they are command-det you don't have to worry about an enemy dodging it because they see it.

But if it's not possible, then oh well. Maybe I can get the devs to add them in during a future release, if I can ever get a hold of them.

The last time I played there were only a couple of rockets available, and ammo was rare. It's good to hear that more are out there now, they have a limited use in this game where destructible environments don't exist but they still have their charm. Of course they should still be more difficult to obtain, but in the later CGL's it would be great to have them available as an option (at a steep cost obviously).

The same goes with the UGL's, I have no problems with them requiring completion of some quests or tasks first and being priced accordingly. But when I last played, even when I had millions in the bank and was rockin the M249's and uber-expensive gadgets, I was still rarely able to find either the launchers or the ammo. I look forward to seeing them around more often, but still hope that someone can look into their mode of operation and see if something can be done to fix their unrealistic ballistics.

R@S

07-10-2010, 06:48 PM

Haven't I told you that I added a Claymore that has a 60 degree dispersal arch, and a MON-50 that has a 54 degree? What I can't do is add the option to throw them once they've been primed and I thought that was the issue here.

And I forgot to saay in my previous post, you can "lob" grenades with the UGL as long as you fire it from-the hip. Then you can adjust the arch while holding the shift button, just as with grenades.

Ninja2dan

07-10-2010, 07:08 PM

No, nobody told me that Claymores and similar AP directional mines had been added. That's what I had been dying to see in the game, and it looks like my request had already been taken care of. Cool deal.

And no, I didn't mean to "throw" the mines in any way. Claymores are treated the same as any other mine: Deployed, Primed, and await detonation or removal. I guess it was just a misunderstanding of my question.

Once I have the game up and running again I'll have to give the UGL's another try. Before I had only been using them in "aimed" mode because I thought that would provide the best accuracy at such ranges. Now that I know they can be lobbed via hip-shot, with a fairly easy-to-see ballistics path, they might be a lot better than I remember. UGL's sound like they are actually effective now.

Damn, now you've really got me drooling over the game again, and it'll be at least another 3-4 weeks before my PC is fixed. If only I could play it on this crapper laptop.

safoolfool

07-11-2010, 04:47 AM

Don't get too excited, I find the hipshooting of UGLs pretty bad. Your merc ends up aiming it at close to 90 degrees, meaning it looks idiotic and takes a while to land. I also find that it's even less accurate than usual (probably because the game is thinking hipshoot means less accurate, instead of treating it as a different mode of firing), which means it's abysmal.

R@S

07-11-2010, 07:30 AM

I also find that it's even less accurate than usual (probably because the game is thinking hipshoot means less accurate, instead of treating it as a different mode of firing), which means it's abysmal.I have a different experience than this, but I make sure the merc using GL's have high HW skill, at least above 50. And I also think the weapon familiarity is useful as well.

LovelyPencils

07-14-2010, 01:06 PM

Hi,

I cannot download from rapidshare, it is blocked by my ISP. Could someone please help?:(
I also believe that the link is dead.

R@S

07-15-2010, 05:10 PM

Sorry about the delayed reply, been terribly busy. Here's the MediaFire link, it's an updated version that includes all fixes I made so far, enjoy:

Blue Sun Mod 1.02 (http://www.mediafire.com/?kgc2ncummim1njy)

Don't forget to install the patch before you install the mod:)

Kyle

07-16-2010, 02:45 AM

How will v. 1.02 interact with the Class Mod beta 6?

If there's no issues with build 6 of the Class Mod, then do I need to start a whole new game, or can I continue on from the last save?

Thanks in advance!
Kyle
July 15, 2010
:grin:

LovelyPencils

07-16-2010, 02:48 AM

Many thanks R@S! :-P

Chortles

07-17-2010, 05:37 PM

Just to check, does BSM v1.02 require that I uninstall-clean install-clean patch-then-apply-BSM, or do I just let it overwrite my existing v1.01 installation? (Ditto for wondering re: the class system v6 beta.)

Part of my wondering is because of ARMA II's "Six Updater Suite," which in contrast pretty much allows automated incremental patching of the ACE mod and of official Bohemia Interactive beta patches.

R@S

07-17-2010, 05:59 PM

The 1.02 version is the same as the 1.01 with the fix #3. Since it includes a few source code fixes a new game is required if you dont have fix #3. The major differences are that the fix files have been packed into the BSM.AZP archive. If you already installed the fix, you should ignore the 1.02 version. A new version will be available in a few weeks/months which will require a new game. I recommend waiting with a clean install until then.

If you have used the Class System v6 it'll be completely compatible, no need to start a new game. You don't even have to install the 1.02 version since everything is included in the Class System files.

Kyle

07-18-2010, 02:48 AM

If you have used the Class System v6 it'll be completely compatible, no need to start a new game. You don't even have to install the 1.02 version since everything is included in the Class System files.

That's very good to know. Thanks for that important piece of info. :)

IceShade

07-18-2010, 07:22 AM

R@S

07-18-2010, 07:32 AM

I'm starting to suspect the the type of ground you put the mines on also plays a part in how "easy" it is for the enemies to spot them. When I put down mines in the random encounter maps thay usually goes off without the enemies seeing them, while when I put it on roads, in cities and similar flat ground they spot them right away.

Since the maps have a camo "bonus" feature on some surfaces for the characters, I think the same goes for the mines. But this should be tested more to see if my suspicion is warranted:)

EDIT:
It would also explain why the Hidden value in the mineinfo file make them work better when set to 0, I think that disables the environment check. They should've added a camo entry in that ini file instead of using a global value for all the mines, that would make fixing it a bit easier.

IceShade

07-19-2010, 05:36 PM

I'm still not convinced. Yesterday, I hid a few things and mines in foilage, off the roads. The first one was triggered, but nothing afterwards. During the fighting, enemies were standing right on top of everything.

With 7.62's stability as is, I had to reload. When I reloaded, at least two more traps triggered. Pretty awkward.

LovelyPencils

07-20-2010, 12:00 PM

Hi R@S,

I did a clean installation, installed the unofficial 1.06 patch following by the BSM 1.02. when I launch the game, it CTD.

Heres what the log shows.

Log started at 18.07.2010 22:49
00:00.000 INFO [0] .\ProjectE6.cpp (410) Application version: 1.11 Build 286
00:00.003 ERROR [0] .\OldPackFile.cpp (99) Package not found: Patch_1_12.azp
00:00.014 WARNING1 [0] .\local.cpp (24) !LocalTextArray[ID]
00:00.015 ERROR [0] .\Parser\TextParser.cpp (683) Error parsing : '' found, int expected
00:00.456 INFO [0] .\Main3dDevice.cpp (37) 3D device created - Ok
00:00.686 INFO [0] .\SoundSystem.cpp (122) Creating and initializing audio system succeeded
00:03.282 INFO [0] .\Fx\effmanager.cpp (190) Creating and initializing audio system...
00:03.903 INFO [0] .\ZApp.cpp (847) Entering main program loop...
00:12.906 ERROR [1] .\Parser\TextParser.cpp (683) Error parsing : 'WillBeHit' found, int expected
00:12.907 WARNING1 [0] .\CameraPos.cpp (115) false
00:38.455 ERROR [0] .\Items\items.cpp (697) Item not found by name: 'Unique Sniper Rifle SKS (7.62x39)'
00:38.456 FATAL [0] .\Shop\ShopEconomics.cpp (324) Invalid item in economy: 'Unique Sniper Rifle SKS (7.62x39)', shop: Emiliano Calderon_7532

R@S

07-20-2010, 05:21 PM

There must've been some issues with the patch installation, but I'm not sure what. According to the log you're using some old files and that causes the CTD. I'll try to get to the bottom of this by throwing a bunch of possibles at you:)

Check your game directory, is the a folder called ShopINI? If there is, they're either a left-over from a previous installation or the directories are set as read-only and wasn't deleted by the patch script. If this is the case you need to start over, uninstall the game and install it in another directory, one that isn't affected by your OS or virus-protection systems.

When you run the PatchMe.bat script, pay attention to what the script says at the end, it indicates if any of the files or folders are write protected and couldn't be deleted.

Flakt

07-24-2010, 10:46 AM

hi. i've been reading the forums for a while, and i'm an avid user of BSM, but i have a problem. after completing the first battle for ciudad de oro (painstakingly hard), and selling all the loot, i've come across a problem. when i hit leave, and go to the map, everythings fine. as soon as i click on the map to move somewhere, it crashes. i looked at the crash logs, and the first one said it had something to do with bloomfilter so i disabled bloom, and restarted. now it's saying something else. i'll include the log in the post below.

Flakt

07-24-2010, 10:52 AM

Log started at 24.07.2010 11:54
00:00.000 INFO [0] .\ProjectE6.cpp (410) Application version: 1.11 Build 286
00:00.011 WARNING1 [0] .\local.cpp (24) !LocalTextArray[ID]
00:00.012 ERROR [0] .\Parser\TextParser.cpp (683) Error parsing : '' found, int expected
00:00.196 INFO [0] .\Main3dDevice.cpp (37) 3D device created - Ok
00:00.288 INFO [0] .\SoundSystem.cpp (122) Creating and initializing audio system succeeded
00:02.633 INFO [0] .\Fx\effmanager.cpp (190) Creating and initializing audio system...
00:03.026 INFO [0] .\ZApp.cpp (847) Entering main program loop...
00:05.255 INFO [0] .\LoadGame.cpp (834) Loading saved game: Saves\Fast2.286.azp
00:05.659 INFO [0] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:05.660 INFO [1] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:05.661 INFO [2] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:05.663 INFO [3] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:05.717 INFO [4] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:05.950 INFO [5] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:06.883 INFO [0] .\Engine\World.cpp (427) Loading world 'Media.pack\CIUDADDEORO'
00:06.917 INFO [6] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:06.918 INFO [7] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:06.918 INFO [8] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:06.937 INFO [9] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:06.938 INFO [10] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:06.938 INFO [11] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (346) Mesh with NOPHYS property in index.s3p
00:06.975 WARNING1 [0] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:06.975 WARNING1 [1] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:06.976 WARNING1 [2] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:06.976 WARNING1 [3] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:12.738 INFO [0] .\LoadGame.cpp (1209) Game loaded.
>-----------------------------------------------------------
> Exception C0000005 at 0x004AD87A
>-------------------- Call stack ---------------------------

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x004AD87A

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x004AEC1D

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006C1DF0

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006CAE6E

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x00517198

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x0054EAD3

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006C4690

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x0051381C

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x0051381C

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x00513850

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x00517198

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x0054EAD3

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x0054EAD3

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x004BE2E0

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x004C0124

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x0048B065

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x0048B0C9

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x004B1FAB

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x0049E920

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x005AF2A7

ntdll.dll 0x77080000 0x770AFA88

ntdll.dll 0x77080000 0x770AFA88

ntdll.dll 0x77080000 0x770AFA88

ntdll.dll 0x77080000 0x770AFA88

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006BD7C5

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006A2DD2

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006BD70A

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x00697E84

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006BD70A

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006A39B2

> Crash dump successfully saved to Log\2010_07_24_11_54.dmp
00:17.057 INFO [0] .\ProjectE6.cpp (620) Unexpected program termination.

R@S

07-24-2010, 01:56 PM

There's no errror in the log that would cause a CTD, and from your decription it sounds like a memory leak problem. Since the CdO fight takes a long time to finish it's the most likely reason, and the only way around it is to load a save from before the fight and do it all over. I would guess the most likely cause for the CTD is some mix-up with the ownership of the map, that's what gets checked when you travel away from a map you've just conquered. I've had similar issues, even in vanilla, and it's always after a fight where I take the ownership of a city. The last time it happened was in the player base and the only way to fix it was loading an earlier save.

Flakt

07-24-2010, 02:35 PM

R@S

07-24-2010, 05:59 PM

Flakt

07-25-2010, 01:03 AM

You could try it, but I don't think it'll work. Do you have a save when you're still in combat? Then try retreating from the sector and see if the CTD happens then as well. If it's the ownership thingy that's causing it that might do the trick. You'll fail the mission, but at least you'll be able to continue the campaign.

i gave in and just restarted. i have a few requests though, dont know if you'll listen or not.

1 - foregrip as a bipod, so i can add it to different weapons.
2 - make rico faster at getting you requested cars.
3 - differently colored backpacks, different models maybe?
4 - more uniforms if you can make them.

R@S

07-25-2010, 08:02 AM

1: There are several reasons I haven't made the grip attachable, the left hand wont grip it when attached, the weapon stats will get the bipod settings and it will displace the position of the bipod on that weapon since one has to edit it's poisition in the *.act.inf file. These are all due to engine limitations and it can't be changed, if it was possible I would have done it already.

2: Rico always gives you the car you buy directly, the whole ordering business is just a scam and a waste of 1000 eldos.

3: There already are 4 kinds of backpacks that looks different, the ones with small pics is just for storing purposes, not carrying. To add them to the models is too much work for something that isn't supposed to be done.

4: I like the idea of new uniforms, and it will be done for the next release, I don't know how many there'll be, but at least 2 new ones. Maybe this is something you can help with?

Flakt

07-25-2010, 12:14 PM

Flakt

07-26-2010, 02:27 PM

i'd also like to request different vests, more lightweight ones maybe. like the wildcat and the other concealable one, except they're actually visible. would give the light classes some more eyecandy. the standard non concealable vests are absolutely enormous.

MoreDread

07-26-2010, 08:09 PM

new vests are easily done.. you just need to make the textures and add some lines to the ini files for each of them.

more uniforms aren't hard either.. you can check my nightops uniform mod and look at the files in the archive to make your own if you like.

i was thinking about adding most of the clothing npcs are wearing as new uniforms as well.. to give the player more of a choice about looks... this wouldn't be very hard to do either... the only problem is that vests won't be visible when wearing these.. and to change that might require some additional coding done by r@s and lots of textures beeing made.... as each vest has a skin for the whole body.... it would require duplicating each skin several times and copy pasting the vests from the default skins.

this could be done considerably fast, as i have already made new versions of each of the default clothes for my nightops reskin mod and thus have each of the vests on a seperated layer for both males and females...

sometimes the texture layout is very different from the default skins and they have to be resized...

for clothing that shows skin the whole thing gets much more complicated.. as again you'd need to make new skins for every skin color.

all in all it would be a considerable amount of work and increase the size of the mod quite a bit.

in case you missed my mods and wonder what i'm talking about, here's a link to my thread so you can check out how i did it.

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=14759

(note that the hotpants reskin is not wearable clothing, i changed the default skin of these npcs to my custom skin...)

Flakt

07-26-2010, 08:24 PM

TodeswolF

07-26-2010, 09:03 PM

Hey guys!
Well, what about adding some BDUs? I mean real army uniforms like the Digital-Woodland-Camo BDU of the US? Or maybe the German Flecktarn? We could also add the Italian Digital Vegetato... What do you think?
Correct me if im wrong, but all we have to do is using an 'one'-colored uniform and then just put the new texture right over it right?

GreeZ

TodeswolF

Flakt

07-26-2010, 11:00 PM

TodeswolF

07-27-2010, 08:24 AM

thats what i was thinking of doing! i say we add gloves to all of them aswell. everything looks unprofessional without gloves in my opinion.

hmm.. i think this could get a little bit difficult with cloves... :confused:
espacially if you want to add them as an additional piece of equipment, like a backpack or a vest.
or we have to edit the skin of the player-chars, so they always wear their cloves, like black leather cloves or maybe olive-green combat cloves... ;)

Flakt

07-27-2010, 11:21 AM

hmm.. i think this could get a little bit difficult with cloves... :confused:
espacially if you want to add them as an additional piece of equipment, like a backpack or a vest.
or we have to edit the skin of the player-chars, so they always wear their cloves, like black leather cloves or maybe olive-green combat cloves... ;)

not as an additional piece of equipment, but as part of the uniform. like the algeira civil guard uniform has black gloves, whereas the others dont.

MoreDread

07-27-2010, 01:15 PM

allright, allright calm down...

texture replacements are fine, but we cannot, i repeat, CANNOT export models with bone weights at this time.

that means anything that animates can not be done... no new vests, no gloves,
no new backpacks, unless you just copy the old ones and simply add a new texture to them... but theres not gonna be any new models for that until you find me someone who can code import/export scripts for blender.

you can reskin this uniform and add various different types of camouflage to the game that way

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/3369/mdsnightopsuniform01.jpg

however i've got my hands full right now and won't take any requests until i finish the stuff i have planned. so if you really wanna have the things you mentioned, you gotta do them yourselves. i'll gladly assist you by answering questions if you decide to do that, and i'm sure r@s will, too.

Flakt

07-28-2010, 01:10 AM

kido-bg

07-28-2010, 12:25 PM

Hello, i instal evrything by instal notes , but when i try to start new game after choosing pleyer stats and pres start it crashes and in log i get that . Can someone help me plZ
00:00.000 INFO [0] .\ProjectE6.cpp (410) Application version: 1.11 Build 286
00:00.003 ERROR [0] .\OldPackFile.cpp (99) Package not found: Patch_1_12.azp
00:00.019 WARNING1 [0] .\local.cpp (24) !LocalTextArray[ID]
00:00.019 ERROR [0] .\Parser\TextParser.cpp (683) Error parsing : '' found, int expected
00:00.563 INFO [0] .\Main3dDevice.cpp (37) 3D device created - Ok
00:01.427 INFO [0] .\SoundSystem.cpp (122) Creating and initializing audio system succeeded
00:07.040 INFO [0] .\Fx\effmanager.cpp (190) Creating and initializing audio system...
00:09.188 INFO [0] .\ZApp.cpp (847) Entering main program loop...
00:23.323 ERROR [0] .\Items\items.cpp (697) Item not found by name: 'Unique Sniper Rifle SKS (7.62x39)'
00:23.324 FATAL [0] .\Shop\ShopEconomics.cpp (324) Invalid item in economy: 'Unique Sniper Rifle SKS (7.62x39)', shop: Emiliano Calderon_26374

Sorry for my crapy english

R@S

07-28-2010, 12:47 PM

00:23.324 FATAL [0] .\Shop\ShopEconomics.cpp (324) Invalid item in economy: 'Unique Sniper Rifle SKS (7.62x39)', shop: Emiliano Calderon_26374Do you have a folder in your game directory called ShopINI? If you do, you prolly have some write protection setting on your installation folder and the patch dint delete the files it should have.

kido-bg

07-28-2010, 01:30 PM

after sume manual del of items from shopini it work fine . tanks mate

R@S

07-28-2010, 02:12 PM

I'm not sure, but I suspect you might encounter other issues later in your game if there still are some files that should've been packed and deleted by the patch. The best thing would be a clean install, and this time make sure you don't install it in the Program Files or the User folder, I think that's where the writing protection comes from. And when you run the PatchMe.bat, pay attention to what the script says at the end, it'll let you know if there was any problems.

I forgot to say, welcome to the community and enjoy the game:)

Flakt

07-28-2010, 07:54 PM

i just got to the secret harbor mission. finally, a humvee.

kido-bg

07-28-2010, 08:57 PM

when i try to start patchme.exe it can't find msvcr71.dll after click ok it start "file not found .... " and in the end say complete. btw running in win7 - i don instal in Program Files or the User folder. btw chek manualy "read only" it was fine ... i think it can't run azp* file properly

10x R@S :) i play hardlife maybe 6-7 times till last vers... never play the last one

I fix it problem come from azp . 10x again

Flakt

07-29-2010, 04:39 AM

R@S

07-31-2010, 08:51 AM

i play hardlife maybe 6-7 times till last vers... never play the last oneYou really should try their latest version, they've added a lot of new stuff, like the need to eat, character models that change when you put on camo paint, new missions and a lot of other great stuff.

But back to BSM...

I've finished the new missions, there's 11 of them, and tied them together with the player faction. If the player wanna play for himself there's 25 campaign missions(I hope to get that up to 26 as the vanilla campaigns) and there's no need to do the old vanilla missions any more to progress the game levels. I'm gonna spend the last days of my vacation on a play-through and after that I think the next version is ready for release.

There's still some work being done on some new uniforms and hopefully they'll be ready before the next release. I might even postpone it until they're done, it all depends on how the work on the new Global AI and Field Radio comes along.

Flakt

07-31-2010, 06:48 PM

You really should try their latest version, they've added a lot of new stuff, like the need to eat, character models that change when you put on camo paint, new missions and a lot of other great stuff.

But back to BSM...

I've finished the new missions, there's 11 of them, and tied them together with the player faction. If the player wanna play for himself there's 25 campaign missions(I hope to get that up to 26 as the vanilla campaigns) and there's no need to do the old vanilla missions any more to progress the game levels. I'm gonna spend the last days of my vacation on a play-through and after that I think the next version is ready for release.

There's still some work being done on some new uniforms and hopefully they'll be ready before the next release. I might even postpone it until they're done, it all depends on how the work on the new Global AI and Field Radio comes along.

i'll gladly help with uniforms if needed, just drop me a PM.

Solon

08-02-2010, 03:33 AM

Hye!!!
First of all, I'd like to thank all of you who, did such a great job on this game, especially you, R@s.
I played this game like two years ago and really enjoyed it, despite the many bugs that kinda ruined, on the long term, my enjoyment ; I just tried today the new patche and that blue sun Mod, and must say it's really great how much stable it now is.

Now, I have some questions about "problems" I encountered in my new fresh start in 7.62 :
- I can't seem to be able to open any box (ammo, crates, etc.) ; the hand icon never turn "activated" as it usually does, when opening a door, for example... I do think I remember being able to open crates in my previous gameplay, but it appears as if the function doesn't even exist here... Is this normal ? Is this related to the Blue Sun Mod ?
- Also, is it normal that I started the game with 100.000 $ ??? I thought the point of not having any weapon in the beginning was to make it a little harder, which decision I can appreciate, but having 100.000 from the start kind of defeats that purpose... Is this some bug I encountered ?

I must add that I did correctly every step of the installation (clean install, patch, etc.), and that I didn't have no 7.62 data on my computer from my previous gameplay (I played it on a different computer the first time around). Also, I did try to look in the forums for answers but didn't find anything about these two problems.

Once again, thanks a lot for all the improvement and adjustements you made to this game, it is greatly appreciated. It's certainly going to distract me from the important things I need to do in the next weeks to come, but what the hell...

R@S

08-02-2010, 09:06 AM

- I can't seem to be able to open any box (ammo, crates, etc.) ; the hand icon never turn "activated" as it usually does, when opening a door, for example... I do think I remember being able to open crates in my previous gameplay, but it appears as if the function doesn't even exist here... Is this normal ? Is this related to the Blue Sun Mod ?Only about 10-20% of the boxes on the maps are intractable, try some other boxes and see if they work. Since that's actually controlled by the map meshes I haven't done anything about it.

- Also, is it normal that I started the game with 100.000 $ ??? I thought the point of not having any weapon in the beginning was to make it a little harder, which decision I can appreciate, but having 100.000 from the start kind of defeats that purpose... Is this some bug I encountered ?I guess you're playing with the new Class System, which is actually just for testing, hence the 100k starting money. You could change it back to the normal 1000 in the 7.62\ini\outsourcedconfig.ini file.

Solon

08-02-2010, 08:47 PM

Hi, thanks a lot for the quick answer !

Yes you're right I just didn't find any clickable box, I just remembered wrong that aspect of the game ; so, sorry for the dumb question.

As for the 100.000 $, all right, I'll change that ! Are you supposed to start with 0 $, or is there a particular amount, so that I fix it correctly ?

thanks again !
Awesome, awesome job on the game

R@S

08-03-2010, 10:48 AM

The start amount is 1000 eldos, you can set that in the 7.72\INI\outsourcedconfig.ini file.

Solon

08-03-2010, 11:45 AM

Alright, thanks !

Mugwump

08-03-2010, 11:23 PM

Sorry, I had a brain fart and originally posted this in the wrong thread.

"The grass textures appear to be missing and show up as black blocks on my screen if I install the mod. Can you tell me how to fix this issue please?"

R@S replied:
"...you need to supply more info, like what version of the mod, what patch and what OS you're using."

OK, I am running the Gamersgate digital download version of 7.62-High Calibre v 1.11 build 286.

I'm using Windows Vista 64bit with 4GB of RAM, ATI 4870 video card with Catalyst 10.7 drivers (I've also tried 10.6, 10.4, and 9.6 but I get the missing grass textures with all drivers).

I installed the unofficial patch 1.06 over a clean install of 7.62 and then installed BSM 1.02.

R@S

08-04-2010, 07:35 AM

It seems some textures has gotten corrupted, the game automatically creates new ones that looks like black blocks when it cant find or use the original ones. Since it still remains after a re-install, the corrupted textures must be stored in another location than the game folder.

Since Vista and the gamersgate version installs the game in the "User" folder by default, and that folder suffers from some rigid writing protection, it could be a result of that. If possible ,try to install the game in a folder outside the reach fof that protection.

To fix the issue you need to find the corrupted file, do a search on your C: drive for a file called GRASS_ALL_.DDS, and if you find it anywhere outside the folder you originally installed the game, DELETE it. If you can't find that file, try serch for a folder called "7.62 - High Calibre" that is not your installation folder, the corrupted files might be stored there.

Did you get any error messages when you ran the Patch.Me.bat? This mess could possibly be a result of a messed up archiving of the files, but it's a long shot since it's never been a reported error before.

vahadar

08-04-2010, 09:43 AM

Hello,

Stupid question but what is the difference between the BSM mod and the BFX one? I have just played the Hard-life add-on so far and wanted to try one of those two mods from you R@S. Which one should i install to enjoy all new features since i do not want to have 3 separate install of 7.62 on my hdd?

Thanks in advance

R@S

08-04-2010, 02:45 PM

The B.F.X mod was the working title of this project, but changed it's name September last year. The main difference is that BFX didn't have any new missions, still had the weapon limit and doesnt require any patch before installation.

Mugwump

08-05-2010, 11:28 PM

Solon

08-06-2010, 10:40 AM

Hi, I'm having some trouble entering my base... I tried it at different times and every way seems to lead to an CTD... So here's what the log says after the crash (I'm not really sure which part I need to paste here) :

00:40.812 WARNING1 [0] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.813 WARNING1 [1] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.814 WARNING1 [2] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.814 WARNING1 [3] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.815 WARNING1 [4] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.815 WARNING1 [5] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.816 WARNING1 [6] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.817 WARNING1 [7] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.817 WARNING1 [8] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.818 WARNING1 [9] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.819 WARNING1 [10] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.819 WARNING1 [11] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.820 WARNING1 [12] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
00:40.820 WARNING1 [13] .\World\LoadLevelFromPack.cpp (1031) Portals in physics package!
01:35.454 INFO [0] .\LoadGame.cpp (1209) Game loaded.
02:46.619 INFO [1] .\Engine\World.cpp (427) Loading world 'Media.pack\HERO_BASE'
>-----------------------------------------------------------
> Exception C0000005 at 0x005EDF62
>-------------------- Call stack ---------------------------

[...]

> Crash dump successfully saved to Log\2010_08_06_12_40.dmp
02:53.816 INFO [0] .\ProjectE6.cpp (620) Unexpected program termination.

Any Idea what I could do ?
(BTW, this is the correct place to talk about this issue, right ?)

IceShade

08-06-2010, 12:52 PM

Ouch, the base crash. Had that myself once. I think there are some things you can try (that I can't remember), but it all came down to reverting to a previous save.

Solon

08-06-2010, 04:05 PM

Mmh, is there any other way than going back to a previous savegame ? I'm not sure I'll be able to find one that precedes that Base bug... Plus I have another bug with an empty smoke grenade I keep to improve my throwing skill : when I launch it now it just causes a CTD... So any idea about what could resolve those crashes ? For your information, I installed the game in "my program files" and did no manipulation regarding "read only" files ; don't know if that could be the cause of my crashes...

EDIT : So it really was that empty smoke grenade which caused the bugs (CTD when trying to sell it, to put it on the ground, etc.), since there was one on the ground of my base too... Previous gamesave confirmed it, so now I know I should only practice my throwing with empty grenades in temporary places (no town or else the fact that there's an empty grenade causes CTD). So I guess my problem is resolved.

Still, there's something else I noticed since I began my game : why does it reads "0 enemy defeated" in the statistic books of my hero ? I don't know why the number doesn't change, since I've been killing a lot of enemies ;

R@S

08-06-2010, 07:19 PM

The smoke grenade bug has been in the Apeiron games since Brigade E5, and the only thing they could do to fix it was making it impossible to move to the trunk without first picking it up with your hands. But some people can't take a hint;)

It seems you have missed my countless warnings about installing the game in the Program Files folder. So I'll reiterate, DO NOT install it in any folder that has write protection, that includes the Program Files folder, it'll end up in weird errors and sometimes tears:-P

Still, there's something else I noticed since I began my game : why does it reads "0 enemy defeated" in the statistic books of my hero ? I don't know why the number doesn't change, since I've been killing a lot of enemies ;Are you by any chance using any Class system test version?

Solon

08-06-2010, 09:37 PM

Ok for the program files thing. I thought the latest patch made that useless. So I should just install it in "c:", right ? Re-installing won't mess up my savegames, too ?

As far as the "class system test version" thing, I really don't know... I did nothing crazy with my installation of 7.62... I installed the english game (high calibre), and then the latest patch and blue sun mod (all contained in this thread)... So realy I don't know what kind of special version I could be running, since I just installed the usual stuff located in these forums... Any idea how I could fix that "0 enemies killed" problem ?

R@S

08-07-2010, 04:35 AM

Any patch before the 1.06 version required you to set some files to read-only, but with it it's the other way around, you have to make sure no files or folders are set to read-only or has any write protection.

Your saves should be OK as long as you have a similar version and hadn't altered any files in your previous game. The save files store a lot of information, and if you made changes in your ini files it will cuse problems.

Since the kill counter is part of the source code, and you haven't installed anything other than the patch and mod files, I can only guess that you started using a different set of soure code files mid-game. There is nothng else that would explain this and the only fix is starting a new game and keep using that set of source code files through the entire game.

Solon

08-07-2010, 09:46 AM

Wow, that's really strange, then ; for one, I never ever touched any files in my game folder or even installed new ones mid-game, and secondly, the "0 enemies defeated" thing has been there since the very beginning ; I just thought it would fix itself while playing. Couldn't it be that the patch/mod I downloaded had some files modified ? As previously reported, I did start the game with 100.000 $, too ! Weird, huh ?

+ : Okay for the read-only thing, I'll reinstall.

R@S

08-07-2010, 10:11 AM

Since you started with 100k it proves that you've installed the class system test version and that your problem with the kill counter can be tracked back to that. Please try to keep track of what you install and always mention what you've installed when you ask for help, it'll save us both a lot of time.

EDIT: Or it could be that you dint install the patch correctly and that screwed up your game. Since you've installed it in a write protected folder this is very likely.

Xiola

08-08-2010, 02:06 PM

Hi, I have the same trouble. I used a clean install, have tried both with unofficial patch and without.

I start with 100,000 whatever I do?

I downloaded from the first post in the BSM thread and seemingly got 1.02.

Could anyone tell me what I am doing wrong please? i dont want to cheat and start with 100,000.

Solon

08-08-2010, 03:31 PM

Hey R@s, since Xiola here has the same problem as me, could it be that the patch proposed here has some kind of problem ?
Not that what you suggested about installing the game where I did isn't likely to cause bugs too.
What exactly does the fact that my statistic book says I killed 0 enenmies cause ? Because my CGL is actually raising...

Xiola

08-08-2010, 05:31 PM

Also, I checked the outsourcedconfig ini file and it says start amount is 1000 Eldos, yet I get 100000.

Wierd eh?

There are two checks for wrong values. If the option names itself are altered, -1 is returned. If the values are out of range respectively loose (e.g. min > max), standard value will be returned.

**********************/

//********* Gamestart *********\\

StartMoney "1000"

IntroMovie "1" // on 1/off 0

Zantar45

08-08-2010, 06:47 PM

Also having the zero kill count problem.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/Zantar45/kkzro.jpg
Fresh install of 7.62 into a new folder (C:/Games), patched to 1.06 and the latest version of BSM (w/$100k).

Noticed every skill except for Gunfighting/Hip Shooting can still be raised the old fashioned way. Even wiping out a whole town while hipfiring did nothing.

As long as everything else works, I can live with it, just gotta remember to dump more points into it when starting a new game.

Xiola

08-09-2010, 03:38 AM

As there has been no reply here for a while, I decided to start playing even with 100,000 eldos.

My kill counter never goes up (always 0) and I seemingly never get any level up points. (I have killed around 50 enemies now) Do I have to kill more or is this another bug with the mod?

I'm on Winxp, installed into deafult program files folder. In fact everything default and clean install. Tried with patch and without. Without patch I got a crash as soon as I entered the first level, so I gathered I must use the patch first. Did anther uninstall/reinstall but all the same troubles 100,000, no kill counter (0).

Do I need to kill even more than 50 enemies to get more XP points to spend?

R@S

08-09-2010, 09:42 AM

New version is released, check the first post in this thread for details.

Xiola

08-09-2010, 11:22 AM

Awesome.

Should we start a new game?

Xiola

08-09-2010, 08:54 PM

Hi R@S, thanks for your AWESOME work with this cool game.

Just a quick bug report, the money is now correct. Not killed anyone yet to test the kill count.

One bug I think I have found (clean install, winxp). Once I have created a new character with Cameron, I choose trooper and the only Class skills I get are 3 (I think they were the first 3, shooting, gunfighting and something else). My non class skills are the other 2 'class skills' and the 'real' non class skills are missing completely.

Hope this helps you.

Kyle

08-09-2010, 09:03 PM

New version is released, check the first post in this thread for details.
Yay and ARGH! I just installed the mod over a fresh installation of 7.62. Do we need a fresh install, or can we just safely overwrite what's already there?

This report concerns the PRIOR build (I didn't read your most recent post till just now).

The new maps are AWESOME. It still bugs me that we can't ascend some of those small mounds that are everywhere in the terrain, but I can live with it for now. ;)

All I did was enter the new maps, and only engaged in a sortie with those that were present at the Airfield.

When I first requested the Guide to show me what he has for sale, I was a bit worried as to why it took so long to open up the store, but once it did I understood. Wow! It's chock full of goodies for testing! Thanks for that, and smart to do too.

There's a spelling error while interacting with the Guide. The option for playing the tutorial is spelled "Tutoryal," with a "y" instead of an "i."

I have questions regarding the aiming aides. Why is the Eotech 552 limited to a sight range of just 105m at $861 while the Aimpoint M has a sight range of 150m at a lesser price of $486? I looked to see if there was a weight advantage, and there definitely isn't, as the Eotech weighs more.

Also, the Desert Aimpoint found on the HK416 mod 6.8 CQB has a range of 200m; why is this Aimpoint so significantly better than an unpainted regular Aimpoint (is it due to coming from a significant character in the game, or...?)?

I had some problems with the new uniforms. Only Uniforms 03 and 04 appeared in the Guide's shop--is it supposed to be like this and Uniforms 01, 02, and 05 appear at a different shop, or did I screw up the files when I renamed the DDS files I created for the mod? See my email regarding this, as it details what I renamed the files to, but I did some guessing as to which files matched up with which costumes and I wouldn't be surprised if I'm the source of the error. Man, I badly want to see my uniforms in the game! :)

The PRIOR build was great. Downloading the new build now. Thanks again for all of your hard work R@S!!!

:grin:

Xiola

08-09-2010, 09:21 PM

Hi, Kyle,

Do you get the Class system problem that I described above, when spending your points at the beginning? (Only three class parameters)

Lornalt

08-11-2010, 02:22 AM

Hi I just got the game and installed the mod. The thing is every time I save I get a CTD.

Log started at 11.08.2010 10:18
00:00.000 INFO [0] .\ProjectE6.cpp (410) Application version: 1.11 Build 286
00:00.022 WARNING1 [0] .\local.cpp (24) !LocalTextArray[ID]
00:00.026 ERROR [0] .\Parser\TextParser.cpp (683) Error parsing : '' found, int expected
00:00.709 INFO [0] .\Main3dDevice.cpp (37) 3D device created - Ok
00:01.067 INFO [0] .\SoundSystem.cpp (122) Creating and initializing audio system succeeded
00:04.196 INFO [0] .\Fx\effmanager.cpp (190) Creating and initializing audio system...
00:05.021 INFO [0] .\ZApp.cpp (847) Entering main program loop...
00:30.419 INFO [0] .\Engine\World.cpp (427) Loading world 'Media.pack\FAKIROVAMBUSH'
>-----------------------------------------------------------
> Exception C0000005 at 0x76E36BF0
>-------------------- Call stack ---------------------------

ntdll.dll 0x76DF0000 0x76E36BF0

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006BDBC6

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006E000D

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006E2F55

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006E3169

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006DF1BC

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x006BD70A

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x00683BEC

E6.exe 0x00400000 0x005CE793

ntdll.dll 0x76DF0000 0x76E4231E

ntdll.dll 0x76DF0000 0x76E431DF

ntdll.dll 0x76DF0000 0x76E4231E

ntdll.dll 0x76DF0000 0x76E4350F

ntdll.dll 0x76DF0000 0x76E431DF

> Crash dump successfully saved to Log\2010_08_11_10_18.dmp
00:44.346 INFO [0] .\ProjectE6.cpp (620) Unexpected program termination.

Any help would be nice.

R@S

08-11-2010, 03:27 PM

Xiola
When you first created your character you only get to spend points on your Skills, not on any Parameters. Since you chose Trooper you'll get 3 class Skills and 7 non-class skils to spend points on. The Parameter option should be empty.

Lornalt
The log you posted doesn't give any important info on what might be the cause of your CTD. You did follow the instructions in the first post, right? You have installed the patch without errors, all the files from all the archives are in the game directory and most important of all, there is no write protection on your game dir.

Xiola

08-11-2010, 09:43 PM

Thanks for the info R@S.

I found the third mission from the dodgy cop very hard. Where you have to escort the prisoner to the prison. There were only three of us and when I refused to hand him over, we were attacked by around 20-30 enemies! ouch!

I went to an earlier save and left that one for a while!

R@S

08-12-2010, 02:43 PM

I've done a lot of testing lately and discovered a few bugs. There is a box in Radio Hill that causes a CTD when opened, so try to avoid it if possible(it's near the Mayor house).

I also noticed that when you lower your Health stat at character creation you can set it back to it's original state when visiting a doctor. I have removed the possibility to decrease that stat to avoid misuse.

The Field Radio will have to be remade, the way I've made it isn't sufficient. I'll try to get it done by the next release, it's a major task that requires a lot of new code.

I've also made some minor adjustment to the shop inventories, some ammo will be available earlier.

Otherwise I'm pretty satisfied with the mod, the money is tight when you get to the final stages and that's the way I like it. I haven't tried it with the "Easy Money" yet, but I hope it isn't too bad even if it's turned on.

Flakt

08-12-2010, 11:43 PM

Xiola

08-13-2010, 11:21 AM

Can anyone please tell me what th different backpacks are for? They all seem to have the same space.

Flakt

08-13-2010, 02:07 PM

Can anyone please tell me what th different backpacks are for? They all seem to have the same space.

organization purposes, you can put them in the car or something, and put stuff inside them so its tidier.

R@S

08-13-2010, 05:42 PM

on paco's mole mission, i progressed along the mission as normal, and came back, though kelly died in the firefight. now when i talk to him, he says "bring kelly here, and we'll talk" and my only option is to say "i'll be right back with her" and end the conversation. what now?Sorry about that, I seem to have forgotten to add the "goal failed" when she was killed and you are now stuck in the mission progress. The idea was that she must survive, she is after all a police officer and that should matter. If you have an older save, please revert back to that and make sure she survives, otherwise you'll be stuck there. I always place Paquito and Kelly outside the bar with their weapons ready towards the entry point. I then use my main merc to clear the town, and when the next wave comes I only have to worry about one entry point.

I had a lot of free time at work today and got a lot done with the field radio code. I found a way around the old militia spawn bug and that's now fixed. With this new system you'll get a better overview of the militias and the economy of the thing, which was what I was aiming for. I think I'll spend some time improving the weapon ordering system this weekend, and if I have time, maybe do a new mission or two:)

Flakt

08-13-2010, 06:00 PM

Sorry about that, I seem to have forgotten to add the "goal failed" when she was killed and you are now stuck in the mission progress. The idea was that she must survive, she is after all a police officer and that should matter. If you have an older save, please revert back to that and make sure she survives, otherwise you'll be stuck there. I always place Paquito and Kelly outside the bar with their weapons ready towards the entry point. I then use my main merc to clear the town, and when the next wave comes I only have to worry about one entry point.

I had a lot of free time at work today and got a lot done with the field radio code. I found a way around the old militia spawn bug and that's now fixed. With this new system you'll get a better overview of the militias and the economy of the thing, which was what I was aiming for. I think I'll spend some time improving the weapon ordering system this weekend, and if I have time, maybe do a new mission or two:)

i reverted to an earlier save and managed to save kelly. wondering what to do now, tanya tormens' missions are getting repetitive. you mentioned a solo campaign starting with someone named tang, where is he?

R@S

08-13-2010, 06:07 PM

Once you've finished the mole mission you'll get sent to Billy-Bob to pick up a bribe. Once that is done you'll need to do all the missions Billy-Bob offers before you get sent to help Tang. I recommend that you do the Jim-Bob missions too, you'll get access to some very good shops.

Kyle

08-14-2010, 06:02 AM

Xiola,

No, I haven't yet experienced the bug as you described it. Wish I could help you out more on that.

R@S,

WOW!

I was surprised to see that with this release we no longer had access to the firearms smorgasbord, but that's still fine for testing purposes.

I was quite surprised to find that my lost possessions no longer consisted of the HK, but the SPAS did me just fine. I think that it actually makes one's first attempt at taking a town more suspenseful, and I like that. :)

There's a spelling error that I've been overlooking for quite some time. When the Player finally interacts with Paco Diaz and Pacquito's in the squad, Paco offers up the first mission as a "deputy;" the Player has some dialog that could be polished a bit. Instead of responding with "...are pump..." the verbiage needs to be changed to "...are pumped..."

My game ended with two crashes, the last one resulting in a crash to desktop. Both of them occurred near dusk as Cameron tosses the flashbang from the rooftop of the Police Dept. towards the five police officers below, all of whom are standing in a line formation near the steps of the station's main entrance, all of whom are nervously eying said entrance, because it is setup to receive a hail of fire from my two squadmates should any of them foolishly come wandering in. I cook the flashbang for a second before throwing it, and then it's a few fractions of a second after that the crashes occurred.

Before I go, check your email account, as the SF uniforms are ready to download.

Also, could anyone direct me towards two types of armor? I'm looking for the all-black "scorpion" armor (the second best in terms of toughness) and also for the toughest armor (kind of looks like the carapace of a bug). Should time allow, I'd like to come up with matching skins on those armors for the SF.

Thanks in advance, and good night!
:grin:

Flakt

08-14-2010, 01:40 PM

also, is there any dev-implemented weapons testing range or something? because i find myself shooting at the garage doors in the army base to try out new weapons and types of ammo.

Xiola

08-14-2010, 05:14 PM

I experienced a crash to desktop when going to the Librarian for the mine mission.

If I chose to go to Rob Yu, the game started loading the underground and then crashed. I attempted it 4 times and every time it crashed upon loading the underground

I had no option but to fight my way in, am I missing anything by doing this the hard way?

Once I had fought through the mine map, to the entrance, the underground loaded fine.

Just thought I would report this for you.

My group consists of Cameron (pc) , Kelly, the drunk guy and Baddabing, not sure if this is relavent or not?

Kyle

08-15-2010, 06:43 AM

Having a real blast. I'm really exploring around, trying to push the known boundaries, but it's still early in the game, Day 4 or so.

I got a real kick out of seeing Pepe's range of items he's willing to sell you once he sees your badge! Everything he had was sensible too.

Some suggestions:
When selling all of the items from one's trunk, the second dialogue option that the Player has needs a little bit of adjusting, to:
"You kiddin'? Should I throw my wife and kids into the car too?"

This might be a pain in the butt to do, but it would save the Player a lot of time hunting around. When it comes to seeing one's Current Missions, it would be handy to have at the very start of each mission description the following...
Mission's Starting Location: Location X
Mission's Current Destination: Location Y
This way the Player can quickly assess where he has to go.

Point Costs:
For the Skirmisher class, I was surprised to see that the hand-to-hand cost was set at 3. Hand-to-hand is a challenging skill, but I'd consider lowering its cost to 2 for this class, because of how much hand-to-hand combat practice these guys must get.

Possible Bug:
I took over Puerto Viejo after acquiring my goods from Paco. When I returned to Sagrada to run a package delivery to the Mayor from the arms dealer immediately near Alexy Rezvi, none of the heavily armed guards attacked me. Two builds ago, they did. In fact, when I accepted this mission, I pressed the arms dealer to pay me three times as much due to expecting severe resistance in getting the package to the Mayor. Instead, I was able to walk around without so much as raising an eyebrow, and I got $6,000 for an easy job that should've paid me only $2,000. Now, the only thing that makes me wonder why they're not attacking me, is that everyone in my squad was wearing police officer uniforms when we spawned in. To test this, I had one of my squadmates take it off right in front of the heavily armed guards. Nothing, their allegiance stayed yellow instead of switching to red.

Alright, that's it for now. Good night!

Keep up the great work!
:grin:

IceShade

08-15-2010, 09:08 AM

Does the melee skill actually prevent you from being hit as well?

Anytime I go into melee with a low life bandit or whatever, they manage to get a hit on me. And when they hit me (which is all the time), I'm stunned for a bit. By the time I have recovered, they've already swung again.

It's even worse; I once attacked a heavily injured guy. Easy prey, I thought. He was immobilized, was heavily injured, and didn't look my way. I sprinted over to him, kicked him, but before I managed to get my kick in he immediately switched to the "standing" animation, and smacked me in the face.

What.

Flakt

08-15-2010, 11:37 AM

Vader

08-17-2010, 08:09 PM

i play the new missions. first of: great humor and many thanks for so many fixed dialogs and more options in dialogs great R@S .i am now in the mids of the tang missions and i have to pew pew the training ground...
i opted for killing all, why stop when your around^^
after a very interesting battle, in which every baddie ended up ling face down^^ i still wont get the log entry that i killed all in kansas...

i am a bit disturbed. enlightment is much apreciated^^

Vader

Kyle

08-18-2010, 02:11 AM

I spent a couple of hours playing/restarting the same scenario over and over again to try and catch exactly what was going on in the game during a complex situation. Before I go through all of the trouble of writing it up in a post here, I need a question answered regarding uniform-usage that may supply the answer that I was searching for...

As stated above, after taking over Puerto Viejo after I returned to Sagrada to meet with Paco. The area has Guardia posted everywhere, but instead of immediately attacking me as in a previous build of the mod, they stayed neutral.

That is, until I turned Luna in. 95% of the time, within several seconds of handing Luna over to Paco, the Guardia at the station opens up on Luna, then me.

5% of the time this Guardia did NOT do the above, but I'll save those details till after I get an answer to the following:

WHY do the Guardia switch from neutrals to enemies? Is it because...
(1) ...word finally reached Sagrada about my squad's behavior in Puerto Viejo, and they then know that I'm an enemy?
(2) ...when one clicks to talk to Paco, the Player's avatar is forced to stand right next to the Guardia for the duration of the dialog, giving the Guardia time to figure out that I'm wearing a disguise, that my police officer uniform is illegitimate?
(3) ...the Guardia work for another crime lord, who has secret orders to kill Luna should he be secured, and to then kill those who caught him?
(4) ...or a combination of the above?

PLEASE NOTE: If the reason why the Guardia attack is due to a yet to be discovered plot point, please do not spoil it here. Just say that I'll find out later why they behaved the way they did, and I'll be satisfied.

Uniforms, and how they do/do not work still mystifies me. Any light on this matter would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance!
:)

Vader

08-18-2010, 11:58 AM

I think that most uniforms are useless and i use them for taste issues rather than showing flag for the different organizations... as soon as i can get a hold of a palinero uniform my whole sqaud waires them and i wasn´t attacked due to my clothes... i rule this matter directly out. i think that you hurt or killed officials in another city and to wair police uniform doesnt help that fact... your still an enemy of the state. it is only a quest that your playing and your not really an official policeman when wairing the uniform... so enemystatus stayes the same. if you want to change that, buy yourself off the hook by big bob or if your further enough in the big storyline by calderon for 50 grands...

have fun^^

Kyle

08-19-2010, 03:19 AM

Vader,

Thanks for your input. So uniforms don't work as disguises? Too bad.

So, something is causing the Guardia to FINALLY attack me, but what, exactly? Again, they leave my squad alone till Luna is turned over to Paco, then they (usually) first try to kill him, then my squad.

Weird!

Vader

08-19-2010, 09:45 AM

to tell you the truth, i dont play this quest the same way as you did. to reasons for this:
first, luna is a pitty sucker who doesnt deserve going to prison. he hasent done it. the lady is pure sin. also if you succed in turning in luna to the officials and then go back to that dame you will get a nasty withdrawl of your money from her. at least then you will know what kind of character she is... but then she is gone^^

second, when you let luna have his little talk, also with your littler funnie remarks^^, then you will gain quite the opposite as of first metioned outcome. highly recomended.
one could speculate that as such a bad cop you wont get a nother contract from paco. but after a sorry shrug from him he offers you other quests....

all in all i wanst attaced at all during this quest, and i mostly savegame before starting a quest so that i see instantly all outcommings and the choose the better^^ sly me^^

good luck and as the great R@S says save often^^

Xiola

08-19-2010, 07:44 PM

I think I may have found a bug.

In the mission 'Assasins Creed' that you get from the Chinese guy. He offers you many ways to kill a guy. I chose 'Kill them all' cos I wanted to get their weapons.

I went there and tried a few times, but it was very hard, each time some guys spawned in behind me after a while in the fight, I kept losing.

I tried it again a different way with 2 chars sniping from the cliff and my other 4 lined up a little beind the path. I managed to kill them all. this time no guys spawned in behind me, but I was kind of glad!

BUT, Tang keeps telling me to go and finish the mission, everyone is dead, I even went back and killed the poison woman in case it mattered, but it didnt.

Now the quest will not finish, but everyone at the training camp is dead. My journal says (and always said) 'Got to Kansas city and kill everyone there', but I have no Kansas City on my map, I gathered this was a mistake and it meant the training ground (the 'target' is there after all).

I mentioned the guys spawning in before, because I am wondering if they were SUPPOSED to arrive, but never did, and this is what is causing the mission not to finish?

Does anyone have any suggestions other than trying the mission again>?

Thanks

Vader

08-19-2010, 08:37 PM

first : the kansas city is in my opinion a joke about possibly foulout (the game?). you were at the right map. i also choose to do it the hard way. if done correctly it wasnt that hard. i used many grenades and two guys in the ruined houses near the spwan point as trojan horses in the spwaning troops back. also there is a small sandbag wall near the street down to the training yard. there i positioned my char (sniper) to shot incoming from the grounds and facing via spawn point my man guy for this mission, a trooper with an m16 that draw the fire to him. he was heavily packed with a vest and he killed the most.

it was all in all a true beauty of a victory.

but what can i say?: tang still wants someone killed. and yeah, i eaven killed sarah pallino (hur hur hur) well with a name like that i dont need much excuses to vent her skull eaven further^^. but to no avail, tang is unforgiving as before, eaven so there is no one left i should kill some more...

clearly a bug...
i am now in the midst to get again to that point manly due to my stupidity, cause i cant get back to the point to choose another option for this mission. maybe the poison or the snipng will get me an end for this mission.... stay tuned^^

Kyle

08-20-2010, 03:46 AM

Vader,

I never realized that The Lady in Red (that color is always a sure sign of Trouble, isn't it?) stole from me when I went back to inform her of Luna being turned over to Paco. No wonder she runs away after she thanks me!

When I've played this mission in the past, I'll work to meet Paco's wishes till he asks me to plant the drugs on that bandit, which I never do, but I've never played the game long enough to see what happens afterward. There's always a new update released right after I reach that point. :grin:

One reason why I might be confused as to what's happening with the Guardia's attack on Luna and then me, is that in the past, I turned Luna over BEFORE I took over any cities.

So, is it safe for me to say that the reason why the Guardia attack Luna, and then me, is because they are working for The Lady in Red, or...? I'm still trying to figure out why they're so determined to kill Luna (and why would The Lady in Red kill me when I just did her a huge favor?).

Time to test a little before bed, as I just cleared the Army Base.

Xiola

08-20-2010, 09:25 PM

Hi guys and R@S, just to confirm, the missions Assasins Creed will not finish when you choose the 'kill them all' option. I just tried again. This time the guys spawned in again, but I managed to kill them all. Still the mission is active, no enemies left on the training ground map.

Please dont think I am complaining, just trying to help with the bug fixing on this awesome mod and game!
Does anyone know if it is possible to edit a file to force this mission complete please? I didint really want to start again if possible as I have carried on and left the mission hanging. Maybe I should have gone back to an earlier save before I took the mission and waited for the next version of hte mod, but its too late now :/ I just did the much discussed convoy defence mission and I didnt really want to do that again if possible! :D

Kyle

08-21-2010, 07:09 AM

Other than price and ammo box art, what are the differences between the Golden Saber .45 ACP (at $84/box) and the cheaper Remington version (at $48/box)? Are the numbers accidentally reversed, or...?

Thus far, I've noted that there are a couple of missions that have the spelling wrong for when it's declared to be finished. Fisticuffs and A Woman Robbed both have the apostrophe missing, it should say "Mission's complete," or some other such variant.

Xiola, thank you for confirming the bug. That's one I want to avoid.

Also, where can I locate the field radio to order my troops to reinforce an area that I conquered? If the field radio is only made available after a certain event, could someone tip me off as to which one?

Thanks in advance!

Vader

08-21-2010, 11:48 AM

First: in games that relate losly to the Quen of games JA2... there are mostly two kinds of distinguishly colored sorts of amo. RED and BLUE. Red is the FMJ, the Copkiller amo...
Blue is the JHP amo and is intended for soft targets as non protected humies and animals (havent seen a kevlar protected wildcat for a while^^).

in 7.62 there are also amo sets of subsonic amo and also low grade amo, produced in palinero. this palinero product is considerably lower in quality which results in getting your weapons faster dirty an thus damaged/ worn...

but since money isnt in short suppy and weapons come and go so fast and new, sometimes there is no point in buying high end amo. despite the penetration value of palinero vs high end amo the palinero packs quite a punch and is situated in between aformentioned red and blue amo. so if you are using cheap amo, two bullets willrest the enemy in peaces´, while the good amo might need only one bullet... but who cares when the gun is set to burst^^

Xiola

08-21-2010, 02:24 PM

The damage value of the weapon goes up when you load it with better quality ammo.

However i also find the numbers on the bullets confusing. They make it seem like the palimino ammo is better than the more expensive ammo (higher numbers for hp/shock)

Kyle

08-21-2010, 03:16 PM

Vader,

Your disclosure regarding the different types of ammo was VERY helpful; thank you for it.

The reason why I'm so focused on the .45 ACP is due to my just acquiring the HK UMP 45 along with a suppressor for it. Since I've been overthrowing local governments left and right, and since I have yet to figure out where the filed radio is to control my militia, every time I have to reenter a location I previously conquered, I end up finding out that the locale has been retaken by the prior forces. Which means that I can't even simply walk across a street to complete a mission since no one will talk with you while a battle is being waged. :(

Yeah, it's ironic that I'm playing a tactical war-game and I don't want to fight all of the time, but it's become a major headache for me, so I see two possible solutions:

(1) Finally find the all-important field radio to control my troops to secure areas that I've conquered
(2) Enter areas not secured by my militia at night, and then use suppressed weaponry to get through the fight more quickly and efficiently (or so I hope!).

But I remember reading a brief posting about the sub-sonic ammo for suppressed weaponry, and I have to ask: when I fire normal ammo through a suppressed weapon, it produces a suppressed firing sound. Does this mean that the AI have a difficult time determining where the round is coming from, or do they "hear" it as loudly as a normal round being fired from an unsuppressed weapon?

Or, does firing normal ammo through a suppressed weapon reduce its volume some, but not as much as if I was using sub-sonic ammo?

Or...?

There's no point in me pursuing this nighttime-with-suppressors strategy if the AI have just as easy a time locating the "suppressed" firearm because normal ammo is being used.

Xiola

08-21-2010, 03:40 PM

hi Kyle, I used the UMP45 constantly and now the UMP.40 S&W both silenced. Very often I would shoot at the enemy crouched, at low light, and they would not even respond after being hit.

The silenced weapon with normal ammo is definitely effective.

I would think that the sub sonic ammo is even quieter. But I found the normal ammo fine with a silenced UMP.

I love the BSM silenced UMP, incredible damage and good accuracy. Far more valuable than in the stock game.

MoreDread

08-23-2010, 11:52 PM

i would think that the silenced ammo doesn't require a silencer to be almost silent. i don't know about that tho...

the field radio can be obtained by talking to the guy at the new arrival zone (the map that was formerly the first ambush with the bus blockade and 3 wimpy enemies.

if i remember this properly, there is a guy with a cowboy hat who will give you a mission to conquer the radio hill sector... after doing that he will give you the field radio. it really is a great addition to the game.
note that doing this mission (or conquering a sector in gerneral) will raise your cgl to 8.. so if its the first thing you do, your enemies will recieve quite a boost. training enough militia to defend the sector requires alot of cash as well...

good luck in getting it.

Kyle

08-24-2010, 02:56 AM

i would think that the silenced ammo doesn't require a silencer to be almost silent.
Hah! After ALL of these years spent on the original Operation Flashpoint's forums, reading one debate after another as to whether or not sub-sonic ammunition is needed to work with a suppressor to ensure the quietest firing of a round, I never once thought about what it would sound like if the sub-sonic round was fired without a suppressor! Intriguing!

My own conclusions, after reading a lot on firing a suppressed weapon is this: normal rounds fired through a suppressor still produce a terrific sound signature, although the flash is significantly reduced. Sub-sonic rounds are designed not to break the sound barrier, but I always inferred that to mean that it was only in combination with a suppressor, which due to its design of direct physical contact with the escaping round, and by capturing the necessary gases, ensures a significantly quieted round. But your observation throws all that I've read right into the wind! Does anyone know the answer on this, as a scientifically observable certainty?

The overwhelming majority of the articles that I've read about sub-sonic ammo is that the round maintains its lethality due to its redesign, and this is in spite of the fact that it's moving slower, and that it's range is significantly reduced. If my memory serves me correctly, while sub-sonic rounds are just as lethal as regular ones, they do not have the penetration power (I'm assuming that this is due to its shape, or..?). So, its lethality is equal to a normal round against unprotected flesh.

In regards to the field radio... While I remember a man wearing a red hat in the last build, he was not present in the latest build (and I never interacted with him to even see what he was there for! Duh!). :oops:

What I stumbled upon yesterday is the whole "raising funds" and "giving your money to train a good soldier" aspect of conquering a territory. This dialogue is triggered by speaking with the mayors AGAIN, which is something that I hadn't done till late last night. So, I ordered them to increase the defense budget to $233,000, although I have no idea where they'll be getting these funds from.

What's strange though, is that the dialogue options with these mayors are:
1) Increase the budget to 2880 (a VERY small number that is so tiny I can't make sense of it)
2) I want...blah blah blah...to $233,280 (a more believable amount, but where it comes from is beyond me).

So, I've ordered two mayors to proceed with raising the defense budget to $233,000 and I have given each money to train several decently trained soldiers. Time hasn't yet passed to see how this will work out for me though.

But in any case, I've yet to get a field radio, as I've yet to meet anyone who offers it to me in the most recent build.

Am I missing something obvious here, or...?

skrzacik

08-24-2010, 10:38 AM

BUT WHER I CAN FIND THIS GUY WITH COWBOY HUT???
where is this sector ?
i play BSM and i didnt see a location with bus and 3 wimmpi guys?!?!?!
please help mi with this

MoreDread

08-24-2010, 11:54 AM

well i just came back from my vacation.. it worked the way i described it in the previous build, but i'm not up to date...

things might have changed.. it'll take some time for me to get back into it.

especially since i have been recruited as a character modeler for the zeitgeist mod (source engine)

i'll let you know if i find out anything new....

about the ammo: i have no idea if this is realistic.. but i remember that in the game 'boiling point' you were able to buy 3 different types of ammo.. normal/AP and sub-sonic... there were no silencers in the game but using sub sonic ammunition had the same effect.

EDIT:
taken from wikipedia:
In weapons firing supersonic bullets, the supersonic bullet itself produces a loud and very sharp sound as it leaves the muzzle in excess of the speed of sound and gradually reducing speed as it travels downrange. This is a small sonic boom, and is referred to in the firearm field as "ballistic crack". Subsonic ammunition reduces this sound, but at the cost of lower velocity, often resulting in decreased range and effectiveness on the target. Military marksmen and police units may use this ammunition to maximize the effectiveness of their silenced rifles. While the range may be decreased when using subsonic rounds, this may be acceptable for specialized situations, where the absolute minimum amount of noise is required.[14]

However, the numeric effectiveness of subsonic rounds is, again, misrepresented by media. Independent testing of commercially available firearm suppressors with commercially available subsonic rounds has found that .308 subsonic rounds decreased the volume at the muzzle 10 to 12 dB when compared to the same caliber of suppressed supersonic ammunition.[7] When combined with suppressors, the subsonic .308 rounds metered between 121 and 137 dB.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suppressor#Subsonic_ammunition_versus_volume

Xiola

08-24-2010, 12:13 PM

I dont see the start location on my map any more either.

How do we get back there to get the field radio?

Kyle

08-24-2010, 01:16 PM

I got home late last night and didn't have the opportunity to check what I've saved. I'm 90% sure that the man in the red hat at the start of the game is now gone. So is access to a ton of the weapons with $100,000 to buy them with.

But I did forget to mention this last night, not only does one have to talk to the mayors to finance a location's defense force, but one can also order units from one sector to another. I haven't tested this dialogue out, for the simple reason that I didn't have any units yet. I did order a few up (which drained money from my pocket), and I'll see how it goes from there.

I'm guessing that the field radio is gone, and has been replaced by dialoguing with each region's mayor. Which is a sensible solution as well, although having a field radio that can do the same thing is also quite convincing. Ideally, it would be nice to have both options available.

If I'm wrong on any of this, let me know.

MoreDread

08-26-2010, 12:34 AM

yes you can send troops to other sectors.. it is only a fraction of the troops that are available tho.. (with 30 militiamen in the radio hill sector i was able to send out a unit of 10 men from radio hill.. less on other sectors)

you can actually go to the sector you sent em to and wait for their arrival.
you can then fight alongside them or just watch your blue guys fight the enemy...

after dispatching a unit of men from a sector there seems to be a cooldown period until it works again. i have no idea how long it takes.
you don't have to be around for the battle to take place... but since the number of men you can send out is rather limited, and it's not really possible to combine the forces of several sectors... your chances to win will be quite small if you don't.

since i'm not up to date i'm not even sure if R@S has actually released a version with the radio publicly...

it requires the reloaded map pack to work.

Kyle

08-26-2010, 01:25 AM

This whole "field radio" discussion is getting a bit confusing.

I remember R@S exclusively releasing a version of it along with the Reloaded maps about a month back, but I never got far along enough into that build to test it.

Yet this latest build of BSM is not "exclusive," and it comes with the Reloaded maps, and the dialogues with the mayors reveal that after a locale has been conquered by the Player, that he/she will then have access to building up a defense militia, draft defense militia (1 person at a time, and directly at the Player's monetary expense), and then send them to different sectors.

Again, I have yet to test out sending troops from one locale to another, but I'm assuming that from what you wrote, the "mayoral" system matches up well with the "field radio" one that you experienced in an earlier build.

MoreDread

08-26-2010, 08:45 PM

what the field radio does is its basically giving you access to the mayors dialogues from wherever you happen to be so you don't have to actually walk and talk to every single one of them to manage your sectors.

Kyle

08-27-2010, 03:43 AM

Alright, I finally got it MoreDread. Been doing a TON of real life work around here, and it must've made me light headed. Thanks for your patience. :)

Are you playing the latest build? If so, do you know where, or have a good guess, as to where the field radio might be?

Vader

08-27-2010, 09:47 AM

quick side question? did anyone happen to read an answer about the training ground mission and the problem we have with said thingy from r@s?

seems he is on holliday or sumthin`...

Kyle

08-29-2010, 03:01 AM

I too wonder what happened to R@S.

I hope that whatever it is it isn't a crisis of some sort.

Hang in there man, if it is.

Vader

08-29-2010, 11:38 AM

well, as our moding guru he is entiteld of a privat life. as much as it bothers us gamers and consumers of his brilliant art.

by the way: i solved the kansas city mission, the one where a man has to be killed on the training ground... just poison him via the means of this palinero chick. then leave the map in the süawn area... solved. after that...oh the things i could tell^^

but wont, cause of spoiling^^

r@s has done tremendous work for this game, it is truly awsome....

Kyle

08-30-2010, 05:35 AM

after that...oh the things i could tell^^

This level of teasing is evil, y'know that right?

Of course you do.

You're Vader.

And Vader knows bad better than Chuck Norris knows, well, anything.

;)

Xiola

08-30-2010, 06:52 AM

Hi guys, I found out that you can just wait for a couple of days after that never ending training ground mission and you can fail it and move on to the next one.

Vader

08-30-2010, 12:12 PM

beside i got an iron grip of keeping my secrets to myself... mwuahahahahahaha :mrgreen:

spoiling is on a black list of the U.N. and the would crawl upon me like cheap shit^^

but i might talk if persuaded^^

Nat_Crelk

09-02-2010, 03:04 PM

Hi there !

1) I apologize for my accent : I'm French

2) Congratulations for the BS Mod : you're doing a very very great job men !

I played 7.62 with BS Mod since 0.7 Beta (or something like that) and I really enjoy that ones!

I came back from holidays today and Surprise!! there's a new version released of BS Mod.
So I started downloading.

All is perfect for : BSM 1.3 Base, Map Files Part 1, Map Files Part 2 as for
Unofficial Patch 1.06.

But when I've checked for Map Files Part 3 I've found that the archive was corrupted with this error message :

"! I:\Game Mix\7.62 High Calibre\BS Mod 1.03\Media.pack_pt_3.rar: Fin de l'archive incorrecte
! I:\Game Mix\7.62 High Calibre\BS Mod 1.03\Media.pack_pt_3.rar: Echec CRC dans random_21.azp. Le fichier est corrompu
! I:\Game Mix\7.62 High Calibre\BS Mod 1.03\Media.pack_pt_3.rar: Fin de l'archive incorrecte"

In English : 'incorrect end of the archive, Echec CRC in random blablabla File corrupted, incorrect end of the archive"

Excuse for the translation :confused:

I will try to download it again tonight
But is there anyone who had the same trouble or is that my F****** old office computer ?

Tks a lot

I've done it correctly, that was my computer
thanks at all

R@S

09-04-2010, 09:04 AM

It's been a long time and I don't know what to answer.

The Field Radio:
You'll get it when you do the first "capture" mission for Tang. In this version it only uses the mainconv of the Mayors but I have already made a new version with new functions and a much better overview.

The Assassin's Creed mission:
The issue has been fixed and was only with the "kill them all" option. If you choose sniper, sapper or poision instead it should work, and you can still kill them all after the main target is dead.

Kyle

09-04-2010, 06:41 PM

R@S,

I'm very happy to see your return to this thread. Been missing you man! :grin:

Not that you have to be here all of the time, but when one witnesses a certain pattern of responses in relation to time, one develops a type of "forum-rhythm" and when that gets disrupted...

Well, worries begin.

It's just good to know that you're alive. I hope that you agree. :)

In regards to getting missions from Tang, I have yet to even encounter Tang. My playing has been pretty sporadic due to a tremendous increase in work load. I'm preparing for school, and I'm teaching in four different classrooms at four different buildings (as far apart as 29 km!), and just one of those rooms took 120 hours to get it ready. I kept a log of it, and if it wasn't for the very hard work of my parents, sister, her two boys, and especially my wife, there wouldn't have been a chance of my being ready for the first day of school. I am very fortunate to have a family that's so willing to make such huge sacrifices on my and my students' behalf. :grin:

And then there's my college work... :(

But that's another story, so...

------------------------------------------------

I need some tactical advice when entering areas that are hostile to me. Generally, these are regions that have been previously conquered by me, but are then taken back.

A lot of my time has been wasted due to entering a hostile zone, to find that, at the best, their backs are very temporarily turned away from where I'm spawning, and then I basically have to keep my squad in place and just have them open up as quickly as they can with high heart rates due to them being intimidated by all of the enemy. Isn't there a way to enter a spawn zone with high stealth, while also not triggering the rapid heart rate response due to being "surprised" by seeing enemies allover the place, when one would assume that your squadmates would expect to see them there?

What's the best way to enter them from the global map to maximize a stealthy entry? In general, I've noticed that the global map appears darkest at around 22:00, as none of the region is lit by a faint blue glow, which is obviously the moon. Is there a stealth bonus if I were to enter a zone before the moon's light reaches said region?

Also, I noticed that even if I slow my vehicle's entry to its most minimal speed, there's no stealth bonus. So, for a $100, should I leave my vehicle entrusted with a nearby bartender, and then as one gets near the desired area, enter the region by foot as slowly as possible, or...?

If I conquer a region, and choose NOT to spend $5,700 to draft a soldier one unit at a time, how long will it take for a defense force to develop on its own, that's if a region is even capable of doing that? Does it add a soldier once every day, up to a certain maximum, or...? I'm assuming that one's finances plays a role in this, and if it does, how can I go about actually increasing it? I realize that when one talks to a mayor that one can raise/lower the budget, but does that indicate the actual amount of money that's flowing into the region? If not, how can I determine the actual amount of money that the region has, and how can I go about trying to boost its income?

I've drafted two units into a defense force that I plan on sending to a region. How much control do I have in equipping them? Could I, for example, "drop" a suppressed and scoped M4A1 onto/near a unit, and he'll automatically pick it up for later usage, or...? And if that's doable, should I assume that I should supply said unit with loaded magazines so that they can reload in the midst of battle, or...?

Sorry to hit this thread with so many questions. But they're there so I'm asking them. :)

Thanks in advance for any advice!
:)

Xiola

09-04-2010, 07:40 PM

R@S, thanks for your great work on this game!

I can see you will be a game developer one day

Xiola

09-04-2010, 07:44 PM

Kyle, no offence but I think you are expecting alittle too much of this game :) You are testing things which are really too complex for this game in which you were meant to get jobs and complete them.

The conquering thing isnt even really worth doing, its just a money drain.

The campaign is the real aim to the game, not conquering cities, unless its a specific quest.

NPC's never pick up weapons on the floor, or at least I have never seen it happen yet, unless its their weapon that was shot out of their hand.

I dont think there is a way to be sure that you steathily enter a city, its just chance as to where the enemies are located.

Kyle

09-05-2010, 12:25 AM

Xiola,

Part of the problem with the questions that I ask about the mod is that I have never played through the game even once, with or without a mod. That puts me at a disadvantage when trying to think through in-game issues. R@S is aware of this, as I informed him of it right at the front of our PM exchanges to one another.

I appreciate your response though, as it infers to me what the game engine "was" and "was not" designed to do, although I think it's fair to say that the game was released in a state with a lot of potential "wases" not being finished, or ironed out in regards to having bugs removed, leaving a number of features as "almosts," if you get my meaning. I also think that it's safe to say that R@S has done a lot to take a number of the "almosts" and made them "almost theres," which is a boon for us players.

Who knows, maybe one of my questions will lead him to think of a new approach, and before you know it, he'll have tugged out another miracle from the title.

My plan, unless R@S should inform me otherwise, is that with the next release, is to stay strictly to the missions till most, if not all of them, are completed. Then I'll go around conquering territories. It should help a lot that I'll have a full squad by then, with access to an enormous amount of resources.

And in regards to AI picking up weapons after they've lost their's... I'm 95% sure that I've seen police pickup weapons that weren't initially their own, for example, changing up from a shotgun to a MP5.

R@S

09-05-2010, 08:23 AM

Entering hostile cities
There are several ways to do this, you can wear enemy uniforms and they wont turn hostile directly and that gives you a few seconds to clear the immediate area. Or you could rush for cover, it's what I usually does. Try entering through the spawn point nearest to the hospital, that buildings gives you many options. You can go inside, up on the roof or use the corners to wait out the enemy, the aim-at-point function will save you in those situations.

If you want to use dark as cover, the time between 00 and 03 is the most effective.

Militia will be "grown" if your funding is big enough, but it takes time. How fast depends on reputation and how much funding your militia has. I dunno how many militia men you can have in a city, I've had 200 when I set the funding to max and waited a few weeks. There is however a limit to how many militias there can be in a loaded city, which is 35, all else is regarded as patrols that will attack the city if an enemy patrol captures your city.

The AI doesn't pick up weapons the player drops, but it does pick up weapons fallen comrades drop and I think also their enemies' weapons.

Vader

09-05-2010, 07:24 PM

nsc and enemys pick up any weapon, i have seen that for sure. and if i am not misttaken it is writen down in the booklet of the game as a warning...

as for conquering hostile cities:

i have done so out of mischief or amusement numerous times.
here are some of my strategies:
first find a secure area where you have good sight but your oponent doesent. meaning in short house fights!!!!
the KI is to dumb and also you get much better work out of grenades when fighting inside...
to do so i try to get my squad generaly inside a bar. the bars are all built the same. i position only my team on the ground lvl because when it gets to achieving unrealistic headshots the enemy is alwas better... and on the first floor the oponent can only see your head when you are crouching...
on the groundfloor i position mostly two soldiers at the rear entrance facing the door and being not seen through any windows. normaly windows are not seethrouable by the enemy but the get smashed sometimes...
one soldier is locatet at the toilet as backup for my other soldier located in the main bar room. if i got more soldiers than i put them in the Corridor that leads outside the main bar room. the guy in the main room is my char, also my main fighter. after every one is in their position and secure i await the incoming enemy. they will! get into a sloughterhouse. works always infailable.
after the initial wave of suiciders is drained he (main char) gets out hunting. i prefer silenced weapons for this. all german weapons (HK XY) are good for that early in the game. if you face more than one enemy together be sure to kill firstly the one thats facing you with a claer headshot. the other one wont be bewildered most times, also if he is alarmed then he still has to turn around and thats costing allot time for him...

one a side note: if posssible and my weaponry allows for it: a fight in a hostile city is far easier if you are on your own. the more mebers you have in your team the more you have to control. so if you plan to attack a hostile city then go alone. and as r@s says save often^^

hope i could help.....